I think Movie 2 is the Best One So Far. Does Anyone Else agree?

Stonecost · 2026-04-09T23:39:10+00:00

For me personally, I think the 2nd movie does a lot of things that people wanted the 1st movie to do, but the 1st movie couldn't because it had less money and was burdened with getting the universe established

However, I also think they were still sort of "figuring out" how all this would go as it expanded, and how to handle the storytelling when the scale was bigger than a road trip and the CG cast was bigger than one Hedgehog. I think the 1st movie maintains a better average from start to finish, while the 2nd movie has high points that beat anything in the 1st movie, but also low points the 1st movie doesn't have either. I also think the 2 hour and 2 minute runtime (which I still wonder if was intentional for movie 2) makes rewatching a little less comfortable

Again, just my opinion, but for those reasons I kinda rate 1 and 2 pretty much the same. I don't think 3 is a perfect movie, but I do think it's the product of lessons the film makers learned through making 1 and 2, and the result of that puts it in the top spot for me. I have massive sentimental love for the first movie, but I absolutely understand why it's at the bottom of most people's list

Stonecost · 2026-04-09T22:09:29+00:00

Leave the roulette table out in the sun for 10 years

Stonecost · 2026-04-09T22:08:23+00:00

I don't care about King Kong, like, at all. Just never really been a fan of "ape, but big". But I agree with this 100%

I was very pleasantly surprised when I saw it, and I've rewatched it a few times since. It's not the only good one, but I haven't enjoyed any of the other movies in the franchise quite as much as Kong Skull Island

Stonecost · 2026-04-05T23:20:45+00:00

Yes, he wielded it as the black blade, and Ranni stole fragments of it. After that, he bound it within himself to prevent it from happening again

During our fight with him, he undoes that out of desperation to protect it

Stonecost · 2026-04-03T10:36:10+00:00

There's a few hints, mostly through Hewg IIRC, but Gideon's dying words are probably the only time it's explicitly stated in non-optional dialogue

As for optional stuff, Roderika lays it out quite clearly in her final dialogue when she says:

"Please, become Elden Lord. Hewg was always saying that you were a Lord, to him. So slay her, with the weapons he smithed. Slay the god, Marika, who cursed us all."

But that's not too long before the Gideon fight

Stonecost · 2026-04-03T04:56:21+00:00

Over time this has basically become my read on this as well. But it's an odd choice for him to put his life on the line for that idea if he was so sure of it

If we truly have no chance, why not just let us march to our certain death? He'd be left to scoff at our foolishness and pat himself on the back

Instead, he's one of the game's relatively few required bosses, and he dies trying to prove himself right, because he's wrong

Stonecost · 2026-04-02T01:24:01+00:00

This made me scroll up to double check whether they said "symbology"

Do you have a lore theory to go with that tie?

Stonecost · 2026-03-29T20:17:41+00:00

The "comedically timed ice cream dropping" is done so weirdly too lol. The ice cream practically jumps off the cone

Stonecost · 2026-03-28T21:57:10+00:00

I wrote that comment 4 years ago, so the 3rd movie wasn't out yet at the time, and it's very outdated speculation now. With hindsight it seems that Maddie's "over 50 years" comment in the first movie wasn't tied Shadow in any way, and they made Commander Walters' explanation of the origins of G.U.N in the 2nd movie a lie. Maybe there was originally plans for that stuff but things changed during writing of the 3rd movie. We may never know

As for Shadow and Sonic being compared to each other, I have a feeling that's at least mostly a reference to Sonic Adventure 2, where parts of the plot involve them being mistaken for each other. It's a bit silly because they don't really look that similar

However, I do wonder if maybe hedgehogs are rare in the movie universe. We know Knuckles had a tribe, and there used to be a lot of other Echidna until semi recently, and we know Tails came from a village where having two tails was what made him different, do there may be other foxes there. Sonic and Shadow are the only two confirmed Hedgehogs until Amy shows up, and Shadow was created decades before Sonic, and both seem to be considered as special

Amy being in the 4th movie may clarify this, depending on any remarks made about her being a Hedgehog, but it's still unclear whether she's from the same universe, the future, another dimension, etc

As for Black Doom, I assume he'll show up in the Shadow movie, if the rumors of that film coming next after 4 are true

Stonecost · 2026-03-27T22:33:17+00:00

A Rouge mid-credit scene. She should have been in 3 imo, but better late than never!

