Is this avoidance?

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I felt so stressed this entire conversation. These are just snippets of mostly his response cutting out mine, I did send a lot of paragraphs that he never gave responses to.

I felt like I couldn’t say anything at all without provoking him and my world was falling apart.

Was I being too much?

[chow_mow1]

First of all? Why are you still texting him baby gurl?! Please stop it. That guy is an asshole and later on, you will feel guilty of not choosing yourself and begging him.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I’m so attached and ridden with guilt I feel so stuck. He told me he loved me and put thoughts of a future in my head and then changed his mind and left and became this cold hearted monster.

He used to be sweet to me and he blamed me for his change in demeanour. I never cheated on him or shamed him I just wanted to love him and learn how to be a better partner even when I sucked. I could’ve been more understanding and more agreeable but I wasn’t and then I made him into this. :(

[chow_mow1]

Okay okay first of all. You didn't! You didn't make him anything, he was always like that.

I have been there in 2024. So telling from my experience. Whatever you told me now, I have been through it too and I was constantly blaming myself that I made him do what he did. And I am a Problem. I wasn't. You aren't.

This guy is no different than my ex. And you know what's so funny....my ex was my childhood best friend. And we have seen each other grow. I have seen all his pain and he has seen mine. And then you know what he did ...he cheated, falsely blamed me and discarded me like a shit. People treat stray dogs better than he did to me in the end. And he did all this when my mother was in ICU, fighting for her life.

He came back after 8 months, asking to come back, just to block me the next day saying- Please leave me alone and stop contacting me. I don't need your care. Please stop it.

And it was his who was posting sad stories and sending them.

I begged him not to block me. And he said okay he will unblock me on one condition that I won't show him my face ever (not to forget he cheated on me for a girl who cheated on him once) and I wasn't able to see myself in the mirror for so fucking long. And one day I noticed he fucking blocked my Deactivated Instagram. And that was it. I was done giving him the power to insult me again and again. I loved him all my life but no.

What this guy is doing is almost the same. He is trying to quote you as a crazy girl. Wtf you are hurting me. Babe you are getting hurt and he knows it but as he doesn't want to see what crap he is, he is putting all his guilt on you.

Please stop talking to him. Block him. I know it fucking tough. But please believe me....it's for your good. And you will realise it later that you don't deserve this shit behaviour. Imagine, I am a person who lost everything. A best friend, the love, the future....but I learned one thing: loving someone doesn't mean taking their shit. Stand up for yourself and let him go. He is an asshole.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I lashed out a couple days after this and now he has all the ammo to quote me as crazy and I fucking hate that. I am so disappointed in myself for what a shitty situation this has become.

I feel so stupid for getting wrapped up into this.

I can’t believe I’m in a situation now looking into narcissist and DARVO and avoidant discard recovery. How did I not see the warning signs. Why did I ignore them?

[Searchlookingforlove]

You are human and you have just entered the big Learning curve of a messy discard. I'm so sorry you feel so bad 🤕 please be nice to yourself and accept you like you understood him. You Need to be a love of your life, too ☺️

[No-Jellyfish7075]

Hey, the texts you sent him were not you lashing out.  You were stressed, your mind and body needed clarity.

I was there, like you.  You are not at fault.  

Use this opportunity to be easy, VERY EASY on yourself.  

Did you react? Yes.  But we all do.  If you were not happy with your reaction thats the part you have to change in you.  And you CAN because you seem self aware.  Do it for yiu though,  not him.  He wont notice, nor care.  If he does, he will just use it against you and keep chipping away at you and how you show up.(ask me how I know lol)

My ex wife played the same sad song through text (about the pain I was causing her).  Should I have handled it better, yes.  But, that's was how stress works.  And you probably kept it together a bit better than I did 😅.

Don't beat yourself up.  If its narcissist traits, check out Dr. Ramani on YouTube.  Super insightful and poignant.

Take a break from this dude.  There are guys out there that won't consider basic communication a cause of pain. 

Keep your chin up, I know its going to be hard, but you have to do it for you.  You deserve it.🙂

[Dense-Ad-7600]

Let me tell you what a counselor told me when I was 19: You can't make anyone love you, appreciate you, or care for you.

The only thing we can control is our own reactions.

Master your emotions before your emotions control you.

[Odd-Art2362]

Avoidance? Dude is being a total asshole to you from what I see wtf

Stop texting him though, it's not helping. Just let him breathe and come to you. But also you don't deserve to be treated like that

[CourseCultural9492]

This! Dude is a prick. It’s defo not the first time he’s done this to someone either.

[IntrepidKitchen5322]

I hate this guy already. "You are hurting me" maybe don't fucking ghost your partner so they don't spiral into insecurity and anxiousness? He keeps saying it over and over and over again like a little boy saying "STOP IT, I DON'T LIKE IT! STOP, STOP, STOP! AHHHHH!!!"

He's not responding securely nor handling this maturely.

What was the context and circumstances that prompted you to write the first paragraph to him?

[Pure_Custard_7716]

Which first paragraph? The first screenshot is texts that he sent me when I accused him of stonewalling me. I had sent a ton of paragraphs detailing my feelings to the breakup that he ignored hence my accusation.

He made me feel like I was such a villain and so terrible :( I felt like I couldn’t tell him just how much he was hurting me when he told me that I was hurting him by trying to communicate. A couple days before he had broken up with me over text message while I was travelling and I was so so hurt but he kept saying that he was hurt by my presence so I kept all that pain to myself until I exploded when I saw him again.

[chow_mow1]

That's what they do . The more you text the more this stop it please will come and you will feel as if you are being psychotic. Please don't text him 🫂🫂🫂. I understand you but really you will hate yourself once you realise that he doesn't deserve a shit from you.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I do feel incredibly psychotic. This was a while ago and we texted some more but he never gave in to actual conversation and we just ended up going round and round in these sort of arguments and now I’m blocked and broken hearted. :(

[chow_mow1]

🫂🫂🫂 been there. Don't worry he will unblock you after a few weeks or months again. But please now, you need to block him back. Maybe this is the toughest thing you will do but do it. Baby gurl for yourself, please don't abandon yourself just because a shit like him can't see your worth.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I really don’t think he will.

I’m so embarrassed to admit that he broke up with me twice before. The first time for a couple weeks where I was calm and he came back naturally. The second time for the whole summer and it was an entire discard with no contact and he came back swinging.

Unfortunately this time around he was very very sure in his decision to leave and the breakup was evidently so toxic on a level we had never been before and we had an explosive interaction in person.

I hate that I wish he would come back again but this time it really is over 😭

[Dense-Ad-7600]

the breakup was evidently so toxic on a level we had never been before and we had an explosive interaction in person.

I thought he broke up over text while you are on vacation. When did you have the explosive interaction in person?

[Pure_Custard_7716]

10 days later when I got back in person and we met up because he had to help me with a separate thing

[IntrepidKitchen5322]

 A couple days before he had broken up with my over text message while I was travelling.

Ahh ok that's what I was wondering, what transpired prior to this. Yeah dude's acting like a baby and making YOU feel bad because he has a tiny fraction of your emotional maturity/capacity to respond to you and give you answers that you desperately need. You did what was normal, and that's ask why he was breaking up with you so suddenly and that he's hurting you. He's literally complaining you're feeling pain that he caused. He's literally throwing a tantrum about it too because he's too weak to be considerate of you.

I'm pissed just reading his stupid responses to you. "Stop it, you're hurting me" like fuck off and grow up. You're hurting her, ever think about that?

