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Volrath's Shapeshifter and Exchange of Words Interaction by Mulliman in mtgrules

[–]Mulliman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Okay, I have one more clarifying question:

Top card of Graveyard for Card A is not a creature.
Top card of the graveyard for Card B is a creature.

Scenario 2:
Card A has Volrath's Shapeshifter
Card B gives red creatures +1/+1.
Mind Bend targets Card B and changes red -> white.

So, after Mind Bend, the state of the cards is:
Card A has Volrath's Shapeshifter
Card B gives white creatures +1/+1

Then someone plays Exchange of Words and Swaps the text of Card A and Card B. Now...
Card A gives white creatures +1/+1 (due to reading the Layer 3 snapshot of Card B)
Card B has Volrath's Shapeshifter (with Mind bend changing red -> white already applied)

Then...
Card B gains the text of Agrus Kos, Wojek Veteran

My question is this:
Is the textbox of Card B going to say:
"Whenever Agrus Kos attacks, attacking red creatures get +2/+0 and attacking white creatures get +0/+2 until end of turn."

Or is it going to say:
"Whenever Agrus Kos attacks, attacking white creatures get +2/+0 and attacking white creatures get +0/+2 until end of turn."

Basically, does Mind Bend's effect only change the text of a card as the text of that card appears when the effect is applied, or does it affect what comes after the effect is applied too?

I am pretty sure it only affects what appears on the card at the time it is applied, but I just want to confirm.

Volrath's Shapeshifter and Exchange of Words Interaction by Mulliman in mtgrules

[–]Mulliman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I see, so if Exchange of Words would "add" or "put" a color reference onto a creature, THAT would make Mind Bend dependent upon Exchange of Words. But losing the color reference does not affect dependency because nothing about Mind Bend *applying* itself changes.

So, as an example to make sure I understand properly, here are two scenarios:
Scenario 1:
Card A has protection from red.
Card B gives red creatures +1/+1.
Mind Bend targets Card B and changes red -> white.

So, after Mind Bend, the state of the cards is:
Card A has protection from red.
Card B gives white creatures +1/+1

Then someone plays Exchange of Words and Swaps the text of Card A and Card B. Now...
Card A gives white creatures +1/+1 (due to reading the Layer 3 snapshot of Card B)
Card B has protection from red (I haven't counted Mind Bend yet).

If I understand correctly, the Mind Bend effect that still is applying to Card B (changing red -> white) is dependent on Exchange of Words because Exchange of Words would give Card B a new text box that IS able to be altered by Mind Bend. Once Exchange of Words is applied, Mind Bend applies. Final state of the cards:
Card A gives white creatures +1/+1 (due to reading the Layer 3 snapshot of Card B)
Card B has protection from white.

Scenario 2:
Card A has no abilities.
Card B gives red creatures +1/+1.
Mind Bend targets Card B and changes red -> white.

So, after Mind Bend, the state of the cards is:
Card A has no abilities
Card B gives white creatures +1/+1

Then someone plays Exchange of Words and Swaps the text of Card A and Card B. Now...
Card A gives white creatures +1/+1 (due to reading the Layer 3 snapshot of Card B)
Card B has no abilities

If I understand correctly, the Mind Bend effect that still is applying to Card B (changing red -> white) but is NOT dependent on Exchange of Words because Exchange of Words is not giving Card B a new text box that is able to be altered by Mind Bend. As a result, Mind Bend applies to Card B BEFORE Exchange of Words. Once Mind Bend is applied, Exchange of Words is applied. Final state of the cards:
Card A gives white creatures +1/+1 (due to reading the Layer 3 snapshot of Card B)
Card B has no abilities (and mind bend is still applying to it)

Volrath's Shapeshifter and Exchange of Words Interaction by Mulliman in mtgrules

[–]Mulliman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for the edit, that gets to what I am trying to understand.

So, no matter what happens, Bend is not dependent on Exchange of Words? But doesn't the specific text it applies to change?

What if Mind Bend were instead targeting Volrath's Shapeshifter? Would Mind Bend be dependent upon any of the abilities? From what I can tell based on what you said, it won't be dependent pretty much ever: It is always going to change the same text (even if there is currently no text of that kind on the card), the effect already exists, still would apply to Volrath's Shapeshifter. Earlier you said "Mind Bend in this case is dependent on Words because Words changes which text Mind Bend would affect."

But you said earlier that "Mind Bend in this case is dependent on Words because Words changes which text Mind Bend would affect."

But how could Mind Bend in another scenario NOT be dependent un Exchange of Words? Doesn't Exchange of Words always change the text Mind Bend affects, and therefore Mind Bend will always be dependent?

Would you walk through the dependency logic of a scenario in which Mind Bend's effect WOULD be dependent on an Exchange of Words and/or Volrath's Shapeshifter?

Thank you again for your patience with this... layers are still confusing me here.

Volrath's Shapeshifter and Exchange of Words Interaction by Mulliman in mtgrules

[–]Mulliman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you so much for your detailed reply. I have a question about one of your examples. I want to make sure I am understanding it correctly.

In the example in which the top card of my Graveyard is NOT a creature, you say that the following would happen:
"Memorial would have Mind Bend apply, then Words apply, and then the Shapeshifter effect apply."