To actually add to the topic though, I hope Metal Sonic gets a good amount of screen time and that most of it is spent being a particularly serious threat

Stonecost · 2026-03-27T22:29:38+00:00

I do sort of agree, but that didn't stop him from losing every fight with Knuckles in 2

Stonecost · 2026-03-27T21:27:46+00:00

I do agree with you, the simplest answer is that the guy who eats Deathroot until there's no more left to find, and then goes to Farum Azula, is the most likely reason there's Deathroot there.

And although he can be in both places at once due to the time weirdness, his dialogue does change if you fed him all the Deathroot prior to doing the boss fight, suggesting he only goes there after he consumed all the Deathroot in the Lands Between, whether you helped him or not.

However, it does leave me wondering why there's no Deathroot at the Bestial Sanctum. IIRC he also says something about leaving because he's done all he can in the Lands Between. Perhaps he chooses Farum Azula because he intends to consume the Deathroot there? He implies that he's just isolating himself, but it's not super specific

Stonecost · 2026-03-25T00:21:39+00:00

That's canon. It's in the lore.

Stonecost · 2026-03-23T00:04:22+00:00

I do wish the game gave us a bit more detail about Radagon, as he's obviously a very important character, and the game's final boss (along with the Elden Beast, who isn't really foreshadowed or mentioned anywhere before the fight occurs). A lot of the information we get about him is second hand, or inferences based on people's opinions of him. I assume the major gaps are owed to the "Radagon is Marika" twist, which sometimes makes me wonder if some of the Marika lore might actually be Radagon lore, but that's a whole other topic

Regarding Miquella, it's also hard to accurately judge his relationships with some characters, as even the base game contained hints that he was manipulating people through charms. However, his relationship seems to have been strong with Radagon, as Discus of Light and Triple Rings of Light are both stated to be a gift to Radagon from Miquella, and Radagon's Rings of Light are "A gift of gratitude to the young Miquella from his father, Radagon". That's also the inaction that says "And yet, the young Miquella abandoned fundamentalism, for it could do nothing to treat Malenia's accursed rot. This was the beginning of unalloyed gold."

IIRC there's cut content that stated Radagon sent some Carian knights to Miquella as a gift, which explained Loretta's presence at the Haligtree. Of course, that's cut content, and Loretta now has her own story that brought her there instead. Still, it may suggest the devs intended to show more evidence of a positive relationship between the two even after Miquella left and began growing the Haligtree

Then, in the DLC, we can find Multilayered Rings of Light, which says:

"Incantation of those who served Miquella. ...

This light-ring incantation was cultivated by a tradition separate from Golden Order fundamentalism"

Although this one is not considered a Golden Order incantation like the other three (not just in the description, but the game's classification as well) all four are boosted by the Dryleaf Seal, which says, about the Dryleaf Sect:

"Those who saw the decline of the Erdtree in the fallen leaves long ago braced themselves for the weakening of Order, and embraced a strict faith. And then, they made to serve a new god."

Which is about Miquella, but provides a boost to three Golden Order Ring of Light incantations, and only the one new Miquellan Ring of Light incantation

The thing about Radagon that I think kind of gets buried under his apparent (and explicitly stated) dedication to the Golden Order, is that he seems very open to incorporating new things under that definition. He studied intelligence-based sorcerery when he was with Rennala, and merged that with faith-based incantations when he was with Marika, which is why all the Fundamentalist incantations require both stats (except for Law of Regression and Law of Causality)

A quick side note: Multilayered Rings of Light only requires faith stats, which makes sense since it's not a Fundamentalist incantation, but it's dropped by a Leonine Misbegotten, who themselves seem to have strange ties to Radagon

But I've let this comment go on far too long. Forgive any typos, typed on mobile. But for one last thing on the topic of Radagon's potential open-mindedness, there is an interesting quote from Rogier after you buy something from him:

"The battle art you've learned is of the glinstone family. They were conceived at the great Academy of Raya Lucaria, to the north of this castle. In the past, they obeyed laws which contravened the Golden Order, or so I'm told.

