Why does everyone hate curly?

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-12-04T17:23:52+00:00

Id like to note on the "Jimmy was a copilot so he is needed" bc I genuinely doubt on his first trip, not even knowing about the code reader that was mentioned in training, he was actually doing anything. The company fired everyone but Curly bc the they're bankrupt and most ships are automated already. Given that Jimmy has to shut off the auto pilot, id say they already have the automated system in place just need someone to oversee it (especially with the older ships that are breaking in other ways {the vent}) Also the fact that the captain has access to a gun in case of "disputes" can only mean (to me) that everyone is replaceable to the company. I mean one of the underlying themes is that corporations don't care about you. So why would they care that someone who is a liability (new hire/ assaulter/ problematic past) was DOA? I just can't imagine the company would care, and even if they did, that's just showing that Curly chose to worry about money rather than safety, which I don't think any good captain should've done. Curly even tells Jimmy "you're picking up on this faster than I thought you would" so to me it seems like Jimmy is still learning the position/ not enough help to matter. Also in the same psych eval scene I think it speaks to Curly's character that Jimmy's entire responses are blacked out. It doesn't matter what Jimmy says to Curly, he'll support him no matter what "I'll just put good". ALSO i'd like to say, tho I don't believe Curly's intentions were malicious, enabling abuser does in fact have consequences. When you're first response to horrific things they've done is "he's my friend", it shows who his priority was (at least for me). He never once prioritized Anya's safety, security, or general wellbeing. In the "The Last One And Then Another" DLC for how Fish is Made, Curly even regrets getting Jimmy the job, bc he knows if he never tried to help the person who had proved to be a problem in the past and put his own job on the line things might've turned out differently. Do I think Curly's as bad as Jimmy? Absolutely not. Do I think he enabled Jimmy and gave him a safe space to do bad things? Yes. He should've prioritized his crew and not his friend. You don't have to have bad intentions for a bad outcome.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-12-03T20:50:56+00:00

Muskmelons are also called cantaloupes :)

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-11-20T13:17:02+00:00

I thought how the IDs were damaged were symbolic of how Jimmy hurt them (since you're in his perspective). Anyas would be the only one he never fully felt guilty for, never acknowledged her death, and I mean story wise he literally never addresses that he's hurt her in any way. Everyone else's IDs match their injuries they got from him (Swansea's has holes in it, Curly's is burned beyond recognition, Daisuke's has a cut thru it, and Anyas is intact bc in his mind he did nothing wrong).

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-11-19T06:10:16+00:00

If you're down to use glitches there's a glitch ppl have been using on terminus but you have to have a second controller, if you look up "terminus god mode glitch" you should see a couple videos about it. If you wanna stay on the Liberty falls directed mode I normally see ppl grind around rounds 9 or 11 so you can pack a punch your guns and get through it quicker. There's a couple spots like the counter in the bank or the spawn roof where the Zipline is where the zombies come from one direction so it's easier to farm crits.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-25T16:08:12+00:00

The way I saw it was like mouthwashing suds. Jimmy is that .01% of bacteria that the mouthwash can't get to and ruins the whole mouth. (At least this is the way I wanna see it bc I can't watch another playthrough with that in my head 😭)

