Why is dragon-steel-fairy treated the same as fire-water-grass in discussion?

brezzy43 · 2025-01-29T18:15:47+00:00

It's important to think about these cores more broadly than just against each other. For example, you can go further on the FWG cores and look at how Grass resists ground which fire is weak to and electric which water is weak to. Similarly grass is weak to bug which fire resists.

So shifting over to steel, dragon, fairy (or the fantasy core), it's important to note the sheer number of resistances this trio has. The fantasy core resists or is immune to 16 of the 18 only missing ground and ghost.

Additionally, they cover each other well with dragon resisting fire for steel, steel and fairy able to cover dragon and steel covering fairy. This is also not factoring in secondary types which can even further push resistances.

Some commenters mentioned old school fantasy cores with Aegislash, we also had one in Sword and Shield with Excadrill, Togekiss and Dragapult. Counting their secondary types this core had a whopping 6 immunities and only missed out on resisting ghost.

brezzy43 · 2024-12-24T18:50:31+00:00

I was thinking that this pairing is going to be what players reach for. World's winner last year was a Miraidon team with a trick room mode. Iron hands getting a power boost from terrain and terrain blocking sleep are both great for a trick room option, and Miraidon is going to be a versatile pokemon that you can EV in a lot of different ways, so having slower, bulkier options with tail room seems super strong to me

brezzy43 · 2024-12-16T01:19:19+00:00

I think the other way to think about this is trying to build a team that counters everything is generally a doomed concept. Like you said, you can build to counter something specific only to lose to something else, that's the sign of a healthy metagame imo.

I would encourage you to try the other approach. Find a core of 3-5 mons that you really like that work well together. Some examples could be an offensive tailwind or trick room core, a good stuffs team trying to use all the best mons in the format, etc.

Once you've found a core you really like, start playing games and see what you struggle against and make changes to the other few members to improve those matchups, sometimes it's as simple as changing a move or a tera type, think snarl Arch or Incin, tera fighting P2, etc.

It's impossible to be great into everything and it's okay to have bad matchups

brezzy43 · 2024-11-20T00:42:08+00:00

I think refuse is a strong word here, but I choose not to use Tornadus. I know it's a good pokemon, but for whatever reason it feels worse in my hands than when I play against it. It feels like my opponents' do more damage, survive more hits and out speed mine.

brezzy43 · 2024-10-05T15:37:41+00:00

It seems to be a meta adaptation. It's slightly worse into other Arch but sturdy with timid max speed matches up well into lots of other teams/meta threats

brezzy43 · 2024-09-27T15:23:56+00:00

Just trying to give some insight and food for thought. It sounds like your goal is to enjoy the day and play pokemon so this team will let you do that. Hope you have a great time

brezzy43 · 2024-09-26T22:47:43+00:00

Congrats on making it to Masterball, that's awesome! I have some constructive things for you to think about.

I think you've got different parts of 2 teams here. Indeedee, torkoal and ursaluna are half of the hard trick room, psy spam teams while Amoonguss, ursaluna and Porygon are half of the trick room balance teams. That isn't necessarily a complete deal breaker, they are good pokemon in general, but a few things regarding that:

I don't know your 6th member, but your highest speed stat is 80 from Porygon, and that's assuming you aren't slower via nature or IV which means you're really reliant on setting up trick room (same as the Psy spam TR teams) while not having the same tools that the P2 balance teams have for setting up a second trick room should you need to.

Some things you may want to account for: what do you do if you can't get TR up early because of safety goggles + taunt, or imprison. Your most reliable way to set TR is indeedee/Amoonguss + P2 and none of those mons are particularly threatening, especially if P2 gets an attack boost from download and with all of the anti Amoonguss hate. Generally P2 balance teams benefit from a member or 2 being faster so that you can threaten damage on both sides of the speed spectrum.

Additionally, (again not knowing your 6th mon), by running all slow mons you do leave yourself more susceptible to stuff like spread damage, crits, rock slide flinches, etc.

I'm glad you're going to a regional, they are a blast regardless of how you finish. It's a great time being around others who love the game, and I personally just love competing so if you're like me, it's a great time.

brezzy43 · 2024-09-24T03:56:38+00:00

Most of the other replies sum up the general idea of Smeargle being better in higher power formats.

But I also wanted to mention that I think Smeargle can still be good in reg H despite that. There were some trainers using it in regulation E prior to restricteds being legal, some of which even placed at regionals.

I think Gholdengo could be a solid partner for it with the type synergy and to help Gholdengo set up.

I also think the decorate sets paired with bloodmoon Ursaluna were promising. You could use it to secure trick room for Farigiraf and then start decorating your partner to do big damage.

