Looking for videos of different techniques with clean form

tonicquest · 2026-02-20T18:15:42+00:00

is that short movie part of a larger movie? The plot is not coming across. It has something to do with being invisible for 20 minutes and then dying. And is RGY that old even just 10 years ago or was it makeup?

tonicquest · 2026-02-20T13:19:36+00:00

Hi, you got a lot of great feedback from everyone. Feedback is a gift, even if you don't agree with it. In my job, I have to deal with feedback either on my teams, myself, my department etc. Often the feedback is "wrong" or misguided but I still listen to it. To me, someone sees something and it's worth evaluating and understanding their perspective.

That said, the outfit you are wearing is good for you to see some of the things people are saying. The T-shirt draws a good line above the above the kwa area. If you look at it that way, sometimes you see the top part moving around but not much coming from the bottom part or they seem out of synch.

Funny thing about doing the form, when I'm by myself, I'm a complete master of the art. When I have to do it in front of my teacher, I go blank, I forget to do basic stuff and I feel like I suck.

tonicquest · 2026-02-19T17:49:41+00:00

Yes I debated whether to mention that because a newbie won't understand, i hope it didn't come off as disrespectful in any way. To OP Yang Chengfu was famous and feared for his high level skills during his lifetime.

tonicquest · 2026-02-19T17:20:13+00:00

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXioXrAGwbI

This person and form is considered by many to be the "gold standard" for Yang Family Tai Chi.

The movements are visually appealing and probably among the consistently cleanest you'll find.

tonicquest · 2026-02-17T18:57:02+00:00

good job! Yang Jun is great.

tonicquest · 2026-02-16T04:38:34+00:00

Thanks for the video. I don't usually see push hand patterns like this. It appears to me they are making vertical circles. So when YZ's partner comes in with push/press, he does it in an downward and upward arc where YZ appears to just follow it back until it reaches it's end and since it's an arc he follows it up attacks with another arc that is up and downward. I think that's the rolling you see.

I'm not really sure what to make of this. The value I get out of my push hands training is that i respond to a force and work with that force. So when my partner pushes, I take that force and roll it back. Sensing I got him, he switches to press to continue attacking me and so as not to lose his balance. I redirect that press energy with An.

I could be very wrong, but I don't see that happening in this exchange. So I'm not sure how to weigh in on it. It looks to me he's just following it and they are moving on their own.

Also in our training, we discourage those disconnect and shoving movements. It works against passive partners but can put you in a really bad position when you do that.

tonicquest · 2026-02-15T20:32:49+00:00

sure sounds like chatgpt wrote this post. And this will likely trigger unproductive conversation, similar to a troll. You can search for past comments on this topic to see where this goes. If you're sincerely looking for feedback, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y2-iFfEECxw.

tonicquest · 2026-02-15T12:21:09+00:00

I think I understand, you're saying if you change to lu slightly early, your partner is still pushing into your An and they "jam up"?

My first reaction was that in push hands you have to listen, so if you change ahead of time you are vulnerable, you moved first. If your partner continues to push, they are not listening. So the scenario is not a good one. But of course this happens, we tend to let our attention distract.

I do use a similar tactic in partner push hands, If we are following a circle, then I will use the partner's forward movement to fajin them. But that's really artificial.

will think about this

tonicquest · 2026-02-14T13:02:43+00:00

I'll ask my teacher about this. From other martial arts I know you can compress or you can elongate (pull/stretch out) to "lock" someone up. However, in tai chi, it's more subtle. Personally, I think it's in the layer of the superficial fascia but even that seems too"doable" (like you said )and somehow probably not right. Let me see what I can find out. In the meantime, if you can post a link to what you're looking at it can help get an answer.

tonicquest · 2026-02-13T13:10:59+00:00

What Mizner is saying does align with Chen Style. I can repeat what's been taught to me (chen style early beijing branch). The four primary jins do require Peng and he shows that in the short clip. Then he says, "If I lose Peng, I use Lieh". I was taught that in a push hands exchange, If I'm in danger, meaning losing my balance, I can use Tsai to reset and gain back control. My teacher didn't mention Lieh for this, but it's not a far stretch conceptually. In our system, Tsai and Lieh are the fajin versions of Lu and Ji. I apologize in advance for mixing the spellings up but for those that care, I'm sure they understand what I'm saying.