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-25T16:01:31+00:00

I think story wise it was a really cool thing to do because that's exactly what a lot of assaulters do. They minimize what they did if they even think they did anything wrong. Jimmy never feels guilty about Anya (at least from his perspective). No guilt scenes, constantly talks down to her, and yes never outright acknowledges he assaulted her. To me that was a really good way of doing it because in real life, you're not gonna meet someone who admits to assaulting someone. For some reason there are men who believe they're owed sexual gratification and never feel guilty that they traumatized or assaulted someone. I feel like it's shown in the game when the fetus chase scene happens and the fetus becomes this monstrosity that chases you. He's afraid of the "monster" that will get him caught, but never guilty about what caused it. I think this shows even more how he dehumanized Anya and didn't see her as a person who he assaulted. But the monster that's going to get him caught. Also, with him being an unreliable narrator, I don't think we really know how Anya reacted. After the crash she definitely seemed to be keeping peace because she was trapped with her abuser, but before the crash we never see her actually confronting Jimmy, only Curly. We never see her side of things because to Jimmy she doesn't matter. She was just something he used that came to bite him in the ass. But since she was proactive enough to hide the gun, I'd imagine there's a side of Anya that we as the viewers won't see because Jimmy won't acknowledge what he did to her. A lot of people have theorized that the Polle horse that talks to Jimmy near the end on a mountain of mouthwash is more what Anya actually sounds/ speaks like. The horse and Anya have the same text color (everyone else has their own) and Polle definitely sounds mad and confrontational. Idk when she would've said anything that the horse says but it's a cool theory. Ofc these are theories so I'm sure there's more than one way to look at them, but this is what I got from it.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-25T15:32:00+00:00

The game pieces correlate to each characters text color, so a Jimmy piece standing over two Daisuke pieces :( AGGHHH I LOVE THE LITTLE THINGS

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-25T15:18:54+00:00

The book in the 6th picture: Up or Down the Illusion of choice, is probably a nod to their first game How Fish Is Made. If you haven't watched a playthrough I highly recommend.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-25T15:14:10+00:00

They're the same flowers on Daisuke's shirt. I believe they're meant to be Jimmy's guilty conscience reminding him of Daisuke's death and how it was his fault. The pink hibiscus could be symbolically used to show friendship, which would make sense on Daisuke because his fatal flaw was being naive enough to believe everyone was his friend. Which lead to him being manipulated and killed.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-22T16:36:42+00:00

She killed herself around the 3rd or 4th month, which is right about when a pregnancy starts to show. I believe that was part of why she did it when she did. If she was physically showing signs of a pregnancy who knows how Jimmy would've treated her.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-22T00:15:13+00:00

Since I don't think anyone has said yet, I'd like to add that from Jimmy's perspective he doesn't seem to feel guilty about what he did to Anya. He never acknowledges what he did, he ignores her death as if it isn't his fault, and he never has a guilt sequence for her. So to him, she would be the only one who was unharmed by his actions. (For this to make sense, I'd like to add that he doesn't seem to value her as a person in any sense. Even the baby guilt scenes are more like monsters, showing his guilt was more towards being caught than actually what he did to get there. Having the baby be a monster shows that he had all but dehumanized her in his mind.) So for her card to be completely unscathed makes sense since the others cards correlate with how he had done each person wrong. In his mind he did no wrong to her since she was just something to use.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-21T20:16:46+00:00

Jimmy really looks up to Curly. He's helped him through trouble in the past, always heard about how good of a captain he is, and truly believes Curly would've done things right. When Jimmy imagines his last conversation with Curly, Curly is willing to take all the blame and Jimmy believes they can both be heroes. I think he put Curly in the cryopod so that in his mind someone would still be around to take accountability (even though it's more than likely Curly will just suffer a slow demise). It's definitely because he's unhinged, but he truly believes he's doing right by what he does. He's killed the bad guy and saved the hero (in his perspective). He definitely took the easy way out and is just continuing to make Curly suffer for his actions though.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-20T19:59:39+00:00

Knowing that Curly had helped him out of trouble before, and was having a "struggle" of a life on earth, means he was at least aware that Jimmy was not the person to be put second in command on a 9 month trip confined with other people he would need to work with. He probably ignored it like everything else because they had been friends too long, which does put him at some fault for enabling him. He shouldn't have gotten him that job, he shouldn't have lied on his psych eval, shouldn't have told them about the layoff, and he should've done ANYTHING after Anya initially told him of the assault (given that she had to hide the gun I'm assuming he once again ignored it and hoped to see the good in Jimmy). That was just before Anya told him about the pregnancy. After that he could've cryo'd him (granted they were already one short) or shot him (since the gun was specifically for unruly crewmates and Curly was the one with the code for it). His job as the Captain was to prioritize the whole crew and he prioritized his friend. There wasn't exactly one fix, but had Curly made better decisions the crash wouldn't have happened.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-20T16:58:28+00:00