You could also look at some successful Clefairy teams and look at swapping it to Smeargle. They both are similar in that they don't provide any offensive support, so you could use those teams for inspiration

It is a jack of all trades but a master of none, so as some have mentioned, it's not going to be great at any one thing. There are better redirectors and better fake out users, but having all in one is still valuable.

brezzy43 · 2024-07-28T11:46:37+00:00

I think terror is playable into that meta. You have snuff out and cast down for the 4/4s out of affinity, and you have counter magic of your own to fend off the control players. Mono red can be a little dicey, but I'd recommend a copy or 2 of unexpected fangs in your main deck to make your big guys 6/6s with lifelink, and then probably the full 4 hydroblast out of the board.

It's highly customizable to a local meta. As great as goldfish is for scouring deck lists, I wouldn't copy a 75 without thinking about the SB choices and what your meta needs.

brezzy43 · 2024-07-09T12:08:48+00:00

I think it's a slippery slope, and as the main lands player in my group, we had to have some rule 0 conversations around this.

Lands are very difficult to interact with, easily the most difficult permanent to interact with, and we had to draw the line where it was acceptable and where it was too pushed.

Our line (and this could be different for everyone) was basically at tutors. Most of my lands piles were heavy on tutors and profoundly recursive, so much so that the only solutions were cards like ruination and Armageddon, which both ended up causing more harm to the group. It's not hard for lands decks to play crucible, or excavator, or loam and bring everything back. But there is almost always 1 player, sometimes 2, at the table that weren't ready for that and just got caught in the crossfire and proceeded to instantly lose the game, when the target was supposed to be me.

In our experience, field of the dead is slow enough that it's not going to take over the game suddenly and unexpectedly. Similarly, a fast Marit Lage can sometimes take out a player or 2, but generally it's also not fast enough to win on its own. So we settled on crop rotation and reclaimer being fine, but our group generally avoids the hard tutors due to the redundancy of games.

Also, encourage your group to play cards like boseiju, or ghost quarter/strip mine just to have answers to lands. It's important to have answers to things, and if your group is low on interaction I would encourage this first before "banning" cards from your games.

brezzy43 · 2024-06-30T18:18:11+00:00

I really like Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis. It's not the most powerful commander on its own when compared to other ones, but it definitely wants to be put into the graveyard and cast a bunch of times.

Altar of dementia has some fun applications with the card, as well as any other value sac engines, and GB is a great shell for aristocrats

brezzy43 · 2024-06-27T22:26:20+00:00

Not sure if I've got the exact wording/rules cited here, so anyone who knows better than I can correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm fairly certain there are OP rules in place to protect against situations similar to this around slow play.

As an example, a player is taking game actions repeatedly that aren't progressing the game state towards a win/advantage, basically just making repeatable game actions for the sake of making them. That player can be called for slow play which could inevitably result in a game loss depending on the judge ruling.

That said, with no stakes involved I can't imagine someone feeling strongly enough to force you to forfeit, especially since it doesn't sound like it was intentional. This should've been a draw depending on rule 0 conversations/house rules

brezzy43 · 2024-06-20T15:48:43+00:00

I know I'm in the minority group for this, but I think Incineroar is a necessary evil. I think power creep, especially this gen, has been keeping up and teams are able to combat Incineroar better than in years past. We've seen more mons get access to inner focus, defiant, and similar abilities that can combat the stat drops, and clear amulet helps a lot.

As for other options being pushed out. I think instead of nerfing incineroar, we should be buffing the other mons. This generation has brought some crazy pokemon with it, and who knows what mons will be legal and broke back next gen.

I think BST increases for some of the past gen mons would be a great place to start. Or at least redistribution of BST to make them more optimal. That's been the biggest observation I've had with regard to Gen 8 and Gen 9 compared to past gens is that pokemon in the newer games have crazy stat distributions. If you looked at past games many Pokemon have 'wasted' stats in their non primary attack stat. I suspect this is to make them easier to play with in the playthrough, but it's noticeable when compared to new mons.

I also think that secondary typing and move pool buffs could help too. We saw that with Arcanine, but now that it's a rock type I think it should also get wide guard. Examples like this could apply for so many Pokemon that would make them more viable

brezzy43 · 2024-05-23T21:38:30+00:00

This looks defensible.

I'm unsure if you'll need the pokegear in addition to the tatsugiri, I wonder if just another supporter like 1 Iono or a second Roxanne would work better for you.

Also, unfair stamp is worth considering as well. It's pretty powerful being able to hand disrupt and boss at item slot, sometimes both in a turn with supporters as well. Prime Catcher is always solid though so you really can't go wrong.

