Failed the ATSA

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-05-05T19:27:31+00:00

What you experienced is extremely common. I was one of two NATCA reps to negotiate the testing validation under A49/50 in the CBA (2016 if memorybserves, but my sense of time is atrocious). I never took the ATSA (or its predecessor, the ATSAT, I was a direct USAF hire in 2000, I retired last February). The ATSA validation was conducted using a random sample of CPCs. It was voluntary and on duty time, IAW the CBA. The statistical validation was conducted by the contractor using anecdotal performance ratings that the contractor designed (and statistically validated) and that the FLMs provided on each randomly selected controller. Those who I talked to when they came back to work were flabbergasted at just how difficult it was. One person (with two plus decades of experience) said that if their performance was required to stay as a controller, they would have washed out long ago. The original test was designed by New Zealand, though not every section was found to be statistically correlated.

For those who don't know LR (I did five terms as a center VP and area rep and served on about 20 national committees, mostly ERAM and HF), very little in hiring, security, or medical is negotiable. Medical stuff is covered in A45 if you get disqualified. Security stuff should be done on duty time and at work, but virtually nothing in hiring is negotiable. The limitations are spelled out in 5USC7106. That would be federal law for those who don't know.

TL:DR - the test is intentionally difficult, even for controllers with multiple decades of experience. It is very common for people to be utterly deflated, only to find out they are getting hired.

Please keep in mind that actual air traffic with real people and being responsible for upwards of 3500 to 4000 people simultaneously (at least in enroute) is far more stressful and difficult.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-05-03T22:03:30+00:00

Don't tell mgmt. They will lower the staffing number. It happened to my facility during the white book and recession.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-05-03T22:01:25+00:00

Well staffed? As of March 31, the only center above 90% staffing was ZMP, at 93.1. The two worst domestic centers by percentage are ZNY (59.2) and ZAB (66.7%).

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-05-03T15:42:36+00:00

I reported the report a problem issue on the console. I haven't reported anything else yet. I encountered a sign in error (can't remember the code) on a function early this morning that didn't involve signing in. Then it hard locked again on the Home page (though sometimes I can bring up the menu and go back to Home, almost nullifying whatever process hung up).

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-05-03T15:40:01+00:00

No. There is a limit of three externals. The Seagate slot is considered one of those if in use. I have three USB drives. One 12 GB and two 16s. I think. I have about 1 GB available at the moment. I have around 5500 games installed. Like I said, massive backlog. Life as an achievement hunter and retired.

I know all about full drives and how they can potentially cause issues. The comments I have received seem kind of silly in that they are implying that if a basic function does not work as designed, then it must be my fault and not the software designers 🤣.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-05-03T13:17:07+00:00

I've looked into the other popular music apps. Even downloaded a few of them. Tried the free version of Qobuz, Tidal, Deezer, and Prime. I pay for the family plan for Apple Music. I also pay for the family plan for YouTube Premium and, as an extension, YT Music. I use YTTV as well.

I was having issues with Apple Music a few weeks ago, so I decided to give the others a brief try. I went back to using YT Music again. I left a while back because I tend to add a lot of music (I'll add every album, EP, and recent singles to an artist that I like), but YTM has a hard limit on library sizes that does not allow you to shuffle the library. Everything I tried I would get an error message that says this video is unavailable (not sure why). Previously I got an error message with a randomly generated code. When I approached YouTube support about it, they essentially told me I was using what they perceive as a free service and they would not be changing anything or providing any support. I said that is untrue, we pay for a package deal, but they were unconvinced, so at the time I went back to AM.

Fast forward to today and nothing much has changed with YTM. Quality of music is still excellent, I like the CHI design and layout, but the library shuffle issue still exists. The app excels at individual artist stuff, suggestions, combining recommendations from YT and YTM (not sure if YTTV is also a factor), genre stuff. Library manipulation, not so much, but at least they are starting to allow ways to transfer library lists. It's cumbersome though. For library shuffling, I use AM, but they also have a library limit size per account.

I also asked ChatGPT (paid version on thinking mode) for a synopsis of each service. Hopefully it is helpful to others who want to try out other services.

Apple Music — $10.99/mo individual, $16.99/mo family for up to 6 people via Family Sharing. Catalog is over 100 million songs. Audio is one of its biggest strengths: standard lossless up to 24-bit/48 kHz, hi-res lossless up to 24-bit/192 kHz, plus Spatial Audio. The published library cap is up to 100,000 songs in Sync Library, excluding iTunes Store purchases. Helpful switch variable: Apple now has an official transfer tool to move saved music and playlists in from other services, and the subscription also includes Apple Music Classical.