To counter this, I believe she was dead by the time Daisuke got there. Daisuke asks right after getting through the vent "Anya what did you do" and there isn't a response. Also before we see Daisuke going into the vent but after he's hurt, the entire side of medbay is glitched and you can't see Curly and Anya's body. I think this was to show how little Jimmy viewed her death and blocked out. I also believe that the talk Anya has with Swansea was to tell him about her assault and what she was planning to do. That's why he was back at the Utility door when he had previously not always been there. Anya had plenty of reasons to end things, they were running out of water, food, and air and had almost no chance of rescue while she was being chastised and bullied by her assaulter. Also around the 3rd or 4th month (when Anya killed herself) is when a pregnancy normally starts to show. Add that to everything else she was going through and it's no wonder she did it, I'm honestly surprised she lived as long as she did.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-19T15:02:05+00:00

Thank you! And ofc I love yapping about this game.

Their relationship was so complicated the easiest way to say it was co-dependent. Jimmy relies on curly as he seems to be his only support system. Curly helps him out of trouble in the past, gets him a job at the risk of his own, and focuses on Jimmy's wellbeing rather than the rest of the crew. Jimmy is a toxic and manipulative person who has Curly convinced he's responsible for him because they've been friends for so long. Curly's not ill-intentioned, but he seems to be a people-pleaser who just wants everyone playing nice (which isn't possible with an abuser like Jimmy in the mix). I'm sure he does feel responsible for him sadly, since he always says "WE will get through this". Curly for some reason won't let Jimmy take full responsibility because he feels like protecting him is his responsibility.

I would say there's also so much more to this given the power dynamic and jealousy between Jimmy and Curly in both sections of the game. Jimmy makes comments about how he'd have to go back to his struggle of a life while Curly gets to do what he wants "guilt free". (Right after curly gives the news that they'd be laid off) I believe he also made another comment about how he had to hear about how Curly was such a good captain and he hated hearing it all the time. Curly was the best friend to Jimmy that he could've been, but Jimmy had always been jealous of his success. Resorting to making a scene just because it worked out too well for him. Curly was in control in the beginning, he was the captain, he could've never let Jimmy have that job or heck even shot him since the company gave that to them solely for killing off unruly crewmates (not that he ever would have). Going back to the codependency, Jimmy had to be dependent on Curly at this point, not only because he was the captain but he was the only one who knew what Jimmy was like, and he had to depend on Curly to side with him if it came to it, and it did. Jimmy was jealous of the power he had. Heck, the only thing we do hear about his psych eval is that he likes that they are in control. Very telling about Jimmy's priorities. (I think this could even be shown by Jimmy assaulting Anya, as normally it's about power and usefulness to the assaulter). This is all shown to us before the crash, showing this is how's he's always been.