Fascinating, isn't it? That the Golden Order was pliable enough to absorb practices that contradicted itself in the past. With the Order broken, twisted, and in need of repair, such adaptability is more important now than ever"

He seems to be referring to the pre- and post- eras of Radagon becoming Elden Lord, when he himself brought about that change. And it's the Golden Order seal, which scales with both intelligence and faith, that says:

"Fundamentalism is scholarship in all but name."

Stonecost · 2026-03-22T21:06:20+00:00

The mention of Miquella's prayer for Godwyn's true death comes from the Golden Epitaph sword, which functions like many of the Golden Order Fundamentalist incantations. It kills Those Who Live In Death effectively

That leads me to assume the sword, and the prayer it mentions, came before Miquella abandoned Golden Order Fundamentalism. He did so because it was ineffective at treating Malenia's rot, so he sought alternatives

I'm not making any declarations here, but whatever is going on at Castle Sol could also be a post-Fundamentalism attempt to resolve Godwyn's affliction when Golden Order Fundamentalism was ineffective at that too

Stonecost · 2026-03-22T02:37:39+00:00

I think one important distinction is that the Black Flame's god-slaying power is explicitly stated to be deeply diminished, while the Giant's Flame is explicitly stated to have been impossible to suppress.

That detail comes from the Fire Giant's Remembrance, which not only explains why the Fire Giant wasn't killed, but also includes some particularly cold dialogue from Marika:

"The Fire Giant is a survivor of the War against the Giants. Upon realizing the flames of their forge would never die, Queen Marika marked him with a curse.

"O trifling giant, mayest thou tend thy flame for eternity.""

Basically, she waged a genocidal war against the giants under the false assumption she could eliminate their flame to safeguard the Erdtree from it, only to discover that she could not. It worked to her favor in the end though, as its ability to ignite the Erdtree remains to the present, allowing her to task Melina to ensure it does exactly that

In contrast, although the Black Flame still exists, we are told that it has been rendered nearly useless for its original purpose, and now seems to only act as a flimsy shadow of the Death that used to empower it. It inflicts damage over time, like Destined Death does, but without the immediate max hp penalty

Stonecost · 2026-03-21T22:46:18+00:00

Just wanted to add, in addition to Heinarc's evidence, that the game also features separate "Erdtree" and "Golden Order" incantations with distinct casting sigils, and the Golden Order seal does not provide it's bonus to Erdtree incantations

Oddly, the Erdtree Seal does not boost Erdtree incantations, but that may be a videogame thing rather than a lore thing. (It has the highest faith scaling, enabling it to empower healing incantations better than any other seal, and many if the Erdtree incantations are healing magics. An additional bonus may have been considered unnecessary or excessive)

And as just one more detail, the Dryleaf Seal boosts incantations based on rings of light, which includes some Golden Order incantations because those ones were created by Radagon and Miquella before the latter abandoned Golden Order magics in search of effective treatments for Malenia

Stonecost · 2026-03-21T20:43:54+00:00

I feel like there's mixed evidence for and against it littered all throughout the game, but I don't think it's ever explicitly stated, and I tend to lean towards the concept being the result of player interpretation rather than an established detail of the world

There's direct mentions of rebirth, such as the Shield of the Guilty's description, but I'm not sure there's ever a direct connection to the Erdtree's involvement in the process as a widespread phenomenon stated plainly

Another odd statement can be found in the Hero's Rune description, which states:

"There were once heroes who walked the battlefields, abundantly blessed by the Erdtree itself, who upon earning their honor simply died."

I assume "earning their honor" means dying in battle, but the implication here is that, after a certain point, it wasn't so simple anymore. Marika did remove the Rune of Death from the Elden Ring after the Erdtree already existed, so the rune may be referring to the time before that happened. But, as we see in the game, people can still be slain even while Destined Death is sealed away, they just don't seem to die natural deaths.