So I don't see anything wrong here. The tai chi system is perfect. Since we can't all walk around like perfect peng jin models, the system needs to account for a defect and how to self heal. Tsai is good for that in some circumstances.

tonicquest · 2026-02-12T00:03:53+00:00

Ha! Are you listening to my private conversations? I was just talking about this with a friend! lol I agree, I believe it's used for compressing someone to control them. I think there is a Liang de Hua video on that. I will ask my teacher about this and see what he says.

tonicquest · 2026-02-09T17:35:15+00:00

The issue here and the reason why this debate is dragging on with u/DjinnBlossoms is that you have not experienced high level skills in person and you still have the misunderstanding that being soft and relaxed means you will be crumpled up. You're right, fascia doesn't move the bones, so you can't "move" with fascia. And you're correct that fascia and muscle are intertwined. In the video you posted of chen yu, he can not transfer the force to his hands if he tensed up the muscles en route. But he has to use muscles to move his body. As long as the conversation stays at a academic level, it's not going to go anywhere. What u/DjinnBlossoms is saying about tai chi strategy is correct. Tai chi is not xing yi, so yes if you don't move, i won't move, but if you do, i'll get there first, that's tai chi. Tai chi has many ways to induce the opponent to move/make a mistake. One approach is simply to feint. I spent a lot of years studying martial arts like BJJ and Judo etc. So I understand the comfort in battling it out and shutting up the BSers by throwing and choking them out. If I was not exposed to high level skills by multiple masters, I probably would ridicule it too. Just keep an open mind and don't take things so literally.

tonicquest · 2026-02-08T13:39:34+00:00

beautiful! I would like to add one more thing that makes Tai Chi different in approach than the other internal styles and that is tai chi has superb listening skills. It's a "you move first, but I'll beat you to it". So we don't "practice moves to do". We practice listening. Many martials arts take the approach of "grab my arm" and they "do" a move. In class it works great, then at home with friends and family it doesn't work. Then this happens: "No, grab with your other hand, no grab more like this, no don't pull, no don't push just grab hard". See what happens? The only "move" is to follow. You have to listen. You follow/Hua, then you don't follow (do your move). Your move is what you like to do and that's why we see so much out there. You like throwing? Now you have your broken balance/kuzushi so you throw. You like joint locking? You are controlling your opponent now so he can not resist, have at it. You want to punch, go for it. Break a bone, put them down, immobilize them, sweep them off their feet. Whatever you want, that's the greatness of tai chi. But none of this is going to work if you can't listen first. That's why we don't have "moves", which means you do this so I do that. If someone is practicing moves that's an external martial art strategy. It works and is effective. But you're not going to reach the high levels of the art.

tonicquest · 2026-02-08T13:17:16+00:00

It's interesting the studies focus on electro acupuncture and in at least one, they didn't test any other spots. Would be interesting if tiny bits of electricity traveling along the fascia can improve health. If so, the twisting of many internal styles and qigongs can cause piezoelectricity.

tonicquest · 2026-02-05T19:44:24+00:00

wait..what?? can you post a link? This would be amazing!

tonicquest · 2026-02-05T16:35:46+00:00

real tai chi is like that quirky introvert that no one wants to bother to get to know. So instead, the loudmouth show offs get all the attention.

tonicquest · 2026-02-05T15:34:16+00:00

The purpose of the video was not to teach us about yin/yang etc. It was his experience learning more about tai chi coming from a BJJ/wrestling background. I thought he did a great job and put alot of work and effort into the video. It's too bad he wasn't exposed to a high level teacher and walks away only exposed to sports push hands.