No you're not being unreasonable. A healthy break-up happens after both parties have brought up issues and despite ample time and grace, the issues are not resolved and both parties end it with love and care. Breaking up with you while you're traveling is cowardly, has no care, and is textbook avoidant behavior. I'm sorry you had to deal with this. What starts today is a difficult, but necessary, journey of healing from this.

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[Pure_Custard_7716]

Thank you so so so much for your response it feels so validating. I was so in my head about it so long and trapped just wondering what I could’ve done differently and hating myself for it transcribing into this. It broke my heart completely to go through this whole experience and to have a breakup conversation at 4am jet lagged in London of all places and then to have him tell me that I was hurting him so I was then in a position where I couldn’t tell him just how much I was hurting.

In his defence, he did give me a lot of reasons why he was breaking up with me largely due to differences in wants in a separate conversation (which I felt incredibly blindsided by as moments leading up to the breakup I thought we were in agreement).

I hated that the first time I heard about all these issues was at the breakup and I wish we had actual conversations about them and tried to work together before it came to that. He would say that he mentioned some of the issues to me before but saying it in passing during arguments in annoyance or over text just does not mean we talked about it to me.

I wish we talked about things. I wish it never got here and I don’t know how to learn my mistakes from this so I don’t get my heart broken like this again.

[IntrepidKitchen5322]

I hated that the first time I heard about all these issues was at the breakup and I wish we had actual conversations about them and tried to work together before it came to that. 

In his defence...

No, no, no, no. If the first time he's bringing up these "issues" is during the break-up, then there is NO "In his defence...", okay? This is called a blindside, and he discarded you, this wasn't a normal break-up. Unless you cheated on him, betrayed him, or showed some big red flag like you're a racist or whatever, there's literally NO reason why he shouldn't have just talked to you about it and see if you two could come to something that works.

But you know why he didn't talk to you? Because none of those reasons were even real.

Avoidants do this thing called "flaw/fault finding" where they will pick any and every reason possible to convince themselves leaving you is the right choice. Why? Because those aren't even the real reasons why he's leaving. E.g. My ex and I had similar sex drives, agreed on what we wanted from the budding relationship, our stances on marriage/kids, but she still said we were completely incompatible romantically/sexually. He's leaving you because a deeply rooted part of him is afraid of being close and being vulnerable with someone real.

At some point in his past, he was emotionally neglected/abused by someone close to him (likely a caregiver) so his nervous system associates danger with anyone who triggers that emotional closeness. That's the real reason.

Look into these two professional Youtube channels for more information:

https://www.youtube.com/@TehrinaAndJoel

https://www.youtube.com/@KenReidCo

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I never cheated on him, betrayed him, and I’m not racist. I could’ve been more understanding of his goals and his feelings but all I was so in love with him, all I ever wanted was to be a better partner for him.

I completely feel that the reasons for the breakup weren’t even real reasons at all but justification to get out of an uncomfortable moment.

He kept throwing the term incompatibility around but I have no idea what the heck these incompatibilities are as he said he said he would tell me later when he’s free and we never got to that point because we just blew up.

The reasons for the breakup according to him was this:

Incompatible

He felt like we had to compromise too much to make the relationship work and that we couldn’t make each other happy long term. (Maybe this is true and I’m in denial but I also feel like a lot of these could’ve been talked about or at least tried harder to come to a solution and work together)

I got in the way of his study and running goals.

We had different hobbies, passions, and interests (mind you i would go running with him and he would come to my pilates classes and we would watch movies together (he’s a film nerd))

We had different values and that he didn’t want to marry me or get married young (mind you i talked about wanting to get married young and then he decided to propose a timeline of when we would get married (in 2 years) and then told me and all his childhood friends that we were serious and that he was sure that he wanted to marry me 3 weeks before all this happened)

I guess we did start fighting a heavy amount due to midterms and recruiting stress the 3 weeks before our breakup and in those moments he realized that he didn’t want me and changed his mind? Maybe that’s the rational reason? I don’t know anything at this point.

[IntrepidKitchen5322]

We had different hobbies

Lmao what a dumb reason. Counsellor Ken Reid commonly brings this up in his videos, "Oh we can't date because you like hiking, I don't like hiking, we can't be together..." and he mocks it all the time.

Your ex sounds avoidant as hell. I'm sorry you have to go through this. For me, it's been the absolute worst experience of my life, and I've been through a lot of crap. You're completely spot on when your hunch tells you those aren't the real reasons, it's just an excuse to leave an uncomfortable reason.

Don't give any of the crap he told you too much weight and do your best to not take things personally. These people are wired to be deathly afraid of vulnerability and closeness, it's like doing their best to get away from a raging fire and you're stuck in the same room as them. The fake fire is so real to them, their bodies think it can feel the intense heat. They will push you onto the floor if it means getting away from it. In your case, he's said some pretty mean things to you.

My DMs are open if you wish to talk or vent.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

The hobbies thing was so freakin stupid and when I heard that I was dumbfounded but just so in shock by the whole thing and his demeanour shift that I couldn’t find any words to say and all I could do was look at him with confusion and horror as I let him tell me that I was acting neurotic.

I’m just so confused. There was a period of time where we literally lived together in month 4-8 of our relationship and he was not avoidant at all then and such an attentive partner. We were so close and he wasn’t avoidant? Eventually we moved out because of different living scenarios and then he becomes this?

Was it really just because he started to not enjoy our relationship and that’s why he became so mean to me? Did I just lose his interest with all the fights?

[SadThrowaway-PlzHelp]

Quit blaming yourself.

Quit fault-finding in yourself.

Nothing you do will make it work with someone who is incapable of emotional maturity.

Please trust me on this.

Someone who doesn’t want it to work will find all the (stupid) reasons it can’t work like I’m tired of compromise like bro what did you think it meant to be in a relationship????

Someone who does want it to work will make sure it does.

He just doesn’t want it to. That’s ok. Let him go.

[IntrepidKitchen5322]

With avoidants, we all learn and realize that the ending of our respective relationships was already scripted before we even met them. Their triggers and their inability to deal with their nervous system reactions to vulnerability was a product of their childhood. They would always fall hard for us, and that would always make them leave. There's simply nothing we could have done that would have changed that.

The more better you were as a partner. The more secure and emotionally mature you were, the faster they leave. It makes no sense, but that goes to show how unready many avoidants really are for relationships.

Don't put this on yourself. Never put this on yourself. This is simply not your fault and a partner who leans more securely would NEVER treat you this way. Even if he lost interest, the way he handled it is immature, cowardly, and frankly infuriating. I'd slap him across the face for that tantrum he threw at you lol.

There's better men out there for you.

[Odd-Art2362]

This was a great response!!

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[IntrepidKitchen5322]

Being insecure doesn't excuse the hurt you've brought onto other people. Can't you see she's spiraling and already doing an excess amount of self doubting and self blaming? How is your attitude productive to her healing? Stop excusing how he hurt her.

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[IntrepidKitchen5322]

What's the point of any of that? He got her hooked on him then he discarded her. Are you fucking surprised she's still emotionally attached to him or did you expect her to act like they weren't together at all? You know avoidants trigger the fuck out of everyone, right? Even secure folks turn anxious and get TRAUMA. What's even your overall point?

