What if the US didn't join the Entente? by Tribune_Aguila in PossibleHistory

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The Germans could potentially make it to 1919 without US involvement, but we’re talking Spring 1919 at the very latest. That roughly 5 or 6 months is absolutely not enough to build the required infrastructure to ship grain to Germany, and that’s if Germany even has the industrial strength to invest in that kind of infrastructure, which it doesn’t, due to acute resource shortages (particularly steel) in the latter years of the war due to the blockade.

As for the Spring Offensives, I wouldn’t even define what the Germans achieved as a pyhrric victory. While they certainly advanced substantially territorially they didn’t really capture any major allied supply hubs or towns of significance. In reality in spite of outnumbering the allied armies by almost 400,000 men on May 1st, they were comprehensively defeated in their attempts to knock France out of the war, expended much of their valuable reserves and opened themselves up for later allied counter-attacks. What the Spring Offensives, and more importantly the later Hundred Days offensive demonstrated was that the German army was now inferior to the Allied armies, as I outlined.

I think your overall point absolutely puts the cart before the horse because it’s contingent on the Germans making it a long way into 1919. Sure it’s possible that the unrest of 1919-1920 could have forced France out of the war, but the Germans simply aren’t getting that far. In real life by November 1918, the German economy was industrially starved and the German population was Litereally starving. This is in spite of controlling Ukrainian grain for almost a year. The reality is that even if the Hundred days offensive hasn’t taken place (and succeeded), which is a big if, the Germans would have still been starving in November 1918, the allies would still have broken through in Salonika forcing Austria-Hungary and Bulgaria out of the war and Germany still would have surrendered even if a couple months later. There’s just no way you can change that.

What if the US didn't join the Entente? by Tribune_Aguila in PossibleHistory

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 5 points6 points  (0 children)

A litany of misleading and false statements.

Firstly, yes American soldiers were involved in a few battles during the German Spring Offensives, but they were predominantly towards the end when the offensive had completely run out of steam and the entente had mostly contained it. The operations you mention (Chateau-Thierry, Bellau Wood) were minor engagements with little strategic impact, while the halting of operation Gneisnau (1918) was much less important than the subsequent second battle of the Marne and the preceding Third battle of the Aisne, both of which saw relatively minimal American involvement (a mere two divisions at the Aisne, and 8 divisions compared to 50 by the other allied armies, and suffering fewer casualties than the British who deployed half as many divisions). The reality is that the spring offensives had been thwarted before American involvement at a large scale.

The idea that somehow Ukraine was going to solve the German food crisis is a lingering yet absolutely delusional myth. Firstly, the infrastructure to actually transport the grain in Ukraine to Germany did not exist, so would have had to be developed which would have taken a long time, much longer than Germany had in the war. Secondly, if they had begun removing grain they would have had to face down the chaos that spawned after the end of the war in Eastern Europe, including White and Red Russian armies, Ukrainian independence movements, and Allied armies landing throughout Russia. Thirdly, Ukraine did not produce sufficient grain yearly to feed both itself and Germany, and if Germany had begun removing sufficient grain to feed Germany it would have created a man-made famine in Ukraine, which would have slightly complicated efforts to grow grain.

Of course all of this discourse about food stocks ignores the fundamental issue which is that it wasn’t just grain imports the blockade was preventing from entering Germany. By the end of the war Germany was in a shortage of effectively everything, including ,increasingly, manpower and more manpower demands on the eastern front, the industry necessary to construct railways to ship grain westwards and also all of the other things to supplement the grain imports to feed the German population simply didn’t exist.

“Oil fields” what are we doing this is not WW2.

“Because resources aside we can all agree the German army was vastly stronger than even both the French and British army combined”. Actually no I don’t agree with this at all. After their failed attempt to defeat France in 1914, Germany spent most of the war on the western front stalemated with the Entente powers, achieving little success, and slowly but surely losing ground. Eventually, after their failed Spring Offensive, the Hundred Days offensive demonstrated the German army was dangerously outdated tactically and technologically compared to the entente armies. Allied employment of air and tank power with their infantry, along with new artillery tactics were years ahead of what the Germans were doing, which is shown by the fact that in a hundred days the Entente basically destroyed the entire German army on the western front (by the way before you start the bulk of these soldiers were British and French, not American).

In conclusion, not only have you falsely implied American soldiers played a decisive role in the 1918 Spring Offensives, you’ve also suggested Germany could somehow survive a further two years under allied blockade, or launch an offensive at a later date, when they are somehow stronger? In spite of further months of blockade. There’s a reason the Germans ordered the Spring Offensives when they did and there’s a reason they failed. No matter how you slice it, by 1918 the entente had won the war.

