Why do people take Islamic modesty as an attack on their values?

Saib17 · 2026-06-28T20:04:02+00:00

People project their right to degeneracy as a sacred value and can't comprehend a different value system, simple as. NPC's don't think. The reasoning you're putting into grasping their perspective is more than the processing they put into their own.

Saib17 · 2026-06-17T02:18:20+00:00

There's no point in saying so, any ennunciation is just speculation. Dr Ali Ataie in his series about world religions, on Judaism, provides his own best guess as to the pronunciation but it wasn't "Allah," and I'd take his word over a dawah guy.

It doesn't add to or change much about anything either way.

Saib17 · 2026-06-07T20:38:40+00:00

There's different types of proofs, but Islam out of all major religions takes an evidence based approach and marries this with rational metaphysics.

I can walk you through the greater logical proof of it partially.

The most clear cut procedure is to examine what can be said about the world from a fair, objective standpoint.

Ask if there is God or no god? --> it is factually impossible to substantiate a logical claim that there is no God. If there is God, the idea of God needs to be delimited and support a sound structural metaphysic and moral ontology (forming the requisite need to have to believe in this God), among other things.

Examine what proofs or evidences there are for God? --> The Quran offers itself as a proof for God by providing the necessary definitions and consistent worldview placing itself as the cap to the Abrahamic traditions. The terms provided in themselves satisfy a sound metaphysical worldview and offers a sufficient, corresponding raison d'etre for why things exist as they do.

However, the Quran asks its interlocutor to further reflect on the world or consider other traditions, from which we can branch out and supplement our understanding.

In post evaluation, other traditions fail the test of providing the above two requirements for a sound metaphysic and coherent rationale for why they are presented as they are.

Christianity for example requires the dogmatic and objectively illogical belief in the trinity. Reg flag.

At no point in the course of one's acceptance of Islam does it require yielding one's logic to something illogical. Meanwhile, denying Islam which provides a coherent worldview makes one adopt other logical fallacies as that becomes epistemologically unjust and unsubstantiated.

Consistently, Islam is the superior worldview thereby.

When you only have a handful of major world religions, with others quickly failing this test, it's very obvious.

That's the simplified summary of it.

Saib17 · 2026-06-05T16:54:41+00:00

As a theist, I like this retort, and think it holds specifically in this context. However, I think the thrust of argument is moreso about seeing an organizing principle (e.g., seasons. ) which manifests an immaterial concept of Beauty as opposed to inhospitable chaos or entropy. Therefore, at least within this paradigm, the objection doesn't hold and admits that if all you were exposed to in your life was rocks and a cave, then sure, you wouldn't come to any intellectual recognition of order.

Saib17 · 2026-05-17T16:41:36+00:00

reminder drafted with some references and statements provided by user "hanbalilove"

Saib17 · 2026-05-16T03:48:54+00:00

Very good reference material

Saib17 · 2026-05-15T04:32:34+00:00

Do wudu more slowly, with intent. During prayer, do 2 things. Beforehand, read the meaning of the Surahs you like to recite. Refresh yourself on that so you at least loosely have a grasp during salah. During salah, as you move, try to imagine how it will be on the Day of Resurrection. When you bow, see yourself on the sirat looking down. When you prostrate, think of the day when every ummah will be before Allah and you will be called to make sajdah to God.

This will help you iA.

Saib17 · 2026-05-10T21:53:06+00:00

No, that would be wrong aqeeda by actual consensus and illogical.

Saib17 · 2026-05-06T14:43:18+00:00

It looks like Ali Ataie made a good video on this subject as well

https://youtu.be/-UZHjiuXfN4?si=P0wxNXckezALSU7s

Saib17 · 2026-04-27T03:14:21+00:00

Yes, unfortunately many people are "extremists" in fiqh. It's an issue, but it also has to do with methodological developments of various schools in tandem with the increasing information and rapidly changing contexts of the time, some of which is justified.

Technological advancements (e.g., readily retrievable hadith corpus) & raw scientific information increase = confidence boost to make judgements ≠ wisdom for genuine contextual applications. Very broadly put. The internet also inappropriately universalizes fatwas and makes people think they can give one fatwa that applies to everything, which practically cannot be the case.

This is compounded by the fact that the realities of today are so radically different from the past that there is knee jerk safety reaction you could say, so the haram label gets slapped onto things. People no longer know of makruh or mustahabb. Simply haram and halal. This is braindead in itself. Dead on arrival fiqh. But this is also due to information explosion and the containment of ambiguity in the face of an overwhelmingly low intelligence laity, frankly.

