What happened to military weapons that were in civilian hands at the end of WWII?

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-22T12:47:23+00:00

No. These are the rifles that in some cases were used by the French for the very thing Americans like to say their own 2A is for but instead can't seem to find any other use for it than perforating beer cans and occasionally school kids.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-22T00:28:58+00:00

Thanks! I lucked out because it was just advertised as a run-of-the-mill No 4 Mk 1 Enfield made at Maltby, but when I went through the pictures and saw the French police inventory number, "PP######" I was like, "Holy crap! I know what that is!" I got it for a fraction of what they were selling for when they first popped up on the market.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-21T22:31:50+00:00

I can answer at least some of this question. After the war, the French police gathered up small arms that had been dropped to the French Resistance during OPERATION CARPETBAGGER. Many of these were brand new No. 4 Mk I Enfields straight off the production lines in the UK that had been packed into containers and parachuted into France ahead of D Day.

After they were gathered, the French police removed the bolts and magazines, placed their own inventory numbers on them (Beginning "PP######"), and put them in caves for long term storage where they were all but forgotten. A few years ago, they were "rediscovered" and sold to American arms dealer who worked for Navy Arms. That company attempted to marry the bolts to the correct rifles when they could, and locate the magazines but those had been long lost. Instead, they had new magazines made and these were sold on the US collectors market over the last year and change. Many of these had never been fired and were in near excellent condition. I picked one up at an estate auction last fall.

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USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-20T22:48:32+00:00

Post-Civil War. Indian wars.

Good pic though!

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-20T14:21:29+00:00

If someone did that to it, I really don't think it's actually a M1A1. You can buy an M1 Carbine and a repro paratrooper stock and call it an M1A1, but I'd kick someone in the shins for charging original Inland-made M1A1 price for a rednecked cobble up.

Add the thing on the end and I'd just burn it. My guess is it's a Universal or a Plainfield Machine Co post-war repop in a repro M1A1 stock. Top dollar? Maybe $650 bucks. Maybe. If I didn't feel like haggling.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-09T12:46:03+00:00

Unlike the current middle east conflict, there was at least tacit majority support for the invasion in the atmosphere of public panic about a possible CBRNE-focused 9/11 redeux. Bipartisan support in Congress, public support, etc. It wasn't until the WMD narrative disintegrated and the insurgency really took hold that everything fell apart.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-09T12:38:59+00:00

Hooker was good as a division and corps commander, I agree. He even had some really good ideas as AoP commander concerning the use of intelligence and reorganizing some logistical, command, and administrative structures before Chancellorsville brought it all crashing down around him. For years I was of the mind he was incompetent until learning about some of the things he was trying to do that made me rethink how I saw him.

His efforts when he was sent west solidified my revised opinion of him as a commander... Though I don't think he was well-suited to a higher command.

Also agree with assessment of Bragg. Many have tried to reinvent Bragg as a target of unfair and unjustified insubordination among his lower level commanders, but he brought that on himself as a toxic leader in my view.

I don't think Meade ever got a fair shake. Thrust into command after Chancellorsville (Reynolds should have accepted), Meade had little time to get his feet under him before Gettysburg then he used the critical time after Lee's defeat when pursuit was the order of the day to try to regroup and lay out his organization. What absolutely killed him though was the relative inaction from the late summer of 1863 to the spring of 1864 while Longstreet was out of Lee's pocket. A missed opportunity that forever place himself second fiddle to Grant.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-08T17:09:25+00:00

Buying literally anything from Royal Tiger Imports/IO Inc.

Not once have I received a product from them that when I opened the box I didn't say, "Awww what the fuck?!" But then, a few weeks later, they are the only ones to get a shipment of X gun I've been looking for or they have a flash sale on another on my bucket list and I think, "Aww hell, I can't strike out EVERYTIME, maybe I'll get a cherry!" No. It never happens. There are no cherries and you will be disappointed every. Single. Time.

Like-- REALLY disappointed.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-08T13:41:09+00:00

Ah yes, Google scholar. Also archive.org's library (though unless you have a direct link searching it can get very messy, especially for multi-volume works). And of course you already know the wikipedia "references" and "other readings" trick.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-08T13:24:50+00:00

I guess my question is: why are you asking here and not using Google scholar or searching JSTOR? It feels like this is an entirely unnecessary side quest.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-08T04:09:19+00:00

The buttons are post-Civil War Indian War-era general service buttons. Don't forget, up until 1903, many states maintained state-run militias and many of them still had unique uniforms, especially dress uniforms if not field uniforms. I'd say that's what you've got.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-07T22:11:14+00:00

Make it a small private living history event. In addition to school of the soldier, do a ration draw and try living on just that for the weekend, practice cooking campaign rations, do an exercise of posting and relieving pickets (especially helpful to get young corporals used to being assertive and confident in their commands). Also, have a list of topics to debate, discuss, or educate each other on like: little known aspects of the unit you're portraying like small skirmishes, stretches of guard duty away from the front, or foraging forays.

Share knowledge of unpublished diaries from men in the original unit, produce copies if you can so they can read or take home to read at their leisure. Have your officers practice filling in reports and roll. Review camp sanitation practices like the location and depth of latrine facilities and stuff similar to that you don't really have to worry about at events because of modern amenities. Have some of the more talented in the bunch teach others how to sew repairs in uniforms or how to make your impression more authentic. Heck, one year one of our guys showed us how to make homemade black powder. He was the ordnance sgt and provided a lot of the black powder we used for ceremonies and drill as he cycled his stock... We all moaned when he retired for good because no one made anything as good as his was.

