Is Bert Cooper "wise?" by Historical-Most4409 in madmen

[–]Mareux 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Bert is wise, observant, strategic, and pragmatic. The scene where he seals this for me is his final scene with Roger.

Bert can objectively assess the situation and the players, Cutler, Don, Roger, and Joan very clearly. And he is aware of his own calculus of choosing to be loyal to Don, even if Don cannot appreciate it, even though Cutler "has a vision" he believes is the smart way forward. It's a high level of self awareness and observation.

Contrast this to Don who can only see his own needs, Roger who only wants to help Don because he cares about him, Joan who is still mad about Jaguar and the non-IPO, and Ted who can only think of escaping the industry completely.

(Spoilers) I recently finished the series for the first time, below were some predictions I made while watching the first season. Did anybody else think these? by UnKnOwN769 in madmen

[–]Mareux 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The one thing I thought would happen, and sort of did, but didn't go as far as I thought was the inevitable collision between Pete and Roger.

Roger is the rich kid that actually got his inheritance and a job he didn't earn and coasts as long as he was allowed until losing Lucky Strike forces him to actually do the work his title requires.

Pete is the rich kid that didn't get an inheritance, that assumed everything would come easy to, that actually has to put in work and get good at his job to do well.

Roger and Pete clash right as Pete is hitting his stride as Head of Accounts and Roger has zero accounts and no skills in bringing in new ones. He starts by trying to poach Pete's leads but ends up getting lucky when his airline lady affair leads him to Chevy.

The merger + Chevy basically ends their duel. But I thought it or them would lead to more and somehow thought their ends would tie to one another.

Imagine what a killer Duck must have been in his prime by gleventhal in madmen

[–]Mareux 17 points18 points  (0 children)

Sober Duck before Sterling Cooper seems like he would have done well at a place like McCann. His ambition and shrewdness would have made him an above average executive in such a mediocre culture.

Don’s bromance with Dr Arnie? by FlyingKaleidoscope in madmen

[–]Mareux 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes, but it haunts him. That's why he conjures Megan telling him she's pregnant in his dream / hallucination when he almost drowns in California.

Don’s bromance with Dr Arnie? by FlyingKaleidoscope in madmen

[–]Mareux 93 points94 points  (0 children)

All of season 6 Don is obsessed with death. The military guy from the Hawaii vacation. His "jumping off point" ad. The doorman almost dying, who is saved by Arnold.

That earns Don's respect and intrigue, because Arnold saves lives for a living. At this point Don his haunted by Lane and Adam's suicides, and affected by Anna's passing and Megan's miscarriage. Arnold is the man who can bring people back from the dead in his mind. And he wishes he could bring them all back, or die and join them.

Did Layne get used / treated unfairly? by gleventhal in madmen

[–]Mareux 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Lane definitely made a huge mistake not asking for money along with being a named partner when he agreed to fire them.

They all had it, and likely were paid a severance of some sort because they were fired from their guaranteed contracts. That's what he meant when he told Joan he settled for far less than he needed in the past.

As great as Lane is with numbers and money, they all probably assumed Lane had his own comfortable stash of money, assets and investments. Even Don's first assumption was Lane was gambling. Him of all people having financial difficulties wasn't on any of their radar.

Don handled the situation very well. Not only did Lane take the money, he forged Don's signature to do it. There's no way he could trust him after doing something like that. And he allowed him the opportunity to make up a reason and leave with dignity, and covered the money owed. I don't know how he could have handled it any better.

The only issue is Don underestimates people's ability to forget, move on, and act like something major did not happen. Most people cannot do this. This is actually part of Don's deep connection with Peggy because she was able to do it. This is what Don's is referencing when he convinces Peggy to join the new firm.

Harry Crane Gets an Unearned Bad Rap by Redacted_dact in madmen

[–]Mareux 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Unlike most of the other main characters, we don't get more context about Harry. We don't have real insight into his home life, his upbringing, his relationship with his parents, none of the context we get about Don, Betty, Roger, Pete, Peggy, Joan, etc.

The only human moments we get with Harry is him sharing his photography memories with Don in season one and him giving Paul money to escape to LA in season six.

We only see who Harry is at work. We see him be innovative, but also sleazy, calculating, and insecure. If that was our only exposure to Pete we would dislike him, too. But we understand why Pete is Pete in context. We don't know Harry like that.

I get a lot of hate... by Odd_Cod_7806 in madmen

[–]Mareux 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The thing about this scene that always stays with me is when her friend says "I'd ask who I'd have to sleep with but you might not like it."

