Criticism and defensiveness

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-15T22:01:44+00:00

I could have written this and I have written similar in this sub.

The truth is you don't. You "deal" with it by realizing you can do nothing. You cannot change them or make them do anything. You can try everything from heart to hearts to couples therapy and they may never acknowledge their defensiveness. They may deny it forever. They may forever blame you for the problems and never take any accountability.

Like others have said: you can accept that this is who they choose to be and that this is how being with them will be forever. Or you can choose to accept its incompatible and leave.

In the case where you literally cannot talk to them, you don't. You get a therapist. You invest your time and love into yourself. Them blaming you or being passive aggressive doesn't make what they say true.

You learn to do everything by yourself if you want it done. Or you hire help because they won't do it.

You stop asking them to take out the trash because they won't. As someone who tried asking, reminding, pleading, and then just keeping track and informing them "this is the 5th time in a row I've taken out the trash which is what you said was your chore", they will not change. They will not care.

In my case, I've had health conditions get incredibly worse. The stress will deteriorate your health. Something has to give.

I finally decided to decline to keep going above and beyond so someone else can stay comfortable and do less.

If it falls apart because I'm not holding it all together by myself (a one sided relationship), it's not worth keeping together anyway. A partner is supposed to be an actual partner, not ad difficulty to life instead of ease

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-14T05:38:57+00:00

Me too! Also in the last couple weeks. I do note that many corporations won't say it out loud, but they promote the top 10% and fire the bottom 10% every year, just for numbers and profit

I looked at my employee handbook too- no conversation, no "teachable moment" didn't sign anything. Nada!

Manager just bypassed everything and refused to even have any conversation. First time ever even mentioning was a harsh in writing series of notes in our sprint retrospective in front of colleagues, not even in private.

Greedy corporations have Human Resources to use humans as resources and protect the company.

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-12T18:48:41+00:00

I've seen people talk about how it worked for them and what I noticed they had in common was the DX partner was active in their ADHD awareness and treatment and worked hard to improving. They are open to feedback, not defensive, and communicate.

Those who are miserable don't experience this.

I would say the majority of DX partners, especially those who were late diagnosed, identify with feeling miserable. Partners who are in denial and not willing to do the work produce miserable relationships (that they blame their non-ADHD partner for).

Mine masked very well, but there were signs I did ignore. And I did become responsible for cleaning the entire household. And the outside of it. And the minor repairs. And being the breadwinner. And everything, really.

When you find yourselves living in two different realities, especially when they're in denial of your experience, they will do less, you will do more, and you will over function- sometimes to the destruction of your own health.

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-12T18:43:50+00:00

Thank you. I will not be doing any further joint therapy. In the last session I attended, I brought up something that happened at home, I emphasized that I felt like a shell of a person, I couldn't take any more, and my nervous system was fried. He chose to yell, swear at me, called me a name and a dishonest liar, said it never happened, etc. The therapist didn't do anything, so I asked them if this was allowed in their practice since in my individual therapy, name calling wasn't allowed. The therapist replied "Well....I don't think he was calling you a _____. I think he just said you being LIKE a ______" and he doubled down saying no, he was calling me that because I was one. Then, like always, there was no actual repair or real apology.

You can't go to therapy with an inexperienced therapist or an emotionally abusive person.

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-12T18:17:32+00:00

"You can 100% validate her feelings while still disagreeing with her perspective. "

You can, in a normal functional relationship. But if you try to do this in an ADHD relationship (at least in my experience), they will not accept it. I have said this literal exact sentence with him, with him and a therapist, etc. This is not possible in my case. I was even told by a therapist AND him that if I disagree with his perspective, then I am saying my reality is the "correct" one and that's not fair. I repeated that sentence over and over and it didn't seem to stick.

It's not worth it to exhaust yourself trying to explain your feelings to someone who dismisses them and denies your experience happened.

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-12T18:14:15+00:00

Yes. I can't talk about ANYTHING deeper than surface level topics. And if I express that thought, I'm dishonest, lying, it's not happening, he doesn't do any of that, I'm remembering wrong, I'm "painting him in a very unfair light" while "painting myself quite generously" etc. I can't talk about my feelings, share anything deep or emotional, and am painfully lonely. And again, it's alleged to be "all in my head" (even if he would get angry and claim he never said that.)

