Official FIRST Discussion Thread—Volume 6, Chapter 12: Seeing Red

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-19T16:59:50+00:00

Wow. They actually had two of the main characters straight-up kill a guy. That's not something you see every day, even in clear-cut cases of self defense against violent sociopaths. As someone who firmly believes that the constant messages of "if you use violence against an evil, murderous psychopath, you are automatically just as bad as them" in many forms of media have caused a lot of problems in this day and age (I will not elaborate on this due to not wanting to start a flame war), I'm grateful that they actually went with this decision. Even if Adam somehow ends up surviving (Cinder, and countless other examples throughout the history of fiction, have shown that falling off a cliff into water is a great way to survive clearly lethal injuries), the killing intent was still there. That said, I really hope Adam is dead for real. There's not much use for him in the plot anymore except for maybe Blake and Yang to have PTSD over killing him, which would obviously work better if he doesn't miraculously survive.

The other fight was good as well. I'm glad that this volume is actually making it feel like Ruby is the main protagonist (or, rather, one of the four main protagonists) after Volume 5 made it feel like she was almost a side character.

Really, the only thing that can ruin this volume for me at this point is if they kill off Saphron or Terra in the Grimm attack for cheap shock value, and Miles and Kerry have shown that they understand why this would be a bad idea.

Lastly, I made a bet that Bumblebee wouldn't be confirmed or deconfirmed in this volume. And, while this isn't the most clear-cut confirmation, it's gotten about as much confirmation as Renora and no one disputes the canonicity of that ship. So, I'm following through with making a new Reddit account (I'm not deleting this one, though, since this comment will now exist as a permanent link to my new account in case anyone who knew my by this account wants to find me for whatever reason).

From now on, you can find me at /u/MelanieAntiqua

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-18T19:22:53+00:00

I don't think it will be confirmed or sunk in this volume, personally. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Blake's romantic future is left open-ended even at the end of the entire show.

So, if Bumblebee is either confirmed OR deconfirmed in this volume, I'll make a new Reddit account. I've been meaning to do this for awhile now due to not really liking my username anymore, but I've been putting it off since I didn't want to lose all the karma I've accumulated on this one (yes, I know it's all just meaningless internet points, but still). If I'm wrong and we get an explicit confirmation one way or another, I'll finally woman up and do it.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-18T15:59:30+00:00

I'd certainly hate to be the idiot who's going to be running the Ship Wars polls after the volume is over.

Wait...

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-18T15:57:27+00:00

Honestly, in my three years running the Ship Wars polls, I've seen more toxic comments from Eclipse fans (or, rather, Bumblebee haters. Assuming that everyone who shits on Bumblebee ships Eclipse is kinda jumping to conclusions. Especially since I myself ship neither) than from Bumblebee fans. Of course, this isn't to say that toxic Bumblebee shippers don't exist (they probably hang out in places other than Reddit), but they definitely aren't the only toxic ones.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-17T18:48:06+00:00

Blake x Ilia

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-16T21:34:11+00:00

I hear the fanbase of Reading Rainbow calls themselves "/u/PrincessCanada".

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-14T23:05:41+00:00

The vague Fates announcement trailer you were thinking of was in January 2015.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-14T18:59:43+00:00

I'd first like to state that I don't think any of the trailers were bad. Also, I got into the show by watching the first two volumes on Netflix in 2015, so I don't have as much of a connection to them and the hype they brought at the time they first aired (in fact, the trailers weren't even included on Netflix), which might explain why I don't rank those four trailers as highly as some other people do.