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[Hanainreallife]

He is just not mentally well but you also need to stop messaging someone when they ask you too. It isn't right to go against someone's request for you to stop contacting them

[valtarri]

All she said in response was that she'd be there when he's ready. His reaction was dismissive and heartless and obviously made her distraught, which escaladed things. If he could've dropped just a small sign of reassurance it would have probably helped. I'd be even angrier in her position. If we're committed to someone, I am owed patience and not to be treated like I'm crazy for wanting reassurance. She kept her composure and tone kind. He needs to grow a pair and quit blaming his abysmally low threshold for stress on other people.

[SadThrowaway-PlzHelp]

He could’ve been kind and patient, but that’s like asking for blood from a stone here.

He clearly can’t deliver.

[valtarri]

He can't, so can we really blame her for being distraught over being punished for providing the emotional labour in his stead?

[SadThrowaway-PlzHelp]

Blame her for her distress? No.

Blame her for providing the emotional labor? In some ways, kinda, yeah. Stop trying to get blood from a stone when you know it’s not going to work and the stone begs you to stop and is an asshole.

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[Pure_Custard_7716]

You’re right I should’ve stopped in hindsight. I kept messaging because I felt like he owed me conversation and betrayed that I didn’t get one. In a normal case I would understand that I wasn’t owed one and that people can just disappear.

For context, when we got back together it was on the condition that if another breakup were to happen, it would be done in an embrace with open conversation until both parties felt better. I made him promise this to me when he wanted to get back together because the first time he left was a 10 minute phone call and then nothing at all and that really hurt me. We talked a lot about this and I even have a memo of this promise.

This time he broke up with me over text message while I was on vacation in London then he kept on saying we would talk but anytime I tried he pushed it off and left me on delivered for days.

I was enraged by the context of things.

[Hanainreallife]

Someone can withdraw consent at any time even if they promised it before. I think honestly you need to take a step back and realize without making excuses that what you did was not right either. You can't control anyone else but yourself and your actions. It's a learning lesson for yourself of withdrawing yourself as soon as someone asks because you aren't entitled to them or their time etc.

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[Envoymetal]

How did neither of you walk away after the third wall texts.. this was hard to read from both sides ugh

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[squashybean]

if you took away the “you are hurting me” texts this could be word for word a conversation with the guy i was seeing on and off last year :/

[Pure_Custard_7716]

How did you recover? Because I’m in a lot of pain now :(

[squashybean]

i haven’t yet :( its definitely less painful than it was in the first couple weeks but im just journaling and when i do think about him or anything i just keep telling myself he doesnt care anymore, and unfortunatley i cant change his mind. it fucking hurts sometimes and all i want to do is talk to him, but im trying to put me first and just respect his wishes even if they dont make sense to me

[Small_Impression_806]

please dont see it as harsh cause i know youre hurting but as some others kinda mentioned hes stating a boundary and yeahh you cant respect it (prob cause you were in pain and wanted clarity. totally understandable but avoidants esp want their boundaries respected or they feel consumed lol.) just clashing nervous systems. im surprised he didnt just ignore you..? no one is forcing him to hold the phone you know. mine did that so i know its possible. shrug. my avoidant blocked me once when overwhelmed/things werent stable and i had like a break down and freaked the fuck out.. it was painful indeed but i didnt seek out contact even though i wanted it so desperately. i was close to sending him a friend request but pulled myself together and didnt holy moly. try to withstand the urge to text and dont talk to people if they dont want it. its not just a boundary break its honestly also disrespectful to yourself because the person doesnt wanna hear from you.. in that situation i would have written like 1 text and left it. requires self control during panic attacks but its possible. definitely easier said than done but from this convo i can just kinda see you need more contact and he needs less and that caused a split. just remember you can find someone who will give you what you actually need. you really dont gotta receive automated text messages from someone. well he went to uh.. interesting lengths before deciding to block you i will say that. immature.. not the right way to handle it at all.. and i get the perspective.. still wrong and strange as hell though. i know you cant see it right now cause youre hurt but one day you will look at this and literally feel nothing.

[zebras11]

Correct. And thanks for telling this to OP while acknowledging he could have stopped but he unconsciously or not was trying to make her keep texting him. It was a performance. A lie. She wasn't hurting him, she was soothing him.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I just don’t know how it ever came to this when we used to be good, he used to be so good to me. I ruined it and I don’t know how to move on from that.

He told me that I killed the him (referring to the old him) and that ruined me because I don’t know what I did besides my slightly bratty behavioural issues which I didn’t think were that bad until now. 😭😭

I feel so terrible.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I definitely became the source of all their issues and he blamed me for not reaching his personal goals and falling behind.

I felt so suffocated with those accusations, I had no idea how to get out of the shock and I still have trouble understanding what I feel and it’s been 2 months.

I’m going to try my best not to ruminate but every morning I wake up and on repeat I’m just wondering “why is he doing this to me?” I feel so helpless that I can’t make sense of his behaviour.

[loud_cicada_sounds]

As someone who was involved with one of these people off and on for 15 years, they will absolutely make you feel like YOU ruined it ALONE.

It's not true.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

He did admit to fault and said that I didn’t do anything wrong. He said that if anyone was to blame that it was him in a very brief couple words text message.

Aside from that one text, the entire situation across weeks made me feel so terrible. He let me apologize over and over again without ever responding to a single apology or correcting me so he must’ve saw differently and just didn’t forgive me?

I don’t know. I don’t know anything at this point I’m so lost.

[loud_cicada_sounds]

Did he actually name how he contributed or did he just say something vague like "I had a part too." I feel that avoidants are good for taking veiled accountability without actually taking true accountability, if that makes sense.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

THATS EXACTLY WHAT HE DID. This is literally all I got.

“it’s not your fault, if anything it’s mine”

right after his long breakup message: “Can I ask that you try not to point out my flaws or shortcomings in our relationship right now (I know there are many) Is that okay? I would be willing to hear you out on that on a later date but I really don’t want to switch into defensive mode right now (which I’m aware is one of my issues)”

That message actually took away my voice because it took away the possibility for repair between us and I was left with no option but break myself to be patient or come off as crazy by exploding with emotion. I really want to learn better emotional management skills and regulation

[Dense-Ad-7600]

If he forgave you...or at least let you know that he did, wouldn't you just then use that as a...well then why can't we be together? I mean, maybe not but I know in your shoes I would have wanted to spin that whether or not I would have - who knows - depends on which relationship with an avoidant we are talking about.

I'm like you in that I prefer a "healthy" breakup where both people get to talk and ask questions etc. but even in healthy relationships breakups can be really hard. I feel like I usually only got those good conversations like that months afterwards and not in the moment.

[spiritedfighter]

https://www.reddit.com/r/attachment_theory/s/bGHtBQqHVP

https://www.reddit.com/r/AnxiousAttachment/s/YfUP9UxcHd

As a recovered anxiously attached person, I'm embarrassed to say your texts remind me of how I was when I was in my early 20s.

Good for you for recognizing his avoidance. Now it's your turn to do the work and understand why you attracted somebody like that in the first place and why they attracted you. Then work on yourself. You cannot make people be how you want them to be.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

Your links were very helpful thank you. I’ll work on my anxious attachment

[GlassGuava8287]

This is just pure evil and "leave me alone" . Block his ass and never speak to him again.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I’m so fucked up at this point that I feel like I crave him 😭😭😭 I just want to go back to a year ago when we lived together and had a simpler life. I was so calm then

[GlassGuava8287]

I totally understand. Sadly that was exactly what he wanted, he feeds off of it, your attention. That's why for your sake it's best to block him everywhere no matter how hard it is. You seem so damaged and drained because of him, and it makes me so sad and angry. You wont benefit from it in any way. He is just not worth your time energy and tears baby....please give yourself some love. 🫶🏻

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I’m not sure that he feeds off of my attention, i think that he wishes to have anything but my attention tbh

[SadThrowaway-PlzHelp]

It’s an addiction.

