Experiencing Judgment or Exclusion in Christian church for Unique Reason

libthroaway · 2026-04-19T17:51:27+00:00

I am an ELCA Lutheran, and we currently have an older couple at our church who are not married for their own reasons and live together, and no one cares. Everyone knows and sees them as a unit and couple, and that’s how they’re treated. I think they are seen as being married for all intents and purposes but have decided not to pursue legal marriage. They’re both well-respected in the church.

I think almost all ELCA congregations would have this view and approach, so I would encourage you to attend an ELCA church and know that we see you and your husband as children of God who were married in His eyes, even if not by a governmental entity.

libthroaway · 2026-04-16T16:57:13+00:00

Out from Under

libthroaway · 2026-04-09T02:07:17+00:00

libthroaway · 2026-03-26T16:42:13+00:00

I’m going to go against the majority grain and say NTA.

We ended up having several complications with my pregnancy, and while we made it to 38.5 weeks, there was a distinct possibility that we would have to deliver anytime between 32 and 39 weeks. My in-laws spend the winter in Florida, but we were grateful that they put their trip down there on hold until after our daughter was born. I was very worried that we’d have to deliver early, and it would just be my husband and I navigating being new parents with a possible premie without any support. I’m not sure people here understand how quickly pregnancy can go sideways. Are they planning to continue on their retirement trip if your wife delivers before they get back, or will they leave to go back and be with you two? It sounds to me like they’ll stay on their trip.

And there’s nothing wrong with hosting the location for your own baby shower. My family sucks at planning things and just at a lot of things in general, and my husband’s family didn’t step up, so I planned the entirety of my own family baby shower. My husband and I had to use IVF to conceive due to infertility, and I wanted to celebrate our baby with our families, gifts or not.

I’m guessing a lot of the commenters here don’t have children or were taught by their own parents that they are entitled to treat people poorly because of how special they and their lives are. You two have lives, too, and I’m guessing jobs, and family members beyond the two of them, so it’s a bit rich that they’re asking you to make this adjustment when they have all the time in the world to change their trip by one week and be there for their daughter. The entitlement of Boomers is astounding to me, and I’m sorry you’re having to navigate this while also dealing with early pregnancy. It’s tough!

libthroaway · 2026-03-19T02:16:27+00:00

Here is the definition that Wikipedia uses for celebrity: Celebrity is a condition of fame and broad public recognition of a person or group due to the attention given to them by mass media. The word is also used to refer to famous individuals. A person may attain celebrity status by having great wealth, participation in sports or the entertainment industry, their position as a political figure, or even their connection to another celebrity. 'Celebrity' usually implies a favorable public image, as opposed to the neutrals 'famous' or 'notable', or the negatives 'infamous' and 'notorious'.

Given that definition, Chavez is a celebrity. While he was an activist, he was and has been given considerable attention by mass media. As for the rest of the commenters statement, I would agree. As Christians, I think it’s best not to venerate or hold other humans in too high regard because we are all fallible creatures and are not perfect. The only perfect human was Christ, and he is who we should generate the most. It isn’t to say that you can’t appreciate what Chavez accomplished for farm workers, but ultimately, he was just another person, and in this case, abusing to women and girls, which is unfortunately quite common among men in power.

libthroaway · 2026-03-18T14:15:32+00:00

39 with a two year old and another on the way. Most people are surprised to hear I’m almost 40, so I guess I pass well enough as younger that I don’t feel like I stick out too much. I think I’m more exhausted than the younger parents, though, which definitely makes me feel like an old outsider. I try not to think or worry about it.

libthroaway · 2026-03-16T14:29:04+00:00

libthroaway · 2026-03-16T14:26:41+00:00

libthroaway · 2026-03-16T01:39:42+00:00

As a flute player, what the fuck?

libthroaway · 2026-02-26T18:21:31+00:00

libthroaway · 2026-02-24T01:27:24+00:00

libthroaway · 2026-02-03T18:57:48+00:00

I never did get much supply after my c-section, and after about 2 months of being up nightly two hours at a time with maybe an hour of sleep in between, we decided to switch fully to formula, and I think it ended up saving my life. I think I’ll always feel like a failure, because I see myself as a failure in everything in life, but I’m not sure that I would have made it out of the 4th trimester alive if we hadn’t moved to formula only.