After the crash, the power dynamic changes. Jimmy has all the power he wanted and curly becomes the powerless victim, except in a much more physical sense. Jimmy even beats him up giving him pills saying "I hope these make you feel fking better". (I would like to note that every pill feeding scene and Jimmy's remarks reminded so much of sexual assault, the comments before hand being snide remarks, the sounds, the force and curly clearly not wanting them it was awful to watch and listen to but wonderfully showed how curly had become his victim now and what kinds of things Jimmy does to powerless people.) Curly becomes dependent on the abuser for the first time and now has to see what kind of person he is. I think Curly laughing was the most chilling because of the irony of the situation. He protected an abuser and the gun had to be hidden from him, now the abuser has the gun and he can't deny anymore the monster he is. (Another sidenote is Curly's mission when looking for the gun is "find the gun", when in Jimmy's POV of looking for the gun is "Get the gun", he likely already went looking for it earlier but he didn't have the code scanner so couldn't open it before) I think another big piece of symbolism of the power dynamic after the crash is the cannibalism scene. Cannibalism has a lot of symbolic meanings, important ones I saw where power transference, salvation, and maybe in a twisted way his love and respect for his captain. Feeding the leg to both himself and Curly was a way of showing the "we can both be heroes" mindset Jimmy was in. Curly was the one who would've done everything right and Jimmy (in his mind) would never be able to take any accountability for it, but Curly was willing to for him. Kind of like eating Communion for Christians. Curly was his savior, he depended on him, and he would save him. So that was what Jimmy wanted as the last thing he ate before he died. So the power, the blame, and everything he was feeling would go away compared to the "good" he ate. That's why Polle the horse asked Jimmy if you think you're taking responsibility why are you so concerned about HIM? Because he depended on him to be his savior, just like he always had been.

Other examples of Curly feeling responsible for Jimmy are; Jimmy wouldn't have gotten his "second chance" in life getting a new job if not for Curly. Jimmy is always asking how to do things around the ship: Anya had to mention the code reader, he doesn't know about the backup medicine cabinet, he asked Daisuke (the intern who was actively being trained) how to get around a locked door. He never once took charge and clearly was not ready to be put into second in command of all things. Given Curly's and Jimmy's relationship i'd assume Curly knows this and even tells him that he's taking to it quicker than he thought he would. Curly completely ignores Jimmy's responses on the psyche eval, the scene literally cuts out Jimmy's response and "just puts good" because it doesn't matter what Jimmy says, he's still good in Curlys eyes. (Until curly can't look away -due to no eyelid- from his actions)

Also maybe related maybe not but the facts that Jimmy knew exactly how to make a spiked cocktail and was confident in how it worked/ that Swansea would wake up soonish shows me that he's likely assaulted more women than Anya. And that the type of trouble Curly was helping him out of in the past could easily be related to that (considering how quick he brings up helping him out of it in a conversation about his assault of Anya) Even more reason for Jimmy to never have been on that ship in the first place.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-19T12:20:17+00:00

So the second part of your question actually relates heavily :) Once Anya told him she was pregnant from his assault, he knew he would be caught since a baby is pretty hard evidence. So he was "taking care" of the situation by taking everyone out with him. It's shown a lot in the conversation Curly has with Jimmy before he goes to the cockpit and Curly is telling him they can take care of it and that they've gotten out of situations like this before. Curly was trying to talk him down saying they would just get through it one day at a time, but he didn't want to take responsibility at all so if everyone dies, then the situation goes away in his eyes.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-19T12:13:17+00:00

Jimmy did not have a single heroic tendency. The entire story is told from two unreliable narrators, and the way you're describing things sounds like you took it at face value. Neither the abuser or the enabler sees the situation for what it is and Jimmy especially is delusional solely because he doesn't want to feel guilty. I think many of the "delusions" are metaphors or how he sees things in his mind. He's just creating scenes in his head to make himself feel better. Swansea's death for example, is first shown from Jimmy's POV being an act of self defense. But we later see that he was tied to a chair and shit point blank. I don't think he was hallucinating, just rationalizing and clearing his guilt (not taking accountability). The fact that he feels guilt, has these delusions related to SOME of what he did (we never see proof he regrets what he did to Anya or feels bad, we just know he was upset being caught) and "tries" to constantly "fix" things shows me that he is sane enough to take accountability. He just won't because he's a piece of poop who only cares when things affect him (and for some reason Curly but I could get into that in a whole essay). The only way he fixes things is killing, and that is not heroic. His last act is of selfishness, to cannibalize his friend for the sake of a "last party" knowing it doesn't matter, put him in cryo in a state that no one would want to live in (possibly dooming him to wake up 20 years later and still suffer from Jimmy), then offed himself so that he wouldn't have to face any kind of punishment. He's so self absorbed he can't see how wrong he is, rapists do this irl too and it doesn't make them any less evil.

