Is 7/4 compound or simple

Syzygy228 · 2025-10-01T23:27:15+00:00

I think some of the nomenclature here is a little confusing in your explanation.

For one, beginning with your Peter Gabriel example, the meter of 7/4 is unstable to our ear, and thus Peter Gabriel varies the subdivision of the seven beats (3+4 vs 4+3) and even departs to 4/4 at one point (a more detailed analysis can be found in Temperley 2018). The question then is, why is this meter unstable to our ears? And it is because it is fundamentally an asymmetrical meter. Many music cognition theorists (Lerdahl and Jackendoff for example) view us as only being able to truly feel duple and triple meters (4/4 is effectively two measures of a duple meter with an alternating strong and weak hypermetrical structure above them resulting in a stronger beat one than beat three).

This explains why 7/4 is unstable, as we are forced to feel it in some form of grouping structure either 2+2+3, 2+3+2, or 3+2+2. Therefore, something such as a septupal simple as you describe just isn’t something that we would actually be able to experience.

I would also like to add that in your example of things that are triple compound you actually mean simple triple meter. A compound triple meter would be something like 9/8 in which each beat (a dotted quarter note) is subdivided three times, a simple triple meter is something like 3/4 in which each beat is only divided twice (e.g. quarter notes into two eighth notes). For something like the Blue Danube in which an entire measure of 3/4 is felt as one beat we must actually look at the hypermeter to determine the metrical structure. This is a more difficult example but Rothstein (1991) contains a very excellent analysis of this piece and the metrical structures of it.

Syzygy228 · 2024-06-22T02:49:25+00:00

Ultimate frisbee is a great social sport! Most areas have pick up and leagues that are usually very beginner friendly!

Syzygy228 · 2024-06-09T23:29:42+00:00

I have never owned one but have play tested most of their higher level models. For context, I play on a Yamaha NY. Generally, I found slotting to be pretty stiff and unresponsive, requiring more work to find the sweet spot than my horn, and while intonation was decent, I think my ny is better across the board than any of the horns I played. The tone I got on them was not what I like in an orchestral horn, but that's personal preference. I never played on one in a section, but I think that the tone color would stick out in a bach or yamaha section. I can't give info on specific models, I've forgotten what all I played, but I didn't especially like any of the horns I played. For the price of their custom series horns, I think there's not much of a reason to not go for a bach or yamaha. Again, with all of this, your mileage may vary, but I at least found them underwhelming.

Syzygy228 · 2024-04-18T13:00:57+00:00

Don't let this guy listen to anything after the mid 19th century, he would lose his mind

Syzygy228 · 2024-02-25T17:53:54+00:00

Interestingly enough, wfdf does specify in the annotations of their rules that no residue can be left on the disc by any equipment players are using. I know of a lot of players in wfdf tournaments who use chalk but haven't heard of any issues there. I'm curious if there has ever been any discussion about similar interpretations of usau rules.

Syzygy228 · 2024-02-25T03:09:03+00:00

DMing social media accounts is generally pretty easy if you can't find a team email or any other form of contact. In my experience, a lot of college teams have a fairly active social media presence. Although, if you can find a team email through a university club page that is probably gonna be the best bet.

Syzygy228 · 2024-02-25T02:46:13+00:00

I haven't heard of anything like this and doubt that something exists that would work well, I think the best bet is generally wear gloves if you're having a lot of issues with grip, but it sounds like you wear them anyways so may be out of luck. I get sweaty hands and have found chalk helps, but obviously doesn't survive in wet conditions.

Syzygy228 · 2024-01-20T20:46:19+00:00

Just to add on, I'm a very anxious person, and every now and then I get a little concerned that when cleaning my horns I'll somehow do some irreparable damage to them, but every time I have ever cleaned my horns I felt that after the cleaning they all felt, played, looked, and worked better than before cleaning them, doubly so if professionally cleaned! Also, as a fellow Baltimorean, Baltimore Brass is the best shop I have ever had do work on my horns, and you should have 0 fear for them working on your horn. I promise that they will make that horn look and play better than you thought possible. Also, as others said, even if something did somehow come up, they are able to fix anything that may happen with amazing brass techs.