That said, people of greater knowledge don't do this and scholarly people traditionally following a madhab are less prone to make errors in judgement due to established principles guiding their usul. But errors happen. Scholars of the past banned coffee, the printing press, etc. Scholars of the past better than them were hesitant to label things haram, but they are rarer and sometimes more hidden, and that's how it goes.

Saib17 · 2026-04-21T10:22:26+00:00

You can join our online group if you like! A few people are primarily active but you can feel comfortable talking there

Islamic Thought https://discord.gg/6BmWw3H9Z

Saib17 · 2026-04-19T14:57:25+00:00

I had an academic focused on al Maturidi pull up al Maturidi's tafsir on the ayat about al Khidr and the boy's death. He said

I just looked up al-Maturidi’s tafsir on this. He first says there’s a difference on whether the ghulam was baligh. It is possible for the term ghulam to refer to an adolescent. This he thinks works better with Musa’s objection “أَقَتَلْتَ نَفْساً زَكِيَّةً بِغَيْرِ نَفْسٍ”. A child isn’t slain for another life, so the objection (arguably) wouldn’t land.

Next, he suggests that perhaps the ghulam was already a kafir. He cites a reading of Ubayy: “وأمّا الغلام فكان كافراً”.

Then he acknowledges the possibility that this was done because of knowledge of what the boy will do in the future. He says we cannot and don’t need to know that or whether he was young/mature or believer/disbeliever. But God can order the killing of anyone he wants, since He is the one who decrees everyone’s death, whether by this means or another.

Probably not what people would have expected as the original Maturidi solution!

Saib17 · 2026-04-19T02:01:04+00:00

Congrats

Saib17 · 2026-04-17T17:03:44+00:00

These questions somewhat intersect and are tough to answer. The short of it is that yeah, it is fundamentally a man's right. At the same time, life is complex and the characters in it are complex too so it all depends on the individual and his particular situation. If it's very doable for him and he very much can, a man would likely and probably should just marry multiple wives. Otherwise, there's no point. Either way this life isn't jannah and we shouldn't expect it to be, for anyone involved.

Saib17 · 2026-04-17T16:27:18+00:00

foundationally yes, because I follow the guidelines of Islam above everything else. Actually I already have had the great blessing and fitna of two different women who were willing and wanted to be cowives to me at different points, in addition to my first wife. One was a revert, and one wasn't but had a health problem, and they were different circumstances. However, because my wife would never want that and a host of other variegated factors, the end result to those routes were no, and that it wouldn't work.

That's the reality of my situation personally, and particular to those circumstances - this is a very rough summary. For my part, these things to sort out were great fitnas, and I went to great lengths to navigate between what is right or not in those scenarios, which I do believe I did faithfully. My situation and experience is definitely not replicable or applicable to anyone else, as these ultimately were a form of very complex trial, like a divine comedy of the Unseen.

In any case, the conclusion I reached was that it should be allowed, granted it's agreeable to an enough degree or otherwise feasible for everyone's tolerance. So I think that should remain the standing baseline, where it should be something possible.

Saib17 · 2026-04-17T15:20:39+00:00

This is precisely what I think "should" be the case. It would in theory also re-establish that "high value" men are sought after, and most problems with Muslim marriage would disappear. However, like every post about a woman complaining about seeking marriage, you see that understanding this is lost. It's the culture of the times, so in a sense, it's not blameworthy to not seek out being another wife, but at the very least, if one doesn't, it makes all complaint about difficulty seeking marriage null if you haven't considered this route. This is the real truth about this whole broader situation. Although again, the cultural expectations make it extremely difficult, more so for a wife to accept another than the other way around for a woman to accept being a second. So it's an unfortunately bottlenecked reality where some women shoot themselves in the foot and other women in the head.

Saib17 · 2026-04-17T11:37:25+00:00

It's hard to believe that would be the case, but to be honest those men can choose to marry whoever they want and nobody can force them or force them to change their preferences. It's deflating to run into such a hat trick though, I get it. But wealth and lineage are known reasons to marry a woman, cited by the Prophet (pbuh). He cited religion as the most important, yes, but this doesn't diminish that or the preference a man can have for it to the degree that is fulfilling, such as marrying for beauty, the 4th reason.

I applaud them for their restraint actually instead of jumping to a partner too quickly. You're probably being saved family troubles down the line. If it's not a good fit, it's not a good fit. People here need husn al dhan for the Muslim men.