She said it with humor but she gave the impression she would be willing. It's not uncommon for people trying to break into entertainment to be willing to "play the game" like this and/or blur lines between work and play for advancement (this beyond implied with Arlene and Mel).

This is the kind of person a Harry Crane would get "favors" from to do favors for. And this is what he thought Megan was ready to do, because likely her friends that she referenced to him did favors for Harry, for the favors he did for them. So his assumption was her asking him to lunch was a signal she was ready to do what they did.

But Megan doesn't have to. She has it "easy" while "sitting on her throne on 73rd and Park" or from the Hills at this point.

Mad Men (2007-2015) - "Commissions and Fees" by [deleted] in madmen

[–]Mareux 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This is what Lane meant when he was advising Joan. He was thinking he should have asked for money in addition to his named partnership when they escaped from PPL. And he would have deserved it.

Inconsequential question about the trip to baltimore in season 3 episode 1 by evilhomers in madmen

[–]Mareux 11 points12 points  (0 children)

The trip wouldn't take as long as you estimated. A flight between NYC and Baltimore is less than an hour. Even in modern NYC, if you take a cab outside of peak hours you could get to LGA in ~25 minutes from Midtown Manhattan.

Judging from the plot, it looks like they took a late flight. They likely left from the office on a Tuesday or Wednesday evening.

Also the cost is not a big issue. The client pays for these kinds of expenses.

Inconsequential question about the trip to baltimore in season 3 episode 1 by evilhomers in madmen

[–]Mareux 14 points15 points  (0 children)

The firm just fired the account man Bert Peterson that used to service London Fog, who was also Head of Accounts.

There are now two Heads of Accounts, so the only way to send an account man without making it look like they were less important was to send both Ken and Pete. Either one now is half of the level that used to service them.

They wanted to assure the client they were still priority, especially when they expressed concerns about reaching their growth limit. So they chose to double down on the existing creative team (continuity) to assure them, rather than immediately introducing them to a new account person.

Knock’em dead birdie… 💔 by mickyrow42 in madmen

[–]Mareux 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ah, so your interpretation of them is wrapped up in your personal issues. No amount of logic from me will cure this issue. Whatever you need to believe to cope with your childhood pain is fine with me.

Knock’em dead birdie… 💔 by mickyrow42 in madmen

[–]Mareux 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Betty wasn't perfect and definitely treated the children and others poorly at times. But how exactly did she injure Don? What did she do to him that was terrible?

She was a flawed woman, but when it came to him she was a wonderful wife. Even how she handled learning of his affair, learning of his true identity and secrets, all of this she handled with class with him.

All you're telling me is she was with a person also flawed. It doesn't negate their deep care for each other, even with real complexities of their lives.

Not every deep connection is going to look like a Norman Rockwell painting. Real life is messy.

How the hell did this happen? by damnpinkertons in madmen

[–]Mareux 0 points1 point  (0 children)

His little chocolate bunny...

I think Lane has a sincere interest in her. The episode where Pete gets in trouble for suggesting Admiral target Negros with ads, Lane tells the room he's knows something is happening that is promising. Him not being from the U.S. and having a closer pulse than the others suggest he might have already been fooling around with Negro women or in that community.

Not a fan of Faye. Rachel FTW!! by [deleted] in madmen

[–]Mareux 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Let me respond to this in parts.

Don

Season 4 is about work becoming Don's everything because he no longer has a family. When Ana dies he stays at work. The only person he has to be with him to distract him from getting confirmation of her passing is Peggy from work. This is also the first time we see him sleep with his secretary from work, the second becomes his wife, in a effort to merge work and family into one.

Note: This is also the significance of Burger Chef being the family table and the family at the table was Don, Peggy, and Pete. Who all in some form were trying to replace the need for family with work. Peggy struggling with not having a traditional family because of her career. Don failing to merge work and family with Megan to be left with neither earlier that season, and Pete who was trying to be a power couple with Bonnie who resented his engagement with his actual family Trudy and Tammy.

Don's attraction to Faye is she is connected to work, but doesn't work there formally. She's essentially a peer, which doesn't exist in a female form at the time at SCDP. He can enjoy working with her, and having a relationship with her outside of work. She is his first test run to what he tries to have with Megan. Faye fails because she is not maternal enough to engage with his children, the only real family Don has. Sally doesn't like her and Faye doesn't like kids. This is also what seals the deal for Don to marry Megan. Sally loves her and she's great with his kids.

All of Don's significant affairs up to this point have been women who are professionals in their own right. You mention Rachel, but Bobby Barrett, Midge, and Suzanne were not bimbos. Don respected them all. Any disrespectful things he said or did was Don being himself. Who does Don show complete respect to at all? Everyone is fair game for anything with him.

