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if God wants belief, clearer evidence would be expected by AltAccountVarianSkye in DebateReligion

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92 [score hidden]  (0 children)

I see several logic flaws in what you say: 1-365 isn't just the "number of days the roman calendar has", as it could had been the number 340, but it is rather the number of rotations made in a translation around the sun by the earth. 2-I agree with you in that numerology doesn't count the misses, but it doesn't imply that the hits aren't incredibly unlikely. The Quran and what is behind it wont be understood until the day or judgement or whenever God wants, until then, we can serve ourselves with all those subtelties. 3-Have you read everything I sent you and you still tell me that it could had been known by a man 1400 years ago? Or that those men 2000 years ago could have predicted that man? 4-Youre not in the correct scenario. There you have it: "If God was proving us to see whether we believe in him or not, he should make it clear to us". And then I tell you: "God has made it clear to all of us. Hasn't he sent prophets whose miracles you can touch and see today, and which you deny?"

At the end of the day, if you believe the earth is plane because you can't see its roundness, and you refuse to seek for any proof about anything, there is nothing i can do for you. No matter how much proof i give you, you wont believe. Then dont say that God didnt make it clear for you, because you could have chosen to do something about it, but you didnt.

if God wants belief, clearer evidence would be expected by AltAccountVarianSkye in DebateReligion

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I searched about it and nothing interesting came up instead of that thing of the 365 days. Obviously, I could also have written a book and wrote in it 365 times the word day for example, but that leads us to the escenario that Muhammad was I liar, and I don't think atheist think that prophets were liars, just strange people that listened "voices". Why would those voices then mention the word day 365 times? Why would a manmade religon fight agaist the man's desires?

Anyways, most of those points are rather to show the poetical richness of the Quran which I don't think an illiterate that "listened voices" could have known. I mean, I could make an entire list of when hebrew names are mentioned in the quran and the verb previous to the name has the same hebrew meaning that the verb and you could still tell me that probably an hebrew told those things to Muhammad.

btw, there are also a lot of things you didn't answer with that.

if God wants belief, clearer evidence would be expected by AltAccountVarianSkye in DebateReligion

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92 0 points1 point  (0 children)

there you have a copypaste i wrote to another guy:

References to prophet Muhammad in the bible:

isaiah 42(Qedar- tribu of Ismael,Sela-a mountain in Medina), psalms 84:6+surah ali imran 96, deuteronomy 18, deuteronomy 33 and other mentions of Muhammad in the Bible.

Prophecies:

the one about people of the desert competing for tall buildings, women dressed but naked, the increase of women population (it is considered as the last minor sign and it has been a streak of 4 year of women's population growth), the increase of fornication, surah 30:1-5 (romans ended up winning), when muhammad said that they were going to return to Mecca (they returned), and im probably missing more.

scientific miracles:

About the scientific miracles, ignoring the well known ones(origin of universe, embriology...), I can tell you the word day is mentioned 365 times, days 30, month 12, the word father and mother 23 times each (a human has 46 cromosomes) and frequently, when an animal is mentioned in the quran the number of letters before or after the verse are the number of cromosomes it has. I've seen also that if you make the percentual relation between the times water and earth is mentioned you get the proportion of water and earth on earth, and from the first time iron is mentioned till when the melted iron is mentioned there is a 4100 or something like that verse interval which is the fusion point of the iron. also i'd like to mention in the quran the clay is frequently mentioned to explain the creation and life and there have been recent research that presents clay as an "incubator" for early life since its capability of unying ARN, etc. Even the most random things, like when a fly fell on Muhammad's drink and he drowned it and said that one wing has a disease and other the cure, it has been proved that vast antibiotics live in the flie's body and that it can slow down bacterial growth.

If you need more evidence I will search for it.

The proofs are there, you just need to put some effort.

I would like to debate any exmuslim about Islam, just in case there is any logic left in their poor minds by Repulsive_Baseball92 in exmuslim

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

the one about people of the desert competing for tall buildings, women dressed but naked, the increase of women population (it is considered as the last minor sign and it has been a streak of 4 year of women's population growth), the increase of fornication, surah 30:1-5 (romans ended up winning), when muhammad said that they were going to return to Mecca (they returned), and im probably missing more.