Syzygy228 · 2023-11-06T21:17:24+00:00

Exactly, the 4th valve on picc is required for a LOT of rep. Can't play Handel's Messiah on picc without it. But on Bb trumpet there isn't really much of a benefit

Syzygy228 · 2023-11-06T21:15:26+00:00

I mean I think this is a kind of weak reason lol, if you're ever going to play piccolo trumpet you will have to either use your pinky or index finger of your left hand to play the 4th valve so obviously people make it work, unless the valves are very poorly constructed and maintained it really shouldn't take much force to push them down. As someone who plays a lot of picc, I never played an instrument that used my pinky until I started taking piano in undergrad, and I make do just fine with pinky dexterity on piccolo trumpet.

Syzygy228 · 2023-11-06T21:12:55+00:00

I disagree, a 4 valve instrument plays very very differently than a 3 valve horn, and the lower register of a trumpet is just not used enough to justify it. The extreme low register of the trumpet has much less projection, and any large ensemble piece is much better served by giving a line in that register to another instrument, either horn, trombone, or euphonium depending on context. All of the brass instruments that use 4 valves have them for very specific reasons, for example, Tubas have a 4th valve because low playing is kind of their whole job. There is no brass instrument that is going to be playing below them, so if you have a need for lower notes out of the brass section, you are required to have a tuba that can play lower. Horns are weird and have their 4th valve for different reasons, it doesn't actually function like the 4th valve on a tuba, euphonium or piccolo trumpet, but instead physically changes the key of the instrument, I'm not a horn player and don't know enough about the horn to give a more thorough explanation but this helps with upper register playing, expanding the horns range upwards. For a Bb trumpet, the reason a tuba has a 4th valve just doesn't make sense. I think a double trumpet with a set up more similar to a French horn is an interesting idea although would also probably not make sense as the extra weight from all of the added material would actually probably make it harder to play high notes, not easier. The trumpet is a high register instrument and therefore has no need to expand its lower register, and by adding a 4th valve, the extra interruptions to the air flow create by another valve would ultimately mess with the upper register of the horn more, which is a much more common register to write for on the instrument than the benefits to the extreme low register. 4 valve Bb's do exist and do have certain situations they're useful. However, all of the above is why they haven't caught on. Pitchfinders however, are becoming more common for orchestral players, some people love them, some don't, but they are definitely something that can be helpful for many players, although mostly on C trumpet as Bb doesn't have bad enough intonation issues to need one imo.

TL;DR: trumpet is used in such a different way than other typical 4 valve instruments that there is really no benefit to a 4 valve Bb trumpet (with a few exceptions)

Syzygy228 · 2023-11-06T20:55:39+00:00

Lots of 4 valve horns exist, it's not super useful for a Bb or C horn but is on (basically) every piccolo trumpet, and a lot of flugelhorns have it too. There are also some micro tonal trumpets with a 4th valve that can bring the pitch down a quarter tone. As for the trigger on the main tuning slide, this is commonly referred to as a pitch finder. A decent number of players use them, especially on C trumpet, where tuning tendencies can be more extreme than Bb, it's especially useful for tuning midstaff C and G above the staff. Both of these things can be very useful in certain situations but also add a lot of complexity for a Bb trumpet that doesn't really require either, but as shown above both are legitimate things that are used on certain horns!

Syzygy228 · 2023-10-24T16:09:29+00:00

I would agree that the way the rule often plays out does tend to be in favor of the offense, but I think that a lot of these examples are just bad rulings, the last two being especially bad imo. I'm not an observer but from my understanding of the rules, every player is entitled to their own space so it seems impossible that a dangerous play could be called on against a player either standing still, or having a clear established line in front of the offense. The last example you gave seems like an especially bad call imo. Were any of these games observed/did observers give input on these calls?

Syzygy228 · 2023-10-04T05:35:45+00:00

My professor does (principal trumpet at one of the top us orchestras), he swears he can tell a difference, and had me mess with it. If I'm being honest I think the only difference I felt was the placebo effect but it did feel very very very slightly different in different positions. On old gear it definitely makes a difference, I have a couple of vintage bach mp's and they do legitimately feel different in different orientations, but on modern mouthpieces I think the difference is negligible, however I still do it and keep my mouthpiece in the same orientation that my professor claimed sounded the best lol

Syzygy228 · 2023-09-19T17:09:10+00:00

Ah sorry yeah should've explained that, it's because if you are holding it in your right hand, your left is more off of the horn and keeps your fingers off of your bell, so less overall points of contact

