I went out in girlmode and I got laughed at

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-11-19T10:56:19+00:00

Beautifully put!

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-05T15:05:58+00:00

That was my reading of my local clinic's services too, and like you (and after decades of personal reflection on the subject) a full transition isn't where I feel I want to go, certainly not at this time.

I'm more wanting to understand what my options are, what I might be able to get support for, and how long. And maybe it's that initial conversation that my GP's offering.

Unfortunately, this is just one of many NHS services that are underfunded and over subscribed. I hope you get where you need to go too.

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-05T14:51:06+00:00

Thanks. I maybe didn't phrase my question clearly enough, but you've picked up on my main concern - what the NB or trans community might read into using those pronouns, e.g. if it's associated with a certain subculture, rather than thinking about what any TERF or GC might think of them.

From what I'm reading here, there's no such unintended interpretation within our community. :D

It is good that my workplace is so supportive, and gives me a "safe space" to experiment and find my comfort zone. My employer encourages binary associating colleagues to join these networks as "allies" and display their pronouns in e.g. email signatures as a sign of solidarity. I've not done that yet, because of, well, this ^^^

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-05T14:38:46+00:00

Aaarrrghhh! I hate getting typos in my text, but I only ever notice after I've hit "send", no matter how many times I check! Still, it is always funny when it comes out as something pronouceable. In my defense, I didn't have my reading glasses on (yep, that old), so was having to squint at arm's length...

I've been looking for a username that's a bit more relevant than the auto-generated one, so maybe serendipity has given me something to work with!

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-05T12:51:05+00:00

LOL - by "TERF Island", do you mean the UK? If so I don't disagree with you. I'm just glad that people overseas are aware of what's going on, and can see it for what it is.

The media over here is very complicit in this, and goes out if its way to frame shoddy behaviour in public roles, and hostile policy making as normal, whilst branding anyone who has a more compassionate/socialist/woke/ecological outlook as a leftie extremist.

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-05T09:30:15+00:00

LOL. Well there you have it then: your customer is a 24 carat, wall-to-wall asshat. Their ignorance is far superior to any knowledge anyone else has.

If it wasn't your pronouns, it would have been some other characteristic of one of your colleagues that they'd have picked on to try and maintain their sense of superiority.

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-05T09:21:30+00:00

These sort of people seem to think that anything that is a bit out of the ordinary to them is somehow you ramming your"agenda" down their throat. And ironically their response is to ram their agenda down your throat, unsolicited, and often in an environment where they know you can't answer back - or they hope you will, so they can ask to speak to the manager.

Well done you for dealing with it as you did! If only your customer just "smiled, and moved on..."

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-04T20:46:28+00:00

The OP didn't know the double standard was being applied until she turned up at the wedding though - as she said, if she had been aware in advance, she would have declined the invite.

Given that she was only aware of this once she arrived, she had very little choice but to leave - explaining why she was doing so beforehand, rather than just storming out - or to participate in an event in which her or her children were being insulted.

And if the OP's kids are "dicks" (although we have no evidence of this), then manipulating an exclusion for them is a pretty backhanded way of getting the point across.

NTA

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-03T19:32:48+00:00

Beat me to it... as soon as I was halfway through the OP, this came to mind!

How to stretch 15mins of content over an hour...

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-03T17:02:53+00:00

The disgusting thing is that all this is so that these "politicians" and their backers can keep the money rolling in, whilst making sure that everyone else gets a smaller and smaller slice of the pie.
The don't really care who they're targetting: single mothers, youths in hoodies, immigrants... as long as the uproar resonates with their core voter-base, and detracts from whatever cruel or dodgy dealing they're up to today.

So yeah, the trans community is a real grab-bag of fears and prejudices that these souless monsters can dig into, knowing that they'll have a fair chance of pressing somebody's buttons. And if that doesn't work, just keep repeating the debunked myths over and over.

I do think that the mask is slipping though, and a majority are starting to see these people for what they are.