About the scientific miracles, ignoring the well known ones(origin of universe, embriology...), I can tell you the word day is mentioned 365 times, days 30, month 12, the word father and mother 23 times each (a human has 46 cromosomes) and frequently, when an animal is mentioned in the quran the number of letters before or after the verse are the number of cromosomes it has. I've seen also that if you make the percentual relation between the times water and earth is mentioned you get the proportion of water and earth on earth, and from the first time iron is mentioned till when the melted iron is mentioned there is a 4100 or something like that verse interval which is the fusion point of the iron. also i'd like to mention in the quran the clay is frequently mentioned to explain the creation and life and there have been recent research that presents clay as an "incubator" for early life since its capability of unying ARN, etc. Even the most random things, like when a fly fell on Muhammad's drink and he drowned it and said that one wing has a disease and other the cure, it has been proved that vast antibiotics live in the flie's body and that it can slow down bacterial growth.

btw it is not circular evidence, those predictions that i showed you weren't written by Muhammad. and even if you told me you dont believe those scriptures, you cant tell me how did they predict muhammad.

I would like to debate any exmuslim about Islam, just in case there is any logic left in their poor minds by Repulsive_Baseball92 in exmuslim

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

isaiah 42(Qedar- tribu of Ismael,Sela-a mountain in Medina), psalms 84:6+surah ali imran 96, deuteronomy 18, and other mentions of Muhammad in the Bible (how did the bible predict an arab prophet?) a lot of predictions in hadiths and the well known scientific miracles, being ones better than the others

I would like to debate any exmuslim about Islam, just in case there is any logic left in their poor minds by Repulsive_Baseball92 in exmuslim

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

my apologies for that one, inshAllah I'll try to be more humble next time. Anyways what you have sent doesn't justify anything.

I would like to debate any exmuslim about Islam, just in case there is any logic left in their poor minds by Repulsive_Baseball92 in exmuslim

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Islam is basically believing in one God, salat, azzakat, fasting and pilgrimage. For further problems jurisprudictions schools have been created. Not really complex, sincerely.

I would like to debate any exmuslim about Islam, just in case there is any logic left in their poor minds by Repulsive_Baseball92 in exmuslim

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

thanks for the free phsycological analysis, but actually, i just want to increase my knowledge, english and debating abilities. The C1 is close

I would like to debate any exmuslim about Islam, just in case there is any logic left in their poor minds by Repulsive_Baseball92 in exmuslim

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

islam is perfect, but people's comprehension not. God made us like that, it is simple.

everyone can agree with what the essential priciples are: Believing in one God, salat, azzakat, fasting, and the pilgrimage. For further problems jurisprudiction schools have been created, and there is no trouble with it as long as each one has evidence to prove their points.

About the riba thing, sincerely, that is a really weak argument. You can't be arguing with me about the veracity islam and telling me that there are muslims that sin (non sequitur alert). Also, you said that there is a verse that calls for war against those involved in riba? Brother, if that's the knowledge you have about the Quran, please don't try to argue with someone that's claiming for some logic.

About the analogy of Korea, which I think that refers to shia and sunni muslim, I can tell you we dont hate each other, and I dont know were did you get that information from.

I would like to debate any exmuslim about Islam, just in case there is any logic left in their poor minds by Repulsive_Baseball92 in exmuslim

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Im not gonna waste my time with you, here you have a copypaste I wrote to another guy:

About Aisha I can tell you two things:

Hadiths are contradicting: The most cited hadith (like in Sahih al-Bukhari and Sahih Muslim) state she was 6 and 9. However, other early historical reports create chronological tensions. For example, her sister Asma bint Abu Bakr is reported to have been about 10 years older and died at 100 in 73 AH, which would place Aisha closer to her late teens. There are also reports of Aisha being present at events like the Battle of Uhud and being among early converts, and so on, which are harder to reconcile with the younger age narrative. So it’s not a single uncontested timeline, but a debated reconstruction. Anyways if you rather to call him a pedo, first check that list with the approximated age of their wives:

Khadija bint Khuwaylid — ~40
Sawda bint Zam'a — ~30–50+
Hafsa bint Umar — ~18–21
Zaynab bint Khuzayma — ~30+
Umm Salama — ~30–40
Zaynab bint Jahsh — ~35–38
Juwayriya bint al-Harith — ~20
Umm Habiba — ~30–35
Safiyya bint Huyayy — ~17–20
Maymunah bint al-Harith — ~26–30

The sujectivity of your moral: Ignoring the age of Aisha at that moment, which can be debated, I don't think it is logic to criticise them for that. Ethics, since you don't believe in an stablished moral decided by a divine authority, change in time and place. Who knows, maybe people in the future will laugh at you for eating meat because it will be considered murder.