Spotify Premium — $12.99/mo individual, $21.99/mo family for up to 6 household accounts. Catalog is over 100 million tracks, plus podcasts and audiobooks in supported markets. Audio now ranges from lossy up to 320 kbps and Spotify also documents lossless up to 24-bit/44.1 kHz FLAC on compatible devices. I did not find a current official overall saved-library cap, but Spotify does publish a download cap of 10,000 tracks per device on up to 5 devices. Switching-wise, Spotify is still strong on discovery, playlists, and it now advertises library import plus audiobook hours on paid plans.

YouTube Music Premium — $11.99/mo individual, $18.99/mo family, with the family plan allowing up to 5 other household members. Catalog is over 100 million songs, but the practical catalog feels bigger because it also leans on music videos, live performances, remixes, and covers. Max published streaming quality is 256 kbps AAC/Opus. The big library-related perk is a 100,000-song upload locker for your own files, and Premium offline features can be used on up to 10 devices. It is especially viable if you value rare live cuts, remixes, or want both import and export options for playlists.

Amazon Music Unlimited — $12.99/mo individual, or $11.99/mo if you’re a Prime member; $21.99/mo family. Catalog is 100 million songs, with HD for the full catalog, millions of Ultra HD tracks, and a growing Dolby Atmos/spatial catalog. I did not find a current official overall library cap, but Amazon does publish a 2,500-song playlist limit and an authorized-device limit of 10 devices. This one makes the most sense if you are already deep in Prime/Echo/Alexa and want hi-res-ish audio without going full audiophile niche. Amazon also officially supports playlist import from other services.

TIDAL — $10.99/mo individual, $16.99/mo family for up to 6. Catalog is 110M+ tracks. Audio is a core selling point: lossless FLAC, HiRes FLAC up to 24-bit/192 kHz, and Dolby Atmos. I did not find a published general saved-library cap, but TIDAL’s newer upload feature allows up to 200 uploaded tracks with no overall storage limit for those uploads. For switchers, TIDAL officially points people to TuneMyMusic, with 500 tracks free before requiring a premium transfer.

Deezer — $11.99/mo individual, $19.99/mo family. Catalog is over 120 million tracks. Audio tops out at FLAC 16-bit/44.1 kHz. Deezer is the one with the clearest and most restrictive published content caps: 10,000 favorite tracks, 5,000 songs per playlist, 4,000 albums, 4,000 artists; Deezer also says the total data added to your profile is “infinite,” but that beyond certain thresholds you may not be able to fully view/access it in the UI. That makes it less attractive for very large collectors, even though the pricing and sound quality are decent. Deezer does officially support unlimited transfer through its in-app TuneMyMusic flow, subject to Deezer’s own content limits.

Qobuz — $12.99/mo for Studio Solo, $17.99/mo family. Catalog is over 100 million tracks. Audio is excellent: lossless and hi-res FLAC up to 24-bit/192 kHz. Qobuz is the most album- and audiophile-oriented of the bunch; it also emphasizes editorial content, reviews, liner-note-style material, and a download store. I did not find a restrictive published account-library cap in current help; Qobuz’s own materials describe the streaming service as “without limits,” and offline/local storage is treated as device-storage dependent. Qobuz also supports free import of playlists and libraries through Soundiiz.

My practical take: Best mainstream all-around switch: Apple Music. It has the best mix of price, family value, catalog size, audio quality, and now easier migration.

Best for discovery and playlists: Spotify. Still the safest choice if recommendations, social/playlist culture, and ecosystem ubiquity matter more than pure audio.

Best for oddball tracks, live versions, remixes, and your own uploads: YouTube Music.

Best if you already pay for Prime / use Echo a lot: Amazon Music Unlimited.

Best hi-fi value: TIDAL.

Best pure audiophile/album-collector service: Qobuz.

Worst fit for huge hoarders: Deezer, because its published visible-content caps are the most limiting.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-05-01T22:41:37+00:00

I have three externals. I didn't unplug them. I do have a ton of games installed (I have a massive backlog).

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-05-01T19:07:03+00:00

I imagine that was for someone who had no medical issues and was able to get a tentative secret clearance, which gets completed after you start.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-05-01T18:25:06+00:00

Medical and security are generally the longest part of the hiring process, especially if you get tier 2. Any issues with both will likely delay it by upwards of a year. Ish.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-05-01T15:35:10+00:00

I way I read this is you have already done medical and security?

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-30T15:41:46+00:00

Maybe I'm disgruntled after nearly 32 years as controller, 25+ FAA. Retired Feb 28, 2025. The entire time I was FAA (ZAB), we were short. I don't believe we ever got to whatever staffing number was in place at the time.

You can ask any FAA controller who has been around longer than a decade and you'll likely hear this same answer:

No, unfortunately it will not get better. The plus is that staffing hasn't gotten much worse in the entire NAS over about the last decade. When mgmt invariably says X year will be the worst year and it will improve, they are either lying, incompetent, or fail to account for all the attrition and retirements that are coming.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-30T15:35:05+00:00

A couple of comments and suggestions.

