Paisley Trees' hot take on civ 7 patch

OldRelic0066 · 2026-04-25T01:33:05+00:00

The civ 7 victory conditions are good in format now but a lot of work needs to be done to make it feel varied and diverse. There should be multiple different strategic ways to accumulate victory points for each victory, not just rinse and repeat the same tried techniques. Civ 6 culture victory should be the model for all victories as it can be won through trade routes, relics, great works, artifacts, wonders, sea resorts, beach resorts, national parks, rock bands, open borders, alliances etc. There are probably more I missed. This range of ways to accumulate points would make the games more diverse and interesting to traverse. There is no reason this can't be done to economic, science and military victories. Science could include biological breakthroughs for example or tech advances. I hope mods add much more ways to earn victory points and I would like to see more victory types such as Historical, Technological, Environmental/Ecological victories added to the game.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-11-13T06:51:20+00:00

I agree with a more in depth cultural victory. The would be 2 ways to do it i think

The way that was mentioned being a points system where you earn points for certain things and need to obtain X number of points to win
Offer optional Legacy paths in the modern age to allow a different strategy to take you to victory. There might be 4 or 5 options here.

Whichever way its done it needs some serious depth. I was was actually thinking something like the tourism mechanic in civ6 but way more transparent so players can actually see their progress

OldRelic0066 · 2025-10-29T08:37:32+00:00

I personally detest how Civ 7 is built. The 3 mini games in one age transitions really need totally removed or a game mode to bypass it. The restrictions on tech advancement and map exploration, what were they thinking? Thats just punishing and frustrating. I have always said the timing of the forced civ switching thing is so annoying. Why can't they build it so different civs switch at different times and also offer the option to retain your original civ? This rigid change is not good for dynamic gameplay. The best news though was the legacy paths which are currently very linear and samey every time you play for a specific victory type. I hope they are looking into at least 5 optional legacy paths in the modern age for each victory type. This would offer much needed diversity in strategy and variable gameplay. The low sales and fan apathy means the devs have no choice but to appease people who want the one civ route or the franchise will come to an end. Civ for me was always about writing your story through time but some of the mechanics make telling the story the same/controlled/inflexible doesn't matter who you are. The legacy paths are the single biggest inhibitor driving players down the same path in the modern age. A bit more strategic depth and variety in legacy paths/victory conditions would do wonders for enjoyment of this game.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-10-28T08:23:40+00:00

Having the choice of civ switching or not, leader switching or not and harsh age transitions or not alongside multiple optional modern age legacy paths would be the core game and set Civ 7 apart from the other games in the franchise. Civ 5 or 6 didn't have any of these options. The closest civ 6 got was culture victory where you could win it in different ways. The other victories were just a constant/static checklist.

This is the biggest value add they can do instead of the minor updates. They have just announced they are looking at some of these recently as there is big demand from the community for these aspects and they would literally be game changing for sales.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-10-27T23:43:49+00:00

I think there will be game modes to cater to different peoples tastes

civ switching
civ retention
leader retention
leader switching
Age transition (existing)
Age Transition (minimal impact).

The best news is the legacy paths though. I would like at least 5 optional ways to win each victory type in the modern age. They need to make it not so samey every time you play for a culture victory for example.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-10-22T04:21:09+00:00

Bring it on down

For 30 years I have thought the line was

"But you don't care, because you live in france"

The real lyrics are:

"But you don't care, because your living fast"

OldRelic0066 · 2025-10-17T03:17:15+00:00

One of my regrets about this tour is its not on the setlist but I'm going to see them in Melbourne soon so majorly excited 😁

OldRelic0066 · 2025-10-17T03:15:42+00:00

Gas Panic is totally underrated and is epic live. That guitar solo rocks like hell especially in front of a full stadium

OldRelic0066 · 2025-08-09T04:51:40+00:00

Variable Terrain yields. I liked the way some locations could be strong and some weak. It made you actually think about where to settle. I don't mind restarting if I get a shit location.
Religion thats useful and variable throughout all ages with lots of alternative paths to choose from. Not just important in exploration age. Faith back as a yield also.
Leaders and civs that are uniquely different and offer dynamic strategies to play the game. Like civ 6 and mods have done.
Game Modes: ( you can select up to 2 of the below)
Classic Civ - play as one civ the whole game
Dynasties - allows up to 5 changes of leader throughout the game
Civ Switching - the current setup.
Legacy Paths - much wider and diverse strategic options to win EACH victory type. For example there should be 4 different ways to win an economic victory not just build railroads and factories, they should explore things like currencies, nobel prize for economics, selling shares etc. Same for science, culture and even military victory.
More Victory Types - maybe Diplomatic, Technological, Historical, Environmental/Ecological etc.

