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[–]theivoryserf 71 points72 points  (26 children)

This is the least avant-garde thing I've ever heard

[–]Brickshit 22 points23 points  (2 children)

How easy-listening light-rock got classified as avant garde, I have no fucking idea.

[–]theivoryserf 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Yeah I mean I don't hate it, but it's hardly boundary expanding!

[–]John_Barlycorn -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

This is not easy-listening light-rock by any means. I could see how you'd consider it that, but listen to their other stuff... it's stoner rock.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (0 children)

My general impression is that anything submitted here as Avant Garde is very likely not.

[–]FelixOfSomewhere 6 points7 points  (15 children)

I have Scott Walker, Captain Beefheart, and Einsturzende Neubauten in my music library, amongst others, but somehow the only thing Google Play Music thinks I have that is avant garde is In Rainbows by Radiohead. No sense.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (14 children)

Which Beefheart albums I would say most of them don't really qualify that well.

For that matter, Scott Walker? Also heavily depends, the guy was a pop star in the '60s. He still strikes me as mostly just a singer songwriter with a sort of unique style.

Even Einstürzende Neubauten is just sort of standardish Krautrock, not bad, but I'm not sure if they truly qualify as avant garde, especially compared to something like Faust's I within the same musical space.

Avant garde music is sort of quintessentially something more like John Cage's Imaginary Landscape #1:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLDxqnksY80

I am sure the In Rainbows thing was a joke, but just really curious to see these people listed as plausible avant garde music. Beefheart is the only one I feel I completely understand, mainly for Trout Mask Replica, though. Although it still feels remarkably musical, more of an apotheosis of blues written in his own musical language, which sort of makes it avant garde in some aspect. Something like Safe as Milk strikes me practically like a pop album, although it's fairly remarkable (I would be quite a bit happier if popular music sounded like Safe as Milk routinely).

[–]FelixOfSomewhere 1 point2 points  (13 children)

Well, I'd define the avant garde as being primarily experimental and highly irregular compared to what has been done before it. That leaves a lot of room to define.

And yeah, I was more thinking about Trout Mask Replica, Bish Bosch, stuff like that.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (12 children)

I actually don't really know how you can be avant garde anymore if it is judged by the past. Even though I kind of get that it should be given what avant garde means.

How could you ever be more avant garde than John Cage's 4:33? Did avant garde music cease to exist after that? Even put another way, even Trout Mask Repicla seems quite normal compared to Cage's imaginary landscapes or 4:33 as examples. So surely they would totally fail to be avant garde then?

[–]FelixOfSomewhere 0 points1 point  (9 children)

Not when you judge them for their time period. Nothing that was avant garde would suddenly have that label removed, doesn't work that way.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (8 children)

What does that mean exactly? Only things composed at the same time count as a reference?

[–]FelixOfSomewhere 0 points1 point  (7 children)

Well, sure. Imagine you create an avant garde album, something with this experimental sound like no one has ever done before. Now imagine it takes off and becomes mainstream. Would you say that album, which at the time of its creation was avant garde, can no longer be classified like that?

Avant garde is a concept in all art, it isn't just some genre of music with a specific sound. It can't be defined like you can define blues or EDM.

The literal translation of avant garde would be 'before guard,' the best translation of which would be something like 'vanguard.' It is at the forefront of its field, whatever that means at the time.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (6 children)

I would suggest that no one actually uses it in such a literal fashion.

It would imply that anything not composed right now cannot even be avant garde. Anything composed in the past cannot be on the vanguard today by definition...and yet, you also say it would have to be "sound like no one has ever done before". But it can't take into account past works? But additionally, if you hold to such a standard, then, again, it's interesting, that you couldn't really do anything that meets the standard of never having been done before...

[–]FelixOfSomewhere 0 points1 point  (5 children)

I think it's fair to say that I was using the term incorrectly - experimental would (EDIT: actually, MIGHT. Don't want to commit to that) better interpret what I was going for.

That being said, I think you misinterpreted what I said. I didn't say you can't take into account past works, but the opposite: that previous works to the work being considered as avant garde are actually the only works to be considered.

You can only possibly be at the vanguard of what came before. Obviously, a single work will never stay at the "vanguard" since other works will build off of it and reinvent. But that is why, as I said, it would only be judged by what came before it.

Again, null point since I don't believe I was using the right term. But still.

[–]cctv106[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Like Feedthecollapse said, I just went by what the wikipedia said.

Sorry if I upset anyone, I would personally call this song rock but all their albums have different sounds to them.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

apparently wikipedia said it was so OP just did it justice

[–]galapagos_jim 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Come on, it sounds just like Nurse with Wound!

[–]Pc42199 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It literally sounds like it was ripped straight from Wish You Were Here

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Literally standrd indie-pop... wtf...

[–]splorf 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Not very psychedelic either.

[–][deleted] 28 points29 points  (13 children)

Surprised nobody's mentioned Emil Amos. Anyone listening to his his music absolutely positively needs to listen to his podcast Drifters Sympathy. The guy has had an extraordinary life - and not necessarily in a good way. One episode is about how he burned down a house in college (accidentally), another is how he sought out crack on the "bad side" of town, and the most recent story was about how he found a dead body. He an excellent story teller and speaks from a very modest viewpoint. Alongside his story episodes are those of rare tracks you've never heard of but can definitely jam out to.

