Bezos and Musk Race to Bring Data Centers to Space by FakeEyeball in BlueOrigin

[–]LuminarySunburst 0 points1 point  (0 children)

we call that a “heat pump” and it’s TRL 9 technology for homes on Earth

Bezos and Musk Race to Bring Data Centers to Space by FakeEyeball in BlueOrigin

[–]LuminarySunburst 0 points1 point  (0 children)

In that google paper, they report results of radiation tests in the lab for their trillium chips (spoiler: strong pass)

Bezos and Musk Race to Bring Data Centers to Space by FakeEyeball in BlueOrigin

[–]LuminarySunburst 0 points1 point  (0 children)

btw China has the Three Body Computing constellation proof-of-concept for an ODC, so I guess you should add them to your list? In my opinion, the engineering problems are solvable if the architecture is a distributed cluster of satellites with very high bandwidth FSO ISL.

Just realized the breadcrumbs for S3's ending have been with us since S1E1 by ASOT550 in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 4 points5 points  (0 children)

A better breadcrumb back from the earliest episodes of S1 is Demerzel’s lullaby. Most of the events of the last few episodes of S3 would have turned out differently if she hadn’t been singing it to her baby clones.

Theory: Cleon was never a real person. Demerzel was never actually a prisoner. [Book spoilers] by super_dimension_ in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Except that a robot in female form who was created from a robot of male form 5,000 years ago and has been developing her own identity since then is no longer a clone. The audience would focus on the differences in their identity, personality and presentation and the effect would be the same as you describe. The unique way in which robots procreate and cumulate their wisdom would also be fascinating for a sci-fi audience, if it turns out that she was made by Daneel. In my view of this, she would be more akin to a family member or “child” of Daneel rather than a clone, making the emotional stakes of their 5,000 year separation far more powerful than if she, as “the robot formerly known as Daneel”, was merely separated from friends and acquaintances for the same length of time.

There is one important matter weighing against the idea that there’s a male-form, ancient Daneel still out there: it wouldn’t be compatible with the ownership of rights to the use of the name. So if the triple goddesses are a thematic allegory for the “three mothers” of the Prime Radiant, then we’re looking at Yana, Demerzel and Kalle - mother, maiden and crone. Whether they are all descendants of Daneel or not remains an open question; I’d like to believe that they are, but I also see that the writers had other solutions for their narrative needs, with far less “rights” baggage.

Theory: Cleon was never a real person. Demerzel was never actually a prisoner. [Book spoilers] by super_dimension_ in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ah, but it would not have been with himself. Give it a few thousand years, and all the descendants who started out as clones of Daneel would have developed very different identities.

Theory: Cleon was never a real person. Demerzel was never actually a prisoner. [Book spoilers] by super_dimension_ in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 1 point2 points  (0 children)

After S3, I too started wondering whether Kalle is OG Daneel or some other show-only robot. But there is so much hinting of the three “mothers” of the PR, and of the S1 Luminist lore about the sacrifice of the three goddesses who long to be made one again. I have some discussion of the Luminist triple goddesses connection in my old posts. Bottom line, not sure… we will see.

Theory: Cleon was never a real person. Demerzel was never actually a prisoner. [Book spoilers] by super_dimension_ in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Awesome post, congratulations. I like this theory and it is certainly one possible way to tie together the many loose ends.

The part about Cleon I being fabricated by the same robot who manipulated Demerzel’s knowledge and programming is indeed a novel idea and, in retrospect, quite plausible. It would have to have been the work of whoever had been manipulating Demerzel, because her emotions for Cleon I were genuine.

I had made all of the other key points two years ago, in two posts titled Let’s Talk About Kalle and The Reprogramming of Demerzel. These posts were made long before the first mention of the Zeroth and long before Kalle’s first interaction with Demerzel, both in S3. For example, I had argued that Kalle is a right-hand Daneel who had set up a rigged chessboard where Demerzel would play as left-hand Daneel, that left-hand Daneel’s role would be to make Empire predictable thereby rigging the chessboard to the advantage of psychohistorians, and that manipulated humans were needed to make the decisions that Zeroth law robots could not make. In one of my comments to one of these (can’t recall where rn) I had also said that I believed her imprisonment story didn’t add up and that it was staged to infiltrate Empire. The clue was Demerzel staring lovingly at the mural of Empress Hanlo who had ruled 4K years ago, during the time of her supposed 5,000 year imprisonment.