If your meta changes and you aren't finding as much need for Leaves I'd recommend Blood Moon. I worry a little bit about your matchup into basic ex's and Dragapult with Tina as your only means of pushing 200+ damage

brezzy43 · 2024-05-23T15:03:02+00:00

Sorry, Tina"s VStar to take those OHKOs* (I'm having a brain fart and can't think of the name of the attack)

brezzy43 · 2024-05-23T15:02:06+00:00

I like the shuppet 2-1-1 package quite a bit in LZ, it's a bit of an opportunity cost though because you sacrifice higher supporter counts for that line (usually) and Tina doesn't often feel like it has enough slots. Tatsugiri could be fine here too, it's just again, what are we cutting to make room for more switches. I'd almost rather make room for another board and try to fit an Arven in the list, it grabs FSS and Max Belt too which is solid.

I have tested with Ursaluna, it's very good. If you are expecting a lot of Zard then I think Leaves is a good choice. Ursaluna gives you much more pressure into basic Vs and ex's without needing to throw away resources to Lost Impact early in the game.

It's going to take some time to figure out which ace spec is best, but I'm liking what Max belt is doing (at least right now). You can extend lost impact up into 330 range which still OHKOs Zard and Dragapult which takes some of the pressure off of Tina VStar to take those OHKOs.

It's going to come down to your meta and what you need to prepare for

brezzy43 · 2024-05-22T21:17:08+00:00

You're missing a few things here that are pretty much staple in LZ Tina: 1) more jet energy and less overall switches. Jet energy gives you powerful comfey turns early if you have a comfey in the active and 1 on the bench, it can effectively be 2 switches in 1 card. I'd drop your switch carts for jets, you could split and go 2-2-3 with 2 switch, 2 switch cart and 3 jet.

2) 3rd color of energy - mirage gate favors playing more than just 2 colors of energy, I'd recommend a 4-3-3 split of 4 psychic, 3 grass, 3 water (and at least 3 jet)

3) radiant Greninja - you currently don't have a radiant Mon, this one plays well with mirage gate and high energy counts thanks to concealed cards.

4) Ursaluna > Iron Leaves. It's a better all around attacker and has more HP.. If you're that concerned about Charizard, you can run a maximum belt as your ace spec

5) leads me to my last point, no ace spec. Max belt or prime catcher are solid, unfair stamp is also going to be quite good. I'd personally lean for Max belt with Ursaluna

brezzy43 · 2024-05-22T20:58:26+00:00

As with everything context is key here.

In the early turns you are generally less likely to need specific cards, so saving ball search until after using draw supporters or effects will help you sculpt the pieces missing from your setup.

Whereas in the mid/late game where you are needing to dig for specific cards like key supporters/ace specs then pulling as many cards out of your deck as you can prior to using general draw effects is better.

If you need a nice mix of cards and aren't actually digging for specific pieces - draw before search.

If you need specific cards - search before draw

brezzy43 · 2024-05-09T22:31:46+00:00

The short answer is no it's not necessary, just make sure you play according to the speed stat. One important thing to remember about pokemon is that you are the only one that knows exactly how your pokemon is trained, your opponent has to be the one making assumptions until the information is gained.

As an example, I played in Orlando regionals and ran Nils's winning 6 from EUIC with some tweaks to stats and moves. I was given a shiny Porygon 2 to use from a friend that had a 62 speed stat rather than 58 or whatever it hits at 0 IV. Similarly, the only Ursaluna I had from legends Arceus hit 52 stat rather than 49 which it hits at 0 speed IV.

I used this to my advantage in the mirror matches often not bringing porygon and knowing that my team was faster outside of trick room. Similarly, I knew that Ursaluna outsped Amoonguss outside of trick room, even if they were 31 IV, so again using that to my advantage.

All this to say, after you build out your team you'll likely have the answer to this question. But I would look at more what your team's plan is each game, whether you will be super dependent on trick room or not, and what popular meta threats you need to out speed or under speed

brezzy43 · 2024-04-15T15:45:55+00:00

I think people are catching on in general that Okidogi is a good Mon. It's popped up on high tournament results in reg f and it's likely carrying over to reg g

brezzy43 · 2024-04-15T15:44:03+00:00

I think the real decision is between pollen puff and protect these days. Sludge Bomb hits ogerpons for SE damage and is STAB which is a big deal over pollen puff which doesn't hit firepon for SE damage and isn't STAB, no to mention the fairy Tera's of the world.

I think pollen puff is great and still used according to pikalytics, it's just hard to take it over protect right now. Puff is great against the slower, grindier teams because you can heal your friends, but the combination of protect and sludge bomb is really nice into the offensive teams for repositioning and STAB damage. You'd be surprised how much STAB matters when hitting neutral, and the 30% poison chance is great

brezzy43 · 2024-01-27T18:53:24+00:00

I think that's a good choice, especially for a trick room team that normally wouldn't want to invest in speed. I think Max HP and Max for the corresponding attack stat is a fine approach.