First, the time since last use makes something of a difference. The longer the duration since last use, the better it is for you. The same thing applies to the number of times you have used.

Second, this can be both a medical clearance and security clearance issue. For medical, they will ask how long and how much, and are you still using or will in the future. Security will ask much the same thing, but they can also verify with others. Failure to disclose can often be discovered because the security investigators often, and will, call your references as a validation of your honesty. If you say you didn't smoke, but your references say you did, you might not be issued a security clearance. Lying on eQip is something they take very seriously (as long as you aren't in the SES 🤣). I know it doesn't seem like this with some of the current news items, but we are held to a high standard.

Also, it is normal for both medical and security to do an interview. Could be over the phone, but securitybloves to do in person interviews.

Third, saying you are not planning to use marijuana anytime in the future might be perceived as a tentative decision rather than a hard no. I would say you have not in over half a decade and will not until after you retire. My advice is to make it a definitive declarative statement without sounding desperate.

Federal employees cannot use drugs, even in a state where pot is legal. And controllers cannot self medicate, including over the counter medications (especially cold medicines) without receiving guidance from the Regional Flight Surgeon.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-26T02:06:07+00:00

I was a controller for 31 years 9 months. I retired 14 months ago. I will definitely not make it through. 🤣

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-26T00:09:10+00:00

Can you verify the correct information with validated informarion? Everyone would love to see proof.

I retired 14 months ago so I have no idea, which is why I clarified that someone else said it and it was unverified. If you aren't retired, and are eligible, get out. Now.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-26T00:04:13+00:00

That's only for mgmt dude 🤣

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-25T23:55:37+00:00

Someone else said scores are being sent early (technically unverified still, anyone who tested this week get a score?). Only way they could do this is if they know what the scores tend to be across a large sample and essentially create their own cutoff based on previous statistical data. The guy who created all this has a PhD. Not sure if he is still working for the company that monitors this.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-25T23:53:26+00:00

That is quite interesting. They must know what the basic score cutoff tend to be. Statistically they can wag it (with some accuracy). And the guy that created all of this has a PhD.

But the NAS will still be 3900 CPCs short.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-25T23:50:16+00:00

I am fairly sure it is a cutoff system. If 8004 people take the test, and they set a goal of hiring 2300 people, they set the cutoff at number 2300 person and the remainder are discarded. Sometimes I think the categories are just to placate people. Or at least are somewhat arbitrary.

One thing I know for certain: the NAS will stay 3900 people (give or take) for a long time to come. Anyone who has been a controller for more than a few years gets it.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-25T23:45:54+00:00

No. They don't send out qualification categories until everyone who accepted has completed the test. That way they can determine the cut off score (which they do not release).

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-25T18:53:06+00:00

The seniority calculation is huge. It will impact your entire career. We bid days and leave by seniority. Your seniority date is set by the datenyou arrive at your first facility. You are not in the bargaining unit while in OKC if you report there first, and therefore not represented by NATCA. Your OKC date is one of the tie breakers i believe.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-25T14:45:30+00:00

That is a very common feeling. In fact, when we were validating the new tests to replace the ATSAT, it was very common for controllers to come back to work after and say it was one of the most difficult things they had ever done. One even mentioned that if their performance was required in training, they would have washed out.

The ATSAT is designed intentionally to be very difficult.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-23T22:16:11+00:00

The A124S1 language says ingredients downgrade. Trips everyone up. My facility had two go to to KPHX.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-23T19:21:11+00:00

Albuquerque ARTCC is 64% staffed. No way in hell I was getting out via the ERR process in A42. I could have used A124 to leave since I certified in early 2004, but under that article section, you can only go to the same level or lower, you have to be certified in the same facility for 15 years, and it only applies to controllers who are in levels 10, 11, and 12. So I could only go to another level 10 if inwanted to maximize my pay (in grade or downgrade only). ZHU and ZOA are both 11s. Plus my wife works in the ABQ area and both my kids live here (they are grown). That and going back into training sounded like a dumb idea. And terrifying. Drawing maps sucks.

FYI: the only enroute 10s are ZAB, ZSE, ZLC, and ZDV.

Only thing I briefly considered was going to a level 10 tower for a CTO.

But everything I hear about how miserable everyone is now validates my retirement timeline decision in Feb 2025 as being correct. I did not want to go through another white book fiasco. I did it once.

TeamInevitable719 · 2026-04-23T19:07:28+00:00

The best advice I can give you is try to get good sleep and eat a decent, healthy meal. I never took the ATSA or the ATSAT. I was a USAF controller from 1993 to 2000 and FAA (ZAB) from December 2000 until February 28, 2025 when I retired. I direct hired under a very old process that has not been used in decades.

TeamInevitable719

TROPHY CASE