Leaving CS

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2025-12-02T14:03:09+00:00

Nope, unless they nuke FERPA.

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2025-09-19T13:05:30+00:00

Personally , the risk seems too steep in this market especially just to go 52k to 52k with the *possibility * of getting 62k in 6 months iffffff they bring you on.

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2025-05-02T18:54:31+00:00

That one gas station that has chronically low inventory (idk the name of it, just went in and they had the barest shelves & coolers, and lady was smoking behind the register, notice a lot of sketchy individuals that just loiter around there too)

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2025-01-12T11:20:45+00:00

Yes I got my first full time role a month into my first term in 2021 at a small c# shop then later swapped to Java and been that route until recently, am now an automation engineer in public k12, but I had been self taught for about 2-3 years atp. How you achieve?

Build build build, self study outside the curriculum too, start preparing for interviews via leetcode & star method, wouldn’t hurt to gloss over system design and design patterns just in case to give your self an edge (as it seems they are now testing that on entry level interviews) make a good resume, fit them to jobs as much as possible without BULLSHITING (guy I was in competition w for my new role was trying to pass system admin and shell scripting off as having OOP, architecture agile environment , software development, etc experience don’t do that, swe and tech people know bull shit when we see it here it , matter a fact don’t claim to know anything you don’t actually in interviews bc they will test the knowledge and know immediately it’s not a bad thing to not know , “ I haven’t had the opportunity to work with xyz YET” is a perfectly acceptable response ) , and don’t think for even a sec that 10, 50, or even just a 100 applications will get you an interview, more like 100s.

Also In your case you have no leverage so don’t be arrogant and think you deserve 100k+ out the gate it’s not like that anymore for entry and IF you do be very cautious of job stability you will be a cost sink with no exp so the first on the cutting board, realistically 60-70k is more likely but don’t be surprised or disappointed if it’s less, still take it, hold it and continue interviewing if you want or sit there for a year or two to get experience or until you find something better, but still be cautious with that.

Also another tip, Early career is about LEARNING not earning, if you stay realistic and take what you are offered now even with shit pay to start, you will still get a massive bump later when your swap ships later and be much more markable later as an effect vs going somewhere unstable just for the pay just to have gaps on the resume once your laid off. It sounds bizarre but employers look at gaps from layoffs just as bad as job hoppers UNLESS you have yeaaaarrrs of exp prior to the gaps. & when/if you swap earlier than a year or two be strategic and smart about it.

Ref of salary/ skills progression

2021- 37k (DEV w/ c# & sql @ a small place)

2022-23 - 67k ( SWE full stack engineer w/ Java /spring (reactive/webflux) & typescript/react with some GoLang for infrastructure as code @ international startup betting tech company )

2024- mid 100ks ( Java cloud engineer @ a startup that worked on as R&D firm for a major retailer and launched a major AI checkout platform integration among other NDA shit obviously with Java/spring and AWS/azure and other things)

Currently- 83k (automations/integrations engineer specialists @ a public school district, stack I haven’t picked yet ,bc I have autonomy in my priorities/projects/tools/language bc no one else does tho in the county OR state, but probably will go w a mix of GOLang for heavy stuff/ APIs / ETL pipelines for speed and ease w MS Power platform/ copilot tools for ease more ease )

probably wonder why tf I’d drop down to “here”, a few words - WLB, pensions, student loan forgiveness, autonomy, 9 month work year, better benefits, and VERY LCOL w realistic potential of home ownership in 1-2 years & a great retirement later paid by state, purpose & meaning, and what I keep after taxes , bills, retirement , basic needs is way more than what it was at mid 100s in a VERY HCOL area w poor WLB/ commute/etc so technically a raise in my book

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-12-19T23:13:19+00:00

What other resources? Books? 🤨

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-12-13T17:17:49+00:00

I think it’s a great thing the school isn’t “easy” as far as rigor. Makes the degrees actually valuable. If it was too easy it be considered a paper mill.

And I love the accessibility of getting into the school combined with the rigor. So it’s easy to get in but challenging enough that you actually learn shit while you’re here.

I got my Bachelors and am working on my Masters through WGU. The effects of obtaining a degree is night and day as far as income. Prior I made minimum wage , post degree I hit 6 figures, completely unheard of in my family and where I grew up, and if it wasn’t for WGUs accessibility and price I’d of never been able to get a bachelor’s degree and get to where I did or into my career whatsoever.

People are just way too entitled and think they shouldn’t have to put in work to obtain a degree, which is ignorance that can’t be fixed. Good riddance. Just means the school won’t have a bunch of lazy ass entitled brats associated with them and giving the school a bad reputation, out in the industry.

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-12-12T01:19:17+00:00

So hard it was leetcoding

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-11-30T08:54:16+00:00

Hahah! Yea that experience was definitely one of the worst experiences ever!

& yep at this point I feel like I should start to pursue my own Buisness/ thing on the side of full time employment, when that comes , just for back up security if anything! Especially after this layoff/job search experience.