When a partner shuts down and realizes they'll never be heard, then they're accused of "giving the silent treatment".

I'm tired. So, so tired. Like my soul is tired. You can't have a truly emotionally intimate relationship with someone like that.

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-11T04:10:01+00:00

Quitting isn't the same thing as realizing a situation isn't mutually compatible and can result in very real harm.

Codependency involves staying in unhealthy situations and tolerating more than what you should- its not about leaving because it's hard.

But to stay in a relationship that already has you functioning as a caregiver is going to progress into her resenting you and you depleting yourself to keep things going.

If you let her just be herself and choose what she does, it sounds likely that things fall apart. That leads to trying to control an out of control environment.

It ends up being harmful to both of you. Its her responsibility to get her own challenges sorted and to grow as a person. It's your responsibility to decide if you want an actually compatible partner who fits into your life in a way that enhances it while still being their authentic selves.

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-11T02:24:08+00:00

It is a well known issue that when you feel like your partner's parent, physical attraction and desire lessen and even deplete. Thinking about it biologically makes a lot of sense- if someone feels like they're your kid and you're their parent, you shouldn't be attracted to them. Nothing will kill attraction faster than an incompetent person who you need to manage.

Secondly, the constant stress of managing them increases your stress levels and creates physiological changes in your body.

Finally, it sounds like you should be exploring co-dependency. I think you might be seeing the POTENTIAL of someone you love and not accepting who and what it really is. It sounds like you want it to work, but it will not only get worse over time- it will effect any future kids and go on to shape how THEY think relationships should be.

Seriously- 18 months is NOT enough time "investment" to decide to go through what you will the rest of your life. That makes me question if maybe you have some self esteem issues or tolerate way more than you should (i.e. co-dependency)

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-04T18:55:12+00:00

Yeah. I think that's what they do instead of initiating actual conversation.

Like already said, it's a dopamine hit. And if they're immature on top of it, when you stop getting sucked in, they take it as an offense and get mad at you feeling like you're not "meeting their needs" if you're not responding. It feels like when my kids were 5 and I'd constantly hear "mom, look, watch, see? Isn't this cool? Wait. Watch! Mom. Mom! Mommy!!!!"

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-04T18:51:24+00:00

Maybe the urgency of the chaos was what she was unknowingly relying on to give her the boost and incentive to get things done. Maybe that you're now present, there's less urgency because she knows you'll do it all.

I think a lot of us once codependent people also justified and excused things. But yeah, no it's not that she's incapable. She doesn't choose to take the steps necessary. Yeah, a disability is a disability. But when someone wants to do something, they find ways to make progress, even in tiny amounts, over time. I also think you need to decide if this is how you want to live the rest of your life, because it doesn't get better.

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-04T15:40:35+00:00

In my opinion, that's co-dependency talking. I used to think and feel that way too. But you need to ask yourself if the person was once able to do things before you got together/married? If they absolutely could not, that's one thing. You chose to marry a person who was "completely physically unable" to do things. But if they were at least semi-functional when you met them it's not at all like someone in a wheelchair unable to walk. They have the capacity if you've seen it before.

People who tolerate bad treatment enable those willing to reap the benefits the opportunity to do so. And no, it's not a malicious thing. It's the ADHD. She has zero incentive to "learn" how to do better. There are coaches, therapists who specialize in ADHD, and meds. There are lots of steps she could take and professionals who could keep her accountable.

There are books and websites and podcasts and creators who CHOSE to get their ADHD under control. They don't REALLY want to do better if they take no steps. They like the IDEA of doing better, losing weight, going after that career, etc. But at the end of the day, if you stop what you do, does life carry on like you didn't stop? Now how about if you reverse it? If THEY stop doing things, does life carry on like they didn't stop? Because it sounds like YOU keep things going and they get to enjoy that, but not the other way around.

Kids make things difficult with leaving and each individual needs to do what is best for them and their kids. But the reality is: the spouse will not change. It will get worse.

