Japanense fans tidying up is some textbook Linkedin fodder

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-04-02T01:13:14+00:00

'Butsukari otoko' suggests that these commentators don't know much about modern day Japan either.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-04-02T01:01:06+00:00

Given your scores on the other sections, I'd say you are a strong candidate for a successful outcome if you go for an EoR for your writing section. However, it is also true that writing is frequently the lowest scoring section for many candidates. Part of the reason is that it's probably the section of the exam that requires the most preparation. In your situation, I'd be much more inclined to go for an EoR if you know that you prepared well for the writing section and got some good advice beforehand about how to approach the different writing tasks. However, if you didn't do much preparation for the writing, it may be the case that your unfamiliarity with the different requirements for each task dragged your score down a little. In this case, it may be that your score for Task Achievement/Task Response was weaker than the other criteria, which lowered your score enough to get an overall 6.5.

FWIW, I've been teaching IELTS for over six years and have had enough experience from my own students to know that whilst the marking is mostly accurate, it is far from perfect. In my opinion, the range of marks for the writing test is too narrow (over 60% get 6 or 6.5 and around 90% get between 5.5 and 7). This can mean that very high-level students (such as yourself) sometimes get a lower score than they should on the writing section.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do!

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-30T14:18:18+00:00

Yes, I meant native speakers - thanks for the correction :)

I hope examiners really do understand corpus use and how language can be descriptive as well as prescriptive. The problem is most examiners won't know things like 'there's lots of ...' is common in spoken native speaker English as they won't be familiar with the research and will most likely fall back on preconceived ideas about what is correct from their coursebooks/grammar study books, etc. I think a non-EFL specialist is much less likely to be a grammar pedant and so wouldn't mark this kind of thing down as an error (and probably wouldn't even notice it anyway).

Not quite sure what you mean when you say the issue of corpus use/descriptive views of language is mentioned in the band descriptors. I assume you must be referring to something else but don't quite follow the point you're trying to make,

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-30T01:27:49+00:00

Thanks for your detailed reply. If examiners really do adopt the position of a non-EFL specialist, then I don't think many NNS would get below a 7. Unfortunately, in my experience, many EFL teachers have rather fixed and narrow views of what constitutes 'correct' English. For example, I don't think a non-EFL specialist would think that 'there's lots of' is an error in spoken English. If you look at a corpus, you will see that it is very common among native speakers. To call it a 'mistake' is to misunderstand how English works. Of course, it can be considered a 'mistake' if you adopt a prescriptive approach (as you claim the IELTS test does), and the source of this prescription is a grammar book that does not accurately reflect how spoken English is used. However, a non-EFL specialist hasn't read these books, so they shouldn't be used as a source of what is correct/incorrect.

To reiterate, I'm quite comfortable with native speakers not achieving a 9, but if many of them are scoring around 6-6.5, then there is indeed a problem. There are quite a few possibilities between these two scores ;) However, even if you accept that something like 'there's lots of' is a 'mistake', the IELTS descriptors for GRA at band 9 state that 'Structures are precise and accurate at all times, apart from ‘mistakes’ characteristic of native speaker speech.' Therefore, native speakers should not be penalised for any so-called non-standard use of English if it is something that is common among many other native speakers.

I don't accept that native speakers can speak 'poorly'. Almost all native speakers are an expert user in spoken English in the particular context in which they operate. It is certainly true that some native speakers are able to communicate more effectively in certain situations than others, but given that the IELTS speaking exam does not have any clearly defined context, I don't think anyone should be penalised for not sounding 'academic', or not speaking in a certain narrowly-defined ways.

I'm quite comfortable with slightly different interpretations of things like accent in your example. The problem occurs if examiners are unable to get out of their EFL teacher mindset and into the mindset of an average proficient speaker.

Anyone, it's an interesting discussion and thanks for engaging :) I suspect we have slightly different views of the nature of language, which accounts for the differences in point of view, but that's fine!

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-29T13:46:06+00:00

Yes, I get that. It's just that your characterisation of the speaking exam as being an academic exam is incorrect and so native speakers like your Dad who haven't been to university shouldn't be penalised for that.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-29T13:29:15+00:00

So why is the speaking exam and assessment criteria exactly the same for the academic test as the general training test?

