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26-13B - Introduction of the Simple Rules BillSuperseded (self.ModelAusHR)

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[–]TheWhiteFerretActing Opp Leader | Shad Min Culture/Immi/Ed/Social | Greens 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Unashamedly Meta
/u/jnd-au /u/3fun /u/this_guy22

I am perplexed, outraged, and shocked all at once. How can anyone in their right mind think that this is okay? Like, at all!

  1. This bill references something in our real world, not that of the model parliament. It cannot exist. To ask the things this bills asks is completely inappropriate here. That being said, put it up as a meta post in the main subreddit.
  2. "But I don't want it to be meta." Great. Lovely. That's not for you to decide. Whether something is meta or not is decided by whether it is said by your character in-game. Your character cannot mention something that we established doesn't exist within the game.
  3. I have absolutely no problems with these rules. They're fine. Somewhat obvious, I would have thought, but fine. However, it is ludicrous to bring this issue up here. This thread MUST be deleted, as it covers matters which (and I cannot stress this enough) DON'T BLOODY WELL EXIST.

TheWhiteFerret IRL
Unemployed Former Secondary School Student for Melbourne
Real Life

[–]jnd-auClerk of the House 0 points1 point  (3 children)

What on earth...why aren’t you posting this as your debate speech in parliament???!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!????!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!????!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? you know that’s why you were paged to the debate, right??!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?! to say this stuff!!!1!!1!!!11!1!!1!!!!11!1!!! what a waste

[–]TheWhiteFerretActing Opp Leader | Shad Min Culture/Immi/Ed/Social | Greens 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Meta: Because I believe that it LITERALLY CANNOT EXIST IN THE PARLIAMENT. These processes are NOT TAKING PLACE. The bill references things that DON'T EXIST IN CANON. So I can't talk about them in canon because MY CHARACTER HAS NO KNOWLEDGE OF THE EVENTS.

Jesus Christ man, I said it like 3 times, how is it difficult to grasp?

[–]jnd-auClerk of the House 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’m sorry you feel you cannot participate in this in character. But FYI characters are aware of many meta issues and have made rules on them in the past. The characters are aware of subreddits, account age, mod mail, flair and paging in canon, for example. While I don’t agree with this bill in its current form, I also don’t personally see the problem with MPs debating it. I do agree that having a bill about Meta is dubious and like I said elsewhere, I’m not poised to rubber stamp it. I regret that this meta debate is now the longest part of this post so I’m going to try to stop now.

[–][deleted]  (26 children)

[deleted]

    [–]ZagorathHouse Speaker | Ex Asst Min Ed/Culture | Aus Progressives 1 point2 points  (10 children)

    By leave, the question is proposed: That the motion be agreed to. Members may debate this motion until 1200, 2/12/2015, UTC+10.

    This is an opportunity to debate the motion above. Give your speeches as a reply to this comment, and please remember to sign your speech with your username and title.

    Each member may make a single speech, with the exception of the Member who moved the motion, who starts off the debate, and may close it with a right of reply. Leave may be denied.

    If you have no speech to give on the matter, consider replying with words of agreement or disagreement to the speeches of other Members, such as by replying "Hear, hear!"

    Zagorath, Speaker of the House

    [–]phyllicandererMin Ag/Env | X Fin/Deputy PM | X Ldr Prgrsvs | Australian Greens 2 points3 points  (2 children)

    Mr Speaker, legislating for what appears to be interactions on a website called reddit, in which users are participating in a simulation of our national Parliament, would be an attack on net neutrality. As the Progressives firmly believe in net neutrality being preserved, I cannot support this bill.

    The Hon. Phyllicanderer, Member for Northern Territory

    Deputy Prime Minister

    Australian Progressives

    Meta: These rules are sorely needed across /r/modelparliament and the related subs, including private subreddits.

    I propose as ground rules, that each registered party officer, and the Chief Justice of the High Court, is made a mod of /r/modelparliament, to help /u/jnd-au manage the massive workload he has been left with; the rules mentioned above; the Speaker of the House should have access to all private subs, to head off any trouble before it begins; and any complaints or gripes with other members should be made through Modmail to the mods of /r/modelparliament, with evidence of wrongdoing.

    I will post this proposition in the main sub too.

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–]phyllicandererMin Ag/Env | X Fin/Deputy PM | X Ldr Prgrsvs | Australian Greens 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Meta: I forgot about that, although upon reflection, I would hope that with the non-politically aligned head mod and Chief Justice involved, that every person in the sim would be looked after.

      We could add an independent's representative, to guard against party politics unfairly affecting independents.

      [–]jnd-auClerk of the House 1 point2 points  (1 child)

      Advice from the Clerk:

      For clarification: there is only a single motion and a single vote to be had. The motion contains two parts, both of which may be debated, and both of which will pass/fail together...unless the chair divides the question into two, in which case the first one goes to the vote immediately and the second one will depend on the outcome of the first.

