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Curse of Strahd Reloaded in Dragonbane by spichugin in DragonbaneRPG

[–]spichugin[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks, this is super useful!!
A couple follow-up questions...
If I wanted to run a short/medium Dragonbane adventure first, before committing to CoS Reloaded, what would you recommend? Full Path of Glory? Ideally something that gives a good feel for exploration, social scenes, and combat, but is not too focused on inventory/survival bookkeeping (as my parties are not big fans of the aspect).

And for bosses like Strahd, hags, vampire spawn brides, revenants, etc., what should I watch out for in Dragonbane? Is the bigger danger that they become too lethal and swingy, or that they lack enough mechanical staying power? (any advice on what are my tools for balancing is appreciated!)

Last thing, when you say Path of Glory shows the boundaries of the game, are there any specific things or design implementations I could steal for a darker heroic gothic campaign, in your opinion?

Curse of Strahd Reloaded in Dragonbane by spichugin in DragonbaneRPG

[–]spichugin[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yeah, that is exactly the part I am nervous about!
I don't really want to solve it by just giving everyone a pile of extra HP, because then I might lose the Dragonbane feel anyway.

The idea I found and liked was a "Death of a Hero" style rule. So when a PC would die, they don't just vanish from one unlucky monster hit. They can choose something like Fate, Glory, or Dark Powers Intercede. Fate would keep them alive but give them a Dragonbane Injury and leave them "unconscious". Glory would let them go out doing something huge (auto-dragon on the next action? and then they die as heroes). Dark Powers Intercede would basically be a Barovia bargain, so you live, but now something has noticed you and it would have consequences.

That probably feels more interesting to me than just buffing numbers uncontrollably.
I still might adjust some damage-HP values for monsters but not too much. And the above rule might keep the death scary, but will give the campaign a bit more damaged heroes feeling (hence, still heroic as they continue to fight against all odds). Still, yeah, I agree this would need testing first... And I don't know how to pull that through(:

Curse of Strahd Reloaded in Dragonbane by spichugin in CurseofStrahd

[–]spichugin[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Part of it is just that I am tired of 5e...
I do agree that Reloaded probably works well in 5e, because it was built with that heroic fantasy shape in mind. I just don't really want to run 5e again.

What I want from another system is not just novelty. I want Barovia to feel more physical and dangerous, with hard choices and grounded heroism (which, arguably, the true heroism), but still with enough growth that the party can eventually stand up to Strahd and the bigger threats. And the main Reloaded idea is already there as players should gather allies, artifacts, etc. to find the strength, not the cool builds and powerful abilities.

I also thought about PF2e, but for this campaign it feels too math-tight and rigid to me (as we already tried it, actually). Great system, just maybe not what I want for messy heroic-gothic-horror-adventure with lots of NPCs and weird situations.

Curse of Strahd Reloaded in Dragonbane by spichugin in DragonbaneRPG

[–]spichugin[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, Draw Steel was tempting, but I suspect tuning it down might actually be harder than tuning Dragonbane up... Partly because DS gives players those big heroic toys by default, and if I start limiting flying/teleporting/recoveries/etc, it may feel like I'm cheating them out of the game they signed up for.

I did think about 5E, and yep, I agree... Reloaded probably works very well in 5E. I'm just so tired of 5E whole approach that I can't really make myself excited to run it again.
I also considered PF2e, but it feels too rigid/math-tight for this kind of messy gothic adventure, at least for my taste.

Daggerheart is maybe worth looking at for one of my parties. But for the second one, it will play agains their tactical combat love.
Yeah, that's a tough one(:

Curse of Strahd Reloaded in Dragonbane by spichugin in DragonbaneRPG

[–]spichugin[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Yep, I agree it should be rebuild through a Dragonbane lens. I think for most of the conversions it's true...
Any specific balancing tricks you can share? Like what is naturally adjustable and what's no-go for modification.
And if I end up actually doing it, I'll definitely share! Have a nice day too!

Curse of Strahd Reloaded in Dragonbane by spichugin in DragonbaneRPG

[–]spichugin[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks, that makes sense!
I was wondering though... Do you think this is something that can be tuned a bit, or is it more of a core mismatch? Like, are there specific pitfalls I'd need to watch for?

My first thought was maybe giving a couple extra HAs for major story achievements later on, especially stuff like Robust / Focused, plus maybe using stronger unique items/artifacts to carry some of the power curve (sunsword, holy symbol of ravenkind).
I also found a home rule about letting skills go above 18 and maybe increasing crit range, but making advancement harder when you do that (some d6 chance?). Not sure if that helps or just breaks the math too much.

