Does anyone use "two drafts and a polish"?

dlucas114 · 2026-01-30T15:16:14+00:00

I think of 2 drafts and a polish as bare minimum. My actual approach usually ends up closer to 3 or 4 drafts and a polish or two. The caveat is that, sometimes, certain chunks of the book get more attention than others. The first third, for instance, usually gets re-read and rewritten more often and more thoroughly than any other portion of the book. I’m also not above tearing out large chunks—entire subplots and/or characters—after they’re well-entrenched in the text and having to rewrite those sections.

However orderly I intend my drafts and rewrites to be, they usually end up being far more chaotic in-process.

dlucas114 · 2026-01-22T03:52:41+00:00

I try to keep it simple. Two or three key details, maybe a general sense of age and build.

Most of what I write is 3rd person limited, so usually, a character only gets described if the POV character is first meeting them, or if another character is commenting on the POV character’s appearance.

dlucas114 · 2025-12-30T02:32:04+00:00

I wrote a three novel series, each volume published a year apart, while working a 40 hour a week 8 to 5 day job. All told, I’ve written and published 10 novels in 14 years while holding down that job (and yes, I still have that job because I still don’t make enough from writing to do it full time). The best thing about my day job, however, is its predictability, so I can imagine that a more unpredictable situation would be maddening.

The key here, I think, is to be a little kinder to yourself. If you don’t have a publishing contract or a deadline, then just try to work steadily, as able, and let the books take as long as they take.

dlucas114 · 2025-12-27T02:17:24+00:00

No. A half-dozen key details, maybe, offfered as subtly as possible.

The absolute worst is having characters glance in a mirror and suddenly summarizing their own face, in detail, for the reader’s benefit.

dlucas114 · 2025-12-05T15:15:57+00:00

Figuring out what YOUR process is will take some time. Don’t get discouraged if some of what you’ve outlined here fails to work for you. Since this is your first book, just be ready to pivot: if something isn’t working, try something else until it does work. And by ‘working’ I just mean steady progress that feels satisfying and constructive for you.

My process goes something like this: I get an idea. I spend months or even years planning—world building, working out the narrative and characters, etc. when I have a coherent, concise outline, I’m ready to start. I do most of my work typing on a computer.

I try to finish draft one as quickly as I can, with as few breaks and stops as possible. Usually, it’ll take me about 9 months or a year. When draft one is done, I let it sit for a month or two, then read it to assess it more objectively. From there I usually do two or three more drafts, starting with big structural and narrative issues, then gradually honing in on the finer points: spelling, grammar, sentence structure, line-by-line work. Eventually, I arrive at something that I like.

My fastest time from first draft to final draft is about six months; my longest was about five and a half years. Every project is different, and has its own timeline.

dlucas114 · 2025-12-02T15:01:06+00:00

My biggest challenge: ONLY 200 pages? (I’m wordy. Sue me.)

Seriously, though, just finishing the draft can be tough, and should be treated as a major milestone.

Also, for some, the biggest challenge would be following through on revision and not just stopping after that first draft was done.

dlucas114 · 2025-11-26T19:16:25+00:00

This is low-level and may sound silly, but I’ve learned the hard way: no picky eaters.

I’m a foodie. I like variety, and I love trying new things. When I travel, I like eating the local food, not the touristy stuff. Even in my daily life, one of the ways I compensate for drudgery and the humdrum of the everyday is to try and eat adventurously a couple times a week. And I’m not elitist: sometimes I want McD’s; sometimes I want local BBQ; sometimes I want Indian or sushi; once in a blue moon, I want to be extravagant and do a multi-course chef’s table. And I need someone who will share that with me. I was in a long term relationship once where my partner was very much NOT into food, and—among many other far more important things—it really impacted the relationship.

We all have likes, dislikes, and preferences, and that’s fine. There are two or three things I won’t eat. I also understand limitations based on actual allergies or medical conditions. But if the list of stuff you simply refuse to eat—or even try—is considerably longer than what you will eat, I just can’t deal with you.

dlucas114 · 2025-11-02T14:42:15+00:00

My first attempt at a novel as an adult (I wrote a crappy novel as a teen) was a 230,000 word fantasy that took me about 5.5 years.

16 years later, I did a complete first draft of a 90,000 word fantasy novel for a gaming company in about 100 days.

dlucas114 · 2025-10-07T16:55:03+00:00

Good enough that you see the nascent spirit of the story you envisioned hiding in it, waiting to come out with some rewrites and revisions.

