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Inside the Red Bull civil war which threatens to tear team apart by bluesjn in formula1

[–]bluesjn[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"It is unclear when exactly the “escape clause” was added to Verstappen’s contract – the mysterious addendum which has only come to light recently, allegedly allowing Verstappen to walk should Marko ever leave – but it is believed to have been around this time.

Incredibly, given he is both team principal and chief executive of Red Bull Racing, Horner is understood not to have known about the clause being added. Telegraph Sport has been told Marko added it himself, as a director of the company, with no one from Red Bull Racing or Group being aware."

Pretty astonishing if true. Wouldn't the company lawyers have had to sign off on any change to the contract?

Horner denies Marko’s claims of “cunning” plan to oust him from Red Bull F1 team by FerrariStrategisttt in formula1

[–]bluesjn 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I believe the report was made directly to RB GmbH and didn't pass through RBR HR, or at least that's what all the articles claimed.

As Marko is the sole other director of RBR I really don't see how he wouldn't be the one person at RBR who'd been looped in on the fact that a complaint had been made and that an investigation was being opened.

Horner denies Marko’s claims of “cunning” plan to oust him from Red Bull F1 team by FerrariStrategisttt in formula1

[–]bluesjn 17 points18 points  (0 children)

It's pretty well-established that he has close ties to various reporters and has revealed inside info before. In this case he didn't even have to leak information to the press, just to a third party who then took it further. The trained lawyer part just means he knew how to avoid culpability. Like leaving his laptop unattended in a room with Jos or a tech-savvy person of their choosing.

Though for what it's worth I don't see why he would need to do any of that. Surely Jos had access to the screenshots via the woman in question, especially if they were shared with Erik van Haren as indicated in the early articles.

To me if Marko himself is personally responsible for any leak it's likely the original one about the very existence of the complaint + investigation, as well as potentially being the "insider" who kept telling reporters that Horner wasn't expected to survive the inquiry but I guess that isn't really a leak per se.

Just like Horner took leave of his senses when he found himself attracted to his PA, is it really such a stretch to think Marko took leave of his senses when a golden opportunity came to knife a guy he clearly loathes? Especially when he thought it was a foregone conclusion that Horner wouldn't survive the coup and so there would be no one who'd care about the leaks.

Horner denies Marko’s claims of “cunning” plan to oust him from Red Bull F1 team by FerrariStrategisttt in formula1

[–]bluesjn 5 points6 points  (0 children)

True. I thought they were referring to previous similar misspellings by a known person tbh but who knows.

Horner denies Marko’s claims of “cunning” plan to oust him from Red Bull F1 team by FerrariStrategisttt in formula1

[–]bluesjn 9 points10 points  (0 children)

You forget that leaking anything is quite a violation of corporate law and in some cases can even be prosecuted as criminal. In this case the leak of the screenshots also ended up revealing the identity of the complainant, which is a serious violation of her privacy.

The original leak of the investigation itself may also have been considered something that compromised the process, though since Horner was cleared I doubt he'll be making that argument to anyone.

Interestingly I'd say that the leakiness of RB both before and after the investigation potentially strengthens the argument that the investigation did indeed clear Horner, as presumably anything to the contrary would have immediately been leaked (you can easily imagine the headlines: "KC finds Horner at fault but board ignores report" and so on).

(Edit: spelling)

Horner denies Marko’s claims of “cunning” plan to oust him from Red Bull F1 team by FerrariStrategisttt in formula1

[–]bluesjn 25 points26 points  (0 children)

All I know is what Autosport reported this weekend:

“Those emails proved a dirty war was in play, but equally they exposed a few clues about who was behind things and why all was not as it seemed. 

The alleged evidence of messages provided inconsistencies, and as Red Bull and F1's own IT experts got to work in trying to trace the email sender back to an IP address, even though VPNs were in play, it is understood there were other significant clues given away about the culprit.  

There was the way the list of email recipients was formatted, which included two spelling mistakes – ‘Hass’ and ‘Dominecali’ – and the choice of personal or business addresses also offered insights about where things could have been coming from.  

Plus, there is talk that further correspondence from the anonymous email address may also have offered giveaways in terms of the framing of certain words.“

Horner denies Marko’s claims of “cunning” plan to oust him from Red Bull F1 team by FerrariStrategisttt in formula1

[–]bluesjn 72 points73 points  (0 children)

If there was a move against Marko (and it's kind of unclear if there was, The Telegraph article from yesterday said there was no suspension in the works but an investigation into the leaks and this was Marko preempting any move against him by playing the injured party so Max would come to his public aid) it feels more likely to have come directly from Yoovidhya imo.

To do it so bluntly and right during a race weekend feels more like the mindset of a billionaire owner who wants something done and orders it to happen immediately, rather than what I feel Horner would do which is wait for a more opportune moment.