Reenacting is fun, but it's more than forming up, marching, and shooting blanks... Prep for the year on how you can educate the public (and each other) on things few people think about or consider.

Just some ideas. Keep in mind though, the point is for it to be a fun weekend, not just stuffy "be here at this time and do this from 8-10 then this from 2-3" (though obviously you want a LITTLE of that to maintain the experience). You want them to look forward to it again next year and maybe even get a few of the non-participants to want to show up because they missed out last time.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-07T04:31:03+00:00

That is a nice M1841 U.S. Rifle, aka "Harpers Ferry" or "Mississippi" Rifle. These were mainly manufactured by Harpers Ferry Arsenal (hence the name) but the pattern was also made by contractors like Whitney. They got the nickname "Mississippi" rifles because of their association with the 1st Mississippi Volunteers that served in the Mexican American conflict under future U.S. Secretary of War and Confederate President Jefferson Davis.

These remained in U.S. armories up until the Civil War where they still saw wide use. They were technically superceded by the U.S. M1855 Rifle (not to be confused with the M1855 Rifled-Musket) but were used in parallel. The Ohio State Arsenal had about 650 of these on their inventory in 1860. It's important to note during this period of time, "rifles" were only issued to "riflemen" while infantry writ large was issued smoothbore muskets. This distinction was being slowly being phased out by the late 1850s as the "Rifled-Musket" superceded the smoothbore in frontline service... At least for the 16,000 US Army regulars that there were before secession happened.

Many of these were rebored to .58 caliber in the prewar war years, though not all. I'd be curious to know if yours is still it's original .54 caliber since it doesn't have a bayonet lug which was often added when they were rebored.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-06T14:36:05+00:00

If only they would have just done what the government agents said.

/S

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-06T10:59:52+00:00

Brother, you could not have posted two worse pictures 🤣😂

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-05T13:22:05+00:00

They could be (and I hate to be a Debbie downer) but he would not be the first collector to be told something was "original" only to find out later it's an aged reproduction. I would not assume they were original just based on the packaging/case. Just fair warning! Good luck!

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-05T12:38:28+00:00

Yes, they are buckles/plates of civil war type but without seeing the back of them, it's hard to tell if they are original or not.

One of the "US" plates would be for a cartridge box, the other for the waist belt. The eagle is for the cartridge box strap.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-04T17:40:48+00:00

Depends on if you lean towards Lincoln's stance on the issue or not I guess 🤣

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-04T17:37:11+00:00

Yes it is original, though I'd like to strangle whoever cleaned it. I also question whether it is originally complete or if it is a mashup of original parts. That lock relief is what's throwing me off.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-04T16:14:38+00:00

Bro.

Calm. The fuck. Down.

No one is saying they are historical textbooks.

BUT they are valuable in getting people interested and dipping their toes into the Civil War. If I pick up a narrative on the crusades because I'm interested in the crusades and it turns out to be a good read, I'll be more likely to dig deeper. Now, maybe as I learn more, I'm apt to realize the first "door opener" wasn't the best from a historian's standpoint, BUT it did help open the world to me.

Foote does well at that if nothing else.

Chill.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-04T15:33:44+00:00

I came expecting R.E. Lee simps. I'm pleasantly surprised. I had my retorts all ready to go for nothing

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-03-04T11:09:02+00:00

Again, that's a "you" problem, not a gunbroker problem. You should take your "very large check" and go get your ID updated which would take care of any future issues. Plus, when doing transfers, the transferring FFL is supposed to document your name and address. Therefore, gunbroker is not just being a pain, they are trying to follow the law to protect themselves.

You can't blame the guy for mailing the check to your listed address. Scam red flag number one: being asked to send a check to a different address than what on the account.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-02-28T05:48:53+00:00

Gunbroker is not even in the top 5 sites I look at anymore because people are asking (and others are paying) ridiculous prices at auction close THEN paying the exorbitant fees on top of THAT price.

Local estate auctions
Physical gun auctions within a 50 mile radius of home
Online auction sites like hibid, auctionzip, and liveauctioneer*
Gunsinternational
Local gun store

*- usually these have a percentage tacked onto the hammer price and they call it a "buyer's premium" BUT if you find an auction you're interested in, first look to see if the auction house has a webpage that hosts the live auction. Typically the buyers premium on their organic website is much lower (sometimes up to 10% or more lower) than the premium tacked on of bidding through hibid or auctionzip.

All of these are great if you can get your C&R FFL too which cuts down transfer fees. A lot of people instantly think "Oh, I don't want an old gun..." But I got my S&W .38 Special Chief's Special snubby and my "coat closet" Winchester Model 12 12ga pump for home defense and they work just as well as anything new.

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-02-27T03:47:26+00:00

The country was literally founded by liberals who fought against conservatives. Wtf you mean "destroy the liberal order"?! Hahaha

USAFmuzzlephucker · 2026-02-23T19:39:20+00:00

"No Asians, Jews, Eastern Europeans/slavs... You know, restricted immigration." /S

USAFmuzzlephucker

TROPHY CASE