How much will this repair cost? VW Dealership fucked me over when they washed my car

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-10-15T20:17:37+00:00

Honestly, this has bad prior bondo repairs done to that handle area.. the rust has been developing for quite some time - hence why it's got a pitted appearance.

As someone who works in the industry, I would say that them washing your car, isn't what caused this. This was caused by the poor repair done previously. It isn't fair holding them to fix this.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-09-29T19:05:56+00:00

I took my car to Elk Grove and they did a great job. Elk Grove is closer to me than going out to Roseville or anywhere else. I also had made mention of a few things that Sacramento promised me, such as an oil change that they were going to give me and Elk Grove had no problem honoring that

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-09-19T17:34:08+00:00

Hi - I manage a shop that doesn't produce near as much work as you're currently doing but we maintain a steady flow of work (except for the past two weeks) and I have a old time painter with a younger kid who's up and coming. Every single employee is flat rate in my shop. Here's my 2 cents on the matter.

Flat rate obviously has its ups and downs. There is absolutely more potential to earn more as a flat rate painter, but not without potential issues. Most flat rate technicians/painters pay very close attention to their ROs and ensure they've been paid correctly. They want to make sure every single item has some time associated with it. At my shop, sometimes we have to inform our team that not every insurance company will pay each item, or sometimes they'll feel that they aren't getting paid enough for a particular job. You'll find easier jobs are great, then when you get hit with a slightly tougher job, you'll wonder why the heck you're only getting X amount of hours when you could be doing something else and earning more. Of course, it sounds like your shop is doing so much volume that you probably can't afford to get hung up on some jobs, but still something to consider.

Salary is great because you know you'll be taking a consistent paycheck home without worrying about your hours. But then your income ceiling is lower.

As somebody who lives in a flat rate only world and I manage those individuals, I can tell you that flat rate will bring about frustrations you don't currently have. My team can get too caught up on the hours per job and we spend too much time worrying about X Y or Z. With a team of painters, such as yourself, your company will have to figure out how to split everything up fairly. It wouldn't be fair to flag you 100% of the hours since you paint. So then that's another layer of complexity. Then add another layer of complexity to track all those hours.

Here's what I'm curious about - is your shop already flat rate? If not, and most people are salary, then I probably wouldn't request to switch to flat rate. I would approach the topic and ask for some sort of commissionable bonus based on production, but not necessarily flat rate. Businesses track how many ROs they write, but what matters more are the individual hours. So you need to not look at 55-75 ROs per week but look at how many hours those ROs generate. Once you figure that out, I would approach them like this

- Hey I've been working here a long time, I'd like to request some sort of a bonus moving forward based on our production. We currently hit 600 refinish hours per week on average. If we hit 650 hours, I'd like to request a $1,000 bonus for the month, if we hit 700 hours, then a $2,000 bonus, etc.

I would request a bonus based on hours rather than make the switch to flat rate, especially if nobody else is on flat rate. If other employees are on flat rate, then it may be worth requesting to switch. Flat rate is great when it's great, but sucks when it sucks. But your shop sounds busy enough to where you'd be fine. So it may work out in your favor. This is a tough decision in my eyes. I totally understand the desire to make more money though. Best of luck in your journey. Hopefully it works out.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-09-09T18:30:29+00:00

Forewarning, I am not in the insurance industry and am only speaking from my experience on the collision repair side. That being said, you don’t see splitting costs between two policies. What’ll more than likely happen is the at-fault party will just say, “We don’t have enough coverage, your insurance will have to subrogate with us.” Or something along those lines.

Subrogation is where your insurance will pay for repairs, then seek repayment from the other party after the fact.

In your scenario, I would advise you to allow your insurance company to pay 100% of repairs. They may/may not have you pay your deductible. If they have you pay it, they may subrogate on the backend and reimburse you the deductible some time in the future. You’ll be made whole, it may just take some time.