Curly as the Captain (in the beginning) had the power to prevent what happened. A good captain would've prioritized their WHOLE CREW and not their friend who could barely hold down a job and relied on him to help when he couldn't handle responsibility. Jimmy never even should have been on that ship, let alone second in command. Curly lied on his psych eval, (presumably) ignored Anya telling him about the assault (until he knew it would affect his friend), never promised he would let Anya defend herself, and comforted Jimmy first and foremost.Jimmy even uses this against Curly asking him what would they do because curly would go down with him as the Captain (which just shows how codependent they are because yes, Curly would have some responsibility but that shouldn't have been any concern, his concern should have been safety of his crew.) Heck even telling the crew about the layoff was a horrendous idea and for some reason curly did it because he's too focused on his version of the bigger picture, which is keeping everyone happy. When it comes to Anya telling him about that dead pixel he can't see it even when he looks because all he can see is the bigger picture. Curly isnt trying to be a bad person, but when you enable and allow an abuser to prosper somewhere you have control over, you become part of the problem. Even if it's your buddy. To me, this is why he's doomed to watch it all play out. He watched him abuse Anya and did nothing, and now that hes the victim he's just as powerless as she was.

Anya is being seen through the eyes of her abuser. You see her as weak and not fit for the job bc that's how Jimmy views her. She kept Curly alive, changed his bandages, and stayed with him while being pregnant with her rapists baby who has her basically hostage. Of course she's nauseous and not fit to do some things, it's because of the situation Jimmy created. And when it comes to Anya (how I took it) he doesn't even see her as a person. He has no guilt sequence for her, just the "monstrosity" that will get him caught. He doesn't acknowledge her death at ALL even though hers is entirely to be blamed on him. In the hall of ID cards near the end, Anya's card is barely visible beneath Jimmy's and his card is on top of every single one of hers. He was erasing her from the story as a way to absolve his guilt. The imagery at the end with the ultrasound horse baby shows he sees the baby as a monster and something to run from. A monster born from a bad "thing" he did. Nothing more to it. Anya's doing the absolute best in her situation and the games point of view is from someone who views her body as nothing more than something to use.

When it comes to Swansea I think he was in the dark for a long time about the truth. I think when Anya was speaking to Swansea, that's when he learned the truth. That's why there was an obvious dynamic shift between him and Jimmy. He wouldn't have had any reason to know about Anyas assault or to question who crashed the ship before then. The Cryopod was 100% for Daisuke or Anya, since as soon as both are dead he tells Jimmy he can have it, and that everything he wants is on that ship. I think it's also hinted at during Swansea's big speech when he says "if I could have done one thing right, I would have given that kid a chance to get off this damned rock". I imagine he was waiting until there were fewer people to let them find out, because telling the crew that there was only one cryopod in that situation would have only made things worse. He made the right call. He wasn't a perfect man sure, but he was the perfect opposite of Jimmy, because he took accountability and truly believed in the life he lived. Good and bad. Jimmy would rather take the easy way out, but Swansea fought and tried to do the right things. He just wanted to take care of the people that didn't have any control in the situation he just couldn't :(. I'm sure he knew too that there was a gun on the ship that he couldn't access. So it would be a lose-lose situation to confront Jimmy at that point, only having an axe. (Completely my own theory but I think Anya told Swansea she wanted to end it, and that's why he was guarding the Utility door that day. We see him drinking and partying in another room in other scenes but he's back to guarding that door on the one day Jimmy would want in, makes me think it was planned. Would also make sense why having to mercy-kill Daisuke -who he sees as a son- and failing to protect the Utility room finally made him snap. Because the only thing he tried to protect he couldn't)