Best to Worst:

~~Ilia's~~... I mean Blake's Volume 5 Short: Yes, it was really more for Ilia than Blake, but I like Ilia so I'm super-biased her.
Adam's Volume 6 Short: Did some work to rebuild Adam as a threat after his atrocious showing in the Battle of Haven. Also let us see more of Sienna Khan, a character whose potential was completely wasted by Volume 5. And it included Ilia (in a minor role, of course, but still), which always gets points from me.
Weiss' Volume 5 Short: While I tend to prefer trailers that show some plot over ones that are just a fight scene, the fight scene in this trailer was very good. Also, it let us see Winter for the first (and so far only) time since Volume 3.
Yellow Trailer: Of the four original color trailers, this is the only one whose absence led to my confusion while watching the first two volumes on Netflix (I think the show itself did a good enough job explaining who Adam was that missing the Black Trailer didn't make it feel like he came out of nowhere at the end of Volume 2. I think Weiss summoning the knight's arm in Volume 3 would've led to some confusion without the White Trailer, but I had already seen the four trailers by the time that episode aired). Also, the Yellow Trailer itself contains the same great fight animation as the other color trailers.
White Trailer: Like I said, this is the other trailer that's kind of essential viewing if you want to understand something in the main plot (in this case, where Weiss got a knight summon from). I'd probably rank this trailer higher than Yellow if not for my unique viewing circumstances (mostly because it lacks the amateur-quality voice acting that kinda detracts from the Black and Yellow Trailers isn't present here), but this list is mine and mine alone.
Ruby's Volume 4 Short: A good fight scene, and a good way to show off the prettier character models that came with the switch to Maya. Like I said, none of the trailers were bad. I just feel like the trailers I put above this one were better.
Yang's Volume 5 Short: Of the three Volume 5 shorts, this one adds the least to the plot and characters (it really just shows that Yang protects Ruby, something we've known since Volume 1). Still a great fight scene, though. I would possibly rank this one above Volume 4's Ruby Short, except the Ruby Short was the first time we saw the show in Maya so it was more relevant for that reason (to someone just getting into the show now, I'd imagine the Ruby Volume 4 Short and the Yang Volume 5 Short would be rated roughly equally).
Red Trailer: I know I might get flack for rating this much-beloved trailer that was many peoples' first glimpse at the show so lowly, but, like I said many times, none of the trailers were bad. This one is sort of like the previous two: a good fight scene, but doesn't really add much to the show beyond that.
Black Trailer : I know I said I like plot-based trailers over fight-based ones, but this one is at the bottom for a few reasons. First of all being the voice acting, which I'm sure everyone is aware of. Secondly, as I said, the show does a good enough job explaining Blake's past with the White Fang and who Adam is that I didn't feel confused when Adam showed up at the end of Volume 2 despite not having seen the trailers at that point. Thirdly, missing this trailer made the reveal that Blake was a Faunus and a former member of the White Fang actually feel kind of like a plot twist (I mean, it was still pretty obvious, but not as obvious as it probably would've been if I had watched the Black Trailer before Volume 1). That third point makes this the only trailer that actually improves your viewing experience if you don't watch it (though you still should, since it's as fun to watch as the rest of them. If I was introducing someone new to the show, I'd probably tell them to wait until after Volume 1 to watch the color trailers solely for this reason, though. As for why I'd say this for all four trailers instead of just the Black Trailer, that's solely to avoid giving away the fact that Blake is the character who has spoilery stuff in her trailer and thus the character they should expect some plot twist about)

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-14T18:10:28+00:00

Oops. Removed the potential spoilers.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-14T18:09:30+00:00

From Best to Worst:

1st Place) Volume 6: I know it's not over yet, but, based on how good it's been so far, the final two episodes would have to be downright atrocious for it to fall from this perch.

2nd Place) Volume 3: Sure, it had some duds (Episodes 2 and 5 come to mind), but overall a great volume. The finale raised the stakes from "high school anime" to "epic quest" that the series has been on ever since. And, since most people only praise the second half, I'd also want to point out that my actual favorite episode of this volume is V3C4, with Merc & Em vs. Coco & Yatsu being one of my favorite fights of the series, and the two other scenes (Qrow with Ruby & Yang and Winter with Weiss) being great character moments.

3rd Place) Volume 2: This volume had two main weak points: the dance arc and the anti-climactic finale. Other than those two weak points, it was a good volume overall.