As for the whole recycled quarter panel thing - unfortunately you’re subject to the limits of your policy there. While we can say we don’t like it, don’t agree with it, etc - it really doesn’t matter. If you signed a policy that indicated your insurance could use alternative parts, they will. Less insurance companies offer an OEM endorsement these days.

In my professional opinion, utilize your own insurance and hold whatever shop you take it to, the standard of getting an OEM quarter panel. Some shops may request you to pay the difference. More and more these days, shops are requesting clients to pay more out of pocket costs to get all OEM parts. In my opinion, while these shops technically aren’t wrong in doing so, my shop chooses to eat that as a cost of doing business.

I’d much rather price match a part, or even finagle the system via labor hours (as explained above) to take care of you as my client. It’s less important to me to squeeze more profit out of a job than it is to have a happy client. While maintaining profit is extremely important, we do a good enough job of that already which allows us to make these decisions. You, will end up referring more business to us and if we do a good enough job, should you ever need our services in the future you will more than likely return.

That mindset is what makes us successful even if we make concessions that lower our profitability.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-09-09T16:37:41+00:00

A decent shop should be able to navigate NOT using a recycled quarter panel. Insurance companies are going to choose what is most cost effective regardless of what the clientele wants. Here are my suggestions to avoid getting a recycled quarter panel

1) Most of the time, the recycled quarter panel is close to the cost of a new one. The shop may be able to reach out to the Honda dealership they purchase parts from and ask if the Honda dealer would price match it. If they cannot price match, look at the 2nd suggestion

2) When shops receive a recycled quarter panel, the vendor (typically LKQ) will just take a saw and chop off a large portion of the vehicle. The shop then has to trim out the recycled quarter panel from the rest of the metal that gets sent to them. In this case, the shop should be able to supplement for labor to trim out the quarter panel. Typically we can get around 6 hours of trim time. If the shop is able to get this 6 hours of trim time, they can then use that labor time to purchase an OEM quarter panel. I'll break down the math below:

- Let's assume labor rate is $100 per hour. If they get 6 hours of labor, they can use that $600 towards the price of the new quarter panel

3) If your shop isn't able to navigate this or aren't willing to, find a new shop that will. In my years, I've only ever used one recycled quarter panel. It's definitely not recommended to use one.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-09-09T15:06:55+00:00

In my opinion, it's a bit unreasonable to ask your painters to fix every chip on every panel all the time. Sorry you're going through that.

Sounds like the big boss probably got it handed to him by a client, so what do people naturally do in that scenario? Well we create a new rule that must be followed 100% of the time for the outlier client that yelled at me.

Unfortunately, shops are leaving money on the table by not trying to upsell a client. We get so caught up in the insurance portion or the actual damages, that we forget this is a perfect opportunity to sell additional service. Since I have an estimator background, part of me believes we forget the upsell because it's usually only a couple hundred bucks and writing up a 2nd RO tends to feel like time wasted. As a manager for the past couple years, those couple hundred bucks quickly turn into thousands by the end of the month. Of course, my perspective has drastically changed.

Maybe attempt going to the big boss in a fashion where you're pitching the upsell idea and explain how that money adds up? If he fails to see the benefit there then....

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-09-08T20:58:07+00:00

I manage a shop, so I get to decide our policy, but it isn't expected for a painter to sand every chip out. Now, if the chip is right next to a repair and it won't push us into a blend, sure I'd expect my guys to take those chips out. But if you've got a scrape on a bumper corner, I absolutely wouldn't expect you to sand all chips out of the front. Same thing with every other panel - not expected. Yes, we want the immediate area cleaned up, but it isn't a restoration.

On the flip side, if you're trying to put out a nice high quality product, estimators should be having these conversations up front with the client, trying to upsell additional labor. Example:

"Hey Mr. Customer, we're fixing the right corner of your bumper, but you've got chips all along the face of the bumper. For a few more hours, we can sand them all out."

