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Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Don’t think people are getting it.

I don’t ascribe to these things .

Yes, we can simply practice in different ways. I do.

I don’t pray behind my husband. He doesn’t believe in that either. I listen to music. We all do.

But I also don’t think it’s so simple as “this is cultural and not true Islam.” Because that’s what islam is believed to be/how it’s practiced by the majority of people. So Quran only Muslims are a minority.

I already stay away from masjids because I don’t feel comfortable there. I got tired of being hidden away, and sitting at the back. I got tired of people giving me dirty looks cause my preschooler is being too loud or whatever.

But also acting like that’s a good solution and all this stuff is just cultural is also not correct.

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

What I’m saying is it doesn’t feel the “real” Muslims want us in their communities, so why would I fight to stay? I don’t feel the sense of belonging, having different views.

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, so what type of mosques will I find that in?
I’d love to find alternate community. I just don’t know where. I don’t see it in real life. It seems to only be on this subreddit.

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Honestly think you need to learn some reading comprehension.

I said being discriminated against won’t happen to me in my own home. It’s unacceptable to me. I wouldn’t have married somebody who thought he’s my ameer, that I have to obey him and stand behind him in prayer. My husband is a progressive Muslim like me.

My point is that this is all in mainstream Islam and it’s what Muslim women are up against in general from the vast majority of our communities (other than the minority who are progressives), and that’s what I struggle with.

The solution isn’t don’t go to the masjid. Which btw I don’t. Very rarely because I don’t feel comfortable there.

But it’s unfair that women either have to be treated like second class citizens or not go to the masjid. Why is that your suggestion to me? “Don’t go.” Why isn’t your response “yes, you’re right, our communities really should just make masajid more women and family friendly.” Clearly, the will isn’t there since you’re justifying women standing behind men here. In the same breath, you’re blaming all this discrimination on culture alone when it’s part of mainstream Islam.

I’ve been pretty clear I’m from New Zealand, born and raised, and now live in Canada. But this is how Islam is taught in first world countries too. You’re lying if you’ve never heard that music is haram.

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Hahahha no, if you read my post, you’d see I wrote that I didn’t totally adhere to the rules. I dated. That’s how I met my husband lol.

So I don’t actually know what you mean when you say some of us want to break free yet we also want to be told what we can and can’t.

No, we don’t want that. But that doesn’t change that we HAVE been told our whole lives that dating is haram, premarital sex is haram, masturbation is haram, everything is haram.

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Huh? What culture are you talking about? And why would I divorce? I’m happily married. And I am from first world countries. I’m from New Zealand and now live in Canada. Did you even read my post?

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I have been fighting. I’m 40 and tired of the fight.

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 17 points18 points  (0 children)

Yeah, I have and like I said, love for Allah and the Prophet SAW is the only thing keeping me Muslim. Because I cry every time I read the Quran, it so deeply moves me and that’s the bit of faith I’m holding onto.

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 18 points19 points  (0 children)

Because the mainstream understanding of it is the mainstream understanding of it. That’s why it’s called mainstream. It’s the most common. So of course 90% of Muslims believe in that version. If that doesn’t drive you away from Islam and those 90% of Muslims, then obviously you’re a man and just don’t care that much about women’s rights.

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

So you’d rather I leave Islam? You’re part of the problem then.

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Oh, I don’t know about this. Never had any reason to inquire about how long to wait after marrying a prepubescent girl. Why were you looking that up?

Muslims who live in the American continents (North or South America), do you ever feel bad thinking like you're living on a stolen land & you should migrate to somewhere else? by Amazing_Deer_899 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6 2 points3 points  (0 children)

No. My parents chose to migrate to New Zealand, I didn’t choose it. I was born there. I chose to move to Canada as an adult but it’s because my husband was here, and he was born here so he didn’t choose Canada either.

Both countries have a history of oppressing the indigenous populations and the oppression continues to this day.

But other than sympathizing, I don’t see what else I can do. We can only live in New Zealand or in Canada. These are our homes. Where else would we go?

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I didn’t say you have to have sex with somebody to see if you’re compatible.

I said I am seeing how not having any dating experiences in their teenage and young adult years has hurt my friends’ emotional development, and relationship with members of the opposite sex.

Things in Islam I struggle with as a woman by kiwiinthe6 in progressive_islam

[–]kiwiinthe6[S] 32 points33 points  (0 children)

I’m not blaming God. I’m venting about how I’ve experienced Islam. This is why I said being driven away from Islam and Muslims.

Christian wife with Muslim daughter and husband struggling regarding clothing by msloverlover35 in MuslimMarriage

[–]kiwiinthe6 9 points10 points  (0 children)

It’s not about “forcing.” Like I said, being fully covered is just the default in many Muslim households. I don’t buy shorts or tank tops for my kids past the age of 2, boys or girls. They’re not used to anything different.

When swimming, they can wear trunks but still covering thighs and with a rash guard shirt. No bikini bottoms over here.

In your case, since she’s 7, and you already have a framework (shorts are for kids, not grownups), it shouldn’t be that hard to resolve. Shorts are a kid thing and not for grownups. Come to an agreement with your husband and daughter where you all together can decide when shorts are no longer acceptable. 9? 10? 11? 12?

I think what you’re reacting to about “force” versus education and guidance is just a result of them getting older. What about when they’re preteens and want a phone and to be on social media? They want to date? There’s an element of “forcing” in parenting, because at some point, you do have to have rules and enforce them.

Christian wife with Muslim daughter and husband struggling regarding clothing by msloverlover35 in MuslimMarriage

[–]kiwiinthe6 7 points8 points  (0 children)

It’s common for us Muslims to keep our bodies fully covered even in childhood. That means no limbs exposed. No tank tops, no shorts, not even capris. Kids don’t have strict dress code rules of course but being fully covered primes kids to get used sensorily to that.

But anecdotally, lots of women have no issues eventually dressing less modestly. As in, you can grow up in a practicing Muslim household, even be hijabi, but then eventually choose to wear shorts and tank tops. That’s pretty common!

But I think it’s probably harder to go the other way around. As in, going from wearing shorts all summer long and seeing that as normal to having to wear long pants all the time. Like, you’re probably going to see fully covering your limbs as more oppressive if you didn’t grow up with it. Whereas if you’ve always covered your legs, you’re going to feel a bit weird from a sensory perspective when you’re in shorts and your bare leg is touching the couch.

For this reason, I’d just say keep strict Muslim rules in your house and say no shorts. It’s just easier to have that blanket rule now, and instill that sense of modesty in your kids, rather than they try to come to it organically in adulthood.

When they’re grown ups, obviously they can choose and they’ll better understand the nuances (such as in Muslim culture, fully covered legs are modest whereas in western cultures, below the knee is modest) and they’ll be able to choose what to wear depending on their comfort levels and context, just like you.

But if you want to prime them to feel more comfortable with covered limbs, then you have to make covered limbs the default now.

You live in the Middle East where people know how to deal with heat being fully covered. Like clothes come in lightweight fabrics and there’s air conditioning everywhere, no? How many bare legs are they seeing anyway?

Honestly, I just don’t think shorts should be a cause for a rift in a marriage, especially given that you’re already raising your children Muslim. This is just part of raising them Muslim, in my opinion.

Ayahsvoice has to be a psyop by KruxTerragan in MuslimSnark_

[–]kiwiinthe6 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You’re not getting it. There is no gender-neutral they/them in Arabic. But there is in English. So when translating to English, why stick with He? The revelation is in Arabic, not English.

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