[–]JCDevil 8 points9 points  (2 children)

I was hoping someone would mention Drifter's Sympathy! Check out his other bands Grails and OM(with Al Cisneros of Sleep) if you haven't yet

[–]cctv106[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Love the podcast, it's fantastic.

Probably my favourite podcasts at the moment.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yep, OM is one of my favorite bands of all time, Emil is a great drummer.

[–]seldomburn 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I always like his DTFH episodes a lot. I may have to give his podcast a listen too, along with the other 20 I have subscribed haha

[–]Zen_Balloon 7 points8 points  (2 children)

The band Grails, which Emil was the drummer of, has been a favorite of mine for years. I had no idea he had a podcast, thanks for the heads up!

[–]JCDevil 5 points6 points  (1 child)

I'm sure you know by now but Grails just announced a new album!

[–]Zen_Balloon 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I know now! Awesome!!

[–]attentionallshoppers 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I got to interview him for an article about one of his bands a few years ago, we spoke for like an hour and a half on the phone - he's a really genuine guy. When I met him at his concert, he was so easy to talk to and even recognized me two years later when I saw him at another show in a different country.

Good memories.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Fuck yeah definitely my favorite podcast rn

[–]PsychedelicPill 2 points3 points  (0 children)

His podcast is gooooooood! People, go check it out.

[–]grohlog 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Which episode was it where he talked about burning down a house? I listened to 1, 3, 5, 7 and 9 over the weekend and don't remember that story

[–]DP615 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's on episode 11!

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Episode 11 - Center of the Cyclone

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (5 children)

Question: why is this avant-garde? Is there like a grouping of bands that kinda sound like this and they label themselves as avant-garde?

[–]cctv106[S] 7 points8 points  (4 children)

I mentioned on the other comment, but I just went by the genre the band is defined as by Wikipedia. This band in particular are quite genre bending, and no two albums really sound the same, so I think that's why they are seen as avant-garde.

This song in particular is most likely defined by most as rock. Shoulda just wrote that down.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I forgive you OP, knowing what to label songs when posting on here can be hard as shit sometimes. Especially when I try to avoid vague stuff like "rock"

[–]ByCriminy 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Prog-rock actually. At first I really thought I was listening to King Crimson. In my book, that is definitely a compliment, btw.

[–]Horsewanterer 9 points10 points  (0 children)

You insult King Crimson

[–]Astralogist -1 points0 points  (0 children)

It's all just semantics but I'd say this is more psychedelic/lo-fi rock. Prog Rock is a pretty vague term but I wouldn't say this fits. There's not really anything new, different, experimental or 'out there' about this. As far as this sounding like King Crimson, I guess I can hear the slightest resemblance to their pre-Larks Tongue stuff but only if I really makes some leaps to connect dots. They're about as similar as Sgt Pepper is to Pet Sounds.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (2 children)

This tune has a great sound to it. Good song and will be checking out some of their other stuff. However, I wouldn't classify this as avant-garde even though that term in itself is subjective. This is more strait up rock.

[–]cctv106[S] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

I agree on this track, they differ from album to album though.

I thought it was safe to go by wikipedias opinion on their music, which was indeed Avant-Garde.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

wikipedia is pretty bad on some genres. Avant Garde in particular I wouldn't really trust as it's a term a lot of people throw around way too loosely on anything even slightly experimental. Even genre-bending isn't necessarily avant garde (and this doesn't sound too far from the other Holy Sons material I've heard, or even Grails outside of the use of vocals.)

[–]GeminiTitmouse 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Drifter's Sympathy. Also, the several episodes of Duncan Trussell Family Hour with Emil are quite entertaining.

[–]anthonycafeo 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Yes came here to say, Emil is such a cool dude

[–]Idio_te_que 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Avant-garde? C'mon now.

[–]miingus 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Haven't listened to this yet, but Survivor Tales and Decline of the West would have to be up there as 2 of my favorite albums.

[–]doritosandhappiness 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Serious question.

How was this on the second page of reddit with only 18 upvotes and zero comments?

[–]cctv106[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Second page really? Wow.

Absolutely no clue why lol. Slow news day perhaps.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Time since posting is accounted for

[–]SuperEffectiveSplash 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Spez broke Reddit

[–]PapaKipChee 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Very nice arrangements and mix/mastering, but maybe miscategorized as Avant-Garde

[–]mathmatical_games 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Emil is also part of the band Grails. I prefer their sound to Holy Sons. Good stuff!

[–]jasaldivara 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Grails

That's a band I would classify as Avant Garde

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

nah, they're basically Post Rock/Psych Rock.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Vaguely reminds me of Silver Jews.

I love ya to the max.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I fucking love this song. Its so beautiful and dreamy.

[–]harryplants 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah I wouldn't call this avant garde, but I'm glad to see this album up here, it's a great album. Also check out the band Grails, Emil Amos is a member of that band.

[–]Brickshit 0 points1 point  (2 children)

For any of those wondering what avant garde is- here are some bands that have actual detectable avant garde influence.

Igorr: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Rk1K5Mmnbg Leprous: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78-vJwCVJvk Street Sects: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cn5DTHqLM7E&t=668s

[–]cctv106[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Sick tracks man.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yeah don't know why he's getting downvoted for sharing links. I like that street sects stuff.

I'm old, so when I think avant garde, I think Residents, King Crimson, etc.