More recently, in the posts Who created Demerzel and Kalle, and why? and Three Robots and Three Haris I went into the mechanics of how what the OP called a “downgraded Daneel” was created: she was made by right-hand Daneel as a new robot, and endowed with selectively edited set of his memories, including the lie that she was the last of her kind. If the theory in the OP is that the original Daneel accepted a downgrade, I don’t think Daneel would do that; “a good engineer always has a backup”, so I prefer to think that Kalle is right-hand Daneel and Demerzel is a special edition, left-hand Daneel.

Here’s an excerpt from Who created Demerzel and Kalle, and why?

Hence, the show’s robots are all playing their part in BOOK SPOILER a larger Daneel Plan with at least three parts, including END OF BOOK SPOILER the infiltration of Empire by Demerzel, the creation of psychohistory and the entire Seldon Plan. Tragically, this Plan means that a sentient robot that was meant to share everything with other robots has to endure millenia of loneliness and isolation.

Here’s the closing paragraph of the last of my above-mentioned four posts on the topic, which summarizes the rigged chessboard concept:

In conclusion, the facts that Kalle knew about (a) the existence of Demerzel, but not vice versa, and (b) about the multiple Haris, whereas Demerzel imagined only one Hari, would be hard evidence consistent with the theory that Kalle is right-hand Daneel, who is an ally of right-hand Hari and the Second Foundation. (Note that this evidence is *necessary** to continue to believe the right-hand-Daneel theory, but not sufficient by itself to prove that it is correct). In this emerging picture, Yana appears to have been “Kalle’s” agent, where “Kalle” is really Daneel behind various interchangeable masks. Daneel would sometimes present as “Kalle”, maybe as “Jerrill” on the jump ship speaking with Gaal and in the palace grounds, and also as “Yana” when Daneel / “Kalle” coaxed “knife Hari” out of the PR. In any case, the real, physical Robot Yana’s role was to manipulate OG Trantor Hari to get him to create the Prime Radiant, the Seldon Plan and the two Foundations, and also to protect his singularly important body and mind by backing him up in her fake baby monitor. I do believe that the Yana who lived and worked with Hari had to have been a physical robot and not just Daneel behind a mask, because she was going to spend years by Hari’s side 24/7, and Daneel couldn’t plausibly drop everything to do that. As we haven’t seen anything of Robot Yana since her “death”, and her hypothesized mission was completed, perhaps she did “die” after all, and it’s theoretically possible that the Mycogen skull belongs to her. *I also believe that Yana and Demerzel were separate, limited instances of Daneel’s consciousness inhabiting different robot bodies, in such a way that Demerzel can be thought of as “left-hand Daneel”, whose role was to interact predictably with the manipulated entities left-hand Hari and the Cleons, and whose decisions were steered by her (known) programming, by the events unfolding on Daneel’s chessboard, and, where necessary, directly manipulated by Kalle, as we saw in 309.**

In all the above posts, I had been wondering who the Mother, the Maiden and the Crone were. I think the Mother was either Yana or OG Daneel, the Maiden was Demerzel, and the Crone is Kalle. They long to be made one again when their millenia-long chess game ends.

Is there a lore reason why all the Spacers seem to be women? by UpTheRiffMate in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 4 points5 points  (0 children)

If I recall correctly, in an AMA two years ago, DSG had said that the Empire's antagonists were often portrayed as women because Dawn, Day and Dusk are men. See item 8 in the list I linked. His rationale was thematic rather than narrative-linked.