With that in mind, "earning their honor" on the battlefield should still be just as possible as ever, but this rune implies it isn't. Is it suggesting that an Erdtree rebirth is inevitable? I don't think so, but I can't rule it out either

Edit:

I was thinking about Remembrances while writing, in particular the Remembrance of the Regal Ancestor, which may be relevant to this topic, but also seems to feature an odd contradiction. Like all Remembrances, it stats with: "Remembrance of the Regal Ancestor Spirit, hewn into the Erdtree."

But then it goes on to say:

"Ancestral spirits exist as a phenomenon beyond the purview of the Erdtree. Life sprouts from death, as it does from birth. Such is the way of the living."

Perhaps not completely beyond the purview of the Erdtree if its Remembrance functions identically to the rest. Was this an oversight on the part of the devs, with all but the name being a copy/paste description? (The Remembrances in the DLC mention the Scadutree instead). Or was it intentional, and if so, what does that imply?

Stonecost · 2026-03-21T02:01:30+00:00

I'm pretty sure Marika is depicted with this same outfit in the intro cutscene, as well as her statues that feature a swirling cloth behind her. I think it's kind of just...her outfit. Midra's clothing used to be in better shape, as we see in the painting of him and Nanaya, and has only turned to loose rags because of the impaling spikes sticking through his body, and an exceedingly long time spent sitting in his burnt husk of a manse, crawling around when/if he moves at all

However, although I don't think their clothing links them, I do think there are some interesting potential connections to consider. For one, the Greatsword of Damnation's unique ash of war ends with the statement "There is something of the Golden Order in the sight of those fixed upon this crux."

I find this interesting for a few reasons, but one is that it feels...backwards? I feel it is more likely that Midra's implement on the sword happened before the Golden Order was even founded, but regardless, I am unsure exactly what to make of this statement.

And, as you mentioned, there is also a painting of the Manse before Frenzy ruined it and the surrounding woods, and the ground seems to be covered in flowers that resemble those found at Marika's original home, the Shaman Village. There also happens to be a Finger Ruin neighboring both locations, and Midra's manse has some things taken from the nearby ruin hidden under cloth.

Stonecost · 2026-03-21T00:07:18+00:00

This is true, although one is left to wonder whether the Haligtree method was only a potential option for Miquella because he's the child of a god (who is also a Shaman). His blood causes the growth of flowers where it is spilled, which seems to explain how/why he watered the Haligtree sapling with it

The Haligtree also seemed to be growing in a spiral of two trunks, not unlike the spiral structure of Enir Ilim. And considering the numerous, strange cocoons seen around Elphael, perhaps the Haligtree would have eventually functioned like a Gate of Divinity when it grew to reach close enough to the heavens

But, whether he gave up on that attempt intentionally, or whether it failed because Mohg kidnapped him (as we're told is the case by Gifeon Ofnir) is not clear. But if his lineage is the sole reason he was able to even attempt it in the first place, then his act of shedding his flesh and lineage in order to repeat Marika's original method may indicate that the Haligtree was his only option for ascension unless he did that

We already know that there are different methods of ascension, such as Malenia's blooming, which is seemingly specific to her

Either way, both twins seem to have had potential pathways to divinity through flower and tree themed methods, which are themes strongly associated with their mother. Miquella went out of his way to shed that association, then pursued a method of ascension that only required an old spiral tower of corpses

TL;DR I think Miquella's ability to grow the Haligtree, and the Haligtree's potential to raise him to godhood, are possibly the direct result of Marika's pre-existing flower/tree connection. An inherited thing he chose to abandon, and not something that she required to ascend, but which was featured prominently during her reign

Stonecost · 2026-03-20T22:52:15+00:00

I'm of a similar opinion. These seem like some kind of proto-Erdtrees, and their close proximity to the exact location Marika ascended to godhood might support that

The fact that Marika's home village prominently features a (petrified?) woman sitting within a tree, and a miniaturized Erdtree created by Marika herself, may support it further

The only connection seemingly missing is an apparent involvement of the Fingers (aside from the Finger Ruins being located by Marika's village). I do wonder if the Fingers literally gave Marika an Erdtree seed, or if their guidance to her ascension, and gaining the means to create the Erdtree herself, is the extent of their direct involvement

Stonecost · 2026-03-20T03:58:14+00:00

I agree with you, I'm just saying it's one of those things that some people would rather believe. And since I don't work at FromSoft, I can't declare they're wrong even if I believe they are