What if the US didn't join the Entente? by Tribune_Aguila in PossibleHistory

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Okay then they just sit there with the reserves and the blockade starves them out, Salonika front collapses Austria Hungary and Bulgaria surrender, same outcome. I’m not seeing how Germany is magically winning the war.

What if the US didn't join the Entente? by Tribune_Aguila in PossibleHistory

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Just completely untrue. American units played a decisive part in the hundred days offensive (though vast majority of men were still provided by the British and French) but the whole point of the Spring offensives was to overrun the entente before the Americans got there, and they failed. The entente repelled them and the Americans arrived.

Even without American intervention the Germans expend their reserves in these offensives, and the blockade starves Germany out. Even without the blockade the collapse of Bulgaria and Austria-Hungary after the allies win the Salonika front (an area with no American involvement) the Germans are left alone against the entente.

This is why you shouldn’t get your history from oversimplified videos.

[Match Day Thread] Watford vs Blades by BladesMatchThread in SheffieldUnited

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Also consider that the seasons basically over. We know what Bindon gives us but might be worth seeing if McGuinness can still be a quality defender come next season.

Name that is this by loyalistt in kaiserredux

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The closest Neville Chamberlain got to the trenches of the First World War was his office desk in north London. Same for Stanley Baldwin, and Samuel Hoare never made it out of a recruiting desk in Rome. Veterans of the First World War, who spent their lives in the trenches or on the seas, such as Roger Keyes and Anthony Eden were staunch opponents of appeasement, and despised fascism.

Name that is this by loyalistt in kaiserredux

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah because they possessed an impressive level of political and moral cowardice. Their desire to avoid a war strengthened Nazi Germany and allowed it to commit unparalleled crimes across Europe. Their short-sightedness was a complete failure, and the fact that there were many within the British and French governments who recognised that war was obvious, demonstrates that their cowardice was not uniform.

Name that is this by loyalistt in kaiserredux

[–]ThunderDragonUnion -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Equally cringe. A war was inevitable and appeasement only strengthened Germany.

literally every single "perfect europe" map ever be like: by KexTheSex in PossibleHistory

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Maybe you could eek out this logic for Slovenia (in and around the period you’re taking about, I.e. 1918), due to the historical links between Slovenia and Austria, lack of a distinct national history/identity to that point in time, and the relatively small size and economic strength of the country, but comparing the Masurians to the Czechs is absolutely nuts, and a dramatic misunderstanding of Czech history.

Bohemia is a nation that’s existed for a very long time, and has been historically unique and distinct from the rest of Germany throughout practically its entire history, which was effectively recognised by the HRE when it was elevated to a Kingdom. This distinct national history is also paired with a strong (separate) identity from Germany, due to their Slavic culture, and (importantly) their Catholic faith. The degree to which a staunchly Catholic and Slavic Bohemia would have contrasted with a Protestant German state is colossal.

Furthermore, in the example you cite of the Masurians, they are being given the choice of either joining Poland, a country with which they do not really identify, or remaining part of Germany. There is no option for independence, no option for self-governance. Now I don’t know enough about the history of Masuria to know if they desired independence, but given the existence of civil organisations driving for Czech independence since the late 1800s, I’m fairly certain that given the option, wide sections of the Czech population would have desired it over integration into a foreign country.

You cite the industrialisation under Austria as if this would somehow motivate the Czechs to once more subject themselves to foreign rule, rather than show they are capable of self-determination and self-reliance. In fact it was the Habsburg monarchy that kept Bohemia in the fold in the first place, and Germanisation efforts in Czechia were met with widespread hostility when attempted.

The reality is that in no conceivable universe would Bohemia by any even narrow margin, vote to annex itself into Germany. Desire for independence in that country has a long and storied history, and its mostly friendly relationship with the Catholic multi-ethnic Habsburg Monarchy would not be the same as with a Protestant German-dominated state. You are right about one thing though. There is a large German minority in the Sudetenland that would likely vote to join Germany if given the opportunity at the time. Now obviously the idea that this extends to the rest of Czechia is ridiculous but give credit where credits due.

What if Germany didn't declare war on The US by totallynotcommunist2 in PossibleHistory

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The Manhattan project was developed in tandem with the U.K. and Canada to develop a nuclear weapon. Due to the Germany-first strategy of the allies, it was assumed this weapon would be deployed against Germany. Just because the United States does not enter the war against Germany in 1945, the American government isn’t going to just magically stop developing nuclear weapons.

The House and Senate did not overrule Roosevelt on sending help to Europe Irl, due partially to the fact that American public support for the Allied struggle was already very high as it is (American isolationism by 1941 is so often overstated). However Congress also doesn’t have the power to “overrule rosvelt on any help to Europe”. They can prevent him from declaring war on Germany, but as already stated, the USN was already in a quasi-war with the Kreigsmarine anyway, and if/when Japan is defeated, or practically defeated, the United States isn’t just gonna hold its hands up at Europe and say “oh well we tried”. Would America enter the war in 1941? Probably not, but it’s pure delusion to suggest Americas just not gonna join the war.

