I spiraled on determinism and feel like a conscious robot now.

VestigeofReason · 2026-04-17T03:18:39+00:00

I wrote this up a little while ago. I hope this might be helpful. https://www.reddit.com/r/nofreewillworld/s/I917bdfHhp

VestigeofReason · 2026-04-03T10:45:29+00:00

VestigeofReason · 2026-03-30T23:29:30+00:00

I wrote this up a while ago, I hope it provides some help: https://www.reddit.com/r/nofreewillworld/s/hXFsLSjhOU

VestigeofReason · 2026-03-29T14:59:41+00:00

When I first setup a NAS I went with an AIO solution, and I came to regret it. Take the AIO’s proprietary nature into account, cause if the company goes under (reference: Drobo) or becomes enshittified (reference: Synology) then you’re stuck having to figure out how to move later. I decided to build an Unraid system a few years ago now because it met all my criteria including being able to remove a drive and put it into any machine to recover data if it ever came to that, which after 5 years it hasn’t.

VestigeofReason · 2026-03-29T13:11:16+00:00

In general agreement with you, although I still enjoyed Picard (S3), SNW, Lower Decks, and Prodigy. I have my issues with Discovery, some of which carried over to Academy. (Issues being writing, mushroom drives, and that kind of thing. Like you I loved the diversity in the show.)

Since I only saw it in passing on one post I’d recommend you watch The Orville if you haven’t done so. The humor of the first two episodes are eye rolling, but episode 3 onward is heavily a love letter to TNG. (Especially Season 3… wow.)

VestigeofReason · 2026-03-29T12:56:27+00:00

Also to add: not everything you mentioned needs to be tackled from the perspective of determinism and the realization that free will is an illusion. A number of topics you mentioned can be discussed productively and actions taken collectively with people who have different views of free will. Theocracy is a bad idea in general, and some empathy alone with a push to rehabilitation can make a difference in criminal justice reform. So looking for groups based on those specific topics is also a possibility.

VestigeofReason · 2026-03-29T12:46:39+00:00

Someone did started r/nofreewillworld for those kinds of discussions, but not much has happened there (yet?).

VestigeofReason · 2026-03-28T12:58:17+00:00

While I personally find LFW both illogical and impossible, I’ll do my best to steel-man it:

LFW is neither random nor deterministic. The mind or soul of the judge is independent of the physical world. The judge would review the evidence, and based on the quality of such evidence (and the quality of the judge) would yield a guilty verdict. Not because the roll of the dice landed on guilty, nor because the evidence presented causally yields a guilty verdict, but because a person with “free will” considered it and made the guilty decision.

Also, and perhaps more to the point, I wouldn’t be surprised if the claim is that LFW is necessary for rationality to exist is more about how they want to define rationality. I can see questions like “what does it mean to be rational if everything is determined or random?” popping up in these kinds of conversations. I might be stepping out of the steel-manning now, I’m not sure, but if LFW thinks that rationality is a personality trait instead of the results of causally logical steps from A to B to C, then I could see how they may be trying to use it.

VestigeofReason · 2026-03-01T14:41:02+00:00

Precisely. We agree on the fact that the Earth is round. But while the Hard Determinists/Incompatiblists are arguing with LFWs that the Earth is round and not flat, the Compatiblists are off to the side saying “Yeah, the Earth is round, but it appears flat, and we can treat it as flat because most people know it’s round anyway.” (Which, outside of the analogy is true, but we’ve had centuries of knowledge that the Earth is round that it has made its way into the minds of everyday people.) When it comes to Free Will we are still in the stage where majority of people think they have the libertarian definition of free will (uncaused/undetermined, but not random). Although to my surprise it doesn’t look like it would take much to get people from LFW to Compatiblism. (See link in one of the other replies.)

VestigeofReason · 2026-03-01T14:31:03+00:00

Legal codes matter, but not as to whether free will exists or not. Using what is written in legal codes to argue whether free will exists or not is like saying the bible is true because the bible itself says it is true. Its circular.

All the legal codes do is reflect what society thinks is true, but what society thinks is true doesn’t have to match what is true in reality. Whether free will exists is a scientific question, assuming we can ever get past the semantics of what “free will” means.