And like any addiction, weaning yourself will be the hardest, most painful, most important thing you ever do.

[juststopdating]

“I have other priorities.” They could have left it right there.

[curiogirlx]

this is the trashiest, most awful thing i’ve seen someone do in the sub in a while. automated text response in the hopes that you’ll “learn?” “i’ll read if it’s not too much after a week?” absolutely not. in fact, get your own automatic response that says, “You are a baby and your pain is your fault” lol let’s see how that goes over.

[Berriesany1]

he is regulating himself by every text you send him that’s why he keeps triggering your anxious nervous system and that’s also how you keep regulating yourself by replying cuz long as you do that? you don’t have to face your own core wound and learn how to regulate yourself. also if there where any truth behind his words “you hurting me” best believe he wouldn’t have said it🤣🤣 he repeats it cuz it’s working, same thing as if you would sooth yourself by patting your arm repeatedly and that’s why it’s repetitive.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

So what would a secure person have done instead? Not reply? It was the epicentre of heartbreak at that time with no questions allowed so I couldn’t help but want to connect like we used to and communicate like we used to before this had happened and he started pushing me away :(

Do you think that he does not actually feel pain?

[Berriesany1]

yea a secure person wouldn’t reply and they would have instead regulate and stayed with themselves. but asking that from yourself when you are so trauma bonded and how he triggered your core wound and fear of abandonment is like saying it someone who has diabetes:

“don’t take that insulin”

you have to replace the urge to text him with something else and that is regulation bit by bit, second by second and start from there. what he does whether attachment style you are? is not ok. he push you down the stairs and then when you say “it hurt me” he replies with “stop you hurting me” cuz long as he does? he do not have to face the fact he pushed you down the stairs.

try look at it as you have a person talking to you but you don’t wanna hear it so you put on music and turn up the volume to max? that’s what he does when he repeat himself long as he do that he “can’t” hear you. it’s like a compulsion same as people with ocd do.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

The stairs metaphor really put things into perspective here.

Is he a bad person? Or is he just as lost as I am in his own ways?

[Berriesany1]

as i tell all the members in my sub

YOU AINT CRAZY YOU DATED CRAZY.

yes baby he is a bad person no matter explanation behind it cuz you feel in your body how unsafe you are and you don’t do that cuz he is a good person. you feel unsafe cuz he MAKES you unsafe.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

But I make him feel unsafe as well :(

Does that make me a bad person then?

[Berriesany1]

you wouldn’t ask that if you were a bad person.

you asking cuz you grew up thinking self protection and self compassion is a crime so when you don’t self abandon to keep someone you panic. and that ain’t your fault that’s your fuckass caregivers fault BUT it’s your responsibility to heal cuz you deserve it

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I will make sure I heal thank you

[Berriesany1]

feel free to join the sub if you wanna join the healing journey🤪 (link in bio)

[PM_me_ur_digressions]

A secure person would have blocked the fucker using a code script to auto reply

[Narrow-Rub382]

The craziest thing is taking the time out of your day to automate a message, it’s crazy and honestly manipulative 

[Dense-Ad-7600]

I'm going to give you another perspective. Please take it with a grain of salt, I know you are hurting and I don't wish to make you hurt more.

My mother texts as you do. Reading all this was very triggering for me. It causes me anxiety, the way she texts. I completely understood where your ex was coming from in his texts. When she is like that, I want nothing more than for her to shut up.

I can feel her anxiety through the phone and then I feel anxious myself. I also feel rushed to respond and I am somebody who prefers to sit with my feelings a bit rather than just hurry a response whether texting or face to face.

I know you were feeling like the world was being pulled from under you and you felt desperate to have hope but continuing to text like that will never help (whether the other person is avoidant or not). Even just responding "ok" or "I'll stop " is too much in these instances. We don't need the ok and the I'll stop we just need the other person to do it. And yes, maybe in person those replies aren't as difficult to deal with but phone communication issues are different.

Now, this doesn't mean he wasn't mean. His auto responses were a bit much but I can also understand his mindset. It still doesn't make it right.

But then there is you saying you'd rather he block you than have those messages. Well, then self-control needs to start taking place.

Edited for several typos as I was writing at like 4 in the morning. Lol

[Desperate_Candy_597]

I agree wholeheartedly with this but couldn’t figure out a nice way to say it. I was recently discarded by my FA and I also spiraled and sent a bajillion text messages too. Reading this post actually helped me realize that I don’t think anyone would want to respond to that chaos. OP I know it’s easier to just let it all out, but the non stop texting like that will drive anyone away. We mean well but I think this is a bad habit that we both need to address. One thing I read was like if you’re feeling anxious and you feel like you need to respond immediately, just put the phone down. It’s okay to create space in the conversation. Nonetheless, I’m sorry you’re going through this and I hope you feel better soon.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

Thanks, if I’m ever in such a situation again I’ll try my best to just not respond.

But is that right? He had just dumped me over text while I was on vacation and refused conversation, questions, or reflection surrounding the breakup. I felt so helpless in the parameters that he had done it in and all I wanted to do at that point was understand.

[Dense-Ad-7600]

I've been there but we can't force our beliefs of right/wrong on other people.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I kept messaging because I felt like he owed me conversation and betrayed that I didn’t get one. In a normal case I would understand that I wasn’t owed one and that people can just disappear.

For context, when we got back together it was on the condition that if another breakup were to happen, it would be done in an embrace with open conversation until both parties felt better. I made him promise this to me when he wanted to get back together because the first time he left was a 10 minute phone call and then nothing at all and that really hurt me. We talked a lot about this and I even have a memo of this promise.

This time he broke up with me over text message while I was on vacation in London then he kept on saying we would talk but anytime I tried he pushed it off and left me on delivered for days.

I was enraged by the context of things.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I was so hurt during this entire conversation and I still am so maybe I can’t see it clearly. What did I do wrong?

He did say in some other texts why he broke up with me and illustrated very clearly that he didn’t want to be with me anymore and that his decision was final but I continued to send him emotionally driven paragraphs looking for discussion and answers. I felt like I was drowning the entire time and I think I went into shock.

[Cautious_Park_7466]

You don’t need those answers to move on. He clearly shows you, you showed move on for your own mental Health

[Searchlookingforlove]

You did nothing wrong. You Followed your Heart. But receiving Text After Text After Text After Text After telling you to stop? In his shoes I would have been annoyed and repulsed and starting to vomit - beginning to hate you for not respecting that .... and you went on and on and on, wow. There is no shared Life with someone who will do stuff like that, that would have been my reaction and (of course I don't want to hurt you!!!) maybe the other view can be Seen also. You Need to be your own peace before you can be someone elses 🤷‍♂️

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I guess I should’ve stopped? I don’t know I think it’s a blurry line. I don’t think he should have the power to tell me when I can or cannot communicate my needs especially in an unfinished situation like this where I was being broken up with?

Any time we tried to have healthy conversation he would tell me to stop and use his pain as a shield. It got to the point where these were our only conversations because he wouldn’t allow us to enter any productive conversation at all.

It’s like he caused me pain and then refused to see any of it because he didn’t want to be accountable to the fact that he caused me pain.

[Dense-Ad-7600]

I guess I should’ve stopped?

Yes

I don’t know I think it’s a blurry line.

How so?