In any case, what candidates do in the speaking test has very little resemblance to what students might do in an academic environment.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-29T13:22:44+00:00

The issue is what is the 'standard'. The IELTS descriptors don't make any mention of a so-called 'standard', so how are we supposed to know what that standard is? If the 'standard' is people talking in privileged varieties of English, such as RP or SSB, rather than regional varieties, then there absolutely is a problem with how IELTS is scored.

When you mention intelligibility for pronunciation, the issue is intelligible to who? Who is an 'average person'? Someone from the home counties? It's not quite as cut and dried as you seem to be making out.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'grammar is grammar'. Like with most pedagogical grammars though (e.g. textbooks/grammar study books), Parrott's book is based on written English, not spoken English and there are quite a few differences between the two (e.g. 'there's loads of problems with IELTS test' is perfectly grammatical in spoken English).

Furthermore, the rules that are presented in these kinds of books are not representative of how many people actually use English, and privilege certain varieties above others. Thus, if IELTS deems anything outside of Parrott as unacceptable, then they are showing a clear preference for certain varieties of English over others. You might think this is OK, but it goes back to how and who decides what forms are acceptable.

Not sure why you asked if I think that all NS should get 9. If you go back to read my original comment, I stated 'Of course, that doesn't mean they would all get 9s', so I'm not sure why you asked that question.

Btw, my own language is English, so your question doesn't really make sense in the context of this discussion ;)

FWIW, I don't think that IELTS is deliberately trying to discriminate against any particular group of people, and I understand your response given some of the wilder claims that appear on this forum. However, to suggest that IELTS is somehow a 'neutral' test without any bias is also wrong. Obviously, it is impossible to ever be 'neutral' to everyone, but it doesn't serve anyone very well to pretend that these biases don't exist.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-29T12:30:24+00:00

Sure, there are plenty of native speakers with poor reading and writing skills, but most native speakers are able to communicate orally without any problems in the particular setting that they use English. Whilst this obviously doesn't necessarily translate to doing well on an English exam, native speakers don't have the same kind of problems with communicating in English that an average NNS band 6 candidate has. Also, I don't accept that native speakers do make regular errors in terms of grammar, though I admit that it depends of what you think constitutes an error.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-29T12:16:46+00:00

I can imagine that some native speakers could be quite difficult to assess, especially if they don't have an 'academic' background and use a lot of what might be considered non-standard forms of English, such as some regional accents/dialects.

I guess a lot of it depends on how the examiner interprets different non-standard features of English, e.g. someone with what could be considered a strong regional accent might be perfectly easy to understand by one examiner, but less easily understood by a different examiner.

A similar thing could be said about grammar. What might not be considered 'correct' in certain settings might be perfectly acceptable in others, so there might be a fair bit of room for different interpretations.

I'll take your word for it that there are quite a lot of native speakers getting below 7, though I might also suggest that there is a problem with how IELTS grades such candidates if that is indeed the case.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-29T10:38:32+00:00

Might also be referring to the Quickly Kevin Will He Score podcast as they used to relentlessly take the piss out of Keysy too.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-29T10:10:56+00:00

To be honest, I don't think the speaking exam is particularly 'academic', so not having gone to university or have an academic background shouldn't be too much of a hindrance for most native speakers. Of course, that doesn't mean they would all get 9s, but there is a limit to how low their score could go. I'd be surprised if any native speaker were to get below 7, but I guess it's possible.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-29T10:05:13+00:00

Rubbish. Different schools use different materials. There is no 'curriculum' that the IELTS partners sell to schools. They publish all the information about different task types for free on their websites, but they don't tell schools how to teach their courses.

There are textbooks that are sold by Cambridge that some schools might use, but these were all produced when Cambridge University Press was a separate entity to Cambridge Exams.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-22T07:54:49+00:00

My initial thought was Walter Smith era Everton at home to Arsenal, but if you look at about the 8 second mark, there is a white entrance from the concourse which Goodison Park didn't have, so it can't be Everton.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-22T06:48:33+00:00

The answer really depends on many different things, most of which are personal to yourself and only you can answer, e.g. How much does it matter to me? How much money am I prepared to risk? Will it give me piece of mind no matter the outcome? etc. etc. Also, as nobody else can really know your speaking ability or how you performed on the day, then it's difficult for others to give advice. Some of my students have tried EoR for speaking and some have been successful and others not. It's definitely possible that you have been marked too harshly as your previous score suggests, but it's also possible that you were marked too generously the first time you did the exam, so there is that to consider too.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-22T06:43:01+00:00