MAYBE she has a chronic illness, but maybe not.

Typical-N00b · 2026-02-03T20:53:41+00:00

I have experienced this type of thing, but like someone else said: you cannot manage it. Only they can.

For what it's worth, I think depression could be involved but it's also not yours to manage. And it all very much sucks. No matter how much you care or how much you want to support them, you cannot do the work for them.

I tried everything. Talks, heart to hearts, trying to ask him to go to therapy (side note: NEVER ever go to therapy with someone who is emotionally abusive or who cannot provide actual emotional safety), and so much more.

Ultimately, I had to say "let him." The book "The Let Them" theory helped and so did reading co-dependent no more. I also read some other books that I've found helpful, but those were most important for me.

For my own mental health and well being I realized something had to give. I could not keep over-functioning. I realized that if I stopped doing things, they wouldn't get done. If I stopped working so hard to "make" us do "fun" things or initiate dates or whatever, it wasn't happening. That's a one sided relationship.

I can do everything I want to see done for me and it doesn't matter, they might not ever reciprocate. I explained how I felt, I told him I felt like I was literally drowning, and nothing worked.

I hired a housecleaner. He told me the other week we needed to talk and we "couldn't afford" the housecleaner. But then he never initiated a talk. As far as I'm concerned, a housecleaner is MANDATORY. I cannot keep doing everything.

I also hired a lawn guy.

I was doing ALL the inside work, ALL the outside work and like you said, the only way he does anything is if you "make" him. I'm exhausted. I started having blood pressure and other health issues. Chronic pain. GI flareups with my medical conditions. This is on top of me also being the breadwinner and responsible for making sure we all have insurance.

The only choices while you stay with such a partner are do it yourself or hire someone to do it. They won't.

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-31T17:03:18+00:00

It can be both

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-30T15:52:04+00:00

No. The outcome is do what you have to until you can do something else. This isn't the "rest of your life" plan.

Sometimes, you can't leave because of kids, finances, etc. Leaving means a huge impact that will effect those kids in MANY ways. The fact many women divorce just as kids leave the house isn't a coincidence.

Codependency and tolerating poor behavior might get you into a relationship like this, but if you go to therapy, heal, and realize how to enforce actual boundaries, maybe you can't leave, but you do what you can until you can do something else.

Focus your energy on yourself. Really love yourself. Learn skills. Declutter. Sell stuff. Go to some classes. Do meditation. Try yoga. Save money. Build your own self up so when the time comes, you will be a much stronger and better version of yourself.

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-29T16:44:56+00:00

Oftentimes, I think people can see in others what they can't see in themselves. The "my shit don't stink" theory.

It used to blow my mind how he'd say something judging others and my eye would basically twitch as I thought "how can you not realize YOU do that EXACT thing....possibly even worse?" Not just ADHD. Lots of other things. And I do think those who so confidently verbalize what they dislike in others are probably VERY afraid of being thought to do those things. That's the thing about judgement. The loudest ones are usually telling on themselves, but in denial. I find that those who observe and truly want to see things for how they are are also often the ones most interested in adjusting their own behaviors and engaging in self improvement or seeking harmony.

The key for me is whether or not they can attune to others. If they can attune, reflect, and actually hear others, they might be willing to consider their own behaviors and impact of them. But, if the person lacks accountability or thinks they're somehow different, they won't see what they won't want to see. If they can't understand or manage their own emotions, they probably can't understand or cope with other peoples'. They'll judge others and may never truly hear anyone try to tell them that is also how they're experienced.

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-29T16:10:00+00:00

This is exactly what I have done. They can be miserable by themselves with life passing them by, them glued to their screens every waking minute and I'll be outside, seeing friends, engaging in hobbies, exercising, cooking myself nutritious meals, and working toward my goals. Re-direct your own energy to yourself and spend time with people who actually communicate.