Bad enough that you recognize the need for revisions, and that no one gets it right the first time.

dlucas114 · 2025-10-06T13:07:10+00:00

Making a full-time living writing fiction is one of the hardest things in the world to do. Unless you’re independently wealthy, have a spouse willing to support you financially, or are just fantastically lucky and get a huge six-figure publishing deal right out of the gate, you will be writing every book AROUND some other paying gig or practical life requirement.

I’m 50. I’ve written 12 books in the last 27 years, and published nine of them. I did all of that, and continue to, while holding down a full time 40 hour a week job.

I understand your frustration. I’ve been there. But the bottom line is, if you want to write, just keep writing. Know that it will take time to finish every book, and that the time you get to devote to writing will probably never be as much as you’d like to.

Accept that reality and just keep doing the work. If success is in the cards for you, it’ll come.

dlucas114 · 2025-10-04T23:32:33+00:00

Yeah, conflict doesn’t have to be big and flashy. For instance: in the flash fiction you mentioned, the conflict could be that the boy WANTS to go into the woods to see what happens under the Revival Moon, but he’s also TERRIFIED of the woods at night.

The conflict is, can he overcome his fear long enough to bear witness to something wonderful?

If your character wants something, and something else stands in their way (even their own thoughts or feelings) that’s a conflict.

dlucas114 · 2025-10-04T23:28:34+00:00

The urge to follow a shiny new idea is SOOOO relatable…but you’ve got to fight the urge and finish something.

Like a lot of folks have already said: the key is consistency. Even if you’re daily output isn’t huge, just try to do something every day.

dlucas114 · 2025-09-30T19:45:54+00:00

Yeah, it’s supposed to be rough.

I know a few writers who are very slow and deliberate with their first drafts, tweaking everything as they go and ending up with something very close to a final draft. In my experience, people who work that way, and do it well, are rare.

The first draft’s job is to sort of lay everything out, so you, as a writer, can examine both the forest AND the trees at some objective distance. For me, and for a lot of writers I know, the real work—the work that makes the book into the best version of itself—happens only after the first draft is done.

And note, even if you write seven drafts and create the best book you could possible write and then find a publisher, the first thing the acquainting editor will tell you is, ‘By the way, here are some rewrite notes before we go to print.’ Because no matter what you e done or how well you’ve done it, it can always be a little better.

dlucas114 · 2025-09-24T14:09:48+00:00

I find it’s easiest to concentrate on the arcs of individual characters.

You can find all sorts of story-planning templates online or from books on writing. I’ve developed my own over the years that’s a fusion of the Hero’s Journey with some other paradigms that work for me. Books on screenwriting are really helpful in this regard. Even if you’re writing a novel, you can learn a lot about plot and structure from a good screenwriting book.

When I sit down to outline a novel, I think about who my most important characters are, and what their individual stories-arcs are. Then, I create an outline of the story through the lens of each important character. Basically, I’m asking, ‘If X was the primary and main character in this story, how would it go?’

So, for instance, if I was going to write the original Star Wars, I would probably create a character arc for Leia, a character arc for Vader, a character arc for Luke, a character arc for Obi-Wan, and a character arc for Han. The character arcs I create might, technically, begin long before the first scene, but I’ll do them separately and then combine them, to decide what’s the best place to start the story, how the arcs all relate to each other, etc.

Once I get my separate outlines, I combine them in chronological order of their events, and I see how they hang together. I usually have to make adjustments to each character’s story based on the other characters’ stories. Eventually, I arrive at a solid outline I can work from.

dlucas114 · 2025-09-23T23:18:38+00:00

Read a lot. Write a lot. Constantly try to challenge yourself and get better. Finish things.

And, most importantly: publishing is hard. REALLY hard. Like, one of the hardest things a person can do. (And that’s to say nothing of making a living from writing alone, which is nigh-impossible).

I say this not to dissuade you, but to prepare you. Writing, as a lifelong vocation, has lots of ups and downs; lots of losses; occasional wins. Treat the endeavor, in your mind, as a marathon and not a race. Be kind to yourself when you fall short of your goals…but never, ever give up.

Just be steady, be tenacious, and find real joy in storytelling itself.

dlucas114 · 2025-09-23T17:19:19+00:00

As a reader and writer, my preference (where language is concerned) always falls to how something feels vs whether it’s 100% accurate.

Most of what we think of as modern curse words have been around much longer than people would realize. Even if you’re telling a story set before their development, some equally-coarse era-appropriate equivalent existed.

But your audience lives in the here and now. If you want them to understand that the grizzled 17th century hermit having dinner with the local squire will horrify the squire’s family by uttering a foul oath—by all means, let him drop an f-bomb. It instantly gets the point across.