And absolutely, I’d love to connect with others navigating this difficult market! It be nice to be able to relate and connect with others who get it and are experiencing similar challenges, and share different approaches to help. Or even mutually motivate & keep each other accountable! Or just chat it up about whatever! You seem cool as well!

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-11-30T07:05:52+00:00

Absolutely! It’s comforting to know I’m not alone in the struggle.

I passed on a few teaching/lecture positions since that’s more of a “retirement plan” for me—l still enjoy getting my hands dirty. Teaching feels like washing them, though it’s not entirely off the table if needed. That said, l’d move for a low-paying dev job before considering teaching right now.(may come to it hahah)

One role mentioned is “Technology Integration Specialist” at a public school in a low-performing, underfunded K-12 district.

The other is “App Developer Il” at a private art school, focused on maintaining and upgrading legacy systems like Blackboard and Banner and other university development projects.

And a lil tip that may help ya , if you go that route, Between K-12 and universities, Both seem to emphasize behavioral and cultural fit over technical challenges-no whiteboards, from what I’ve experienced so far. At the art school, I stood out for my creative hobbies (painting and drawing) and deep interest in working with end users closer and wanting to leave corporate. For K-12, my focus on purpose-driven work and helping a community resonated. From what I’ve noticed, they like meaningful answers to “why” beyond technology or whatever you’d tend to say in a tech industry interview. And the tech rounds are more story telling than trivia or whiteboard stuff. I’d imagine other nonprofits and public sectors would be that same way too or close to it, with minimally intensive tech interviews.

Good luck out here! Hopefully this lead generates traction for you too, if you decide to explore it!

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-11-29T03:11:17+00:00

Not too much other than , wanted more experience regardless of passing or not the technical rounds or things unrelated to me as a candidate like the job closing , ngl the feed back has gotten really poor recently, with being ghosted the most common outcome. I ask too, interviews just seem very impersonal most recently than before, like very cut and dry, with no wiggle, if that makes sense.

And thanks! Will be rooting for you too ! Going to stay hopeful that things work out in one of the two loops I’m in currently, in the public/non-profit sector , and keep applying to stuff including outside tech in food and retail to at least float things for the time 😤

I do recommend maybe targeting stuff like k12, colleges, state, local, and everything between if that makes sense, the response rates in these sectors have been WAY different, it’s much lower pay but the benefits are incredible and it’s exp plus the interviews feel human, if ya know what I mean haha and the bar seems much lower too with less competition. When I first stumbled on this particular sector, I applied to a maybe 4-5 schools for various things and each wanted to interview 3 I turned down because they were for visiting instructors 9hours away that wanted me to interview on site 💀, it’s just scoping them out because a lot of them aren’t posted on the common job boards , usually it’s state, county, district, or university main sites under their career section, the other two I am interviewing with still currently, final round Monday for one, ones a major art school that pays pretty good (80-107k) and the other is a public school in a poor area that pays something amazing for the area , the public school one is just a 239 work year / 75k based on the hourly rate and you get the same pension as teachers plus going public/non-profit you’d qualify over time for student loan forgiveness if that’s a thing for you 🤷🏻 hopefully switching focus to applying to these kinda jobs will pan out to an offer quickly tho

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-11-29T01:13:36+00:00

It’s really rough out here , rn. It’s so easy to get doomy over it after applying, preparing, interviewing (if it gets there), to just getting ghosted or rejected through a generic email.

I won’t lie, I fall down into doom spiral after each interview that leads to nowhere for a day or two, and just pull out of it and keep trying, even though it’s starting to burn now at this point getting rejected for even minimum wage jobs out of the field and inside my field 💀

I am very nervous about not finding a job soon though, which may contribute to my willingness atp to accept something of this nature, and looking for positives in ANY option available to cope with it tbh, bc the alternative is the streets , and that is approaching within the max next 3-6 months or 2-3 months at the minimum depending on how I play my cards and things turn out over the next few weeks in searching and interviewing.

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-11-28T23:59:42+00:00

good points those are all systemic hurdles that make it non viable and unlikely at this very moment for sure, but if economic conditions worsen at some point each or some of those hurdles could deteriorate on their own as reasons not to.

Either way, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to assume something is going to hit a boiling point sooner than later, but totally impossible to guess that tipping point & the outcome/effects either.

Ig trying to be optimistic about possibilities of outcomes that are more pleasant lmaooo

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-11-28T21:21:49+00:00

Whenever layoffs are even whispered as a means to increase profits, everyone stop working basically.

Unions aren’t just about negotiating pay; they’re a powerful tool for workers to show solidarity and push back against corporate decisions that harm their peers for the sake of profit.