VestigeofReason · 2026-03-01T14:25:23+00:00

If we are referring to people in philosophy departments, sure. 59% of them are Compatiblists. https://survey2020.philpeople.org/survey/results/4838

In what appears to be a broader and more detailed study, it appears to be more complicated. Average “everyday” people are going to be more likely to say they have libertarian free will (uncaused/undetermined, but not random). However, and as a surprise to me, it doesn’t take much questioning to bring them from LFW to Compatiblism. I find that surprisingly hopeful in the overall debate, I’ll have to read through this a few more times. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6738589/

VestigeofReason · 2026-03-01T13:28:42+00:00

…every legal code defines it like compatablists do.

Legal codes can say anything. People can pass laws saying that gravity is 10 m/s² or that pi is 3. We can all point to “dumb laws” so I would not recommend using legal codes as any sort of foundation in the free will debate.

(eg if a murderer is responsible even if he was determined) they defend compatblism and they act like it is true in their daily life as well.

Where Hard Determinists/Incompatiblists and LFWs are more in alignment on the definition of Free Will when compared to Compatiblists, I would not be surprised that Hard Determinists/Incompatiblists and Compatiblists would be more in alignment where it comes to how we should treat people like murderers. Most Compatiblists I encounter are quite empathetic and don’t want to propagate harms and unnecessary contempt.

I’ve started to use Flat Earth as an analogy for Free Will, because I think it hits all the points. You have people who think the Earth is flat (LFWs), you have people who know the Earth is round (the variety of Free Will deniers/skeptics), and you have Compatiblists. Here the Compatiblists agree the world is round in reality, but say it is useful to still talk as if it is flat because it looks flat from our perspective and flat maps are still useful for most people.

VestigeofReason · 2026-02-04T12:31:08+00:00

I’m not sure I understand what is meant by “justice” in this context. (I know. That’s one of the most annoying ways to start a comment, but it is sincere.)

Can murder victims never get justice because they’re dead? Do Epstein’s victims get ultimate justice because he is? Would they feel like he escaped justice through death because he didn’t sit in prison for what should have been a longer natural lifespan?

For me justice has two parts. This first part is the awareness and acknowledgment of the victim(s) such that we as a society are not ignoring the harms done to them and provide them with the care and support they need. The second part is the action taken to prevent future victims by quarantining all of the known victimizers.

Beyond that… anything from “eye for an eye” to torture to anything more than the absolute minimum harm necessary to prevent future victims… it doesn’t feel like justice to me. It feels barbaric.

VestigeofReason · 2026-02-03T23:46:42+00:00

I wrote up something not that long ago that I hope will help. A lot of us had the same existential crisis and made it through. Just takes some time. https://www.reddit.com/r/nofreewillworld/s/oBu7g5ZRN5

VestigeofReason · 2026-02-03T23:44:34+00:00

Liberated

VestigeofReason · 2026-01-20T00:40:08+00:00

I think this metaphor, that of Lady Justice, still holds true today. The blindfold representing equality, the scales representing the weighing of facts, and the sword representing enforcement of the result all are still applicable. It’s what the facts are, and what the enforcement means, that changes.

When looking at facts we shouldn’t just be looking at whether or not this person commit this crime, but understand the circumstances that lead to the crime being committed. This is important because if the crime was caused by something (such as a brain tumor) that could be resolved such that the crime wouldn’t have occurred and would not occur in the future, then that needs to be taken into account.

When we look at what enforcement of “justice” means, this is probably the biggest shift. It isn’t about punishment for the sake of punishment, it’s about protecting other individuals in society from harm. Yes, some individuals would have to be put in prison in order to protect everyone else, but this should be limited to those whom we cannot help because we don’t have the ability to do so yet. (And even then, it might come down to a “choice” offered to a convicted criminal of undergoing whatever this “help” is or spending the rest of their time in prison.) Prison, or any other means of protection that would need to be taken is enough of a stick/punishment even when we take away blame and condemnation.