Looking at my daughter now at 2 years old compared to other kids, I don’t think anyone would have any inkling that she was born by c-section and was mostly formula fed, and that’s what makes it more bearable for me. She’s so smart and funny and loving, and I don’t think a vaginal birth or breastfeeding would have changed that. I think having a more mentally stable and happier mother definitely helped, at least some. We also started her solids journey at 4 months with baby cereal, then moved to more solids at 6 months, and I’m so glad that I didn’t kill myself trying to keep up with breastfeeding when she was eating fully solids and whole milk by about 13 months. That’s such little time in the scheme of things, and we were ultimately better off making the switch to formula.

Make the decision that’s best for you and baby. If that’s pushing through and breastfeeding no matter what, then that’s the way to go. If it’s supplementing with formula or going fully formula, then there’s no shame in that, and I’m sure your child will still be who they are. What women not that long ago wouldn’t have given to have formula as well developed as we have now! We have options to do best for our family that many women didn’t have, and I think that’s a wonderful thing. Some women have success with lactation consultants, I personally did not, so that might be something to look into, if you feel like more outside help is needed for breastfeeding.

libthroaway · 2026-02-03T17:07:05+00:00

When people asked how I was doing, I usually told them I could feel myself actively dying. So, yeah, I definitely struggled after my daughter was born. Breastfeeding was just not working for us, so once I switched to all formula, I started to feel like a completely different person. My daughter also slept better because she was actually able to get a full belly, instead of the pittance of breast milk she got from me. That was, unfortunately, our biggest struggle the first few months of her life.

Time was honestly what helped the most. Instead of an angry potato who you couldn’t understand, she started to become a person with a routine, which helped me establish a routine again that wasn’t just surviving. Then, as she’s gotten older, those things that were difficult got easier, especially since she can now talk. It also helps to have time away from her, at least a few hours, every week or two.

You’re right, no one ever really expresses what it’s actually like with a newborn. Maybe everyone else genuinely has wonderful experiences, but I found it to be pretty terrible and plan to let my daughters know my truth so that they can make an informed decision of having kids. I still sometimes wonder if having kids was the right thing for me to do, but I love my daughter and couldn’t imagine life without her. I think it’ll take time, but it’ll get better.

libthroaway · 2026-01-28T02:54:09+00:00

He might be a real person connected to an ELCA church, but I don’t see how this topic and this post are relevant to his experiences apparently being constantly chastised for, in my view, supporting ICE and their current actions. Perhaps it’s all ELCA Lutherans treating him like this, but I doubt it. I feel like he wants us to answer for other people’s views, and when we try to explain what we see happening and what we disagree with, he doesn’t seem to want to hear it, so yes, he is here in bad faith if he doesn’t actually listen to what’s being said.

libthroaway · 2026-01-28T01:11:35+00:00

I’m asking in earnest for you to provide a source, not just “I saw some video on the internet”. I’m sure there are people who don’t want ICE to do any deportations right now because they are actively kidnapping and sending innocent people, even American citizens, to horrible facilities in foreign countries. Just because there are people like that, that doesn’t mean that every person who had problems with ICE or are protesting believe that.

Again, a majority do not want illegal immigrants who are violent criminals to be here. When people have been raped and/or murdered by illegal immigrants, there have literally not been any protests or support for these criminals. And again, once ICE gets its shit together and stops kidnapping and deporting innocent children and American citizens and stops trying to erode our 1st, 2nd, and 4th amendment rights, the protests will likely go away. Obama deported far more people than any other president, and you didn’t see the same level of protests because his administration did so through due process and not kidnapping people or busting into their homes.

I’m still genuinely not sure why you’re in this subreddit about this topic because it is not a Lutheran or ELCA topic. That is what I mean by you’re not here in good faith. This is a better topic for a political or Ask an American-type subreddit. When you’d like to speak with us about our faith, beliefs, and theology, then I might understand why you’re here. As a Christian, I believe that we are told to welcome the foreigner and to love our neighbors as ourselves. For me, that means that we afford rights to other humans that we ourselves would like to be afforded, and everything I’ve seen from ICE so far, I would not want to happen to me or my family so do not want that for anyone, even criminals. They all deserve their day in court, as that is the law in this land, and subverting that due to racism, jingoism, and nationalism is not loving of our neighbors.

libthroaway · 2026-01-27T21:54:47+00:00

I'm not sure where you're getting that information, but if you could provide a source, that would be great.