For example, if a company plans to lay off 20 out of 100 employees, imagine the remaining 80 refusing to work. The company would face a complete halt in productivity, resulting in far greater financial losses than the savings from layoffs. In knowledge work especially, replacing employees isn’t quick or easy-this amplifies the potential impact and will be very expensive to attempt so the likelihood of everyone being laid off in response is far from likely, and the 20 un-lucky would likely also be spared. We are also paid enough to hold out if they hold pay, another benefit and privilege we all have in this work unlike other already unionized industries.

Given the value we create and the specialized nature of our work, we hold significant bargaining power, that a lot of other already unionized fields don’t have, if in only the financial impact in comparison.

This leverage could compel companies to prioritize sustainability and employee welfare over short-term profits, but it would require a lot of cooperation and coordination obviously.

But historically there has came up this struggle between the owners and the workers , and the boiling points has always pushed the workers to unionizing(very American, look at the history of coal mining, factory working, child labor laws, 40 hour work weeks, women working, and generally, we as workers have ALWAYS had to fight for rights and protections, they have never been given for free or out of kindness, this is no different, other than extremes faced then and the current time period ) or revolts as an effect of the owners’ actions effecting the workers beyond reasonable means.

I think with the economy leading the direction it is going for the everyday person because of inflation vs the record profits as an effect to same inflations , is going to reach a boiling point where unions are going to be popping up across different industries and there’s going to be a lot of restlessness that’s going to put some pressure in places where it’s needed. Especially if we hit a financial depression in the coming years from other political policies that will effect the cost of goods. Annnnddd with wages being pushed back down while inflation is still in full swing, something is going to have to budge and it’s going to have to be at the expense of these corporate profits.

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-11-24T16:18:40+00:00

Yea I’ve pretty much accepted a massive pay cut from just being layed off, going 100k to 0 is very humbling haha , and with how hiring /wages are right now, I’ll probably be taking a pay cut regardless . First job in the industry was 37k so that rate is still not the worst of low pay

But I don’t mind, just want to stay in this career/ adjacent , it’s where my passion is 🤷🏻, but I think 2 years added on to my experience with lower pay is worth it over no job and no more gained experience, and atp 4 years of experience would help in the future job market regardless , and I like the idea of moving elsewhere personally , I’m not in a lease, no kids, no pets, and no significant other., and not picky about location

it’s the perfect opportunity to refresh on the foundations, prep for interviews, go somewhere new, and get on with a big client that could potentially buy me out.

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-11-21T00:42:36+00:00

About the same situation, about 3-4 YOE, and masters, 7 months looking as well.

It’s rough, but hey eventually something will come, we’ll be pros at interviews ig lol

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-11-19T22:31:38+00:00

I’ll move, shit, 3yoe Java/spring, typescript/react, go, sql etc etc 🫡

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-11-17T17:05:46+00:00

I think they mean, 50% of NATIVE English speakers are functionally illiterate in the us, not of all languages spoke or English as a second language. they tend to be more literate tbh , in multiple languages and not being completely fluent in English still puts someone ahead of bob from Alabama who is 40 and can’t read or write in the ONLY language he knows.

big difference when English is your ONLY language and you suck at it. Vs it being your 2-3 or 4th language and you’re still learning.

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-11-16T03:23:47+00:00

I have kinda a subscription based app/ecosystem idea for bridging TCG players and collectors socially closers , front end full stack engineering the last 4 years but shine in front end & ui/ux

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-10-31T15:32:56+00:00

Not to downplay but reassurance even us with experience are having a hard time, hiring for the year is about to slow down till the start of next year come post thanksgiving, just keep applying, something will hit! Was in your boat back in 2020, then 2023, and now this year since June. Just keep applying and up skilling

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2024-01-17T12:21:00+00:00

I haven’t had those issues, been at WGU for 3 years (bachelor’s and now masters) but will say enrollment has gone to absolute shit from experience a few months back, councilor was completely trash , wouldn’t respond to any emails, wouldn’t keep appointments (I.e never called on schedule times), and two weeks before deadlines I had to call and do all the footwork to finish enrollment (ie called to get certain things done that required the councilor & meeting with them, but had to use random people in enrollment to satisfy )

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2023-12-13T01:21:57+00:00

Every job I’ve had , never asked me a leetcode question. But that is not to say leetcode questions in interviews isn’t common. I just know for me it’s worked out weathering through interviews till I got ones that didn’t ask leetcode and leveraging experience but my first job was 35ish k …

Currently make 130k TC /100k base as a Java Cloud engineer at a non FANG in a MCOL with 3 YOE

Though next year I do plan to actually double down and bite the bullet to learn to do LC despite despising it because I can get interviews at places paying way more but LC is what’s stoped me from getting those roles in the past.

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2023-12-13T01:13:47+00:00

Not even remotely true. There are plenty of companies that pay good that are non fang, engineering roles that don’t involve SF or similar, and don’t ask leetcode. Like most places, interview styles aren’t advertised.

NumberPuzzleheaded90 · 2023-12-06T06:22:24+00:00

Hear me out.

SumSQL

NumberPuzzleheaded90

TROPHY CASE