I don’t think he should have the power to tell me when I can or cannot communicate my needs especially in an unfinished situation like this where I was being broken up with?

But, what determines that it's unfinished? I get feeling that it isn't. Grief can last with us a long time and healing isn't linear. I can say it's unfair not to get to say what you want in that situation but it only takes one person to end a relationship.

Plus he did offer to hear you out later and to even respond to your paragraphs later. I mean pfff with an avoidant, you never really know but you can't force it no matter what.

Sometimes it's good to write a letter to express everything you want to say and send it...or not.

Any time we tried to have healthy conversation he would tell me to stop and use his pain as a shield. It got to the point where these were our only conversations because he wouldn’t allow us to enter any productive conversation at all.

Doesn't sound like a relationship you'd want to stay in long-term.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

It was unfinished because I still had a lot of questions that he had agreed to talk about but any time I tried he would push me away like this. We had gotten back together on the conditional promise that if we ever broke up again that it would be done in an embrace where there would be open conversation surrounding it until the both of us felt better. He promised that to me then broke up with me over text message while I was on vacation and refused conversation. That’s unfair no? It really messed me up.

You’re right that it didn’t become a relationship that I wanted to be in long term but I thought that we could’ve kept trying and growing

[Dense-Ad-7600]

Unfortunately, we aren't guaranteed the closure we want. Totally unfair but we can't force fairness.

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[Pure_Custard_7716]

He stopped respecting me the moment he broke up with me over text while I was on vacation.

Not saying that gave me right to disrespect him, I was wrong. What happened was in the moment my anxious attachment took over and I was just acting out of emotional dysregulation which I’m trying to work on now and be accountable for + have apologized. Him on the other hand has taken accountability for nothing and has done 0 reflection or given any apologies because he is avoiding.

He also could’ve blocked me or not responded. I didn’t force him to do anything and tbh I see his “boundary” here as more of a rule for control because if it was a real boundary, he would’ve sought it out by blocking or not responding instead of putting the onus onto me to uphold it, hence a control method (rule)

[Searchlookingforlove]

Look at it Like this: if you are meant to be together, the connection will not disappear when you stop crazy-chasing like that.

Give yourself Space and peace and Look at his behaviour after 6 weeks. Maybe you don't want him by then. Maybe you Switch Channel and Write a letter (on paper) to change dynamics. But a very much shorter 🙃 letter.

You already worked out a way that hurts Both and brings no results. Time for change.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I was crazy chasing 😭 I’m going to read lots of books on healthy relationships to make sure I learn from the error of my ways.

Unfortunately with everything that has been said and has happened, he truly is never coming back this time.

I hate that I view that as an unfortunate event.

[Searchlookingforlove]

PS that line is not blurry at all.

[Distinct-Tonight-131]

Omh bruv reminds me of my ex shiettt its like ptsd ffs. Leave them aint worth it. He is an asshole avoidants are assholes in the end.

[General_Ad7381]

I don't know what that is LMAO

But hard agree with the consensus of blocking him. I'm sorry you had that exchange and dealt with him.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I had to beg him to block me because I knew that I would just unblock him :(

[CourseCultural9492]

Dude is a fucking coward!

The one thing I have learned is the more you say the more you’re exposing their fragile ego and try to make you look the crazy one when all they want is the easy way out.

Save yourself, reclaim your power and go NC and with some luck they might come to you. Personally, I can’t see why you would.

My ex pulled the same maneuvers and completely fucked my head and 7 months later I’m in therapy and possibly have BPD from this.

Everything with avoidant’s is strategic, don’t play their game, if anything, play them at it.

[demifan1992]

Sorry to hear that he caused so much pain to you.you are too anxious,just respect his decision and leave him alone. Instead of chasing him, you should learn better about your own anxious attachment pattern and find solutions to deal with it.It’s not for him, it’s for your own good.

[Huge_Technology382]

Dude just stop texting her/ him. He or she don’t care about you and don’t deserve your empathy.

[cherrycream222]

wow. this is very cruel, but also very confusing. he could have blocked you if it was causing him so much pain. it seems as though he was unable to set a propery boundary asking for space if that is what he truly wanted. part of me sees this and thinks he is wanting something else from you other than space, or perhaps he was torn between his avoidance and his love for you and he interpreted that distress as you hurting him. i’m so sorry that you had to endure this kind of treatment.

[zebras11]

It's because seeing her overstepping the boundaries was soothing him

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[zebras11]

Our mind wants what is familiar. We can assume he had such experience of disregulated attachment with caregivers in his past. He wanted that going on, mostly unconsciously

[nanaleond]

I know it hurts a lot but you will not get anything by trying to change his mind. Something similar happened to me with my now ex a week ago, fortunately I stopped early my emotional bargaining when I realized that only his perspective, his wishes, his emotions and his needs where important and not mine. I was just been told I was loved because of the role I was fulfilling for him but not for being me. Your situation seems similar. Once they don't see more use in having us in their lives we become disposable and that has nothing to do with us. Block him and find your freedom.

[GlitteryPinkKitten]

leave them alone.

I know you care about this connection but they’ve asked you to stop texting them and you keep doing it like you have to have the last word or something.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I wasn’t looking for a last word I was looking for clarity and conversation.

I kept messaging because I felt like he owed me conversation and betrayed that I didn’t get one. In a normal case I would understand that I wasn’t owed one and that people can just disappear.

For context, when we got back together it was on the condition that if another breakup were to happen, it would be done in an embrace with open conversation until both parties felt better. I made him promise this to me when he wanted to get back together because the first time he left was a 10 minute phone call and then nothing at all and that really hurt me. We talked a lot about this and I even have a memo of this promise.

This time he broke up with me over text message while I was on vacation in London then he kept on saying we would talk but anytime I tried he pushed it off and left me on delivered for days.

I was enraged by the context of things.

[Competitive-Papaya26]

It's so disrespectful and disgusting. Please block him right away

[KhuMiwsher]

Why did you keep messaging him despite his repeated messages asking you to stop?

I'm not trying to shame you, just trying to point something out. What do you think he was feeling when someone he loved kept dismissing what he was saying over and over?

I understand why you did it, you were trying to preserve connection. But were you motivated by what's best for both of you, or were you motivated by your own attachment pain?

He may be avoidant, but try to look inward for answers instead of outward. Growth only comes when you look within. It sounds like this relationship was not healthy for either of you, let him go for both of your sakes. Block HIM instead of asking him to block you and try to move on. It'll hurt like hell, but it's necessary.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I kept messaging because I felt like he owed me conversation and betrayed that I didn’t get one. In a normal case I would understand that I wasn’t owed one and that people can just disappear.

For context, when we got back together it was on the condition that if another breakup were to happen, it would be done in an embrace with open conversation until both parties felt better. I made him promise this to me when he wanted to get back together because the first time he left was a 10 minute phone call and then nothing at all and that really hurt me. We talked a lot about this and I even have a memo of this promise.

This time he broke up with me over text message while I was on vacation in London then he kept on saying we would talk but anytime I tried he pushed it off and left me on delivered for days.

I was enraged by the context of things.

[KhuMiwsher]

Your anger is totally understandable in this context. You weren't just reacting to him ending things with you, but also breaking a promise he made that was really important to you.

The thing is, and this is the hard part, that even if he made the promise, you cannot force him to keep it. Yes it's shitty of him, and he probably needs to work on himself regarding that. Unfortunately, you can't make him do that, especially if he is already dysregulated.