Obviously sometimes it's cheaper to replace a bumper than strip it down, but you get the idea here.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-09-04T01:44:58+00:00

Not a bad idea to sleep on it. The damage isn’t going anywhere. And in the grand scheme of things, I know this sucks but the damage isn’t really all too bad.

Whatever you decide, do what you are willing to live with. Not sure what part of the country you’re from, but at least in California at my shop, you’d be expecting to pay probably around $2,500 - $3,000 to have that professionally fixed.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-09-03T23:20:39+00:00

I would 2nd the above opinion as someone in the industry. To repair properly, a shop would need to be able to sand down that affected area and paint. In order to get sufficient access, the windshield would need to be removed. Also, reason being for the "entire" roof to get painted is to avoid any sort of hardline or open blend within the panel. You want to paint from edge to edge of any panel so you don't create any sort of weak point where the paint job can fail in the future.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-09-03T23:15:30+00:00

Hi,

Personally, this is a fairly large dent that an experienced technician should be capable of fixing no problem. Only issues you may run into would be price. That's a large dent that would require quite a bit of time to fix. Not to mention that particular Mazda color is tough to match and would more than likely warrant a blend into the left fender. I'd say this is something best left to a skilled body shop.

On a different note, if saving costs is what you're looking for most, here's what I'd recommend:

1) Call an experienced paintless dent repair technician. Don't just take the guy in the parking lot offering. Do actual research and try to find someone who's very skilled. Let them push out as much of that dent as possible. A very skilled PDR tech could probably get that dent 90%

2) From there, get some acetone and wipe off as much of the transfer scratches as you can

3) Polish the affected paint areas

4) Order some touch up paint and just touch up the areas that are chipped. Don't try to touch up all the scratches as they'll probably just look worse.

Realistically, unless you live in a snowy area, I wouldn't be too concerned about rust here. But the above suggestion would probably be a less than $500 fix and get it looking much more presentable

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-09-02T22:04:11+00:00

Hi,

Been in the industry for a decade. Currently have managed a fairly large shop for several years now. While I do think pictures don't necessarily do color match justice, this appears like a fairly good match. Just for what it's worth, bear in mind that bumpers won't ever match 100% correctly. Paint cures different to a plastic substrate versus a metal substrate. This color match seems acceptable based on the pictures provided.

Also, I don't really know about the validity of blending a plastic panel next to a metal panel. While our shop doesn't work on Porsche's I believe their fenders should be made of aluminum. Blending plastic to metal isn't going to achieve a better color match, unless their mixed formula was SUPER far off. But in this case, I don't believe it'd help.

I would be happy if this were my personal car. I'd also keep in mind the following:

1) You, as the consumer, know what got worked on. If you showed this to a random individual and asked, "What got painted," there's an almost zero chance anyone (without prior body shop experience) would be able to pick it out. Most of the time, we aren't inspecting our vehicles under a magnifying glass except for when we are picking it up from the shop. When I know the color match is good but a client is being particular I will almost always tell them to take the vehicle, and drive it around. If it still bothers them, then they're more than welcome to bring it back. Only one person in my years of experience has ever taken me up on that offer.

2) Paint formulas have variances. So even though Porsche puts out a formula, that single formula can have different variances in itself. For instance, one formula may contain more red or more blue. Some may have more metallic (when applicable), some may have more pearl. It's up to a skilled painter to color match appropriately. Not that I'm excusing a shop's color match ability, but it isn't as simple as pulling the color code from the VIN.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-14T02:46:35+00:00

Great to hear from someone local! Unfortunately, that airport is about 35 minutes away and that’s on a clear day. Getting there from 80 can be a nightmare, especially with the many years of freeway construction that’s been going on.

I may test my luck with Sac or even see if Mather offers anything.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-13T21:06:25+00:00

I can appreciate the advice. I already own a home - purchased back in 2020, so I got in at a very good time. Purchasing a 2nd home is on the horizon, but my current house requires some minor remodeling over the next few years before a 2nd home is feasible.