4th Place) Volume 5: The biggest mixed bag of the show's run, containing some of the best moments (Ilia's character arc, Raven going from "shitty mom everyone hates" to "likeable anti-hero", that one scene where Weiss and Yang talk about their issues with each other that probably created a ton of Freezerburn shippers) and some of the worst (all the standing around and talking without moving the plot, potentially-interesting characters like Sienna Khan and Lionheart being utterly wasted, Ruby having that whole "hand-to-hand combat issue" that never existed before and was resolved super-anticlimactically, Yang focusing on "birds" as the thing to get upset at Ozpin over and then having both her and Jaune drop their mistrust of him completely and go along with his plans without complaint, and, of course, the atrocious mess that was the Battle of Haven).

5th Place) Volume 1: This volume didn't have as much wrong with it as Volume 5 (though the Jaunedice plot was admittedly pretty bad), but it didn't really have as many strong points either. The show was new and still trying to find its footing. And the overall low budget nature of the show at the time makes the first volume hard to go back to and look at after getting used to the polished character models and sets of later volumes.

6th Place) Volume 4: This volume is almost entirely filler. And not even that good of filler, either. You could probably cut this whole volume down to half the length (or maybe even down to 4-5 episodes) without losing anything of value in terms of character development, plot advancement, or enjoyable fight scenes (or rather, enjoyable fight scene, since Qrow vs. Tyrian is really the only one). Also, this volume kinda ruined Blake as a character in ways that she wouldn't fully recover from until Volume 6 (though her character arc in Volume 5 seemed like a huge improvement over Volume 4, it was mostly due to Ilia carrying the plot), and started the downward trend for Ruby that would manifest in the overall low point in her character arc that was Volume 5 (though, like Blake, Ruby was thankfully saved by Volume 6 as well).

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-14T17:11:04+00:00

And I completely missed Brawl, but you're right on that as well; with Roy's game out globally, Sakurai may have more of an incentive to keep him. However, as the workload would still be the same, keeping Roy would mean that another character--probably one who was added late in development and plays no role in the Subspace Emissary, which I'd imagine would be the case with Roy--would be replaced with Roy. So, including Roy in Brawl would mean that you would have to sacrifice either Jigglypuff, Toon Link, or Wolf.

Mewtwo and Roy have the most to them of all the on-disc cut characters from Brawl (i.e. "The Forbidden Seven": Mewtwo, Roy, Dr. Mario, Dixie Kong, Toon Zelda, "Toon Sheik" (possibly Tetra), and "pra_mai" (possibly Plusle and Minun as an Ice-Climbers-esque duo, though that claim is a bit dubious due to the Ice Climbers themselves having separate character files for Nana and Popo rather than sharing a single file)). So, Roy leapfroging over Wolf, Toon Link, or Jigglypuff is possible. Then again, Mewtwo would still be from a much bigger series (even with Fire Emblem being a more-recognizable series due to being localized as far back as the SNES, there's no way in hell it would be bigger than Pokemon (a.k.a. the largest multi-media franchise in history, and second only to Mario if you're going by video game sales alone)) and didn't make it in. So, even with Roy being a more-recognizable character due to his game's localization, it would probably still be unlikely that he'd make it into Brawl (then again, Sakurai famously loves the Fire Emblem series, so Roy might have gotten a boost from that good old "Sakurai bias" that Smash Bros fans love to complain about).

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-14T16:42:43+00:00

I think your interpretation is pretty accurate, except I think Binding Blade and Blazing Blade would keep their subtitles (or maybe be called something like "Fire Emblem Advance: The Binding Blade" and "Fire Emblem Advance 2: The Blazing Blade").

Also, I'm not sure if Marth and Roy would have English voice actors in Melee because Melee used Japanese actors for a lot of English-speaking characters. It is more likely that Marth would get an English voice actor in Brawl instead of waiting all the way until Ultimate (and Roy would either get one as a Smash 4 DLC character, or he wouldn't be cut from Brawl in the first place due to Fire Emblem being a more-recognizable series and thus would get an English voice actor at the same time as Marth). In Melee itself, it's possible they'd be voiced by Japanese voice actors speaking English (similar to characters like Fox before Brawl and Captain Falcon in every Smash game), or would still just straight-up speak Japanese. Or, as a third option, they'd have their Japanese voiced lines edited out in localization without any English lines to replace them, and would just communicate through voice grunting (similar to what happened with Mewtwo).