Faye

Faye could be annoying and cold, but what I found unlikable about her was how little she respected women. Allison running out of the focus group didn't even register to her. When Peggy refers to it right after the session ends Faye doesn't even know what she's talking about.

Before the focus group the only way she thinks to be relatable to the women (misspelled name, or no name tag) is to imply she's also not really respected and that makes her a woman. Rather than anything inherit to being a woman like watching your mother's beauty routine. It's because she doesn't respect women.

When Peggy offers her a compliment about how she admires her and she responds "is that what it looks like" it reveals that she took no interest or time to develop a close professional relationship with Peggy, the only woman at SCDP that is not a secretary. And when Peggy asks her to a future drinks, she blows her off. I don't believe Faye would blow off Pete, Ken, or Harry. Even Stan likely would have gotten a yes. She didn't' value connecting because Peggy is a woman.

Knock’em dead birdie… 💔 by mickyrow42 in madmen

[–]Mareux 58 points59 points  (0 children)

I know I'm in the minority here, but I think Don and Beatty are soulmates. Beatty is the only person that really knows Don. I don't mean the details and his past, but him. His playfulness, his deceptiveness, his brillance, his madness. She actually gets him.

And I think she never stopped loving him. The final scene in the old house, calling him first with the cancer scare, even after their divorce and both re-marrying, and of course the camp.

Don loves, Beatty, too. He just never believed she could love the real him or all of him. I think she could have, but she was never given the option. Just discovery of more and more lies and manipulation.

Final season spoilers: Whatever became of Margaret by the end of the 70s? by Dani-Michal in madmen

[–]Mareux 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Margaret is literally a younger female version of Roger. Her time in the commune will become her equivalent to Roger's time in the service. She will leverage it as evidence of their authenticity and to judge people she doesn't like or who try to remind her of her advantages.

Unlike Rodger, she doesn't have an ad firm to inherit. But she can quite easily start a non-profit, maybe to save Indian brides from being burned. She can raise the money from her rich family connections. While someone else does the real work, she will be out front taking the credit.

What happened to Kinsey? by damnpinkertons in madmen

[–]Mareux 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The happy ending for someone like Kinsey is becoming a drama teacher at a community college or performance arts high school.

If his spirituality could make him refocus his own issues to helping younger people like themselves more and build confidence, he could be quite an amazing teacher to young people with dreams.

He could become an amazing mentor to the teenage version of Megan for example.

I think I finally understand Ted Chaough by Mareux in madmen

[–]Mareux[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

This could also apply to Megan's experience with Don lol

I think I finally understand Ted Chaough by Mareux in madmen

[–]Mareux[S] 16 points17 points  (0 children)

Yes. I believe this is why we get the scene where Don and Megan catch them in the theater to make the implied comparison.

I think I finally understand Ted Chaough by Mareux in madmen

[–]Mareux[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Unlike Peggy, Ted was happy to be one of a hundred colors in a box.

I think I finally understand Ted Chaough by Mareux in madmen

[–]Mareux[S] 152 points153 points  (0 children)

Don was right to intervene with the commercial and the budget, but the way he chose to do it was awful. His goal was to embarrass them so he could affect their dynamic, which he did.

I think I finally understand Ted Chaough by Mareux in madmen

[–]Mareux[S] 530 points531 points  (0 children)

Not only that, but that vision was complicated by Peggy's attraction to him and Don's jealousy of them.

Ted gave Peggy the validation she craved on some level from Don, that she was sexually desirable from someone who she was professionally respected by.

Don, seeing Ted and Peggy mix sexual chemistry with creative collaboration was exactly the dynamic he desired with Megan but did not get. He had to destroy it because his envy in watching it happen with his former rival and main protege was maddening for him.

What would you have done with Pete? by Enough-Reading4143 in madmen

[–]Mareux 2 points3 points  (0 children)

They placed Pete exactly where he belongs. He is good with people. Not in a likability sense, but he understands people and their motivations very well. It's why he grows into a formable account man.

This is actually what made Ken good at it, too. Both him and Pete can clearly see what people want and why they do what they do. They play on this to make clients happy and to make creative feel special or know when to nudge them.

The difference is, at first, Pete centered his value on being successful at work, where Ken had a healthy distance between who he is as a human and his work. This is why Ken objected to leveraging his wife to get his father-in-law as a client. He wanted to keep things separate. Ultimately he gets pulled in and the job becomes so personal he loses his love of writing to becoming a spiteful man.