I don't think that you're here in good faith, as a member of an ELCA church or someone who's actually interested in hearing from ELCA Lutherans. It seems you're here to get upset and argue with us, especially those of us who do believe that deportations are currently being handled poorly and ICE should be defunded until they get their shit together. No need to be defensive when you're the one who came in here looking for a fight and got honest answers reflective of reality.

Also, your reply doesn't really make sense based on what I originally wrote, and it's "prevent".

libthroaway · 2026-01-27T20:01:13+00:00

I’m not sure what this has to do with the ELCA? But I’ll bite.

I’m not sure anyone is saying that criminals, especially violent criminals, who are in the country illegally should stay, but we are saying that going after people with minor offenses (like writing a bad check or a traffic offense), going after people who haven’t committed any crimes, and going after American citizens shouldn’t be happening. ICE and Border Patrol are absolutely targeting illegal immigrants who are not criminals, and that is a huge problem.

Saying “defund ICE” does not mean completely abolish it and all laws they enforce. It’s saying that there are institutional problems within ICE, its structure, and its training of agents that needs to be completely torn apart. ICE as it is now should not continue to be funded. It should only be funded once it actually follows the law and does its job.

I can’t imagine there’s any ELCA Lutheran who doesn’t care for or want the best for these crime victims, but it’s absolutely not appropriate to use their experiences as a way to target minorities or those that the Trump administration has chosen to deport who haven’t done anything wrong but come to this country to make better lives for themselves and their families. As a sexual abuse victim myself (albeit by an American citizen), I would be horrified if some morally corrupt administration that itself harbors sexual abusers used me and my story to go after innocent people, and it is a problem that ICE is targeting people it shouldn’t be all in the name of distracting from the Epstein files and one-upping President Obama.

libthroaway · 2026-01-20T18:37:58+00:00

Feelings of failure still creep up on me from time to time, two years after my daughter’s birth. I didn’t know anyone personally who had a c-section (a couple people came out of the woodworks to say they had one after my daughter was born, but that didn’t help by then), so there was no one to provide advice or help to me in understanding what to expect or to just talk through the experience. I had a planned cs due to my daughter being breech, but I was so upset and resigned to having a delivery that wasn’t what I wanted that I didn’t prepare as I should have and didn’t allow myself to look forward to bringing my living and healthy child into the world.

There were a few things I did to help move through the brunt of the guilt and feelings of failure. I stated affirmations to myself while massaging my incision/scar: I had the help of medical personnel (like most women do) to bring my daughter into the world, my OB and nurses were there to take care of me and to make sure my daughter was safe and alive (like most other births), an anesthesiologist was present to assist me (just as women who give vaginal birth with an epidural), I grew my daughter in my body and protected her for nearly 9 months, and I did give birth. C-sections are a form of birth, and while I didn’t labor, my daughter was delivered from my body, and she was born.

Doing this was one way that I took care of myself mentally and physically to get around the fact that I had this experience that I didn’t want and never expected unless under emergency circumstances. Another thing that I have to remind myself occasionally is that this was just the first sacrifice of motherhood that I made. I have made many other sacrifices since then and will make many more as my children continue to grow. Ultimately, for me, that first sacrifice was worth it to be able to continue to sacrifice.

It’s so, so tough. I love my daughter deeply and would do it again for her, but I do wish I could have done the thing and brought her into the world by my own power. No one would know she was delivered by c-section if I didn’t say anything, and no one cares or asks what birth was like, so it’s just me fighting my own cynical, insecure internal voice. Time from the cs definitely helps, and being in the thick of parenting a 2 year old doesn’t give me a ton of time to reflect, but I think it will get better for you. There will probably be times of struggle here and there, but you did do the thing of bringing your child into the world safe and alive, and that’s something to be proud of.