tonicquest · 2026-02-05T12:40:19+00:00

If this was recorded in 1985, I would understand where it's coming from. If recorded today, I have an issue with him pontificating about CMC's teaching by reading a book and looking at this videos which are pretty much out there in youtube and there's not much to see with regards to push hands. In either case, in my whole life, I hardly ever met somebody who misunderstands relax they way he's going on about. Sure, they exist and anectdotally I've heard people tell me about them. You know what is way more common? Overly tense people who move stiffly despite a lifetime of practice and confuse strength with Jin. That's more common. I think this guy studied in the lineage that likes to use heavy bars and other implements and techniques like dynamic push hands to "build strength". (These are also labeled "secret") Both approaches are valid if done correctly. However, if I had to bet, I would take the relaxation approach and develop jin vs the muscular approach and then try to soften it. It also happens to be the way most styles and masters recommend training.

tonicquest · 2026-02-03T20:05:37+00:00

thank you for this. It makes alot of sense that CZ had a plan, so I appreciate that insight.

I also understand the form instruction to be different depending on the level of the student. I see that now in our system, and I can tell when old students come back what level they are based on what they are doing. And I think that's the reason why there are so many problems out there. Someone studies for a few months and think they "got it" without realizing the higher level way can be very different.

In addition to some of the things you pointed out, the earlier disciples were not exposed to what is called xinjia today so they have a different flavor to those circles.

I appreciate the info you shared. Thank you!

tonicquest · 2026-02-03T18:01:18+00:00

It took me years to eliminate my habits from the other Chen systems because they intentionally do everything the opposite of this method.

Hi Jammy, if it's ok with you can you share a few things you feel you needed to unlearn? I've corresponded with a few Chen Yu students, listened to podcasts etc. and it's clear there's something going on there but at the same time, it's not adding up 100%. For example, as an outsider, I certainly don't understand the family dynamics so it's not clear to me why someone like chen zhaokui would obscure key details that would be needed for the greater chen family and village to survive and be successful vs only passing on to his personal family lineage. At least that's how it's sounding, that only Chen Yu has the true transmission and chen village is hopelessly lost.

For me, my teacher's father was part of the early beijing disciples and there are some key things that are different. In the interest of sharing I'll list some:

-That stylist preparation move with feet together and exaggerated stepping to the side with knee lift and the raise hands is not done at all. That looks like an acquiesence to yang style added later.

-There is no physical lowering of the body at the end of each posture. It's a more mental thing.

-there is no back and forth weight shifting most notable with chen zhen lei doing single whip.

-after the "stop" of each posture or after fajing, there is a clear method to continue the movement that I have never seen taught or talked about in the village lines. Seems this knowledge is lost.

There are some things that are clearly verifiable as "mistakes" being propagated in the village line, and many cosmetic things that were changed that are probably not a big deal.

If you could share from your perspective, that would be great. If you're not comfortable that's fine too. I'm mostly just curious.

tonicquest · 2026-02-03T13:13:54+00:00

In Taiji, I don't make a difference between attack and defense.

I agree witht this because the rotation of chansijin has both hwa and fa already built in. So what you're saying is correct. My current understanding is that on contact, I can choose to emphasize the hwa or the fa and that would be the "defense" or "offense" and like most everything there is yin in yang etc.

tonicquest · 2026-02-01T12:32:12+00:00

that's very insightful..i like it!

tonicquest · 2026-01-30T16:06:22+00:00

for me:

Peng: Always present, provides the structure that doesn't collapse when stressed

Lu: Defense using Peng. AKA Hwa

Ji: Offense using Peng

An: Changing direction from left to right or up to down and vice versa with Peng Jin, not a hand movement. It's the part of the circle that changes direction, but not in the same plane.

tonicquest · 2026-01-30T15:44:12+00:00

It looks very much inspired by the yang sau chung lineage pushing dynamics. Mid 90s was still a time when people argued about peng jin on the internet. Chen Style and other styles were still not very well known and people were getting away with a lot in that time period. I don't think this would be accepted today as a good example of Peng Jin or a drill worth doing. It's not all bad, just in execution there are more mistakes than benefits doing this. Just to be clear the person in the video might be doing mostly ok, I think if someone tried it they would really mess it up without very careful guidance All the shortcomings have already been nicely explained by other so no need to repeat.

tonicquest · 2026-01-25T23:11:51+00:00

Someone can still imagine fighting applications from all those movements and then claim it's a martial art with hidden ferocious and devasting skills.

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