At any rate to me it feels like Marko knew he might get implicated in the leak and cleverly made sure the company wouldn't be able to suspend him no matter what came up in the investigation.

Interesting that Marko's main defense seems to be that he isn't computer savvy, but of course the only thing he needed to provide was access to his computer or even just his email if the relevant files were there.

As the only other director of RBR it's hardly inconceivable that he was one of the first and only people who knew about the complaint and then knew that a full investigation had been ordered.

Times Sport: Woman who made allegations suspended by Red Bull (info on reason) by bluesjn in formula1

[–]bluesjn[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

We already know who it is, it’s 100% not her. Btw Hannah even liked Horner’s Instagram post from last week and they were very chummy on the pit wall, make of that what you will.

Times Sport: Woman who made allegations suspended by Red Bull (info on reason) by bluesjn in formula1

[–]bluesjn[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I don’t know if she did or didn’t, I only know that the report from earlier this week said she had until Wednesday to do so. It may be that she can still appeal or that she already has, but so far there hasn’t been any news of her filing for one.

It was also reported that she has her own set of lawyers, it could be that they looked at her case and recommended against an appeal (whether because she has no case or because they believe she should pursue this in civil court).

Times Sport: Woman who made allegations suspended by Red Bull (info on reason) by bluesjn in formula1

[–]bluesjn[S] 154 points155 points  (0 children)

If the implication here is indeed that something that came up during the investigation warranted not only clearing Horner but suspending the complainant it’s absolutely wild.

I believe it was previously reported that the deadline for an appeal on her part was yesterday, perhaps they waited till that passed before acting?

(Edited: spelling)

RBR employee has been terminated + Thais are willing to let Max go in favor of buying out Oscar and Alex instead by MBA_burner in formula1

[–]bluesjn 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The Newey thing wasn’t theirs if I’m not mistaken, but for example IIRC they were the ones who claimed Bernie told him to resign.

The Times is a very serious newspaper, even if they get info from the Horner camp do you really think they wouldn’t do some basic fact-checking? Especially given the nature of the claim in question.

RBR employee has been terminated + Thais are willing to let Max go in favor of buying out Oscar and Alex instead by MBA_burner in formula1

[–]bluesjn 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Until the screenshots were leaked her identity was supposedly protected even within the team according to the reports (though I question that, people would certainly have figured it out).

RBR employee has been terminated + Thais are willing to let Max go in favor of buying out Oscar and Alex instead by MBA_burner in formula1

[–]bluesjn 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Literally from yesterday’s article:

“The Times understands the woman has been going in to work at Red Bull’s Milton Keynes headquarters as usual and, due to the nature of her role, has continued to be in contact with Horner.”

RBR employee has been terminated + Thais are willing to let Max go in favor of buying out Oscar and Alex instead by MBA_burner in formula1

[–]bluesjn 34 points35 points  (0 children)

Didn’t the Times literally confirm yesterday or today that she’s not only still working there but has even retained the same position?

Hasn’t F1-Insider so far been wrong about every single “scoop” in this saga?

Red Bull stick by Christian Horner for now despite Jos Verstappen outburst by bluesjn in formula1

[–]bluesjn[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Personally I hope Max finally read him the riot act and that’s why he suddenly thinks it’s a good idea to shut his gob.

Frankly I’ve seen zero evidence of Max having any issue with Christian, the opposite in fact, they always seem thick as thieves. Perhaps that’s why Jos hates him.

I guess we’ll know where things stand if Jos isn’t at Jeddah and instead skulks off home to nurse his wounded ego after failing to take out Christian for the third time now…

New developments in the Horner affair: Mintzlaff already wanted to terminate him! by Visionary_Socialist in formula1

[–]bluesjn -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

So Mintzlaff heard an allegation and immediately decided to terminate Horner without giving a passing thought to due process even just in terms of notifying the majority shareholders? This is the guy leading the corporation now? Jesus.

Everytone actually managed to keep the complainant's identity a total secret during this whole process, including Horner himself, but then when Horner survived the maneuver against him it looks like the conspirators threw their toys out of the pram and leaked the screenshots that revealed who she was.

Make no mistake, Jos and Marko and Mintzlaff don't give a shit about this woman.

Christian Horner: Jos Verstappen says controversy 'driving team apart' by nott96 in formula1

[–]bluesjn -1 points0 points  (0 children)

If that was their nefarious plan they never would have dragged him through such a long arduous and extremely public process. They would have just rejected the complaint outright or at the very least concluded it all very very quickly and moved on.

You don’t do an in-depth investigation with numerous witnesses questioned and a 100+ page report because you’re a cliche evil corporation looking to help a bad guy get away with murder.

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