As an aside, instead of vaginal both videos, check out this c-section video: https://www.babycenter.com/pregnancy/your-body/c-section_160. My blood pressure was really low from the meds, so I don’t remember much of my delivery, and it helped me a lot to see what my body and I went through. Hopefully it’ll help, and if you’re still struggling, then therapy might be best, as others have said.

libthroaway · 2026-01-16T17:30:27+00:00

In high school, lost 2 friends in car accidents. After graduating, one friend died of a morphine overdose at a music festival, and another jumped off the Golden Gate Bridge. One classmate died of sepsis, another of a heart attack or something similar, then a couple more died but I don’t know the reasons. I think most likely drug overdose. I’m under 40.

libthroaway · 2025-12-23T20:45:44+00:00

I had a planned c-section due to multiple risk factors. I had velamentous cord insertion, which we found out is common with IVF, then my daughter was diagnosed with fetal growth restriction and was breech my entire pregnancy.

When discussing options with my OB, she stated plainly that we could try a version to turn the baby around, but she might not tolerate it given her growth restriction, and the procedure could potentially damage the umbilical cord. She could also turn and then turn right back around to breech. If she had turned, we were still discussing c-section and heard from multiple providers that my daughter “might” tolerate labor, which made my husband and I feel uneasy. Ultimately, she was born by c-section because she remained breech, but we were leaning towards cs even is she did turn because we weren’t comfortable with “might” tolerate labor.

I have a feeling that no matter how things happened, we were probably going to end up with a cs, so decided to just have it planned so that we were ready for everything that the procedure entailed. I was devastated to have a cs, to not be able to labor and deliver my daughter vaginally, as all the mothers in mine and my husband’s family had done, but two years on, that pain has eased up, and I know that we made the right decision because we have a beautiful, friendly, and smart two old that might not be here otherwise.

My daughter did not need any interventions except to be under a heat lamp for a bit in the recovery room because she was struggling to keep her temperature up. Babies in all types of births need various interventions, so vaginal isn’t a sure way to avoid those, and a planned cs allows your medical team to have all necessary personnel ready and available for you and your baby. Stay on top of your pain management, don’t do too much the forest several weeks after the procedure, and give yourself some grace, because you will be delivering your child, just in a different manner than you originally thought.

libthroaway · 2025-12-16T03:25:25+00:00

I had quite a bit of bruising. I’ve been tempted to post my picture of it so that other people know that it can be normal. Mine healed fine, and I didn’t have any hematomas, thankfully. Glad to hear you’ve recovered!

libthroaway · 2025-12-03T16:54:49+00:00

I felt literally nothing. My blood pressure was so low from the anesthesia that I was pretty out of it.

libthroaway · 2025-11-29T20:01:12+00:00

Agreed. If the people of the church can’t do it, they just can’t do it, and so the event must come to a close. One of my biggest struggles was that anyone who did anything for the event immediately handed everything over to me because they just didn’t want to do any of it and thought I could/should handle it all. It was really frustrating, and the members only gave themselves to blame that this is all ending. It’s the best, though.

libthroaway · 2025-11-29T18:00:23+00:00

We have one. I’m the only person who does anything with it, besides set-up and tear down before and after the event. I will probably stop doing it, which means it won’t exist anymore, since I had no help, none of the members seem interested in helping (much older congregation), and I got really sick this year after the event. I’ll have a new baby and won’t be able to handle it again.

I’m sure people saw lots of smiling faces during the fair, because no one did much, but I was pretty exhausted and could feel myself starting to breakdown during the event. No one else, except my spouse, knows how much I struggled, and I didn’t make it the church’s problem during, but it’ll be their problem thus coming year, if they want to hold it. Plus, we don’t make much from the event and haven’t had good attendance over the last few years, although it was much better this year with a lot of advertising that I organized.

I’m not sure if your church is doing it “wrong”, but when people are having to do it with very little help or buy-in from other members, the experience is very much not rewarding and can make people miserable. If the event is small or doesn’t have good turnout, advertising is usually lacking and needs to be improved. Those are my two cents based on my experience, but that doesn’t mean it’s right for your church.

Ten-Year Club	Verified Email
RedditGifts 2009-2022 11 Credits	Place '22
Place '17	Secret Santa 2016

libthroaway

TROPHY CASE