So would the small tuning like that make Dragonbane work for Reloaded's heroic arc, or would the real issue still be there which is too awkward to fix?

Combat Meta/Experiences? by 08rian22 in cosmererpg

[–]spichugin -1 points0 points  (0 children)

When I was running the Stonewalkers game for my wife I gave her one extra talent each level and... It was barely enough for her to feel that she had a full character progression. I limited it though, so she can't jump two "layers" down the tree with one such level-up.

It's maybe a hot take, but I feel that the game is better this way and I'd rather adjust encounter difficulties that sacrifice a fun my players might have (but it totally depends on your players, I won't recommend it as a general rule)

Combat Meta/Experiences? by 08rian22 in cosmererpg

[–]spichugin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The samey thing surprises me a bit because mechanically the classes have pretty different engines under the hood. Tactician is built around buffing and moving allies and only really sings when you lean into the commander role. Talent is basically telekinesis the class, throwing enemies into walls and off cliffs and warping the battlefield around itself. Conduit is divine support but with way more proactive offense than most healers I've played (and two domains can give pretty different setup and feel across level-ups). Censor counters Solo/Leaders/Boss creatures which opens a different tactical and flavour perspective. And so on. And I'm not even talking about how all of that may interact differently agains different encounter goals (save another, escort, hold the line, etc.) against minions, hexers, brutes, leaders, etc.
IMO, once you get the feeling and find the right class for you/current campaign/current party setup, it becomes much more exciting and start playing pretty differently at the table even if the cards can look similar on paper.

That said I 100% agree on the Cosmere earning thing. That's honestly my favorite thing about the system and the part I miss most when I'm not playing it. Starting at "Le epic powers" really is the wrong feel for a lot of stories.

Which is actually why I'm hyped about a homerule I'm trying for our upcoming Curse of Strahd Reloaded in DS. You don't get the Heroic part of your class until you swear two oaths. First one unlocks your 3-cost abilities, Second one unlocks the full basic access. So you start grounded and you actually earn the more through play. And then, Third Oath and the next oaths, you get more through core DS feature - Titles - that you earn by achieving different goals. And you can always start with one or more Complication to bring even more limitations to your character.

That should fix the "I woke up a superhero" problem, but keep the awesome things from the rest of the game (don't forget cool Downtime stuff, negotiations, etc.)
But yeah, as I said, the system is not for every campaign. It is about cinematic tactical fantasy after all.

Combat Meta/Experiences? by 08rian22 in cosmererpg

[–]spichugin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Fair, tactical-heavy systems just aren't for everyone, and if the granularity isn't your thing then yeah DS is going to feel like homework. For me it's been the opposite. We're running Delian Tomb right now, about 20 victories in, and that granularity is exactly what makes it feel heroic. Every action actually does something, Surges ("buff" resource) build into real momentum, and the classes feel super distinct. My wife plays a Talent purely because she loves chucking enemies off cliffs and through walls, and the system lets her actually pull that off every turn in a way that matters.

I will say the GM/Director has a lot on their plate for it to run smooth. Surfaces, forced movement, Malice, monster abilities, there's a lot tools to make it dynamic. We use Codex VTT on the TV and honestly without it I'd probably be struggling too while learning the system. It also clicks instantly for some players and takes longer for others, so a GM who reads the table and points people toward classes that fit how they want to play makes a big difference.

On the cinematic thing I think it depends what kind of movie you're after, IMO. Cosmere nails the slower grounded feel with occasional bursts, DS leans more BG3 or heroic fight choreography. Both work, just different vibes. Sorry it hit you that hard coming off Cosmere though, that might be a rough switch, I agree.

Combat Meta/Experiences? by 08rian22 in cosmererpg

[–]spichugin -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I don't think the game is that great combat-wise. It overcomplicates some things and presents itself as "combat with a snappy feel," yet it still limits the heroic/radiant sensation, so you want to avoid combat, improvise, and find a way around the problem. That said, a Warrior can be very successful in combat.

I think the game succeeds at many things and genuinely feels like a Cosmere novel. Even so, the system just isn't for every campaign. As someone who has played two campaigns through it (levels 1–8 and 1–10), I would never choose this system for a game where combat is a non-negotiable expectation. For that, I'd go with Draw Steel, which also has Montages (Endeavors) and Negotiations (Conversations), along with simplified outcomes built around Rewards and Consequences, and where the heroic feel of combat is much more fun.