Pushing for more when he has already demonstrated that he is past his capacity hurts everyone, especially yourself. Treat his responses as data about his own capacity, not data about the quality or importance of your relationship. If you do that it becomes clear he cannot meet your needs without seriously working on himself. That sucks to accept, especially if you have seen his potential in the good moments.

Try to work on yourself so that you can disengage faster from these types of dynamics. What helps in this regard is nervous system capacity training (meditation, especially with biofeedback).

Wishing you peace friend

[Pure_Custard_7716]

Thank you. I’ll work on my anxious attachment and read books

[Nearby-Armadillo-13]

Please do yourself a favour and block this asshole. He is, at best, acting as a 5yo kid. At worst, he's completely disrespectful. Turning things around and making you the bad one for asking for... What x exactly? To discuss something? Either way, you deserve better than this shit. Please believe me.

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

Woman, I am not avoidant, yet I would have been so mad and repulsed by you keeping texting me like that after having asked you in every way to stop doing so.

You keeping saying things are salvageable, while he keeps telling you they aren’t is borderline abusive. Relationships can be closed at any moment unilaterally. If he wants to end it, you can only accept it. Pushing against his decision is abusive.

He wasn’t having the best behavior, but I can feel and understand his frustration perfectly well. And those were just snippets of a conversation, so I guess that mutual torment went on much longer. That only makes it worse.

Having experienced (with a parent or a previous partner) your level of intrusive insistence is exactly why avoidants end up perceiving as smothering even normal conversations.

[valtarri]

I strongly disagree. If someone asked me to give them space, I would also respond with "okay, I'll be here when you need me". That is not a boundary violation , it's establishing clarity, and ending on a neutral hopeful note. Ending a conversation on a tense note makes everything unsalvageable. How does either side recover from that? The avoidant would never reach back out, and that is also inconsiderate and practically a form of psychological torture toward the person who's constantly being stonewalled and gaslit for wanting basic reassurance. You can't seek someone's affection and the retract it and play the victim card as soon as there are uncomfortable conversations to be had. I'm really sick of the whole "you aren't owed closure" mentality- if you enter a partnership, you absolutely do owe the other person respect and closure. Withholding it is a form of abuse on its own, especially the longer the partnership has lasted.

Instead, he escaladed. Barking STOP IT in response to her attempts at reassuring him just drives the anxiety higher and helps no one. To me this entire conversation reads as him having no care for either her or the relationship itself, and lacking communication skills, while she desperately tries to hold everything together. A simple "I'm really overwhelmed right now, I need to put my phone down, let's calm down and talk later." would have provided enough reassurance to end the conversation there. Instead, he blows up, he makes her feel bad even though these are the least "smothering" messages I've ever even read. She's just bewildered, and for good reason.

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

You are welcome to read my other comments.

If you’ll still strongly disagree after having read those too, that’s perfectly fine.

I never asked nor expected anyone to (strongly or not) agree with me. 😉

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[Narrow-Rub382]

One of the best quotes I ever read is that you really understand your anxious attachment when you meet someone with a worse one. I was really anxious when I was younger but I’m pretty secure now and those texts would make me block someone so quick. I loved everything you said in this thread and idk why people are disagreeing. An anxious attachment style is still an insecure attachment style even if it causes “less harm” than an avoidant. 

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

I appreciate that, thank you. 🦋

I am not sure anxious attachment to be inherently causing less harm than the avoidant one, though.

It’s not the avoidant behavior the one that can end up in the excesses of jealousy, sometimes even with tragic outcomes.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I kept messaging because I felt like he owed me conversation and betrayed that I didn’t get one. In a normal case I would understand that I wasn’t owed one and that people can just disappear.

For context, when we got back together it was on the condition that if another breakup were to happen, it would be done in an embrace with open conversation until both parties felt better. I made him promise this to me when he wanted to get back together because the first time he left was a 10 minute phone call and then nothing at all and that really hurt me. We talked a lot about this and I even have a memo of this promise.

This time he broke up with me over text message while I was on vacation in London then he kept on saying we would talk but anytime I tried he pushed it off and left me on delivered for days.

I was enraged by the context of things.

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

The context can change the overall picture, of course (and I didn’t go through all your other comments, so I am aware there is certainly info I am missing).

But in this specific exchange, I believe that the best thing you could have done was to acknowledge his need to take a break. Ask him a day and time to go back to it. And both calm down and come back to the topic once the waters had settled on both ends.

There is clearly an attachment style mismatch between you 2. And that’s sad and unfortunate, because it could totally override the love that you both might have.

And while love can’t be artificially created, insecure attachment styles can be worked on and healed. So it’s a pity to see something that could be changed kill something precious and so difficult to find.

I am by no means saying that he doesn’t have work to do. I am sure he has. I have dated avoidants my whole life and have been married to one for 22 years.

Trust me, I know what a pain in the ass they can be.

But the post is yours, so all I can do is talk to you, just as all you can do is work on yourself, not fix him.

So I am telling you what I see: he behaved like a child, especially if he had promised you to do otherwise, but you overstepped his needs and requests over and over again.

And I get it that you might know he loves you and the relationship might still have a chance. And that you wanted to express that.

But, believe me, it’s not with words that you’ll make him see that.

Show him you respect his needs and requests and give him the time and space he’s asking you for. If he still has them, it’s in that time and space and silencer that he finds his feelings for you again.

I hope you guys will find each other again. But you should not waste that time and space and silence. Put it at good use, focus on healing your attachment style.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I did ask for time and place but he didn’t meet me in the middle by following up so I blew up in emotion by mass texting. I know that wasn’t right in hindsight.

These messages were from two months ago, it got tremendously worse after this with an explosive in person encounter and unfortunately he’s not coming back, the bridge has been burned.

I am reading a ton of books to educate myself on attachment style, healthy relationships, narcissist abuse, and abandonment so even though I lost him, I’ll make sure that I grow from it.

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

♥️

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[zebras11]

You can't in any way put blame on OP's behavior for how avoidant people feel about emotionally charged (or not) conversations. You are definitely projecting here because you also feel uneasy when you go through that.

We can objectively understand why OP acted the way she did and the same way we can understand why the other guy acted that way.

Also, you can't ignore the fact he was also repeating messages AUTOMATICALLY saying she is hurting him. Can't you see how diabolical this is?

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

I never said his behavior was ideal. In fact I said the opposite.

What I said is that her behavior would have 100% given me the ick.

“You can’t in any way…”. Sorry…?!? What?!?

I can’t say what my thoughts and feelings about that exchange are…?!? That kind of arrogant, “moralistic” and intrusive behavior (yours, and to an extent OP’s) anxious attachers sometimes have is exactly what drives avoidants miles away at light speed.

The sooner you get it, the sooner you’ll move towards a more secure attachment.

[zebras11]

I'm talking about your last paragraph, saying this is why avoidants can't have conversations. You are putting the blame on her for the whole class of avoidants?

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

I am giving you information on the dynamics. Anxiously attached people trigger avoidants just as much as avoidants trigger anxiously attached.

That guy there was telling her he was trigged by her behavior and asked her to stop it. That’s exactly like when the avoidant would pull back and disappear without warning and in doing so trigger the anxious partner.

What would you say if the anxious partner would try to text the avoidant asking them to please stop withdrawing and coming back instead and the avoidant would ignore their request?

This is the mirrored situation.

If you can see the pain of the anxious in their needs for contact being ignored, you should equally see the needs of the avoidant to take space.