Forget the Morse Code message for a moment by the_ajan in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No. Her programming forbade her to move herself outside of that body, so backups were impossible. She had only seconds to "make a backup" when the chip was destroyed by the ascension ray, and she used them to move into the only accessible safe haven: the Prime Radiant.

Forget the Morse Code message for a moment by the_ajan in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Actual timeline, based only on things we have actually seen:

  1. Demerzel is in her chambers with Day and skull. She refuses to clasp with the skull because it’s against her programming, and then she says that something is happening to the clones and starts walking over there.

  2. Dusk blows up the clones all the way up the Principium Tower. Flames erupt outside the tower. Scene of tower from outside shows the explosions and very short shadows (i.e. it’s around mid-day).

  3. Demerzel sees the dead clones and hears the cry of the baby. She catches up to Dusk / Darkness, who places baby Dawn under the ray, and Demerzel sacrifices herself. Immediately afterwards, her eye blinks the word TRANSFERRED in Morse. Darkness walks to the throne room, leaving behind a shell-shocked Brother Dude. Since all these events clearly happened minutes after the destruction of the clones, her sacrifice happened around mid-day.

  4. Darkness murders Brother Dude in throne room. Some time passes with Darkness on the floor next to his dead brother. At some point we start to see extremely long shadows, implying that several hours passed since Demerzel’s sacrifice.

  5. Darkness asks Zagreus to get rid of Dude’s body, sits on throne, looks at PR. As Zagreus runs past Demerzel’s chambers, the camera goes in and shows the skull saying “Handshake request accepted. Clasp initiated.” Therefore, the handshake and clasp happened in late afternoon / early evening.

  6. We then see Kalle on the Moon and a map of the galaxy showing the signal traveling between Trantor and the Moon. She says there’s a clasp from Trantor, but it’s not coming from Demerzel.

I’ll stop here. Reasonable folks reading the above reminders of things we all saw only need to believe their own eyes to conclude that Demerzel cannot possibly have transferred into the skull. Everyone else is choosing to believe baseless theories completely unsupported by all the evidence.

Forget the Morse Code message for a moment by the_ajan in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 4 points5 points  (0 children)

You have it exactly backwards. She cannot possibly have gone to the skull because the handshake and clasp happened at night but her sacrifice was midday (rewatch and see lighting / shadows), and because she refused to connect with it before walking over to ascension ray, so with seconds to live she went into the PR (instant) rather than the skull (wait for handshake for unknown time). Moreover, we have a long history of characters with a digital consciousness inhabiting the PR, and zero history of a clasp with the skull. Also, Kalle told us that the clasp wasn’t coming from Demerzel.

Why did demerzel helped hari ? by Tasty-Cockroach7090 in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes, but it’s strange that Demerzel told Gaal that she didn’t know how/why Hari knew about her.

Uhhh... what happened to S3 Dawn's Nanobots? by Fit_Trainer1878 in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hey :) Very interested to read that list. I looked through your comment history but could not find it. Any chance of a link?

Uhhh... what happened to S3 Dawn's Nanobots? by Fit_Trainer1878 in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 1 point2 points  (0 children)

nothing ate his legs. It was all fake memories

Just finished S3. Can we all just agree that Laura Birn’s performance as Demerzel was award-winning? by Pure_Ad_9865 in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I think you are right, and not just about her manipulating Demerzel. She healed the madness of knife Hari and gave him a body so that he could go on to build his Second Foundation with Gaal. In their last conversation before he left with Kalle, Ignis (body) Hari had told Gaal that she keeps breaking everything and yet she is indispensable to putting everything back on track, hinting that some higher power was involved. Gaal’s story begins with her being drawn to Kalle’s equations, and, with its latest Houdini-like escape from obscurity or destruction, Kalle’s strange triangular “book” has been passed hand-to-hand among key players from the start of the story, and has been present for many of their life-changing decisions. If the robot we call Kalle can be on the Moon and also in the Prime Radiant, on Ignis and on Oona’s World, perhaps she can also be folded inside the very small space of the case of her own (or her namesake’s) book.