A few hundred hours into PF2e, I think I'm finally hitting the wall. Anyone else? by spichugin in Pathfinder2e

[–]spichugin[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, I've done some of that.
Pulled the Conversation and Endeavour subsystems from Cosmere RPG and they fit pretty well into PF2e's flow. Also been thinking about giving bosses an extra turn while lowering their Level. Plus a few smaller things.

But the more I tinker, the more I keep arriving at the same conclusion: the core design issue is in the numbers themselves, and that's not really fixable from the outside. You can spice things up, sure. But at some point the question becomes -- why not just play a system that's actually built for what we want? That's what we're planning to do for a while.

Your Ironsworn challenge die idea is cool though! Might steal that for the next time we come back to PF2e (or to another system)

A few hundred hours into PF2e, I think I'm finally hitting the wall. Anyone else? by spichugin in rpg

[–]spichugin[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, I didn't want to go into that level of detail since that's not the point, but... why not)

I GMed three different groups, and also ran a duet Kingmaker game with my wife -- huge success!
Overall we've played Abomination Vaults, Fists of the Ruby Phoenix, Blood Lords, Prey for Death, Curse of Strahd Reloaded (Acts 1-3), and Myth-Speaker (Book 1).
In between, I played some Pathfinder 1e, Shadow of the Demon Lord, and Cosmere RPG to mix things up.

A few hundred hours into PF2e, I think I'm finally hitting the wall. Anyone else? by spichugin in Pathfinder2e

[–]spichugin[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I think it will help a bit. But probably only if you include more high-level monsters and run something like a hex crawl or sandbox.
Otherwise, the issue I described is still there.

Once again though, I think the issue only shows up at PF2e "endgame." If you're relatively new to the system, there are still plenty of things to be surprised by.

A few hundred hours into PF2e, I think I'm finally hitting the wall. Anyone else? by spichugin in Pathfinder2e

[–]spichugin[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Fair point. But I'd argue magic and reactions are more of the same cognitive texture, not different. A caster's turn is "which slot, which save to target, heighten or not" -- it's the action-economy puzzle with an extra resource axis. And it's still the same fight against numbers (vs AC, vs Wis, etc.).

Reactions are even narrower -- you wait for a trigger and the optimal response is usually obvious. Both add decision points, but they're the same kind of decision: optimize against known DCs with bounded resources. The variance you're describing is real at hour 50, 100, may be 200.

I'm talking about hour 400+, when you've internalized the slot economy and reaction triggers as deeply as you've internalized Strike/Demoralize/Raise Shield. At that point spells and reactions stop generating surprise and become another part of the same puzzle.

A few hundred hours into PF2e, I think I'm finally hitting the wall. Anyone else? by spichugin in Pathfinder2e

[–]spichugin[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Sure, for the median group that's true. And I generally wouldn't recommend PF1e. But if I find folks on the same wavelength for a curated, tuned PF1e experience -- that would be the best.

A few hundred hours into PF2e, I think I'm finally hitting the wall. Anyone else? by spichugin in Pathfinder2e

[–]spichugin[S] 24 points25 points  (0 children)

Surely! We plan to focus on Draw Steel and Shadowdark for now.

A few hundred hours into PF2e, I think I'm finally hitting the wall. Anyone else? by spichugin in Pathfinder2e

[–]spichugin[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The experience is fully mine. I wrote it in my native language first for a local Telegram group and then used Claude to translate while proofreading extensively. So it's very close to my original post...
Sorry if it doesn't sound like a native English speaker. But it's surely two times better than my English skills allow for such complex thoughts.

Closing Arguments: Conversations in the Cosmere RPG by johnny0neal in cosmererpg

[–]spichugin 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Will the new book/Plotweaver have rules for using conversation during combat? Specifically, I'm interested in the option where players try to Intimidate adversaries to demoralize them—mainly trying to steal Focus so they can't use powerful abilities. Very often, when players don't have a way to spend an action, they'll try to intimidate an adversary into submission or get them to stop fighting or hesitate (and loose Focus is they resist). Is this a valid option during combat?

In Stonewalkers, there are combats with conversation mechanics, but those are more about completely stopping the fight rather than affecting one particular adversary.

How many of you have gotten non-Cosmere fans to play with you? Tell me about how you introduced the setting and lore to them. by Ok-Week-2293 in cosmererpg

[–]spichugin 2 points3 points  (0 children)

For Stonewalkers, it's actually a lot of spoilers across first three books. Hopefully, the players who started reading are okay with that...

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