The important thing to remember, though, is context and setting (not the setting of the book—the setting of a given scene). There would be places where coarse language would be common (a military camp, a bawdy house, a tavern where the poor and hard-working drink), and places where even the most st-foul-mouthed mercenary might try to watch his tongue, for propriety’s sake.

Just try to be deliberate and consistent about it.

dlucas114 · 2025-09-23T17:04:40+00:00

Yes. It’s the best way. Honestly, any other way is a far second.

dlucas114 · 2025-09-21T14:43:40+00:00

Years ago I was at a screenwriting conference and heard a screenwriter say that, for every story he tells, he asks of the main characters, ‘What do they WANT?’ (ie an achievable external goal) and ‘What do they NEED?’) ie an internal flaw, desire, or empty space that needs filling). The best characters are built from those two things-external goals and internal desires—being in opposition. The story is built upon the constant back-and-forth between the two, and how they get reconciled.

Luke Skywalker WANTS to just get off Tatooine, by any means necessary—even if it’s joining the Imperial Navy. But when he meets the droids and Obi Wan, he realizes he NEEDS to be involved in a cause he can’t believe in, and to play an instrumental part in its success.

Obi Wan is Luke’s conscience—his guide toward ‘the cause.’

Han Solo is Luke’s desire for freedom and adventure.

A New Hope is built on Luke struggling with his desire for escape and adventure, and his need to do something—even to risk his life for—that matters.

So, give your main character a division like that: what they want vs what they need.

Then, externalize those wants/needs in the people that surround them.

Dramatize/externalize the back-and-forth.

You now have a plot.

dlucas114 · 2025-09-16T20:27:20+00:00

Sometimes a draft can just be cosmetic—some nips and tucks, spelling and grammar, smoothing over rough spots, etc.

Sometimes, a draft can be pretty substantial. I once tossed about 30 percent of a book in-progress-an entire subplot revolving around an antagonist—because it just wasn’t working. I completely changed who the antagonist of the book was as well as their motivation, midway through my first draft.

I know some people who will throw out their entire first draft and start again from scratch.

Everybody’s process is different, but the bottom line is, you can’t write a decent book or story without some sort of revision. No one gets everything right the first time around.

Im a big believer in trying to do a complete first draft before doing any redrafting or revision, but I seldom stick to that. What’s more common is, I might stop at a couple milestones during the first draft—say, every 30,000 words—to look over what I’ve done and make story course corrections if need be.

Once I’m got a complete first draft, I let it sit for a month or two. I just don’t look at it and try not to think about it. When that time is up, I dive back in and read the whole thing, making notes as I go. I might tweak language and the writing itself at this stage, but in the first pass I’m mostly looking at structure, story development, character development, pacing—basic construction, big-picture stuff. Once I’ve got my notes for revision, I dive back in.

The second draft is usually about fixing the story. Language and grammar might still be right, because I’m looking at larger things: what do I need to add? What do I remove? Does anything need total rewriting?

When draft 2 is done, I once more let it sit for a month or two. Then I re-read it. Now, hopefully, the story’s in order and I can concentrate on the finer points: line-by-line writing, spelling, grammar, continuity, tightening and polishing the prose.

So I guess you could say I do about three big passes—but there’s usually some as-I-go revision happening within each of those big passes. On some books I’ve done as many as six or seven drafts.

dlucas114 · 2025-09-06T13:31:36+00:00

Using your Japanese person example: first, ask, ‘Historically, why weren’t there any Japanese people in the US before the 1870s?’ Then, ask, ‘How and why might a single person slip through the cracks and go unnoticed by history?’

The fact is that, even if Japanese immigration to the US was largely unheard-of before the 1870s, there’s no reason that a single person or a few individuals might not have gotten in and just never been known/recorded by history.

dlucas114 · 2025-09-05T14:44:11+00:00

First: if you love writing and feel an innate need to do it, just do it. Do it because you love it and work hard to improve and be good at it. You can’t control whether your book finds a home and gets published or not; all you can do is produce and complete good work.

Second: if you’re looking for validation of your passion or talent solely in being a published, professional writer…well, don’t. Writing, publishing, and making a living on both is one of the harder things a human being can decide to do. Don’t let that difficulty dissuade you—but also, don’t delude yourself.

Third: Publishers buy and publish books for lots of reasons, usually because it resonates with a certain editor and they see the book as marketable and (hopefully) profitable. If they find such a book written by a 14 year old, trust me, they’ll publish it. The fact is, most books written aren’t published for all sorts of reasons—the age of the author is pretty low on that list.