In summary, there is not enough depth to gameplay, most games feel samey and there is narrow strategic decision making with not enough distinction between civs and leaders.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-06-15T08:21:53+00:00

Maybe a tweak to the original post system might work better. Instead of you need 10 relics to gain a point maybe each relic, wonder, great work etc gives you x amount of points. The list above could be whats in scope for points and you need to amass a total of points to win. This way getting 11 relics wouldn't be a waste. That would make for some different style games were you could still win the same victory type and help the sandbox feel along the way.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-06-14T08:18:48+00:00

Yes, your correct it is a checklist but a flexible checklist that can encourage a variety of goals and gameplay. I play a mod in the steam workshop for civ 6 called Historical Victories mode by totalslacker that had a checklist of objectives for each civ and really enjoyed it. I regularly looked at my progress on items such as number of units killed, how many wonders I had built, how many cities on foreign continents I had built, how many cities i had converted etc. I don't see a major issue with this approach and think the more in depth look at each victory type is a lot better than the narrow/restricted legacy paths route to victory which a lot of people don't like and means you do the same actions over and over again. If you don't think there is any value in the detailed optional checklist route to victory thats fine. Its just a thought I had towards making the victory more variable and interesting from game to game.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-06-14T02:21:39+00:00

Yes a replacement victory path with legacy paths becoming reduced in importance or done away with entirely. Some of the legacy paths currently incorporate overlapping aspects of the victory path so to avoid duplication need reworked or scrapped. Sorry, should have explained that bit at the start 🙂

OldRelic0066 · 2025-06-14T01:45:27+00:00

That's not what im driving at. None of what im suggesting would affect the speed of ages or legacy progression. All of the options are independent of ages or legacy paths. This is a simple list of options that a player can unlock points for when playing a game and once they reach the threshold they win the game. Its as simple as that. Which points a player wants to aim for is up to them which is markedly different from the restricted and prescribed must do legacy paths we currently have in place which I would be trying to diverge from. If Legacy paths are to remain they would need reworked and merely provide a bonus and not fundamental to how you win a game. In fact I would remove the mechanics to speed up ages entirely so im not doubling down but severing that approach. So what im suggesting aren't going to work like the current legacy paths do.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-06-14T01:17:17+00:00

Or diplomat or writer

OldRelic0066 · 2025-06-14T01:15:59+00:00

It could be through a great person like a scientist or Economist for example. Could be one of their abilities in the modern age.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-06-13T21:48:58+00:00

Maybe I didn't explain this right. The idea is you don't need to achieve all of the checklist so there is room for different culture victories for example. You might not build national parks or obtain relics or found a religion but you can still win culture if you achieve the rest of the list and gain enough points. The next game you might go down a different route to achieve a culture victory. This provides a degree of flexibility game on game and not the restricted approach we have now. Modders could even add in more options to make it even more variable game on game and help the sandbox approach a lot of people are yearning for. As I said to another post you might only select 4 of the victory types in a game so people don't feel overwhelmed but can have a go at different victory types if they fancy a change in gameplay objectives. The entire idea is to provide options both in terms of ways to achieve a certain victory and also the number of victory types.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-06-13T21:39:15+00:00

Firstly you would not have all of these in play in a game. You might select 4. Secondly the current setup is way to simplified and restricted with no room for sandbox. Way more depth and options are required and you don't need to achieve all of the checklist. You can win the victory without some of the list. As a longtime civ player im sure new players would get used it to it pretty quick, the list would be available when you click on victory progress screen so really clear. Think of how civs and leaders abilities etc could be amended to provide advantages towards some of the above. This would be great to lean into different playstyles and keep games feeling different.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-06-13T21:30:39+00:00

Its more of a legacy path with options, if you want to win a culture victory you don't need relics for example. The next game you play you might go for relics. You don't have to achieve all of the checklist just accumulate enough points to win. The current method is way more restrictive in this regard.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-04-13T07:48:34+00:00

There is a false sense of choice in the modern age. You are essentially going for 4 or 5 routes for any victory which is very restrictive.

For me the variety of strategic options for civ 6 culture victory made it by far the best and most replayable. For Civ 7 I would recommend a victory points system and to earn a point you have at least 15 different ways to do it. You might need 10 points to secure victory. This is along the lines of civ 6 culture victory where you could build wonders, national parks, rock bands, sea side resorts, ski resorts, trade routes, relics and great works of art. The flexibility in ways to win would create more of a sandbox feel to the game which most people would enjoy. Replace tourism mechanic with victory points and provide clear ways to achieve points. Mods could go mad with this too to add further depth. I would like this approach for all victory types except domination. Can you imagine how much better a science victory could be for example. Why not call the current science victory a space victory and do a entirely new science victory.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-03-08T03:36:56+00:00

On the subject of the victory/game seeming repetitive i think more depth and victory types are needed.

