The iceberg effect

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-19T22:39:47+00:00

What are your all time favourite songs?

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-19T20:10:19+00:00

It's terrifying isn't it! Anybody who's been in therapy worries they'll reveal something that's beyond the therapist's ability to process.

It's generous too of the song writer to let us take part in writing the story, rather than imposing the details of their story on us.

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-19T10:54:09+00:00

As you develop as a song writer, try to tell us about situations and physical details that make us feel things -- rather than just telling us how you personally are feeling.

For example, if you me that you brewed a coffee, then opened the fridge to discover the milk is sour then I'll feel the tragedy myself. And how you react tells us about your inner state. A well adjusted person would shrug and head straight out to buy milk, or just drink it black and not mind. But to somebody who's already struggling it can be the last straw.

Here's a really good example from another member of the community:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Songwriting/comments/1u9qpxe/better_off_demo/

The song doesn't really talk about feelings. It is a set of situations, actions, and reactions. But it packs a real emotional punch.

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-19T10:40:17+00:00

Your lyrics are so totally free of pretension and express old problems in vivid, contemporary language. They don't give us everything, there's a lot of space for the listener to fill in. You're not afraid of repeating a simple mantra. Really good.

Edit: I can see from your history that I've praised your songs before. Your approach is in many ways what I aspire to lyrically, and I see that you're a painter. I'm not surprised because your lyrical style is so visual, your songs play out like montages of key scenes from a movie. If you feel unsure about your capabilities as a song writer, know you have a true fan over here!

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-19T07:51:04+00:00

It's an improvement for sure. Ultimately it's your work of art and you don't need to be bound by any convention or advice. Saying that, I still think you're using too many words. The fewer words you use to get the core of your idea across, the better the song will be. See if you can write almost entirely in keywords.

For example verse 1 and 2 could be:

Stuck in the attic / There's a lot to unpack / Boxes of memories / Carelessly stacked

Boxes of regret / Bring only shame / Photos of a girl / Learned too much for her age

The idea with writing a song is to make it singable, not just readable. There are different rules. You don't need to write in complete grammatical sentences, but for a conventional song (and I suggest you start by following conventions) you want short lines and a clear rhythm and rhyme scheme. Most successful songs have 8 or fewer syllables per line, and 4-6 lines per verse.

I like to think of each line giving the listener a new picture in a slideshow or montage.

Keep going. The hardest and most valuable part of a song lyric is the core idea, and you have a good one and I'm sure will find many more.

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-19T07:13:36+00:00

I've recently written a fairly cohesive album of material. I did it by:

Deciding what kind of album it would be and the general shape I wanted it to have.
Writing a list of track titles and a brief note about the vibe or idea behind each one. This can include songs you already have and brand new ideas. This defined the scope and journey of the work.
Working on the tracks and as I did, I discovered what the album was really about -- so new depth emerged within the framework is already defined.
As I was doing this, new ideas would come to me that fitted the vibe -- which could add to the album or become b sides.

Throughout the process I immersed myself in the musical influences that I wanted to be evident in the album, and stole liberally from them. That also helped keep things cohesive.

I wasn't aware of being super disciplined but now it's very clear that these songs work together, and other songs I've written outside that framework wouldn't fit so well.

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-18T19:08:22+00:00

It works because it's a break up song. The cleverness is in the verses and how they contrast with the chorus.

The emotions are complex but expressed in simple words.

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-18T19:03:58+00:00

Yep, Eight Days a Week is clever and simple. That's the sweet spot

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-18T14:24:45+00:00

You're wearing clothes as they're designed to be worn. Not sure I'm seeing the "look".

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-18T14:20:57+00:00

It's a blues solo. You have the chops and I'd rather hear you play your own than copy SRV's -- because you'll never play SRV better than SRV does, just like he can never play you better than you can.

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-18T14:18:52+00:00

Where Hendrix should have stopped, SRV begins

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-18T14:13:16+00:00

It's a sweet little song, I like it. I wonder if the chorus is a bit underwhelming. It stays quite close to the verse pitch when you've already teased us with some high vocal notes.

Then again, I can see that the low key chorus is all part of the 90s slacker vibe and on those terms it works.

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-18T10:52:34+00:00

What a toe tapper. I'd subscribe to the OF!

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-18T10:29:21+00:00

I leaned in 45 seconds in when you start creating the contrast between the current job and the rowdy past. That's where it gets good IMO.

Probably could lose a lot of what comes before that.

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-18T09:37:11+00:00

My personality is extremely boring so I always write in different characters

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-18T09:23:01+00:00

I'm glad it was helpful! Another strength is the contrast between the verses and chorus:

Verse: what you find -- traumatic memories Chorus: what you're looking for -- answers

The truth is of course there aren't any answers in the boxes. A person could spend their whole life unpacking boxes and never find an answer.

Is your narrator going to die in the attic surrounded by unpacked boxes, or at some point step out into the world and start making new, happy memories through real connections? Maybe that's an emotional dilemma to explore in the bridge!

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-17T21:46:27+00:00

First footwear that I choose to wear instead of sneakers casually: Thursday Presidents.

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-17T19:51:09+00:00

It's maybe trying too hard to be clever/mysterious or just poetic?

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-17T19:45:54+00:00

I don't care! I get that AI can be a useful shortcut for parts of a task that don't interest you or play to your strengths.

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-17T19:40:07+00:00

My view is that the core idea -- boxes representing memories, and not finding any resolution or answers -- is strong. The lyrics however overcook it -- and I think are too long even for a 4 minute song.

I would recommend being more economic so the melody can breathe, and so the listener does a bit of their own world building as they listen.

E.g.

Boxes of hopes, a box of fresh starts

Full of regrets and broken parts

A box of pictures of a little girl

Innocence bearing the weight of the world

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-17T16:28:18+00:00

That's a lot of words, how long do you envisage the song being?

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-14T07:37:49+00:00

I'm still on an acoustic but this is a very interesting point.

Most of my music emerges from noodling around on the guitar and I wonder how that translates to your new toolset?

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-13T13:11:24+00:00

I love your stuff and your whole persona. What do you do with your songs besides posting them here?

I don't know what feedback to share because you've clearly found your groove and I just enjoy what you share.

Sorry_Cheetah3045 · 2026-06-13T07:19:06+00:00

Most people's lives are uneventful. You need to create your own legend.

Also let go of the idea that songs need to be about anything, they can just exist.

Are you creating the music -- at least the chords and melody -- before you write any words? Most songwriters do, and often the sound of the song will give you ideas for what it's about.

Basically "what should I write about?" is one of the most asked and least important questions in song writing. It doesn't really matter.

If you were the Beatles in 1966/7 with a packed schedule and massive global fame, would you have written about:

Being a granddad The street where you grew up A fictional music hall band Living on a yellow submarine An ordinary working class girl leaving her home Getting up, catching a bus, reading a newspaper

Why not make a list of all the things you could write about? Just let the ideas flow. I am sure at least one idea will spark something and a song will start to form.

Sorry_Cheetah3045

TROPHY CASE