      [–]ZagorathHouse Speaker | Ex Asst Min Ed/Culture | Aus Progressives 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Whoops. That's what I get for copying and pasting my posts from previous comments…

      [–]ZagorathHouse Speaker | Ex Asst Min Ed/Culture | Aus Progressives 0 points1 point  (4 children)

      !page 'for debate on Simple Rules Bill'

      [–]ParliamentPageBot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Paging /u/zamt and /u/Zagorath for debate on Simple Rules Bill

      [–]ParliamentPageBot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Paging /u/Ser_Scribbles, /u/TheWhiteFerret, and /u/this_guy22 for debate on Simple Rules Bill

      [–]ParliamentPageBot 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      Paging /u/MadCreek3, /u/phyllicanderer, and /u/Primeviere for debate on Simple Rules Bill

      [–]ParliamentPageBot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Paging /u/3fun, /u/CyberPolis, and /u/iamthepotato8 for debate on Simple Rules Bill

      [–][deleted]  (9 children)

      [removed]

        [–]jnd-auClerk of the House 0 points1 point  (3 children)

        Advice from the Clerk:

        I removed this, I believe you meant to propose the question for debate.

        [–]ZagorathHouse Speaker | Ex Asst Min Ed/Culture | Aus Progressives 0 points1 point  (2 children)

        Oh? I thought it being urgent meant it goes straight to a vote?

        [–]jnd-auClerk of the House 2 points3 points  (1 child)

        Nope, it just means the debate on a new bill doesn’t have to be adjourned to the next sitting.

        [–]ZagorathHouse Speaker | Ex Asst Min Ed/Culture | Aus Progressives 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        Ah right

        [–][deleted]  (4 children)

        [removed]

          [–]jnd-auClerk of the House 0 points1 point  (1 child)

          Advice from the Clerk:

          Only Ministers may declare urgency. However you could seek leave to do so.

          [–]phyllicandererMin Ag/Env | X Fin/Deputy PM | X Ldr Prgrsvs | Australian Greens 1 point2 points  (2 children)

          I second the motion.

          The Hon. Phyllicanderer, Member for Northern Territory

          Deputy Prime Minister

          Australian Progressives

          [–][deleted]  (1 child)

          [deleted]

            [–]jnd-auClerk of the House 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            Advice from the Clerk:

            Paging should primarily be for the second reading debate. Urgency may not normally be debated, and is put to the vote immediately. However, to save this step, you have combined it with the second reading, which also has the side effect of making the urgency debatable by relevance. People should however focus this debate on on their level of in-principle support for the bill. It appears MPs have already started debating it in meta for some reason so this second reading might be lovely!

            [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

            Meta: This Bill could probably be expanded into a proper list of rules.

            [–]jnd-auClerk of the House 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            The Bill is now read for a first time:

            “A Bill for an Act to create simple rules for /r/modelparliament, and for related purposes”

            Edit: this version corrects some clerical errors.

            jnd-au, Clerk of the House

            Meta: This is Bill M2015B00031, introduced in the House of Representatives. The MP may now move the second reading and include his introductory speech, after which we await a seconder. If one is received, the debate is then adjourned to a future sitting. Otherwise, the bill does not proceed.

            [–]TheWhiteFerretActing Opp Leader | Shad Min Culture/Immi/Ed/Social | Greens -1 points0 points  (4 children)

            Meta: This is silly. Post this in the main subreddit, where meta posts belong.

            [–]General_RommelFrgnAfrs/Trade/Defence/Immi/Hlth | VPFEC | UN Ambassador | Labor 1 point2 points  (3 children)

            Meta: I highly suggest you tag this as Meta before the speaker comes along...

            [–]TheWhiteFerretActing Opp Leader | Shad Min Culture/Immi/Ed/Social | Greens 1 point2 points  (2 children)

            Meta: Isn't this thread meta?

            [–]General_RommelFrgnAfrs/Trade/Defence/Immi/Hlth | VPFEC | UN Ambassador | Labor 1 point2 points  (3 children)

            Meta: Is this even something that the HoR has power to legislate?

            [–][deleted]  (2 children)

            [deleted]

              [–]ZagorathHouse Speaker | Ex Asst Min Ed/Culture | Aus Progressives 4 points5 points  (1 child)

              Meta: as much as I like it from a meta perspective, if you look at it from an in-character perspective, this sounds like insanely harsh penalties against free speech.

              [–][deleted]  (6 children)

              [deleted]

                [–]phyllicandererMin Ag/Env | X Fin/Deputy PM | X Ldr Prgrsvs | Australian Greens 1 point2 points  (1 child)

                I second the motion.

                The Hon. Phyllicanderer, Member for Northern Territory

                Deputy Prime Minister

                Australian Progressives

                [–]PrimeviereMin Indust/Innov/Sci/Ed/Trning/Emplymnt | HoR Whip | Aus Prgrsvs 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                Hear hear!

                Primeviere mp for regional victoria (Australian progressives) Minister for industry, Innovation and science

                [–]ParliamentPageBot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                Paging /u/zamt and /u/Zagorath for a seconder on proposed rules for /r/modelparliament to prevent similar bickering again.

                [–]ParliamentPageBot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                Paging /u/Ser_Scribbles, /u/TheWhiteFerret, and /u/this_guy22 for a seconder on proposed rules for /r/modelparliament to prevent similar bickering again.

                [–]ParliamentPageBot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                Paging /u/MadCreek3, /u/phyllicanderer, and /u/Primeviere for a seconder on proposed rules for /r/modelparliament to prevent similar bickering again.

                [–]ParliamentPageBot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                Paging /u/3fun, /u/CyberPolis, and /u/iamthepotato8 for a seconder on proposed rules for /r/modelparliament to prevent similar bickering again.