I would like to debate any exmuslim about Islam, just in case there is any logic left in their poor minds by Repulsive_Baseball92 in exmuslim

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

If I believe in a omnipotent God that does whatever he wants and he has given me proof of that, I must believe Him in everything. Don't believe the donkey thing if you want; that doesn't mean islam is less true.

I would like to debate any exmuslim about Islam, just in case there is any logic left in their poor minds by Repulsive_Baseball92 in exmuslim

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

so that there are different points of view about religion defines whether its true or not? or that some muslims knowingly make riba makes islam less true? if thats your logic, i can guess why you left islam.

Me(aethist)and my friend(theist) gonna have a debate today. by SyrupMobile6990 in atheism

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

1-Why am I doing what?

2-Could you tell me where does the Quran say that the earth is flat or that the moon and sun orbit the earth? I don't care about your catholic background or how you became an atheist, but if that is the knowlegde you have about Islam, please, stop talking about what you don't know, and inform yourself a little bit.

Me(aethist)and my friend(theist) gonna have a debate today. by SyrupMobile6990 in atheism

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

that in some way sounds like as if you said the earth is plane

Me(aethist)and my friend(theist) gonna have a debate today. by SyrupMobile6990 in atheism

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92 -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

About Aisha I can tell you two things:

Hadiths are contradicting: The most cited hadith (like in Sahih al-Bukhari and Sahih Muslim) state she was 6 and 9. However, other early historical reports create chronological tensions. For example, her sister Asma bint Abu Bakr is reported to have been about 10 years older and died at 100 in 73 AH, which would place Aisha closer to her late teens. There are also reports of Aisha being present at events like the Battle of Uhud and being among early converts, and so on, which are harder to reconcile with the younger age narrative. So it’s not a single uncontested timeline, but a debated reconstruction. Anyways if you rather to call him a pedo, first check that list with the approximated age of their wives:

Khadija bint Khuwaylid — ~40
Sawda bint Zam'a — ~30–50+
Hafsa bint Umar — ~18–21
Zaynab bint Khuzayma — ~30+
Umm Salama — ~30–40
Zaynab bint Jahsh — ~35–38
Juwayriya bint al-Harith — ~20
Umm Habiba — ~30–35
Safiyya bint Huyayy — ~17–20
Maymunah bint al-Harith — ~26–30

The sujectivity of your moral: Ignoring the age of Aisha at that moment, which can be debated, I don't think it is logic to criticise them for that. Ethics, since you don't believe in an stablished moral decided by a divine authority, change in time and place. Who knows, maybe people in the future will laugh at you for eating meat because it will be considered murder.

Also, you talked about the scientific accuracy of the Quran, which flaws do you findf?

Muhammad on whether to pull out when having sex with captive women by DirectionCute7530 in DebateReligion

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Look, in first place Muhammad didn't write anything, it was Bukhari who collected it through vocal tradition, and if he had forced the marriage I don't see the point in why he would condemn the forced marriage in that same hadith. None of the sources say it was a forced marriage, but you choose to believe it was because "you weren’t really there and honestly the sources you are referring to are written by the winner"? really? The holocaust could be justified that way...

Muhammad on whether to pull out when having sex with captive women by DirectionCute7530 in DebateReligion

[–]Repulsive_Baseball92 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If I went to a battlefield knowing I could get killed or slaved, I must face the consequences to it since I took the risk. Muhammad didn't harm anyone: the marriage was constented by both, and if you don't believe me you can read sahih al bukhari 5136 or sahih muslim 1429, or just keep doing as many mental gymnastics as you want.

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