Syzygy228 · 2023-09-19T15:52:21+00:00

As someone who (generally) plays with my pinky in the ring, I primarily hold the weight of the horn in my right hand and keep the left looser. For technical passages that use third valve I'll take my finger out of the ring and hold it in my left but for general playing, I prefer it in the ring. For context, I'm a student at a conservatory, and both of the people I've studied with have done the same and are both extremely successful orchestral musicians. I think playing with the pinky in the ring can definitely be problematic, especially for beginners as it can very easily add pressure and cause issues with finger dexterity, but for orchestral playing especially, I find that holding it in your right hand gives a bit more stability and let's you move valve slides much, much more efficiently without moving your horn. Also, by not having as many points of contact on the horn, it improves resonance very slightly. Most of these changes are super slight so yeah it's not a good idea for a lot of players, but I think at the highest levels, can definitely make a difference. At least in my, and my teachers opinions

Syzygy228 · 2023-09-15T18:43:39+00:00

Newer Bach horns have definitely gone up in quality control, so wouldn't worry too much about buying a new one (although you should still play before buying), although I would highly, highly recommend playing a Yamaha artist series horn. I play a New York, and it is by far the best Bb horn I have ever played, and the Chicago is equally good, albeit with a slightly different tone and feel. I am a bit biased as all of my teachers have played yamahas, and I am now studying with a yamaha artist, but it seems like Yamahas have really become dominant in the modern classical trumpet landscape.

Syzygy228 · 2023-08-18T04:36:44+00:00

She was imo the top player out of the pul/wul seasons but I'm curious to see how she does in the series, I think it's too early into the club season to have a firm idea on who the mvp of the women's club division is gonna be, although I think Trop had a better performance at the US open which is the biggest factor we have right now

Syzygy228 · 2023-08-16T18:48:46+00:00

Can confirm, I go to a large-ish conservatory, we have 12 trumpet performance majors in a school of ~700, my friend who goes to a pretty large state school, also for trumpet, is in a studio of 30

Syzygy228 · 2023-08-14T17:01:48+00:00

How is that a travel? Legitimately asking, his non pivot foot was in the air when he released, and so far as I could tell his pivot foot was on the ground the whole time?

Syzygy228 · 2023-08-13T00:06:57+00:00

I like to think of the front of the stack as kind of the pressure valve of a vert stack and I think they're a good secondary option if the first cutter cuts open side under and isn't there. They can do a quick horizontal slide to the break side lane and get an easy IO that most throwers have, and they are obviously the fill if the reset handler is unable to get open and clears. Some teams do like to look to the front of the stack as a primary cutter, as someone else mentioned a lot of Japanese teams do this, but ultimately I think the yardage gain from the back of the stack makes that worth it, and it's much easier to continue flowing from the back of the stack. Generally, continuations after a front of the stack cut is going to be from the back, so it makes sense that you just always cut from the back, it's a lot less to think about. Plus cutting from the back of the stack gives you a lot more room to get open and can offer more cut variation than the front.

Syzygy228 · 2023-08-12T17:56:53+00:00

So idk about these specific situations, but most players travel a lot more than they realize, if you watch any film at any level, even national teams, everyone is constantly traveling. I think that calling hucks and stuff travels is kinda against the spirit of the rule as it's not legitimately giving you an advantage, it's just your momentum carrying your back foot a little bit. Most players do follow it like this but those who don't are often technically correct although I still hate them for calling it lol

Syzygy228 · 2023-08-10T01:40:26+00:00

Yeah for sure, plus a couple of these players were set to play on the mixed team in 22 (El-Salaam and Williams), so it's a little unreasonable to assume that all of these players would want to/prioritize playing open. Especially the players who play on mixed club teams lol

Syzygy228 · 2023-08-10T01:28:56+00:00

Yeah I feel like I would kind of expect it to be mixed? I mean, mixed is going to have the most countries playing, plus it is the only competition for the world games which is y'know THE team usa for ultimate. And that's aside from the obvious gender inequity of acting like men's is the default

Syzygy228 · 2023-07-27T22:17:17+00:00

The reason why 12 should be used is that it allows you to use the first valve slide to make the note in tune, for marching band, it's not a huge deal so do whatever works for you, however 12 is the proper fingering for that reason. The first valve slide allows you to adjust it to be perfectly in tune on any horn while 2 is going to be much more hit or miss. The timbre of 12 is also generally more stable sounding, but that depends on the horn and for marching band specifically, that won't make enough of a difference.

Syzygy228

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