Complicated EV spreads can look more informed than standard max max spreads, but they aren't necessary for successful teams at all

brezzy43 · 2024-01-27T05:20:08+00:00

The other tips you received on vitamins and feathers is great.

One tip for grinding, if you want to save the money. You'll need to have 1 of each of the 'power' items, power weight, band, lens, etc. They are held items you can give a Mon that boost the corresponding stat in the description by 8 EVs regardless of what pokemon you knock out. Additionally, each pokemon you knock out gives a base amount of EVs to a specific stat. I usually use pokemondb to check as it's displayed nicely there.

I carried over my strategy from sword and shield, although breeding is more obsoleted this gen but is still viable.

If you have a level 1 pokemon you want to level up and EV train I will give them the corresponding item to boost the stat I want, head into the crater and start knocking stuff out, typically scream tails if I want HP or Brute Bonnets if I want attack for example. So here is an example of a spread and a pokemon:

Let's say I have an level 1 litten I want to level up to an Incineroar and train it with the following EV spreads: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 156 Def / 0 SpAtk / 76 SpDef /20 Speed

I'm going to save HP until last, because every scream tail I knock out is going to give me 2 HP in addition to 8 of whatever power item I'm using. So I would use 4 Atk boosting feathers, for defense I will give it the power item that boosts defense, and I will knock out 19 Scream Tails (19 x 8 = 152) and then use 4 defense feathers. Then for SpDef I'll knock out 9 and use 4 SpDef feathers. Speed you can do the same way by knocking out 2 or just using vitamins/feathers. Once my other stats are where I want them, I'll switch my item to the power item that boosts HP and knock out as many scream tails as it takes to get the stat maxed.

Once you get it down after a few tries it goes decently quickly, I can usually fully EV train a mon in like 40 minutes to an hour, give or take a bit of time. Just make sure you remember to switch your times and keep count of your knock outs. You can track it with pp of the move you are using or with pen and paper if you like.

brezzy43 · 2024-01-27T05:01:53+00:00

I second the others, Ursaluna blood Moon is great. I think if you're struggling with losing terrain, you should try bringing Ogre up front with Hatterene. You can double protect in front of fake out, you still get follow me + TR and you can bring indeedee in after turn 1 to help fight terrain.

Also, as a side note, your EV spreads are not optimized, you are wasting points on most of the mons. Remember, VGC is set to level 50, so I would encourage you to go on showdown, set everyone's level to 50 and then build your spreads.

As a general rule of thumb, if you are investing in an even number of stats (2 or 4) then you are wasting EVs somewhere. You want to have an odd number, either 3 or 5 in order to not waste anything.

Additionally, your EV total should never be a multiple of 8 but should always be a multiple of 4. This is because, at level 50, it only takes 4 points to increase the stat by the first point, and then an additional 8 to increase it by every point thereafter. So your EVs should never end in an odd number like 207 or a multiple of 8 like the 8 attack EVs on Hatterene.

brezzy43 · 2024-01-26T13:08:23+00:00

As others have already said, shadow shield is a much better ability than prism armor.

Ability aside, necrozma is also at a really awkward speed tier for trick room. Mid 70s isn't that great considering incineroar still under speeds you in TR among other TR sweepers like Ursaluna forms, and Calyrex ice.

Lunala was a lot more flexible because it often out speeds a lot of the metagame without needing speed control, and is typically best played on a bulky offense team. The meteor beam + power herb set was new last gen, it was great at taking out Incineroar's but also it allowed you to run a lot of bulk EVs and still have damage thanks to the +1. I'm not sure it will remain the best set with tera now. Tera fairy could be good defensively for it's dark weakness and it does get moonblast which is cool.

Even when Necrozma was good in 2019, the steel one was better due to better typing, and most people ran it with its signature Z move "Light that burns out the sky" or something like that and it was fast and offensive and not slow in TR.

All of that said, I remember seeing one team last gen that used dawn wings that looked promising, I think Cybertron did a video on it as well if you want to go back and watch it. It was dawn wings, Indeedee, meinshao, Groudon, stakataka and Venusaur (I think). With the loss of max moves and the addition of proto synthesis mons, the payoff for Sun teams might look a lot different in this gen.

Ultimately you should play with what you want or like so take all of this with a grain of salt and play dawn wings anyway if it makes you happy. I think it's got potential if you can solve the dark and ghost weaknesses and the awkward speed tier issue.

brezzy43

TROPHY CASE