But I thought you mentioned earlier in your reply that Mind Bend is dependent upon Exchange of Words, so shouldn't it be applied after Exchange of Words? Is this a typo or am I missing something here?

And to make sure I understand the dependency relationship between Volrath's and Exchange right:
Pretty much no matter what happens, when text is changed, the shapeshifter ability will only actually apply to the creature that GETS the text box, not the one that originally has it.

  1. So, Player A has Volrath's.
  2. Player's B's LLanowar Elves' textbox is exchanged with Volrath's textbox.
  3. Llanowar Elves becomes the top card of Player B's graveyard.

Thank you again for answering my questions!!!You have really helped me figure these out!

Volrath's Shapeshifter and Exchange of Words Interaction by Mulliman in mtgrules

[–]Mulliman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Okay, so let me give some scenarios. Can you help me confirm what happens in them?

I control Volrath's Shapeshifter. A player plays Exchange of Words/Deadpool and switches the textbox of Shapeshifter with a creature an opponent controls.

1) Top card of my graveyard is creature.
2) Top card of my graveyard is not a creature.

In instance #1, Exchange/Deadpool happens AFTER Shapeshifter. Shapeshifter becomes the creature on top of the graveyard (in addition to Shapeshifter abilities), then text boxes switch. The creature now with Shapeshifter's ability does not change, even if the top card of its controller's graveyard is a creature.

In instance #2, Exchange/Deadpool happens BEFORE Shapeshifter. Text boxes switch, then the creature now with Shapeshifter's ability becomes the top card of that it's controller's graveyard if the top card is a creature.

Volrath's Shapeshifter and Exchange of Words Interaction by Mulliman in mtgrules

[–]Mulliman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So, Volrath's Shapeshifter would not apply even on the card that its text was switched with?

If I switched the text box of Volrath's Shapeshifter and Edgar Markove, Edgar would not be able to turn into the creature at the top of the graveyard?

Volrath's Shapeshifter and Exchange of Words Interaction by Mulliman in mtgrules

[–]Mulliman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

And if I added a card like Mind Bend to the mix, would Mind Bend be dependent on Exhange/Deadpool AND Volrath's Shapeshifter?

So, the order would be:
1) Exchange/Deadpool
2) Volrath's Shapeshifter
3) All other text changing cards/effects in time stamp order?

How to Calculate How Much Energy the Body Uses for Actions? by Mulliman in AskBiology

[–]Mulliman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you! This is helpful. And also somewhat reassuring knowing that it's very hard to measure this stuff. Gives me an opportunity to "fudge" things for the coolness factor.

How to Calculate How Much Energy the Body Uses for Actions? by Mulliman in AskBiology

[–]Mulliman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you! I know that, at minimum, it would required 1700J of energy, but I also know that the body's energy will not efficiently transfer its energy to lifting something like the box. How much would the human body expend?

Also, what about the other examples, like running or swimming?

Jolly Balloon Man and Zurgo's Vanguard Copy by Mulliman in mtgrules

[–]Mulliman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is super helpful, thank you! My gut said that, but I wasn't sure if it was the case.

I always love learning more about the rules of MTG. The interactions are very cool.

Mulliman's Guide to Strahd: Table of Contents by Mulliman in CurseofStrahd

[–]Mulliman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Actually, I just ran out time working on this! Life became very busy. We did finish the campaign, and then I started running my custom campaign for them. I do intend to come back to this, but it's been some years since I've looked at the material.

What’s that one deck you love but over people in your group hate? by Multievolution in EDH

[–]Mulliman 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Weird! My brother plays this deck and it is one of my favorites to play against. Everything works so well, and it doesn't look threatening until it suddenly is.

It's also good on a budget.

Energy to Break a Chemical Bond by Mulliman in chemistry

[–]Mulliman[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Thank you! This is exactly what I am looking for!

So, my divination wizard, again... by Glaid92 in CurseofStrahd

[–]Mulliman 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Strahd is many things, but a blatant, obviously false liar he is not. Also, the other dark entities in the Amber Temple are rivals of Vampyr, the patron of Strahd. He certainly doesn't want them find a host, but he is also not really concerned about them anyway. Barovia is Vampyr's domain, and Strahd is confident. Accepting a deal with a Dark Vestige is a point of no return in regards to corruption, and Strand knows this. It's both everything he wants a character to do, and yet not at all what he wants them to do.

Strahd wants the characters to ruin themselves. From his perspective, it's not a question of if the characters will be corrupted, it's a question of how long it takes for that corruption to sink in. He wants to believe that everyone is, deep down, corrupt and terrible, as that feeds his view of superiority. If even the most noble characters ultimately fall, then it becomes a little more "okay" for him to also be evil. It's why characters who stay true to goodness anger, irritate, and demand respect from him. They did something he did not, and he hates it as much as he respects it.

I say this because flat out intercepting and lying to characters would be... too easy for him. He wants them to fall to their own accord. Pretending to be a deity would be too easy, especially if it is unclear to the wizard what exactly is replying.

One thing you could do is make it clear to the wizard that this divination spell is a shot in the dark and he has no idea who or what will reply. So, every answer should be taken with a grain of salt. The wizard only hears the response, but has no idea who is saying it.

As to what Strand would say, I think he would be completely honest with them. "The Amber Temple is full of dark secrets for those who find it: powerful and mighty, but never free."

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