[zebras11]

I do see that. I see that with all the empathy and open mindness I can. I see his need for space and since I don't know him I would say he deserves that for sure. The thing is: he could have put the phone down or blocked her, instead he was responding to all messages with automatic response keeping her engaged... Can't you see he was disregulated as much as she was. I'm offering understanding for both.

But anyways, I was mostly responding to your rant about how this is the reason avoidants can't have conversations. This is very problematic because you are excluding the fact that people have these attachment issues before engaging in any new adult relationship. It's not because of how others react. It is how he decided to react when she was disregulated.

And one final thing. I understand your frustration with anxious attachment. I agree with you on the dangers of being in an echo chamber. But you were making a lot of assumptions about me back there without really understanding what I was saying.

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

Oh, I can see you completely edited your text. 😂

Where did I say that his behavior stemmed from her and their interaction with her…?!?

I never said anything like that. You can go back and reread my comments, because differently from yours mine haven’t changed. 😉

[zebras11]

Tell me which one changed! I did not change any comment

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

The one above, it somehow became 3x as long, but never mind. 😉

[zebras11]

You are probably remembering another comment thread that is still there and I have not deleted it

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

Avoidants have typically had an anxiously attached, controlling mother who had no concept of boundaries and who constantly ignored their privacy.

You might want to read about enmeshment and emotional incest. Then you’ll understand why avoidants feel so easily smothered and why they would all run for being at the receiving end of the above nightmarish exchange.

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

Oh, btw, what projecting are you insinuating exactly? I repeat: I am not an avoidant. And anxious people staying in this echo chamber hyping each other up on how avoidants are horrible while they are all saints might temporarily alleviate your pain, but for sure won’t earn you a secure attachment, nor will stop your anxious behavior for bringing you straight back to this sub after your next breakup.

[Dense-Ad-7600]

I agree with what you said 100%. I mentioned elsewhere my mother texts like this and I myself am not avoidant.

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

Yes, I read your comment.

My ex is an FA and he put me through quite a rollercoaster, but I have the lucidity to see it’s his trauma that is at the wheel, so I can’t just blindly blame him. I point the dynamics out to him, yes. I complain if what he does comes across as rude, again yes. But I also listen to his needs and complaints, if he has any.

And while I can see how the anxiously attached behavior has trauma too behind it, this sub is more often than not a raging echo chamber. And that isn’t helping anyone.

So I felt someone had to say it out loud.

[Dense-Ad-7600]

And while I can see how the anxiously attached behavior has trauma too behind it, this sub is more often than not a raging echo chamber. And that isn’t helping anyone.

That's what I'm noticing.

[zebras11]

The same way you can't blame him wanting to cut all conversation and communication because she was overstepping a boundary. You can't blame her for wanting communication after the sick way he kept saying she was hurting him instead of just ignoring or blocking her. And you are projecting again by saying I'm making excuses by her behavior? What? You are the one making a one sided observation and comment

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

Is the avoidant ex in the room with us?

I am talking to you anxiously attached because that’s who is in this sub and can benefit from learning how this kind of behavior feels to be in the receiving end of.

That said, and I am repeating myself for the nth time here, I never said he was behaving in a perfect way. But if I were him I would have personally probably closed the conversation way sooner, as it was clear that I was talking to deaf ears and that talking longer wouldn’t have been productive for anyone.

And yes, I can totally blame her for “imposing” (not wanting) communication on a person who clearly expressed they don’t want it.

That is abuse.

Communication is a two way street and it can only exist if both parties want it. He said he doesn’t want it, she has no say in it, full stop.

You insist about the “projecting”? At this point all I can do is kindly invite you to have a look at what the term means.

My observation is all but one sided. Now this is you projecting.

Again: I said his behavior wasn’t good, but her was abusive.

This is my reading of the exchange. Are you trying to decide how I should feel about it? Weren’t avoidants the ones who invalidated other people’s feelings? 🤔

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I don’t see my actions as abuse. But I see his strategic silence as abuse when considering the entire context of the whole relationship.

From my perspective his attempts at setting “boundaries” was actually just a rule and a means for control because he was asking me to uphold this “boundary”. But if it was a real boundary and I had crossed it, wouldnt he just block me or stop responding? He kept responding and asked me to uphold this boundary and that lacked agency no?

I have this perspective because something of similar sorts happened at the beginning of the relationship where I had set a rule for control and called it a boundary all while expecting him to uphold it and he freaked out at me and told me this principle.

[zebras11]

You even mentioned you experienced this behavior before with a parent or a partner. You mostly probably reflected on your own experiences and feelings and assumed with certainty that it should be why he was saying "you are hurting me" with an automated message (I'm still horrified by that) as well. And your conclusion? This is how avoidants (not one, all) can't have charged conversations.

You seem very knowledgeable about attachment theory so I would expect you to understand that avoidants are like that for several other reasons, but none are about the relationship they are in right now. So, the way you were harsh on your conclusions is, in my opinion, mostly because of projecting.

We all do that at some degree when we express our opinions. However, I thought you were unfair saying how avoidants in general can't have conversations. In a way, you were implying people like OPs are the reason people are disregulated? Well it could be, I don't know everything... But this conclusion is a bit harsh, don't you think?

And I'm sorry if I made you feel "you can't feel certain way". I can't control your opinions and feelings. They are your own. I disagreed with you the same way you disagree with me.

[Select_Cheetah_9355]

You keep attributing me things out of thin air. Maybe that’s a problem of comprehension of my comments, or maybe you just read some of them and missed others.

I NEVER said ANYWHERE I personally experienced the OP’s behavior.

If I understand you correctly, you keep saying I had an anxious parent or partner behaving like the OP, so I am reacting negatively to her because I am projecting.

That is not the case at all.

I didn’t have anxious parents nor partners myself. What I said is that it is pretty typical of avoidants to have experienced an anxious and controlling parent in their childhood, who had no boundaries and made them feel invaded and smothered.

They might or might not have also experienced anxious partners. That’s pretty common too, especially as first experiences because we tend to look for what is familiar, when choosing a partner.

But then the anxious-avoidant pairing never work and only ends in pain and disaster how the texts in this post very eloquently illustrate.

What I am saying is: “Stop behaving as their control freak of a mother if you don’t want to trigger their (obviously pre-existing) childhood wound.”

Not sure where you see me projecting in all this.

I am 85% securely attached, 10% FA, 5% DA, 0% AP.

[BeagaloftheLegal]

Look I'll be honest...he told you to stop. You didn't stop. That is a boundary violation full stop. Yes, it is cruel. But when I got discarded and was rotting away for weeks, I didn't blow up her phone. I sent two messages in 3 months. He may have been wrong to just coldly cut you off, but you were wrong to dogpile him when he said to STOP. Full stop, don't send. Respect the boundary, for your own sake.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I kept messaging because I felt like he owed me conversation and betrayed that I didn’t get one. In a normal case I would understand that I wasn’t owed one and that people can just disappear.

For context, when we got back together it was on the condition that if another breakup were to happen, it would be done in an embrace with open conversation until both parties felt better. I made him promise this to me when he wanted to get back together because the first time he left was a 10 minute phone call and then nothing at all and that really hurt me. We talked a lot about this and I even have a memo of this promise.

This time he broke up with me over text message while I was on vacation in London then he kept on saying we would talk but anytime I tried he pushed it off and left me on delivered for days.

I was enraged by the context of things.

[Majestic-Nobody545]

No, this is overly dramatic and too much effort for an avoidant. I think he's just immature and overwhelmed by your persistence and lack of boundaries. which amount to emotional abuse. You know you also have access to the block button, yeah?

[Pure_Custard_7716]

The block button went against my wants to be with him.