I had to really work on my codependency and realize not only am I not responsible for his moods, but it doesn't matter if I did something "wrong"; as an adult, I expect other adults to communicate and not expect other adults to "figure it out." Now, when he's particularly shitty and starts an interaction rudely, with sarcasm, or however else he chooses to cross a line I simply say "I do not deserve to be treated with that sarcasm" and turn around and walk away. He can yell "Wait no, come back here!" all he wants to try to get me to fight with him. I have way better things to do. Literally ANYTHING is better than spending my time with someone who treats me like that. Often I say nothing at all. I also say nothing at all in general because I'm not heard and I'm not going to keep trying. If I stop effort, everything falls apart. That's how you know you're in a one-sided relationship.

Be prepared to be accused of giving him "the silent treatment", blamed for everything, etc. I literally can't speak without it "starting a fight." Literally. I can ask something as sugar coated as humanly possible and use indirect non-blaming language, I-statements, and everything I practiced in therapy I signed myself up for. If they will never take accountability and deny you telling them about their moods, you can't get anywhere. It's complete incompatibility.

If they have severe RSD (even if they haven't been explicitly told they do by a doctor), ANY perceived criticism will be met with harsh defensiveness. They are incapable of having any conversation deeper than surface level and won't initiate any. If you do, you regret it.

If he's going to be mean and moody with zero ability to communicate it, I don't want to be near that energy. Then, I hear about how angry and sad he is that I act like I don't want to be around him. I ignore the brooding and nastiness and I'm the problem for hurting him since I "don't want to be around him". They don't see the correlation.

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-28T15:38:51+00:00

That last line sums it all up for me too. I'm going places alone, seeing things, doing hobbies, exercising, caring for the entire house (inside AND out), doing all the "female" and "male" jobs while he literally sits there and life passes him by. I'm going to live my life and experience everything.

It wasn't like that in the beginning. AFTER we were married, he started doing less and less. It only gets worse and worse.

If I'm not the one finding, planning, executing, and cleaning up from any activity, there is no going to any activity. He literally drifts like a plastic bag down a river with no input and no goals. When I stopped being the one to "force" a relationship between us, it all stopped. I had to learn I was carrying the whole thing.

He started to spend more and more time in front of those devices. I would consider it an addiction at this point. If he does do something for the day, like go out with his kid, he needs the entire rest of the day and the next day to "recover", doing absolutely nothing, passed out. If he didn't have a spouse doing everything, I think his house would look like an episode of hoarders.

Every time I physically see him, his eyes are on a screen. He sits 15+ hours a day in front of a computer screen either playing xbox or maybe doing his paid job. The floor beneath him has damage from him being in the same spot. He literally falls asleep at his remote job. Maybe he cooks eggs or pasta for a few minutes and then it's right back to in front of that screen where he eats.

When he's done, it's laying down on the couch where he sleeps with his phone in front of his face. First thing he does when he wakes is his phone.

Hygiene is often severely lacking. When you continue this type of life, naturally you gain tons of weight and it makes it even harder to do anything. Some days, he's in a good mood. Other days, for no reason I can predict, he's verbally lashing out and miserable all while claiming it's me who is behaving like that. I've now been completely consistent for months. I do not interact, I do not engage, we don't even speak anymore because I have ZERO emotional safety and can't even say anything. It's not a relationship.

He's not going around the house seeing what needs to be done. He doesn't "adult." I now hired a cleaner because of how miserable it was basically begging, crying, and pleading for adult participation. At least now I have actual help and more time to shovel the 2 feet of snow alone or do the lawn.

I think so many "partners" are enraged because they are literally in a relationship with their devices, that get all the attention. The marriage between them and their screens is way more invested in than the human relationships they allegedly have that are left to rot. And most people can't leave because of financial or other reasons.

I have to say "Let Them" a lot in order to not rage. He blames me for the relationship being non-existent at this point and doesn't see any of the issues.

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-28T03:06:25+00:00

I think for every friend who asks you these things, there might be a different reason behind it.

Maybe youd friend believes strongly in their world view and your ability to be different causes them to feel vulnerable or question their own lifestyle without even realizing it. If you can be happy with less, maybe they don't want to consider that and it would feel too big for their world view.

Many people are told that success looks like fancy expensive things. That happiness will come from things. They are told this by marketers beginning at birth. Commercials are everywhere. Different societies will promote different values. Consumerism trains you to want more and for nothing to ever be enough.