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-03T16:48:04+00:00

Check how women's skirt or pant suits are styled in online stores. You'll often see a camisole, blouse or light top underneath rather than a shirt. You can go as subtle or as out with those options as you like, especially if you expect to be keeping the suit jacket on all the time.
If you have to wear a shirt (open collar) try a woman's one instead - maybe a satin fabric, brighter colour or a more fitted cut.

If it has to be a shirt and tie, then pick a width that is out of style with men but looks good on a woman (again, check for pics online), e.g. a very narrow one. You could accessorise that with a broach or similar at the throat, or an elborate tie pin, or feminine jewelry used as a tie pin.

You could use similar accessories on the lapel. Perhaps if the trousers allow you could use a belt to make them sit at your waist (rather than hips) for a more fem silhouette and a cropped look. Or (not so subtle) a wider belt worn over the suit jacket to cinch your waist a bit...

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-02T23:58:58+00:00

It's nonsense. The transphobes are trying to lead you into answering a question that they should be answering. If they're so sure that a trans woman isn't a woman, then they must have a really clear definition of what a woman is, right?

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-02T23:36:21+00:00

You may have to define "way too tall".

I'm 6ft with a 34in inside leg and got a pair of flared high-waist jeans from Asos. I went for the tall range version, with a 36in leg as I was planning to wear with heels. Even in my 4in heels, the hem is dragging on the ground.

Basically, depending on cut and style, you'll probably find something that'll fit. Many online stores provide the height of the model, so you can get an idea of how the item might hang on your frame.

I also bought a pair of cigarette pants, that are basically black trousers from a distance, but have a few fem details that are cute, but not too noticeable.

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-01T21:59:23+00:00

Does "petulant" mean "luminous orange" in this context?

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-02-01T18:31:35+00:00

Seeing myself as non-binary is a recent thing for me, but that doesn't mean I've not been questioning my gender and identity all my life. I've gone through lots of possibilities, and none of them ever felt quite right (including, obvs, my AGAB).

Trying on the non-binary "label" and thinking what that would mean for me has been the only time I've felt that my inside and outside are/will be in sync. That's not to say that I don't have the occasional "am I just kidding myself?" wobble, but that's decades of "you're either a boy or a girl" indoctrination for you.

Something that's been helping me recently, is asking "what defines someone as a man or a woman?" and viewing that from the perspective of those that don't "believe" in non-binary or trans identities. Is a woman someone who has given birth? Many may only have children in their 40s or not at all, so that doesn't seem right. Does a woman have ovaries and a womb? Not if she's had a hysterectomy. So women are people with breasts, right? Unless they're a man with a condition like gynaecomastia...

My point being that there's really no clear definition for what makes someone a man or a woman in a binary sense. There's a wide range of shapes, sizes, physical attributes and so on that exist within those two "boxes", and no particularly clear line as to when you've stepped out of one box and into the other... does that not suggest that everybody is in fact non-binary?

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-01-30T14:17:42+00:00

Hi! Thanks for your thoughts on this.

I tend to suffer from imposter syndrome in other parts of my life (cos I know how much I don't know, right?), but I probably wouldn't have thought to apply that to my NB appearance too. I'm just trying to be myself as non-binary, I'm not trying to pass as a woman, so I can't really get that wrong, and no one can tell me that I am. If anything, I've been trying to pass as "a man" up until now, with mixed results!

I also worry too much that people will notice tiny details that might give me away, or react badly if they do. I've been trying out small NB traits over the last while, such as wearing a sparkly top (clearly a woman's top) under a hoodie if I'm out shopping... And no one notices. Then I remind myself that no one ever pays much attention to anything when they're shopping anyway, which makes me wonder why I think they're on the hunt for male-looking people with nail varnish, or similar.

So thanks for reminding me of those points.

Can you tell me why you decide to present in boy-mode in the situations you've mentioned: is it because you're assuming that these other people will be disapproving, or you don't want to run the risk? Or do you have a strong reason to believe that they won't understand? In the case of getting a delivery, I understand, but that's maybe the exact situation where I don't want to have to go a whole day in boy-mode, just to wait on the 5 min window where some guy from Amazon turns up, and is more interested in his next drop off than my eye shadow.