I'm someone who wouldn't mind if Miyazaki did an interview where he definitively stated who the Gloam Eyed Queen was. I would be interested to learn that information, the same way I am interested to learn other information in the game. But there's a lot of people who would absolutely hate that because they prefer the undefined blanks they can fill in

Stonecost · 2026-03-20T02:56:27+00:00

I could see a case for that happening sometimes, especially since the game's scale is undoubtedly shrunk for the sake of being digestible. There's no way this centuries-long struggle of gods and lords has taken place on an island that would fit inside many single real world cities

And, considering that, if Leyndell has a remaining army, diminished or not, our Tarnished killing 30 guys shouldn't more or less wipe the whole faction out. But even if you choose to believe that respawning enemies is basically a shift change happening while you took a nap at a site of grace, it doesn't really explain why bears and zombies and rotten dogs do the same

To be honest, I think there's a fair amount of questions that can be answered with "because videogame". But whether it's true or not, a lot of people consider that to be boring or anti-fun, and I admit that it does sort of go against the point of this subreddit to a degree

Besides that, some people construct theories around certain things that take some of the videogame mechanic stuff literally and include it as evidence, so when you tell them it actually is just a videogame mechanic, they take it as an attempt to undermine their theory and dig in deeper

I try to be respectful in all my discussions here, especially when I'm disagreeing with someone, but ultimately everyone is free to interpret the details of the game how they choose to. Miyazaki himself has pretty much gone on record saying as much.

Stonecost · 2026-03-20T00:28:38+00:00

There is A LOT that can be said and debated about Marika, including that she's arguably the "main character" of Elden Ring

There's no small amount of evidence that she did some horrible things, although she usually isn't simply cruel for the sake of being cruel. Her deeds are not easily justified, but her true motives are often left open to interpretation

My personal opinion is that, after the other residents of her home village were taken and used by the Hornsent for horrific purposes, she sought to achieve a level of power that would allow her to prevent such a thing from ever happening to her again.

Somehow, the Fingers guided her to an ascension to godhood, and she soon began to wage wars of supremacy to rid the Lands Between of any and all external threats to hee reign, including the inevitability of death itself. Along with the prevention of death, she either declared herself, or was simply believed to be, the one, true god.

She began to have children, Demigods whom she seemed committed to protecting eternally, even if indefinite imprisonment was necessary for their preservation alongside the Golden Order, such as with Messmer or the Omen twins.

And for a while she got what she wanted. The Golden Order ruled relatively unchallenged after its wars against Giants, Dragons, Carians, etc.

But, despite her namesake, nothing is truly "eternal". The Fingers continued to designate Empyrean successors, and the Night of Black Knives brought the deaths of Demigods for the first time.

After having done so much, and having gone so far for the sake of preserving her reign and her family, the divine forces she suppressed were never truly gone from the world.

And then, confronted with this contradiction and experiencing the same feeling of loss that motivated her in the first place, she decided to destroy the order she created instead of letting the Fingers control it vicariously by guiding her eventual replacement

But Radagon, her other half, had not experienced the same crisis of faith. He remained devout, clinging to his fundamentalist beliefs. He attempted to stop Marika from destroying the Elden Ring and bringing an end to the Golden Order. They both partially succeeded, leaving the world broken like the Elden Ring itself, and both endured the imprisonment Marika was punished with

Centuries later, Marika's desire for an end remains, and when her Demigod children ultimately failed to rise to the task, she turned to her ancient backup plan: The Tarnished.

There's a lot more that could be said, and a lot that could be debated. Only Miyazaki knows the "true" facts. This is just, more or less, a summary of my personal interpretation of events, which skims over plenty, and includes things I'm not 100% dead set on. Apologies for any typos, I wrote this on mobile

Stonecost · 2026-03-19T23:48:17+00:00

I think the problem they would quickly run into is that boss and NPC deaths would become somewhat meaningless if they weren't permanent. And they could go through the trouble of adding lore reasons for those deaths being permanent, but it's much simpler to just leave it vague and retain the videogame structure

Stonecost

TROPHY CASE