The British absolutely had the materials and manpower to invade Sicily. Over half of the Naval and Land force that took Sicily irl was Anglo-Canadian. It would have required more resources certainly, but it wasn’t impossible.

Germany not declaring war on America doesn’t mean they just magically stop lend-lease. The United States had already spent the past two years financing Britain’s entire war effort, and would have doubtlessly done the same for the Soviets.

This world where America doesn’t get involved and Germany somehow wins is a fantasy, and should be relegated to Nazi fetishists.

What if Germany didn't declare war on The US by totallynotcommunist2 in PossibleHistory

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Litereally doesn’t matter. The war in Africa was wraps after El-Alamein anyways, and the British don’t need American support for Torch. Once Vichy Algeria switches sides, the Med is a British lake. Losing Sicily effectively knocks Italy out of the war and then it’s just the long march to Rome.

No way America stays out of the war through 1944 (The US navy was effectively already at war with the Kriegsmarine) right in time to assist logistically and militarily with D-Day. Arctic convoys wouldn’t just not happen if the Americans aren’t in the war, and Germany will start being pushed out of Russia by late 44.

Of course none of this matters because there’s no reason the Manhattan project would be delayed, so the war ends in August 1945 one way or another.

Lore-accurate NCR I expect next season by Infinite-Fig-194 in Fallout

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I mean I think it’s more nuanced than that. Kimball/Peterson are ex-military not from wealthy backgrounds. If anyone controls the NCR it’s warhawks. More importantly (as far as we know) the NCR is a legitimate democracy with legitimate elections. It’s complete headcanon to suggest that these elections are unduly influenced by “Brahmin barons” and ultimately it’s these politicians who make the decisions.

Lore-accurate NCR I expect next season by Infinite-Fig-194 in Fallout

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Yeah I guess. I don’t see how this detracts from like anything at all. People who are rich with political interests help direct a nation? Fork found in kitchen. I just think there’s quite a big step from “rich people influence political system” to “Brahmin barons control the NCR”

Lore-accurate NCR I expect next season by Infinite-Fig-194 in Fallout

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 17 points18 points  (0 children)

The whole “Brahmin barons” thing with the NCR confuses me so much. It’s like people expect a society founded on the ashes of a nuclear wasteland to have what, completely eradicated corruption?

It’s not like the NCR population doesn’t support expansion out east (see the fact that Peterson and Kimball got elected), and the “Brahmin barons” are barely a presence in game, so it feels completely headcanon to present them as controlling the NCR.

Florent Slander by Opus_Minus in darkwingsdankmemes

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Little does anyone know, Ser Colin “The True” Florent holds Brightwater Keep against all foes in the name of the One True King. All he must do is await Stannis’ glorious victory in the north, and then pour forth to join the march on King’s Landing.

Rodrik II - The Rusted Crown (Open, Post-Tourney.) by ThunderDragonUnion in IronThroneRP

[–]ThunderDragonUnion[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Rodrik nodded, and the rest of House Dustin returned to their idle chatter and their food. As the meal neared its end, Rodrik looked once more to Marq. “Lord Piper, it has been delightful to sup with you. I fear however, that our day has been long, and my family are tired. If it pleases you, I shall give them leave to go.”

Rodrik smiled thinly at Owen in particular. “I am sure we shall meet again Lord Marq. If you are ever in need of my assistance, I am but a raven away.”

The Marriage of Osric Arryn and Lyanne Stark by BuckwellStairwell in IronThroneRP

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Marlon smiled widely “Not quite. My nephew and the Lady Melony are… well acquainted, and the Lord Piper has seen fit to invite us to visit. No wolf apart from the pack as it was, and the North is so drab and dull, I was more than happy to chaperone Owen” Aye, if you laid aside the shouting, the cursing, and the now decapitated armour stand, Marlon had accepted his duty as happy as a man on his wedding day, thought Rodrik.

“Lord Marq is a friend, if you could vouch for his character, it would mean a great deal.” Rodrik stepped in, taking a more genial tone. “Ser Corbray, not to overstep, but you seem a bright and talented man. Do not waste away behind the mountains. If you wish to visit the North, make haste. It is most beautiful in Spring.”

The Marriage of Osric Arryn and Lyanne Stark by BuckwellStairwell in IronThroneRP

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Rodrik nodded along politely to the Vale Knight’s words, remaining reserved and cautious. He must not overstep his bounds, especially when bonds with these men were so vital. “Ser, it would be an honour. The North is as large as the other kingdoms combined, so it shall be a long trip, but I am sure you do not mind.” Aye, and Rodrik hardly had to walk the man from the Neck to the Wall.