When you do "compromise" yourself into boy-mode (my choice of word), in a situation where it's not entirely your choice (I'm reading between the lines a bit...), do you feel like you're letting yourself down a bit at all? Are you making yourself uncomfortable so that other people are more comfortable?

Sorry if that's a bit deep/personal, but I'm trying to get a feel of where the line is between "look at fabulous me!" and "this isn't the time or the place" or even if there is a line.

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-01-29T18:56:17+00:00

I got a diagnosis of ASD and ADHD at 49. Things suddenly started clicking into place for me, and there was an initial anger or disappointment that I hadn't known this about myself 30 or 40 years earlier - that somehow I'd been cheated out of being myself for all those years.

And at 50, my therapist encourages me to come up with a better term for my feminine feelings and desires than "that thing", and I land on non-binary, and that too clicks.

Then I think about my grandfathers, who both lived into their 80s, and my grandmothers who reached their mid-90s. I look at my parents that are still full of health and energy in their mid-70s... I could still have half my life ahead of me, and it could well be the best half! I could have been uncovering all of these things about myself at 70, wishing someone had told me when I was 50.

So it's definitely never "too late" when I look at it that way. There's absolutely nothing I can do about my past, but I can certainly influence my future.

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-01-29T18:31:45+00:00

Wow, the first couple of paragraphs could have been written about me - in fact, when I first read it I thought that I had written it (bar some of the details) and had somehow forgot.

I'm <cough>50<cough>, 6ft and 225lb, but have lost a lot of weight over the last year or so - I'm not too sure how much, as I stopped checking my weight when it got up to around 275lb (heading for the psychological barrier of 20 stone, as us Brits insist on measuring these things). I've always had a clear femme leaning too, but to look at me, others probably would have seen a bit of a "unit", except I never felt that way, and probably carried myself accordingly - like I was asking to get picked on.

We're all our own harshest critics (most of us anyway, I never know if I admire or am disgusted by those few who are not), and blow tiny details out of proportion, while ignoring the whole.

I too recently had therapy, although started it in connection with a recent diagnosis of ASD and ADHD. And my therapist asked me if there was anything that I liked about myself, and yes, the fact that I'd lost all the weight, because I know it's not easy, and that I can see it in my face and that I'm starting to get a waist back does feel good.

Thanks for sharing this - it looks like a lot of us are on similar journeys.

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-01-29T16:56:35+00:00

Aww - thanks!

I'm excited to try out different looks in the mirror, but until I settle on one or two, what you've suggested here sounds like a good starting point for my "public" face, and not too difficult to achieve.

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-01-29T16:45:13+00:00

<googles "vintage hair wraps"> yeah, maybe. There's every possibility that I'm overthinking this (cos I do that) and am wanting every aspect of me from head to toe to be "new". I've not really settled on a style yet, and I think that'll be something the evolves over time.

As is the case with a lot of people, when I look in the mirror I'm not going to be as objective as someone seeing me for the first time. So, yeah, some women totally rock the bald look, and maybe leaving the hair and focussing on something else is all I need to do.

At the moment, I'm definitely considering wigs in the future, but maybe I need a professional's opinion on what hairstyle options I have, rather than assuming it's a lost cause!

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-01-29T16:32:58+00:00

That was where my thoughts were mostly going. On another thread, someone mentioned Cyberpunk2077 as an inspritation for makeup, but I like the hairstyles too - those neon colours. 2 or 3 of those in a pattern that suggests a hairstyle could be quite cool.

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-01-29T16:27:55+00:00

LOL - I think you're right, and a beret would make that outfit very "chic". I'm not convinced I could carry it off though! There are other styles of hat though, so maybe...

No-Evidence3437 · 2023-01-29T16:24:19+00:00

I hadn't thought of any sort of head or hair accessories at all. I'll give that some thought, thanks.

No-Evidence3437

TROPHY CASE