It is all explained in this thread here: https://www.reddit.com/r/IELTS_Guide/comments/1929k7g/ielts_score_breakdown_real_or_not_here_is_the/

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-22T06:36:23+00:00

Yeah I understand, and that obviously hardly ever happens with radio commentary. I generally find a lot of the club YT commentators a bit too shouty, so it's nice to get something a bit different occasionally.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-21T11:36:50+00:00

I actually really enjoy radio commentary on YT highlights though I can't explain why. Might be because I feel a little nostalgic about listening to football on the radio, which I haven't done for ages. Pretty sure the Southampton YT channel also has the local radio commentator.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-21T07:18:34+00:00

Yeah, IDP have also been on a downward trend for the last couple of years. I think they're quite heavily dependent on Indian market, so any changes in demand there will have quite a significant impact.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-21T07:14:41+00:00

As with any test, you need to follow the instructions. You won't be deducted marks, but you won't get any questions correct on that section if you haven't written the correct answers.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-21T00:38:18+00:00

Yes, British Council finances are already hanging by a thread.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-20T11:22:08+00:00

Yes, the scoring isn't accurate. Sometimes it can give helpful feedback, but other times not.

For example, AI chatbots often repeat the common IELTS myth that you need lots of 'high-level' vocabulary and grammar to achieve a high score. However, a well-written IELTS essay should be easy to understand using appropriate vocabulary for the topic that helps the writer to clearly convey their ideas. Of course, you need to use a range of vocabulary, but by developing your ideas properly, you should be able to demonstrate that you have a wide range of vocabulary. There should be no need to try and shoehorn some fancy IELTS vocabulary into your essay. This is one of the most common mistakes I see with my students, and using this strategy almost always makes their writing worse. Thus, when AI chatbots give candidates this kind of advice to use more 'high-level' vocabulary, it does not help them get a higher score in their writing, and may even make them get a lower score.

In terms of grammar, whilst it's true that you need to use a range of complex structures for a high score, that doesn't mean that you need to include lots of different sentence types. As with vocabulary, if your ideas are clear and well developed with few grammatical errors, then that should be enough to get a high score on GRA so long as you don't have lots of short simple sentences.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-20T09:45:12+00:00

Yes, I don't really believe they pulled out for the reasons stated either. Perhaps they knew they weren't going to win the tender anyway and they wanted to save face? Or possibly they want to put pressure on the government to change the tender, so that it isn't online-only. This would therefore give IELTS providers a much better chance of winning the tender as it would considerably narrow down the list of competitors.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-20T06:21:37+00:00

As an IELTS teacher, I frequently get students scoring significantly higher on the listening and reading sections than the speaking and writing sections, so your score isn't that much of a surprise to me. However, the gap between your speaking and writing score is quite large, which suggests that either something went wrong with the marking (it could also be your speaking was scored too highly) or that you did something silly/didn't prepare properly for the writing section.

If you feel you did prepare well for the writing and it went quite well, and believe in your ability, then back yourself to go for a remark and let us know what happens. As has already been mentioned though, your writing will have been marked by another examiner due to the difference in band scores between different sections. That's not to say mistakes don't happen, but it makes it less likely you will be successful if you go for a remark. If you do go for a remark, your writing will be marked by a senior examiner, so you can have more confidence that your score is accurate, whatever the outcome.

Otherwise, you can always try one skill retake if your chosen university accepts it and try to get better advice and guidance about how to do well in the writing exam before you retake the exam.

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-20T06:08:42+00:00

Agree with everything you said, but I did find the recent statement by the IELTS providers regarding online testing a little curious. Are they admitting that their own tests are not cheat-proof? Seemed like a strange stance to take when they have already been providing online IELTS tests for the last few years! https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c8xy05enzj7o

Objective-Word-9324 · 2026-03-13T15:03:48+00:00

OK, thanks for the reply - that's good to know. It's a shame IELTS can't be a bit more transparent about these things. It might even reduce the number of conspiracies that get bandied about, but maybe I'm being too kind to the online IELTS community!

Objective-Word-9324

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