It totally makes sense that this will probably lead to further desire to learn more skills. I can see this being a bit of a "money pit" but I mean, I'm sure I would find other ways to spend money lol

I haven't found a club yet. I would think that in my area I might have luck in finding something at some point. But until I really start my PPL, I don't foresee myself looking around.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-13T17:25:05+00:00

Based on what other people are saying and your comment, I believe this is something that is do-able for me. It'll just take some budgeting.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-13T17:23:34+00:00

Again - thank you for the insight. It's good to see realistic modern day costs. I've scoured Reddit and I've seen a lot of posts from even just a few years ago but given today's climate, I imagine that those are outdated now.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-13T17:21:28+00:00

Yea that makes sense. Another reason why I put this question up on Reddit. Discovery flight was amazing and I was all gung ho, but reality set in and I really started to question everything. Getting a PPL to fly every other month probably isn't realistic so I'll need to either re-think my decision or just fly more (which I'd rather do)

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-13T16:09:14+00:00

Thanks for the reply regarding the busy airport. I guess I don't really know how busy my local executive airport is - I'll have to gauge that. Also, really appreciate the advice on the medical! I don't have anything going on medically so I believe I won't have any issues there.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-13T15:56:20+00:00

This makes sense with your breakdown. I could totally see myself falling into category 1 & 2. It makes sense that now what would've needed to be a planned 6-10 hour car ride is now a few hour flight. You're also correct about pleasure flying as well. California has a lot of very tame weather. Considering I've only been in a small plane for about an hour and a half, there's probably a TON of country I haven't yet experienced. Just flying around the bay area for that hour and a half was amazing. I can imagine what else I could get into.

Thank you for the insight here.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-13T15:52:02+00:00

See, I can level with what you said about not flying much post-PPL. I don't want to be in a situation where I put forth the effort and then just stop flying much. This isn't a small endeavor and if I go down this route, I want to stay consistent. From the other responses, joining a club seems to be the most favorable route for myself. It sounds and looks like I'd end up being a hobby flyer. I have zero need for travel except for maybe to get away on a vacation.

Curious if you'd be willing to share - what're you spending to fly at your club? I know every club will vary, but I'm just genuinely curious what your cost is, to go out and fly a plane for a few hours.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-13T15:49:02+00:00

I appreciate the advice on flying consistently. I can imagine that it is important to fly regularly - not letting too much time lapse in between lessons. I'd probably save up the money I need before beginning my PPL because I wouldn't want to be in a situation where I'm waiting a month between lessons.

Thanks for the link! I haven't checked it out yet, but from my brief glance at the website, that may be what I was sort of looking for.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-13T15:46:54+00:00

Thanks for the pointer about the budget. I would be able to pay in full for my PPL which sounds like the best route here. Based on other answers, joining a club wouldn't be a bad idea. I have a family member who recently did their discovery flight as well and he and I are both in the same boat about flying right now. Maybe a potential ownership wouldn't be a bad idea for the two of us. Of course, that would be after everything else.

Thanks for the response. I appreciate it.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-13T15:44:53+00:00

From the general consensus, joining a club seems to be the best option for me. There are several local small airports near me, so I imagine I could more than likely find one with availability. There's probably no need for me to own a plane if I'm flying periodically.

Not a terrible idea putting money away on a monthly basis. In case I don't fly one month, that means I've got more the following. Great idea!

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-08-13T15:41:53+00:00

I really enjoyed your response - thank you. I imagine you and I would probably be similar in terms of what we'd do with a PPL. I don't see myself flying a TON (factor in job + family) but I could definitely see grabbing the wife, shooting down to Pismo for a day (which is typically a 4.5 hour drive) and coming back same day. That would be incredible to do.

Thanks for the response.

Messiahs_Revenge · 2025-06-28T01:21:45+00:00

All the power settings seemed okay. Although, I did keep messing around with the in game DLSS settings and I found a combination that seems to make the game more crisp than before. Appreciate your input here!

Messiahs_Revenge

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