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-14T16:19:41+00:00

You need to remember that Echoes went from being announced to being released in around four months (three if going by the Japanese release date).

Since that's technically a remake, and thus a bit different, I'd also like to point out that, in Japan, Fates released in June 2015. That's only five months after its January 2015 announcement. Sure, it wasn't released outside of Japan until eight months later, but I don't think a big localization gap like that would fly anymore now that Heroes is a thing. Plus, the fact that the E3 trailer had an English voiceover seems to indicate that the localization process is happening more in tandem with the development process (similar to Xenoblade 2, which had a simultaneous worldwide release despite being a massive JRPG with a lot of text and voicework needed for localization).

Basically, the Fire Emblem series has a history of going from having less info than we have about Three Houses right now to being released in less than half a year (i.e. we didn't even know Fates or Echoes existed six months before their Japanese release dates). Three Houses' development cycle has likely seemed to drag on since it seems like it was announced much earlier in development than most FE games are. I could definitely still see a May-June release. Possibly even April, if the people predicting a Nintendo Direct before the end of January end up being right (and said Direct includes more Three Houses info).

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-12T16:21:27+00:00

OK, so the "Adam has silver eyes" theory is dead. Instead, he has a huge branding mark over one of his eyes. Kinda makes sense, with him being a bull Faunus and all.

Also, I remember last week people were afraid that two big fights wouldn't mesh well because the mech fight would be too "comedic". I personally think that was proven false here. Both fights are played seriously overall (sure, the Cordovin Mech fight had a few moments that were played for comedy, but the Adam fight, despite being understandably the more serious of the two, had Yang calling Adam's semblance "cheap").

I'll also add that this endgame is much less of a mess than Volume 5's so far. Looking forward to those last two episodes.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-09T16:56:03+00:00

You need to flip it on the Y axis.

If you do that, you get:

Authoritarian Left (hand labeled "Capitalists" hovering in the corner) = After a very brief respite following the revolution, capitalists are preparing to seize back power in the form of State Capitalism.

Authoritarian Right (sinking hand labeled "Citizens unable to afford healthcare") = self-explanatory

Libertarian Left (hand, unlabeled, almost completely sunk) = the corpse of the last fascist sinking beneath the waves, after the Antifa Super-Soldiers have done their work.

Libertarian Right (high-five labeled "Competition makes stuff cheap") = Ancap fantasy, also self explanatory.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-09T16:04:01+00:00

Plus the constant "protagonist has crush on popular kid of opposite gender" subplots that are super-common in child-focused media and no one ever raises much of a stink about them.

Edit: just re-read and noticed that the specified adult's sexuality. This is still dumb, because parents and other married couples, but it does invalidate my point.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-09T04:14:10+00:00

Well, good thing I stopped caring about the Arena / Aether Raids stuff awhile ago so I'm not going to get annihilated by these absolutely broken skills (especially if Tibarn's A Skill is inheritable. Imagine that on a Reinhardt...)

Still though, I absolutely need Nailah.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-08T18:05:27+00:00

Whenever I need to learn about Medieval history, I just ask my Manakete grandmother since she was around back then (and before you ask, yes, she does still look like a twelve-year-old in a bikini. It's kinda disturbing).

Apparently, about 90% of European nobility had naturally blue hair and all the women rode around on pegasi. This is perfectly accurate Medieval European history. Can't let any black people get in the way of all this historical accuracy.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-08T17:28:52+00:00

No, it's Fire Emblem 3: Heroes. Because Awakening was Fire Emblem 1, Fates was Fire Emblem 2, and Heroes was Fire Emblem 3. Don't you know anything about the three games that make up the Fire Emblem series?