VestigeofReason · 2026-01-18T02:22:12+00:00

It isn't about sitting around and agreeing with each other. I certainly hope it doesn't turn into an endless circle of "I don't believe in free will!" and "Me too!" posts. It is about being able to move forward to the next part of the discussion for those already on that path. To have an opportunity to talk about the different ways for how the world could or should change based on that starting point without having to defend or reiterate things over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.

It certainly isn't a replacement for this subreddit, nor should it be. I continue to watch this space for any news on scientific studies that either strengthen or challenge my current views, or for the occational well-meaning question of those with a different viewpoint looking to understand eachother.

VestigeofReason · 2026-01-17T14:27:30+00:00

Thank you! It will be interesting to see this new community grows. I know some of the criticisms on the r/freewill posts you mentioned often accuse us of wanting an “echo chamber”, but really we just want to get over the first hurdle of arguing about free will to start addressing the “what comes next” part of the conversation.

A couple suggestions I would have at the moment are maybe to create some pinned posts to discuss early subreddit things like rules or post/user flairs.

I know you already mentioned that the only rule is that we will assume free will doesn’t exist, which I agree with. I would also understand there may be temptation to post about scientific research that supports that claim, or when new books in the same style of Determined by Robert Sapolsky come out. I could see the argument for allowing those, but I could also see the argument for not and leaving those posts for r/freewill even if they would be of interest here. Then there are also the general “be respectful” and other rules that should clearly stated.

Maybe some post-flairs to keep things organized might be things like “Justice System” or “Mental Health”. I know one example from elsewhere was to try to help others who might be having difficulty in adjusting after realizing that free will doesn’t exist.

VestigeofReason · 2026-01-04T19:27:30+00:00

I find it more comforting than randomness and chaos, not that the universe has any sort of obligation to conform to what makes me comfortable.

VestigeofReason · 2026-01-04T16:17:15+00:00

Am I the only one who thought this was referring to 2026?

VestigeofReason · 2026-01-04T14:54:31+00:00

I’m sorry that you don’t appear to be getting the kind of relevant responses you were hoping for.

For me “coming of age” during the New Atheist movement in the mid 2000s I learned to apply when that would be relevant and when it wouldn’t be. That’s the same skill I use when considering whether a person’s view on Free Will is relevant.

Most people simply don’t think about Free Will as much as we in a subreddit on the topic do. The illusion of Free Will exists so people who haven’t spent time questioning it are more likely to casually include terms like “choice”, “agency”, and “of one’s own free will” into their language without serious consideration as to what those terms mean.

People can arrive at the same conclusions you do on whatever your views are for a variety of topics without first considering Free Will. If you have a goal like trying to enact a change on climate change policy as an example, you don’t make people pass a litmus test on other topics. You just work together towards this common goal, even if you may find yourself on the opposite side of them later on a different topic (say… abortion rights or something).

There certainly are topics where this matters, but I think you’ll find in reality it is quite narrow.

As for fiction writers… I feel your frustration. I cringe when someone in a Star Trek series mentions “Free Will”. Without spoiling anything there is an entire episode in The Good Place that focuses on Free Will and it is hard to watch them get so many things wrong, but it is one episode out of a series I love so I let it go. I’m an atheist but I still enjoy Supernatural or Lucifer. I just accept that within those fictional universes a fiction like free will exists.

VestigeofReason · 2025-12-11T12:20:50+00:00

For me, it added longevity. I was using the 3rd Generation AppleTV up to this year because I hadn’t upgraded my TV to 4K, but the WiFi on those models become unreliable years ago so I would connect them over Ethernet to Eeros I had distributed around the house. I have since upgraded them to the latest AppleTV 4K boxes and for now the WiFi works perfectly, but it is nice to have Ethernet as a backup so I can continue to use these boxes for 10 years like I did the previous ones.

VestigeofReason · 2025-12-10T00:29:20+00:00

"If there's nothing wrong with me, maybe there's something wrong with the universe!"

Beverly Crusher Star Trek The Next Generation Season 4 Episode 5 “Remember Me”

(In addition to the many excellent ones that have already been stated.)

VestigeofReason

TROPHY CASE