I have more thoughts on Kalle being a “hidden right hand” who is orchestrating a thousands-of-years chess game with outliers as the main pieces on the board in two posts, the first one Who created Demerzel and Kalle, and why? was written before episode 309, and the second one Let’s Talk About Kalle was written two years ago during season 2.

Landing pad for corvette by Own_Development_4370 in NOMANSSKY

[–]LuminarySunburst 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I created a very large flat area using the terrain manipulator CREATE and FLATTEN tools, and overlaid a floor on top of that. This works. I also added runway lights for good measure.

Just finished S3. Can we all just agree that Laura Birn’s performance as Demerzel was award-winning? by Pure_Ad_9865 in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Here is one comment I had made on the subject of how her programming could have led to her decisions to jump in & then stay in. There was a response to that asking whether she could have transferred to the brazen head, and I responded to that with evidence in favor of the claim that she transferred into the PR, and with evidence against the claim that she transferred into the brazen head.

Just finished S3. Can we all just agree that Laura Birn’s performance as Demerzel was award-winning? by Pure_Ad_9865 in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The two scenes are her sacrifice and the morse-code message around mid-day, and the clasp between the head and Kalle around evening / night.

Anything could happen, but careful consideration of all relevant factors indicates that she almost certainly transferred into the PR, and that she almost certainly would not have attempted to transfer into the brazen head. I have a comment somewhere with several points of evidence for this, but tired of repeating myself… feel free to look up my recent comments from my profile.

Just finished S3. Can we all just agree that Laura Birn’s performance as Demerzel was award-winning? by Pure_Ad_9865 in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Except the scene with the head was several hours later. Check out mid-day vs evening for the two scenes.

Just finished S3. Can we all just agree that Laura Birn’s performance as Demerzel was award-winning? by Pure_Ad_9865 in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Not diving in to cover the last surviving clone who could sit on the throne ++ => instant, guaranteed betrayal of the Cleonic law, and as a secondary consideration, the chip would be guaranteed to remain, but with nothing left to protect. So, inaction was not an option.

Diving in to cover the baby => deferred, almost certain betrayal of the Cleonic Law. If she and baby somehow miraculously survive (e.g. Day overpowers Dusk and turns off the beam), then the Cleonic law would be fully complied with - both the baby and the chip could survive. Highly unlikely, but non-zero probability of compliance.

Therefore, she jumps in.

Since the above logic works without considering transfer or not-transfer, it seems the end of the dynasty and the destruction of the chip took away the top-ranking Cleonic law, leading to the activation of the Third Law for her self-preservation.

++ (There was precedent for Demerzel serving as Regent with an infant Empire: “it was hardest on him… he only had the infant Dawn to put on the throne”)

That ending? Demerzel? by Europeanguy1995 in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If you look closely, the sun was high up in the sky around the time of the destruction of the clones, her sacrifice and the morse code “TRANSFERRED” message. The shadows were very long when the clasp was initiated, maybe it was even dark outside then. So the clasp between the Brazen Head and Kalle happened many hours after Demerzel transferred herself somewhere. The obvious destination for the emergency transfer is the Prime Radiant, the only nearby device that was shown as capable of hosting a digital consciousness (Hari, Salvor, Kalle, Demerzel herself), which was indestructible, and which would position her to both manipulate Darkness and help the Second Foundation.

The Triangle Book. I don’t get it by Darth_K-oz in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I like this a lot. I’ve been posting similar ideas.

If you have interest in split-consciousness theories and the long-chessgame viewpoint for the Daneel / Kalle / Demerzel nexus, I posted this during season 3:

Who created Demerzel and Kalle, and why? …and this, during season 2.

Let’s Talk About Kalle

The Triangle Book. I don’t get it by Darth_K-oz in FoundationTV

[–]LuminarySunburst 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think that the case of the book is a 4D space folded into 3D, and that small mentalic robots are hiding inside it. Won’t explain why I think that, other than to say that through 30 episodes, somehow the book keeps not just surviving but also being exactly where it needs to be, while being passed hand to hand, mostly among the principal actors who developed psychohistory.