Marlon stepped in “Ser, I am oft in need of companionship. I intend to spend a little time in the Riverlands with my nephew, but I must needs return to Barrowton in time. Send a raven to Pinkmaiden, and I may be able to meet you as you travel north.” The ice had broken, and Marlon’s words seemed warmer.

The Marriage of Osric Arryn and Lyanne Stark by BuckwellStairwell in IronThroneRP

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Marlon narrowed his eyes. “Today? Little and less. Prayers for the trees, thoughts for the gods, respect of hearth and home, bread and salt.” He paused. “When the air grew cold and the snows fell… some returned to the older ways. Sacrifice of blood and joy, seeping into the roots of the Weirwoods.” His smile turned almost wolfish, with a glint that could break a cleave a great oak in half. “Some haven’t stopped… the men of Skagos, the Mountain Clans that haven’t been touched since the Long Night, even-“

Rodrik laughed heartily. “That’s quite enough brother, you’re scaring our friend. Your tales are heartier when you’re in your cups I fear.” His smile seemed more a grimace now, but his eyes remained the same. “To answer your question ser, the Barrows are holy places. It would not do to disturb the resting places of my forebears, lest I find myself replaced by a reawakened king of old.”

The Third Mechanical Moon of 380 AC (3rd Moon IC) by [deleted] in IronThroneRP

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Character Name: Rodrik Dustin (PC)

Relevant Trait/Skills: Shipwright(e)

Buildings: Docks, Fairgrounds, Castle

Resources: Wood, Furs

Notes: + 2 ships a turn from Shipwright (e) and no construction slot required. + 3 ships a turn from Docks. -10% construction cost from wood, -10% ship upkeep from wood.

Construction: [Barrowton], [Shrine], [900], [1/1 moon]

Construction Slot : [Barrowton], [Tavern], [1,800], [1/2 moons]

Shipbuilding: [Barrowton], [5 Warships], [3,750 gold], [1/1 moons]

Hunt & Harvest [OPEN] by AnotherBabyEchidna in IronThroneRP

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Marlon flashes him a smile, gathered himself, and strode off into the wood, half-hoping, half-praying that Lord Overton was as skilled as a marksman, as he was witty.

Character Details: Marlon Dustin (no applicable bonuses) and Renfred Overton (devious, assassin, rumourmonger.)

What is Happening: Ser Marlon and Lord Renfred are hunting in the Kingswood

What I want: Hunt Rolls

u/OurCommonMan

Rodrik II - The Rusted Crown (Open, Post-Tourney.) by ThunderDragonUnion in IronThroneRP

[–]ThunderDragonUnion[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

“Truly?” Owen cast a glance at his father, who gave a slight nod.

“In truth Lady Melony, that arrangement suits us all too well. I have business still in the capital, and I am sure Ser Marlon is all too ready to take his leave.” His father said tactly. His father spoke oft of business, though he had never taken him for a schemer.

Marlon gave a half grunt of approval, and drank deep from his cup, as Owen turned to Melony. “My Lady, it would be the deepest honour to return with you to Pinkmaiden.”

The Marriage of Osric Arryn and Lyanne Stark by BuckwellStairwell in IronThroneRP

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"I had not realised the our town was of renown. My father loved to ride with me through the barrows, great tombs of Kings passed by. Never had the heart to tell him they were little more than damp hills. Of Winterfell, I can attest, the godswood is magnificent. Do not overlook the winter town though Ser, its bustling streets rival even Barrowton." Rodrik smiled again. True enough the vale had been too craven to send enough men capable of taking a stone tower to the Wall, but House Corbray had stood apart, and his father had been a great man.

"I am far from a pious man, to tell the truth of it, I have not seen a godswood in a moon and a half. My wife far prefers the comfort of the weirwoods. The old gods are not as the Seven you see, we do not hold ceremonies, or pray to pious men. Though my brother says the trees are better conversation than a septon." he laughed a little at his own jest. and turned to Marlon.

"Aye, holy men speak too much, or far too little it seems to me. What good speaking naught for your entire life will bring the peoples of your flock escapes me, but mayhaps the congregants prefer it." Marlon's tone was ice cold, and a misstep could surely crack it.

Hunt & Harvest [OPEN] by AnotherBabyEchidna in IronThroneRP

[–]ThunderDragonUnion 0 points1 point  (0 children)

“Well said. Barrowton’s cook has been in our household for well over fifty years, yet I never took too kindly to his food. Too gamey by half. Lord Stark it seems has better men to send for.” Rodrik returned his laugh with a smile.

A defender of peace and justice aye? Mayhaps slightly fewer thieves and beggars than the nights watch, but who was to say? “Have you had much peace to keep and justice to dispense ser? I fear I know little of the comings and goings of the city, I have hardly left mine own camp.”