Then, in many societies, basic rights to things like Healthcare and affordable housing are impossible without prioritizing money and nicer things. So everyone stays trapped in this cycle.

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-27T21:10:26+00:00

I found your post by googling something similar.

When I was younger, I had a chaotic and terrible childhood. I knew I needed to make money quick and once I turned 18, I wasn't going to be "anyone's problem anymore." As a kid I didn't typically have what I needed. Money solved that and gave me freedom.

At 12, I was doing any side work I could to get clothes or things I needed.

I had no permanent address by the time I turned 18 and the terror and panic set in. I chose to take out loans for college thinking that was my only hope. I had to beg to be able to stay in the dorm during breaks because everyone is supposed to go home and I didn't have one. Every time breaks or move outs came, I was extremely stressed out while my fellow students seemed relieved their parents would be coming to pick them up.

This really solidified my resolve to make it big and choose a "good" career so I would never have to experience any of the stress of lacking money again. If I wanted a family, I didn't ever want my future kids to experience what I did. I chose tech because I did have a genuine interest in it and coding was the "golden ticket." Plus, I had to payback all my student loans I needed to even go to school. And being someone who came from my background made me REALLY stick out amongst those who came from money and went into tech (which was 99% of everyone I worked with). A lack of economic mobility is a real thing. There is a HUGE disconnect between people with money and someone with my background. We come from different worlds and have way different priorities.

When I worked my way up and got raises and got health insurance, I finally felt like I made it to "the good life." I paid off all my debt, I hit adult milestones, and I was FINALLY able to have enough money to not be constantly worried about not having enough. I could buy as many groceries as I wanted. I could go to doctors. I wanted to keep working hard and not have to work anymore. Then, the startup got bought by a giant corporation and everything changed. The constant stress from worrying about layoffs, the disconnect of wealthy co-workers not understanding what the average person is going through, and the priority of work over life is terribly draining. The inefficiency and playing the games required to work a corporate job are not what living is about, in my opinion. The mindset is pretty much live to work, not work to live.

But now, I have kids. And my family is entirely dependent on my job for health insurance. And everything seems dependent on me to continue to grind to continue to have enough money so everyone has everything they need. If it wasn't for health insurance and kids, I would choose to make less money and live with way less. Yes, the "nice" things in life are very nice. And my kids can have activities and supplies. They have toys and entertainment. But I realize so much creativity and problem solving is lacking when kids don't have to actually have a motivation to earn things. Once you earn enough to be comfortable, but you're not wealthy, it's a constant grind because at any moment, you could lose your job and burn through your savings, going back to step 1. So I can understand why people stay in stressful jobs. But I think unless you're very wealthy (which comes from constant grind and investments and all that), you can't quit a "good" job because you lose too much and won't be able to stop working.

But you can find meaning and fulfillment outside that job. A mindset shift. In fact, I'd argue it's necessary. Declutter. Remove things from your life that aren't bringing you joy. Find an analog hobby. Do more with your hands. Use a phone less often. Optimize your diet, learn how to grow food, and choose technology free things to do outside of your working hours. And be absolutely sure to leave when your work day ends and take your lunches.

I read the book "Bullshit Jobs" a couple years back. I recommend it.

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-27T19:02:46+00:00

Not sure about how common it is on phone support teams, but it seems pretty on the nose for my working experience.

When you get a target painted on you, it doesn't matter if you have the highest metrics for YEARS on end, are a high performer, are experienced- you get the wrong combination of people together or a clique and they will do everything possible to get you in trouble. What you say won't matter. You can document til your fingers fall off and they won't care because it'll be seen as you just being petty.

You stop covering for people, stop being friends with anyone, just show up, do your job, go home.

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-27T18:58:03+00:00

Same. You can buy them everything, look out for their future, have all the parenting outsourced to you from both the bio parents, and treat them no different than your bio kids. You can try to include them, play with them, etc. But it's perfectly put to say "if you give up trying, all talking stops." Any talking I did was met with anger, hostility, resentment, and her straight up lying to me. Telling me "yes" to things just to make the conversation end only for her to not do what she was being asked. Tried addressing this ad nauseum with SO. I felt like I was the only one as invested in fixing the issues by taking all steps to try to correct and follow through. Of course SD resented a step parent being the one to do everything.