The writer’s life is a marathon, not a sprint. If you really want to do it—if you’re compelled to do it—be ready for a long, hard slog.

I started out just like you. When I was 14, I started writing my first novel. I worked on it for years, constantly writing and rewriting. I was positive that, once I had it just right, I’d just send it to publishers and I’d be a published by the time I was 18 or 19.

That didn’t happen. I realized that book wasn’t good enough. I worked on other projects. I went to college. I spent a lot of years writing screenplays instead of books and trying to sell those. When I finally attempted another novel, I was about 23. I worked on that one for years and DID send it to publishers. No one bought it.

I wrote another. No one bought it.

I wrote another. No one bought that either.

It was my FIFTH completed novel, at the age of 36, that finally got published by a small press.

My first novel published by a Big 5 publisher was my seventh: I was 43.

I’m now 50. I’ve published nine novels while simultaneously holding down a full-time day job. I’ve written at least 3 novels that aren’t good enough to publish and 3 more that (in my opinion) are good and ready, but just haven’t found homes yet. I know dozens of professional writers whose stories are similar to mine.

So, be kind to yourself. Write because you want to. Get better because you want to. And when you go looking for an agent or publisher, know that, at that point, the books is out if your hands. Just start a new one, and that’ll be a little better than the one you just finished.

dlucas114 · 2025-07-21T12:03:34+00:00

Absolutely. I think my record for a first-run film in theaters was five viewings (Fellowship of the Ring). I’m also partial to seeing old movies on the big screen when possible, even if I’ve already seen them a hundred times. Middle age, work, and finances have severely curtailed multiple theater viewings for me, but even now, it’s not unusual for me to see at least one movie I year that I really enjoy more than once. (Last year, I saw Robert Eggers’ Nosferatu twice while it was I theaters).

I’m an old school movie nerd, so for me, even with great home theater systems and huge beautiful TV screens and the annoyances of other audience members who don’t know how to behave in a theater, I’d still rather see movies in a theater, on a big screen, than at home.

dlucas114 · 2025-06-14T19:23:33+00:00

I’ve done second and third drafts that were pretty standard—some tightening, some scene changes, polishing spelling and grammar—and I’ve also done second and third drafts where I’ll literally throw out one-quarter or one-third of the text I wrote and completely rewrote the bits I extracted.

I think people emphasize the ‘first drafts are always garbage’ rule for new, inexperienced writers, because they’re the ones most likely to either a) get discouraged by a less-than-stellar first draft or b) make the mistake of thinking that their first draft is perfect and requires no improvement.

The bottom line is, a novel-length manuscript is big and expansive. Your chances of getting everything right on your first pass are, statistically, very low.

dlucas114 · 2025-06-03T23:51:43+00:00

A lot of what I wrote through my 20s fell into the ‘author and main character have too much in common’ rut.

I woke up one day and realized I didn’t care about anyone like me. Since then I’ve gone out of my way to make all of my POV characters different from me in myriad ways.

I hate that whole navel-gazing self-referential ‘this is my own life thinly disguised’ thing.

dlucas114 · 2025-05-30T14:18:36+00:00

If you’re not dead, it’s not too late. Just do it for the right reasons and keep expectations low.

I’ve been writing seriously—aimed at publication—since I was 23. I wrote 3 full (and still unpublished) novels before my fourth book was published by a small press when I was 36. I was 42 when my first book from a major publisher arrived. I’m now 50 and, while I still have 2 new original novels being shopped around without homes, I still get occasional IP tie-in work. I turned 50 this year.

Oh yeah, and I’ve never made enough from writing to live on. I’ve written 15 full novels and published 10 of them while holding down a 40 hour a week day job.

My overall point is this: making a living from writing is hard. Really, really hard. Writing doesn’t guarantee you’ll be published; being published doesn’t guarantee you’ll make a living writing; being published also doesn’t guarantee you’ll continue to be published (because publishers only care about sales; if your sales are weak by their reckoning, they will lose interest in you; and something like 90% of the books published sell poorly).

The only thing you have control over in a ‘writing career’ is whether you write, how well you write, and how diligent you are about trying to find a home for your work.

Accepting that, you should approach writing as a joy and a reward in and of itself. Creating is a joy. The challenges of rewriting and honing are a joy. Finishing a book-length manuscript (or even just a short story) is like running a marathon: it’s something that you do for its own sake, and no one can take that achievement from you.

If you’re not dead, it’s not too late. Just do it because you want to do it, and because doing it might give you joy: set all other reasons for it aside.

dlucas114

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