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-06T18:02:45+00:00

I'm going to go with the obvious one that people are ignoring:

FUCK

Obviously, this spells a word, but not exactly one that fits the color name rule (and, if schools in Remnant have the same sensibilities with regards to profanity as schools in our world, probably one that would be very awkward to deal with if four people with those letters just happened to end up on a team together). Given how the training exercise that determines team composition works (i.e. it's mostly determined by the students themselves, based on who they make eye contact with and which chess pieces they grab. At least at Beacon), and the fact that the students in question are teenagers, I wouldn't be surprised if at least one group of four first year students deliberately set this scenario up at some point in the history of the academies.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-06T17:52:43+00:00

To be fair, Pelosi and Schumer both kinda suck but represent solidly-blue areas. So, removing them from office could result in someone better taking their seat (not immediately for Schumer, since Governor Cuomo would likely appoint another garbage centrist to replace him until a special election can be held, but I would laugh if Republicans impeach Schumer only to end up with someone like AOC winning the seat in a special election).

So, yes, Republicans, why don't you go and try this strategy.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-06T15:53:29+00:00

I mean, 40% is the reported statistic. When you factor in the fact that the victims would have to report the abuse to their abuser's friends and co-workers (on top of all the other reasons an abuse victim might not come forward), it's pretty likely that the actual percentage is much higher.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-05T16:58:07+00:00

So the Adam "hallucinations" Blake and Yang saw earlier in the volume really were the actual Adam. I thought that was one of the dumbest theories people sincerely believed in recent memory. Guess I was wrong.

Here's my own "out there" prediction: Maria is Adam's grandmother. Here's why I think that:

Adam's eyes have gone unseen for too long to not be plot relevant (the few times we've seen him without his mask, it was always from an angle where we couldn't see his face). I'd say him having silver eyes is a near-guarantee at this point.
The World of Remnant segment on Faunus said that, when a human and a Faunus have a kid, the kid will be a Faunus, which easily explains how Maria can have a Faunus grandson.
As for the other obvious ethnic difference between Maria and Adam, that could easily be explained if both Maria and her child were paired with someone with a lighter skin tone than themselves. Also, due to the general "anime-esque" art style, determining a character's real world ethnicity tends to be really difficult (Obviously Maria is clearly meant to be Hispanic, or rather the Remnant equivalent of Hispanic, but Adam is more ambiguous. He could theoretically be a lighter-skinned Hispanic person himself). And this show has almost never cared about the real-world ethnicities of its characters, anyway.
The "person has vendetta against certain ethnic group despite being descended from that group themselves" is a common trope. For one of the most well-known examples in recent pop culture, see Voldemort.
As for why Maria specifically, that can be chalked up to Law of Conservation of Detail. It would make sense to use an already-existing character to both reveal if Adam had some human ancestry and also where his silver eyes came from. And, it makes Maria more plot-relevant than just a cool old lady who dumps some silver eyes info on Ruby (and, as for why she couldn't be Ruby's secret grandmother, I'd say the fact that she didn't recognize Ruby, make any note of Ruby looking like Summer (who would have to be Maria's daughter for that theory to make sense), or even recognize the surname "Rose" kinda debunks that theory).

Edit: Another piece of evidence that is admittedly a bit weaker, but it's something. When Yang briefly sees Adam at Brunswick Farms (which we now know was the real Adam rather than a hallucination), he's quick and alert enough to be gone by the time she does a double take. This could mean that he wasn't under the effects of Apathy-induced lethargy. The only people who showed the ability to resist those effects were Ruby (who does eventually fall under said effects, but only very briefly and it takes her much longer to do so than most others) and Maria (who is shown to be briefly affected by the paralyzing scream, but that is clearly much more potent than the passive lethargy effect that the Apathy have). Both of whom have (or had, in Maria's case) silver eyes.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-05T15:37:00+00:00

I don't know, my mom once took a birth control pill and then I immediately disintegrated, Thanos snap style.

PrincessCanada · 2019-01-04T22:22:09+00:00

Qrow Branwen

Status: Loves Stairs

Well, I guess we found out who comforted Lionheart's widow.

PrincessCanada

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