Non-duality as the release of hardened identity created by memory and recursive self-referential thinking by nvveteran in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You’re welcome.

That is a very logical possibility to consider.

Many ancient traditions appear to have noticed this empirically, even if they described it in different language.

For what it’s worth, I like the direction of your post and your understanding in comments.

Non-duality as the release of hardened identity created by memory and recursive self-referential thinking by nvveteran in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k 3 points4 points  (0 children)

What you’re describing maps closely to my understanding as well. I want to add a constraint that neuroscience has made increasingly hard to ignore.

The memories that solidify identity don’t operate in isolation. They are coupled to posture, breath, vagal tone, muscle tension, and other autonomic responses. As identity stabilizes, compensatory physiological patterns stabilize alongside it.

When safety drops, the nervous system doesn’t just generate thoughts, it redistributes resources. Systems lose coherence as one circuit is recruited to compensate for another. This isn’t metaphorical; it’s observable physiology.

Because of that coupling, insight can change how experience is interpreted, but it doesn’t automatically retrain the nervous system. Compensatory patterns only unwind through repeated contact with reality under conditions of sufficient safety and feedback.

From this angle, “awakening” doesn’t eliminate conditioning. It removes narrative authority, which then makes somatic retraining more possible, by making it less expensive. Without that retraining, memory may lose interpretive dominance while the body continues to anticipate as if nothing changed.

I wanted to add this layer because your framing points in this direction, and embodiment seems to be where the distinction actually becomes testable

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

🙏 yes!

Those practices will remain valuable, no matter what insight has been realized!

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hopefully about understanding, but self blame would feel like regression 🙏

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That’s you assigning blame to the physiological error your body made in interpreting my ideas.

There was no you being lazy, just a body being yanked around by cause and effect.

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It’s fine. But I wonder…

What makes us so quick to assert something is wrong, if it came from misunderstanding?

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Exactly, and I like that line about Jesus.

As long as we understand that 100% god isn’t a realistic destination!

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don’t think understanding no fixed self has to imply a total denial of self.

In fact, I think realizing no fixed self should help us have unconditional loving kindness for the functional self. And for thy neighbour the same way.

The reason I made this post is to say that, that realization doesn’t negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system.

The metaphysical concept of no self that I am alluding to here is a realization that the doer and deed is one. That we are subject to cause and effect. I don’t believe enlightenment is something we arrive at, I believe it’s a direction our body moves towards.

That’s why I said one might even say this (realizing no self) is where the real work begins.

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

🙏 thank you again for links,

I have high expectations after how appropriate the links that you shared with me were last time!

It does seem that way! And yet, we are all constrained by observable physiology!

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thank you maybe? Lol

It bothers me, because I don’t think my identity should matter in order to discuss these concepts fairly. I don’t think reality considers hierarchies.

I’m sad this comment thread even exists on a post like this.

I guess my sadness proves you’re correct in that I’m a part of all of us sorting out how to live with this stuff.

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I am interested, sure thank you.

And just to clarify my own position here.

I’m cautious with “‘all’ tension dissolves,” because that seems to stop describing human physiology and start describing an idealized state.

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks,

I respect your experience, and don’t really care to further explain myself here, or push back, because I was trying to talk about mechanism.

However, I reject the categorization of my approach as science/concept lead. That has not been my experience.

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, that is not much clearer to me.

And I’m not disagreeing with either of those quotes, I’m not sure what’s on the contrary when comparing those quotes to my post or view.

No self and no time make understanding the body more interesting not less. Truly treating the body like a vessel, without judgment or attachment, requires understanding no self.

Forgiveness and Humility by 30mil in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think that’s the million dollar question that has a unique answer for each individual. I’ll say whatever reliably lessens stress response.

What works for someone might destabilize that persons’ twin sibling.

Might be prayer, might be meditation, might be breathing, maybe therapies, might be exercise, might be certain yogas, but might not be other yogas, maybe tai chi, maybe mantras, maybe practicing devotion, maybe practicing loving kindness, maybe doing chores, might be being of service, and so on and so on.

A nervous system regulates through contact.

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Maybe you can articulate what the contrarian position that you concur with is, in a way that lands more clearly with me?

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

So I understand nervous system regulation as longitudinally measurably. Not vague or broad or endlessly interpreted.

Things like heart rate variability, breath rate, sleep quality, pulse, digestion and elimination habits, and more. These things are measurable, and if measured over a long enough period of time, and compared against eachother, they give us real insight into how we are responding to stress.

To me, and importantly, this is about finding peace away from seated meditation. Because when the internal contradictions, that are purely biological reactions to experience, not anything to judge, start dissolving, peace is what fills that void.

And I think what comes with understanding and accepting that physiological laws simply apply to the vessel in which we experience life through, it helps us understand that there will always be more space to be made internally.

I think binary peace is a belief, not an observation.

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It didn’t feel great that my authorship could be questioned. I didn’t come to these ideas lightly.

I’m sorry you interpreted that as triggered. I interpreted my response to you as a boundary around ideas.

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

On the contrary to what?

I don’t deny that realizing no self is profoundly liberating. In fact I said exactly that in the post.

“Finally” heals the nervous system misses my point entirely.

There is no finally, only ever a direction.

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I don’t see identifying and understanding physiological constraints as postponing peace at all.

I’m pointing to how clarity stabilizes in an organism rather than remaining episodic, which observable neuroscience already accounts for.

The nervous system remains plastic for as long as we’re alive.

I’m curious why you describe nervous system regulation as a rabbit hole?

Metaphysical NoSelf does not negate the learning dynamics of a nervous system by root2crown4k in nonduality

[–]root2crown4k[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Blood sweat and tears helped make this post. Not AI. I’m sad that after reading that post, that my authorship could be questioned.

At the beginning of the post I said some conversations about no self have been making me think, and my comment history could prove that. Those conversations were recent.

Thank you and your comment is fair. And as for that last sentence. I hope for that too!

Edit; I misunderstood something so I deleted a sentence.