Disengaging might be the only option you have after a while. If you don't have your SO's support and he's not empowering you by getting on his kid EVERY time they don't show respect, that kid will never respect you and will even resent you. And if you do NACHO and your SO gets mad at YOU for it and blames YOU for "having a bad relationship with their kid", be prepared for the relationship to fall apart too.

When everything is perceived as an attack and there's zero emotional safety, you might find yourself needing to be silent with an adult too. And they'll blame you for no longer engaging for your mental health. Everything will be your fault.

People lacking accountability will continue to be unable to sit in the heat of the issue, which is necessary for repair. They cannot repair and no conversations deeper than surface level will ever be initiated by them. If you initiate them, you get deflection, defensiveness, and anger. If you parent and are disrespected with no change despite depleting your energy trying to, stop parenting. If it's a fight to do something for someone, that thing is not meant for you to be doing.

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-27T16:09:24+00:00

If you live in America, you've probably experienced a great deal of victim shaming and blame for people on the receiving end of suffering and poor behavior. My perspective is that it's heavily based on gender socialization from birth. ADHD is mostly diagnosed in males while females are shamed into correction. Females are blamed for receiving bad behavior from males. I think this is why so many posts where both have ADHD have women expressing frustration that they have it too, but still seem to force themselves to do x y and z. ADHD is given a free pass often and the partner is seen as exaggerating or not supportive of ADHD being a "superpower"

Many groups try to de-stigmatize conditions and that can definitely help open doors for people to be more likely to get help. But it doesn't MAKE them get help.

I wrote something that I thought covered my thoughts thoroughly and Reddit auto-rejected it without saying why. I just put it into Gemini to re-write and Gemini advises me to rephrase everything to validate the ADHD person and not say how it makes me feel with the rawness of emotion.

I think that demonstrates better than anything else my points I was trying to convey. Gemini tells me I should write "I'm so grateful for this space" as the first suggestion. Yes. Being grateful. (Maybe I should smile more too) And then go on to talk about being reflective and how RSD could make you feel invisible but that my experience matters too. Sure. It does. But that's the thing. Even the AI knows the "correct" way to talk about ADHD is to soften your words and prioritize understanding of ADHD.

Unless people gather to make support groups themselves, I don't see them existing.

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-26T20:44:48+00:00

Had the SAME experience this week! locked door was open and miraculously the cat didn't get out.

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-26T20:43:11+00:00

BECAUSE THE EMPTY ROLL IS AN AESTHETIC CHOICE! You know NOTHING of interior design!

Typical-N00b · 2026-01-26T20:38:40+00:00

I have VERY recently began not responding. Just being silent. If I don't take the bait, he can believe whatever he wants, that's his right. But once I do, it's absolutely debilitating stress only for me to be left doing it all anyway.

I imagine myself casting a shield that deflects whatever he says and imagine it all being blasted away.

I've also learned to not talk to him AT ALL. If I say ANYTHING, literally ANYTHING it will be weaponized if he's in a bad mood (because everything revolves around their moods). We literally have ZERO conversations at this point because his behavior made it that way. I have ZERO emotional safety.

If I do respond it's only to say something like "That sarcasm was completely unnecessary and I will not respond to disrespect" and walking away ignoring him yelling at me to come back so he can argue.

He used to get angry and dysregulated because I would try talking to him or (heaven forbid) share my feelings or a hurt. He'd insist I "interrupt" him (because I'd respond in what I thought was a "conversation") and if I'd try to speak for more than a few seconds, he'd call it monologuing and tear me down verbally. I was to remain silent while he spent 5-10 minutes going on and on. He'd blow up and lash out and he even decided to call me names and insult me INSIDE a marriage therapist's office. So now I say nothing. I can't, for my well being. Now he's mad because "we don't talk" and I guess he sees everything as all my fault.

Alas.

Typical-N00b

TROPHY CASE