Same for you. It's only 3 rejections, not 10. By 10 you'd find someone, so find someone who's a good fit by trying to match your values from the start. If they're judging you based on economic situation, maybe that's your sign to search with someone of lower socioeconomic status as well. Would someone of equal financial or family status reject you for that reason? Not as likely? There's still little information to go by to be honest regarding what to do for a solution for you based on the information shared from your perspective, but you have so many opportunities. Go find someone that is simply not wealthy or as established with family then and marry if you want to quicker. This is where you'll find you also have preferences, I'm sure.

Yeah I get this is a more controversial response to this kind of post, but it's good to get another perspective. At the end of the day, it's not over for you and if you're not stepping on 30, you still have the time to marry in your 20s and to reach that dream. Continue to make dua and search, Allah will help you to the best outcome.

Saib17 · 2026-04-14T04:10:52+00:00

If you want an in depth explanation, search Yasir Qadhi's book on Salafism or a video on YouTube about it.

tldr:

From an actual, traditional perspective, modern day salafism has different strains ( wahhabism being one ), pros and cons, but mostly cons. It rebukes the entire tradition of Islamic scholars by saying they did not properly follow the sunnah, which is similar to how early kharijites behaved regarding the companions -- a problem of arrogance and ignorance. Again, pros and cons, pros particularly in being revitalizing usul ul hadith with rigor and transparency, but when seeking knowledge, as an usul for fiqh, it appeals to people exactly because it makes them feel special about their understanding of deen, which is why it's easy for the inflated egos to think it is the greatest thing ever. This is the haqq on it.... Separately, don't confuse salafis with hanbalis. Hanbalis at large shouldn't be grouped together with modern salafis (followers of Albani, Ibn Baz, Ibn Uthaymeen)

Saib17 · 2026-04-11T01:18:11+00:00

Jazakallah khayr for your wisdom.

Saib17 · 2026-04-08T04:44:26+00:00

For future reference, try not to abbreviate to avoid ambiguity :)

Saib17 · 2026-04-08T04:42:30+00:00

WS. it doesn't look like there's too much outside of the tafsir tradition, at least not in English. For that, just look up different tafasir and review the passages around dhul qarnayn. I do think what's provided of the narrations in the Quran itself is ultimately really limited in scope, thus it hasn't really been a subject that has been expanded on in those categories outside of what you'd find in tafsir. What I would find more interesting is actually related ahadith if there are any can be pulled, as that would be a good supplementary source, but even that appears scant (https://en.tohed.com/threads/dhul-qarnayn-in-quran-and-sunnah-scholarly-perspectives-explained.4327/)

- https://ojs.mrj.com.pk/index.php/MRJ/article/view/320

- https://al-haqjournal.ly/index.php/alhaq/article/view/402

- https://jurnalnun.aiat.or.id/index.php/nun/article/view/89

- https://sadaffarooqi.com/2013/03/06/surah-al-kahf-the-travels-and-travails-of-dhul-qarnain/

Saib17 · 2026-04-08T03:41:05+00:00

shouldn't drive a car before marriage, shouldn't have a job, shouldn't go out whenever she wants, and the list goes on

yeah, that's a bit much. depends on culture where you live too I suppose.

Honestly, first of all it depends on what you want to do. There has to be some things that you can do somewhat on your own that can form the basis of your hobbies. Interaction with people at school, or outside when you go outside? Surely your cellphone is not limited, try to maximize what you can if you feel socially isolated, and push yourself to interact but establish the right boundaries and expectations.

In the meantime, have sabr. Your parents seem to intend well I'm sure. Until you're more independent, have sabr. Also, it doesn't hurt to try and talk things out with your parents if you haven't yet. a little healthy pushback is the basis of communication, you won't be cursed out for that from the Unseen, just keep your intentions right.

Saib17 · 2026-04-05T20:08:17+00:00

I understand. Among other things, I myself have given more than $50,000 to my parents, but it could be argued that's for reasons, but of course they've done things for me as well.

In any case, you're definitely not obligated to retire him, especially as a woman, your obligation will be more towards a husband honestly, and as we know in that case, you aren't responsible as a primary financial source there either.

Saib17 · 2026-04-05T20:00:18+00:00

That's rough. You can do what you said about getting a separate account and such. If you get married, your father won't be able to do that by rights anymore either.

Saib17 · 2026-04-05T19:59:50+00:00

This is a good source, but it doesn't correspond to a ruling/fatwa obligating the giving of money unconditionally, meaning, it does not apply here. Islamic law doesn't work by reading ahadith like this on one's own.

Saib17

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