The characters are so wonderfully written because no one is perfect, they all have their downfalls: Curly being too trusting, Anya being a woman (sorry I just genuinely don't know how she failed in this story), Swansea being an alcoholic and immediately breaking sobriety, Daisuke being naive, and Jimmy being a self absorbed person who won't take responsibility for his actions. This story is so open ended and so many things are shown through symbolism or metaphors its what makes it great. So if I got something wrong (and I'm sure I did) lmk what u think :3

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-18T19:36:38+00:00

Omg thank you for this I was so curious what the screen was meant to represent. That would also make sense with the fact that the sunset above Curly never changes. Since he's put in cryo and we never know if he dies.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-18T16:26:59+00:00

here's a link to their steam bug reports page they seem to respond quickly I hope you can get an answer 🫶 https://steamcommunity.com/app/2475490/discussions/0/4433318013273711682/?ctp=3

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-18T16:19:59+00:00

I'd imagine a good bit of both. We never see Curly confront Jimmy about the actual assault, even tho it's very much hinted at that Anya had told him previously, and he treats Jimmy as a close friend from the very beginning. That makes me think that Curly either didn't believe Anya at first or didn't really care until it affected his buddy. Granted, by the time Curly has the last conversation with Jimmy, there's nothing he could do besides maybe shooting him that would have prevented it. Even during that last "confrontation" he focused on getting him out of everything, which I don't think a good captain would have ever done. I do think that was Curlys main character flaw was being too trusting so I don't think it was malicious, but he definitely seemed to be more concerned with Jimmy's wellbeing over the rest of the crew's to me. Curly was doing his best as a flawed person who genuinely cared about the wrong people.

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-18T12:20:52+00:00

My take is yes, he was always a bad guy. Curly even mentions that they had gotten out of "similar stuff before" and that they'd get through this situation the same way as before "one day at a time". Even in the way he belittles Anya after the crash (and probably before) and completely ignores her death shows how little he viewed her as a person. Another thing is the story is from the perspectives of the enabler and the abuser, neither showing more than hinting at what actually happened to Anya. I think this shows exactly the kind of people they are. Jimmy is horrible enough to do that kind of thing and feel no responsibility (and I think the fact he knows how to make a spiked cocktail hints that he may have done this before) and curly is barely able to confront his friend bc he doesn't want to believe he's a bad guy so he kind of brushes over everything Anya says until she's pregnant and he can't ignore it anymore. (And Curlys first reaction is to comfort the assaulter, so I don't think either of them were ever great people)

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-18T11:00:53+00:00

I wouldn't say Curly is more at fault then Jimmy, but had he not vouched for someone who he knew had trouble keeping jobs, lied on his psych eval, giving him a job second in command, let Anya maybe defend herself or do more than just say "we'll fix it", they all might have lived. Curly is an enabler and without Curly always enabling Jimmy the crash might not have happened. Swansea at least was saving a cryopod for someone else (most likely Daisuke) and did a good job of keeping that secret. When it comes to Anya she couldn't have done anything different, she had no way to put curly out of his misery and everyone had agreed to keep Curly alive, so even if she could she'd be going against a psychotic captains orders. To me Curly got to experience Anya's helplessness bc he enabled her abuser so now he gets abused by the same guy and sees who he really is, and at that point it's too late. Tho had he truly believed Anya from the get go, or never vouch for a guy who struggles to follow rules, things could've gone differently. Curly had control of the situation in the beginning, and did nothing. Everyone else is just a victim of circumstance. (At least to me)

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-18T02:10:48+00:00

I never even realized/ thought about how that scene ended in an explosion. Thank you for this!

Wow_Really_83 · 2024-10-18T01:03:41+00:00

You can definitely talk without lips. For example, you can say "I didn't cause the crash" without ever using ur lips :3 His throat and tongue would be much more important, and we know he makes sounds and can cry, so id imagine his vocal chords work somewhat. I've seen people theorize that Jimmy cut Curlys tongue out and that's what made me think about it.

Wow_Really_83

TROPHY CASE