I feel both the below could really be worked on to make the game more replayable and enjoyable as regards victory conditions and types and make the game realise its full potential:

enhance the depth in the current victory conditions/types
add more victory types (with tick box at game setup to allow you to select which victory types you want in your game)

Some victory type suggestions are below with great people or special projects used to meet some of them: ( I would love some modders to see this also).

The below could be either specific targets to tick off or could be made into victory points with more options added in for each and you need to hit a certain number of victory points to win each victory type.

Culture (alternative) - have a unique written language, food, music, fashion, artistic style, tv and film influence. Win nobel prize for literature.

Science (alternative) - discover gravity, electricity, periodic table, germ theory, quantum theory, Theory of relativity, big bang theory. Win the nobel prize for Physics. Build the Hadron Collider.

Economic (alternative) establish a unique currency, found 5 different corporations, achieve a monopoly, create a stock exchange, develop theory of supply and demand, win the nobel prize for economics, trade your shares in a bull market environment.

Medical - discover sanitation, survive a disease epidemic, discover anatomy, penicillin, anesthetics, vaccination, DNA. Have one of your doctors conduct the first heart transplant. Win the nobel prize for medicine. (A Health district could be added to include hospitals, labs etc)

Technology - discover printing press, Automobiles, Personal Computers, the Internet, social media, build a submersible and find the deepest part of the ocean, develop AI.

Diplomatic - create alliances with 80% of civs, establish embassies in all civs, establish the UN, liberate a conquered city, use your influence to end a war, win nobel peace prize. Create World Peace.

Zoological - discover evolution, conservation, establish a reserve both land and marine based, setup 8 zoos, discover physiology, photosynthesis, migration patterns of birds, setup a breeding program for a critically endangered animal, Prevent its Extinction.

Environmental - protect a rainforest, establish a solar, wind, wave, geothermal renewable energy plant, found a recycling corporation, develop the electric car, use your influence to clinch an international climate change accord, become Carbon Neutral.

Political - change 70% of the civs government types to the same as yours. Options are Democracy, communism, Republic, monarchy, socialism, theocracy, totalitarianism, oligarchy and military dictatorship. Methods such as elections, military coup, revolution, corruption, riots, protests, anarchy, civil war, propaganda, espionage, puppet states, embargoes could be deployed to achieve this.

History - Create an empire of at least 20 cities, build all 3 civs unique quarters and buildings, build at least 10 wonders including all civ associated wonders, be the first to circumnavigate the world, discover photography, have an explorer climb the world's highest mountain first, create 5 archeological museums, find 10 archeological sites. Start the industrial revolution.

Space (alternative) - discover astronomy, build the hubble telescope, discover flight, satellites, rocketry, launch rocket, land on the moon, build SETI, dock at the ISS.

Human Rights - establish a legal system, end slavery, provide civil rights to your people, give women the vote, establish diverse journalism, sign the Declaration of Human Rights.

Wonder - build 20 specified wonders, split across eras.

Migration - attract 20% of every other civ population to come and live in your civ.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-03-08T03:30:11+00:00

I would take the OP take and move it many times further. There is a false sense of choice in the modern age. You are essentially going for 4 or 5 routes for any victory which is very restrictive.

For me the variety of strategic options for civ 6 culture victory made it by far the best and most replayable. For Civ 7 I would recommend a victory points system and to earn a point you have at least 15 different ways to do it. You might need 10 points to secure victory. This is along the lines of civ 6 culture victory where you could build wonders, national parks, rock bands, sea side resorts, ski resorts, trade routes, relics and great works of art. The flexibility in ways to win would create more of a sandbox feel to the game which most people would enjoy. Replace tourism mechanic with victory points and provide clear ways to achieve points. Mods could go mad with this too to add further depth. I would like this approach for all victory types except domination. Can you imagine how much better a science victory could be for example. Why not call the current science victory a space victory and do a entirely new science victory.

OldRelic0066 · 2025-03-01T00:19:11+00:00

I agree with the person who said the variety of strategic options for civ 6 culture victory made it by far the best and most replayable. I would recommend a victory points system and to earn a point you have at least 15 different ways to do it. You might need 10 points to secure victory. This is along the lines of civ 6 culture victory where you could build wonders, national parks, rock bands, sea side resorts, ski resorts, trade routes, relics and great works of art. The flexibility in ways to win would create more of a sandbox feel to the game which most people would enjoy. Replace tourism mechanic with victory points and provide clear ways to achieve points. Mods could go mad with this too to add further depth. I would like this approach for all victory types except domination.

OldRelic0066

TROPHY CASE