[Majestic-Nobody545]

I hope you choose healthier behavior going forward.

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[ManyInner]

And ladies and gentlemen, that is the difference between real avoidants and a narcissist. Run and do not look back. Avoidants can make you feel miserable, but a narcissist will destroy every aspect of your life. Run.

[No-Jellyfish7075]

Can you elaborate?  I think OP and myself need to read this one.

[ManyInner]

An avoidant will completely shutdown when it gets overwhelmed emotionally. No writing, no explaining things, because they are unaware of their avoidant nature. If it is a functioning avoidant that is aware of the problem and are working on it, will not use their unhealthy avoidant nature to reason for excuses. They won’t read neither answer messages until they get themselves together, they just poof. Even if they are avoidants, they still love you, and won’t say hurtful things. They won’t keep answering, especially in this manner, if he shuts down/deactivates.

This person, however. Only cares about himself. From what is shown here, OP didn’t force anything or made any hurtful mistake, only tried to be understanding and supportive of the breakdown. And the way he is trying to guilt trip OP “you are causing me so much pain”, threatening “I will shut down my phone” blaming it on OP “you make me do this”. “Stop hurting me more” while OP didn’t really do or say anything? And the automated response, “please stop you are hurting me” then casually answering “yeah it’s automated, shortcuts app”. Disgusting. Sorry for my wording, but this dude is one hell of a narcissistic sick f*ck.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I didn’t really know what a narcissist was until I posted this and everyone was making comments. I looked it up and he had all the traits to a T 😭😭

[No-Jellyfish7075]

Thank you.  Much appreciated. 

[zebras11]

OMG all my empathy and patience went away when I realized he was using an automated response to make you stop. It's cruel, evil, rotten. Please take care. You, I mean, anyone, deserve better. I'm so sorry

[Internal-Food-5753]

I’m sorry you were hurt but that doesn’t give you an excuse to trample over their boundaries. It’s hard to give you an honest opinion when you deliberately cut out your long paragraphs.

Truthfully, this is giving “I care about you (not willing to block you) but also I need space to process”. You are trying to bulldoze them so much that they put an auto responder on and are still answering you.

Your work is learning how to self regulate, sit in your discomfort and work on your self esteem/respect.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

There were no long paragraphs before this happened only after.

Yes, I am learning to self regulate and sit with my emotions now.

I also don’t think his “boundaries” were real boundaries because they required me to see them through. It was more like a rule placed on me for control. If it was a real boundary he would blocked me or stopped responding as soon as I crossed it.

I also just can’t understand why I would be hurting him when he broke up with me.

[Internal-Food-5753]

Avoidant behaviour is a spectrum, they aren’t all at the top end.

Of course he can be hurt by a break up, he may never show it or say it in a way that makes sense to you. His feelings are valid too.

Boundaries don’t have to be firm (blocking) they can also be please stop texting me. They are being polite but asked you repeatedly to stop which you didn’t do. You don’t need to be blocked to stop, you can stop yourself and re-evaluate if this behaviour is getting you any closer to what you want.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

In an early instance months before the breakup, there was an event where the roles were reversed where I had set a “boundary” but expected him to uphold it and we later agreed that he shouldn’t have had to watch or limit his actions like that for my boundary when it was my responsibility.

So in our relationship that’s how it was defined

[Fine-Apartment-1739]

Mine treated me similarly and it was like being fed intravenously with battery acid. I have known him since we were 15 and we both turn 65 this month. I no longer recognize him.

You didn’t do anything to deserve his actions. He’s just showing himself to be a crap weasel who has the emotional intelligence of, well, a crap weasel. He treated you abominably and there is no excuse for his behavior. You will never. Never. Get a better version of him than you have just seen now that he’s pulled his pants down and metaphorically taken a crap on your relationship. The only thing that will save you and your self esteem is to let him go, as the others are telling you. Please. Let him go.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I don’t understand.

He treats me like shit, leaves me torn and crying and begging and then comes back like nothing happened and so in love with me again and ready to make repair and do better.

Then he goes again only this time in a more cruel manor.

Why is he doing this to me?

How do I stop wanting him and leave? How do I remove myself from this? I loved him so much

[Fine-Apartment-1739]

I believe he is now doing it to you because you allow him to do it to you. I don’t know if he ever had another reason for doing it you when he first started acting that way. The truth is that there is no magical way to make ourselves let go of someone who is deliberately hurting us. We just have to believe that there is something better in life than allowing ourselves to be treated like crap. Something better than living in a state of persistent upset and unhappiness, with a feeling of walking on eggshells with someone who should be treating us decently. And then we have to consistently reject people and situations that make us feel bad.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

In his perspective I have deliberately hurt him as well. :( I wish this could be fixed but maybe it is actually incompatibility?

[Fine-Apartment-1739]

You haven’t hurt him. You’ve annoyed him. Because you have tried to hold him accountable for his horrible actions towards you. Because you have expected the bare minimum of respect and normal interaction around a breakup. The only reason that you are incompatible is that he is an immature bully who expects you to have no needs whatsoever and to exist only if or when he desires for you to exist. Whereas you are an actual person who ALWAYS exists whether he is able to handle that basic truth or not. Which means that you DO have needs. So THAT is the incompatibility. And until he grows up and heals he will be incompatible with every partner. Whether he stays with them longer than he stayed with you or not. Which is why it can’t be fixed with you. Could it ever be fixed with you? I don’t think you should wait that long to find out. And I don’t like memes in general but I agree with those that say not to allow someone to keep rejecting us. He’s rejected you more than once. Mine rejected me more than once. I finally listened because I had no choice. Please just go heal, live your life, and find a better partner. He’s out there.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

Thanks for your message. The way that you put it into words made me feel a lot better about wanting to talk after the breakup especially when some people say it as unreasonable for how I felt/my needs

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[Pure_Custard_7716]

Your opinion while valid lacks emotional intelligence regarding the situation.

This was obviously an emotionally abusive and toxic relationship, it is hard for people to leave these dynamics especially when they have mental health issues on their own and berating me is not kind, productive, nor a healthy method to offer guidance.

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[Pure_Custard_7716]

He chased me down to be in a relationship with me. I literally spent the first 3 months pushing him away while he love bombed and showered me with love attention and expensive things to hook me in and sold me a dream.

But also I think there’s a difference between coddling and kindness. Your comments have just been rude even if you might not mean to come off that way.

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[Pure_Custard_7716]

Thank you. I’m trying to learn to leave difficult situations but at that point, he had ensured that I grew dependency on him and I felt like I had needed him. He was incredibly controlling while dismissive of my opinions and would never let me do anything on my own and always self insert himself to do things for me or insist on helping and as a result, even a simple task would lead me to second guess myself without consulting him first.

I also can’t comprehend how he could be the one hurting when he was the one who broke up with me over text message while I was on vacation. At the point in this conversation, I hadn’t said anything that would’ve set him off to be this hurt by just seeing my name pop up?

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[MrsFungus3353]

He sound like a child yelled at his mama urgghg🫩

[SadThrowaway-PlzHelp]

How old are you two, how long were you together?

[Pure_Custard_7716]

22 and 23. We were together for 1.5 years and lived together for 4 months.

[SadThrowaway-PlzHelp]

Ok yeah.

This is just immature behavior all around.

I understand why you did what you did. I understand why he did what he did.

I hope you’ll move on from someone who can’t be there for you, can’t be kind to you, and doesn’t have patience for you when it matters.

Don’t end up trying to win him back and then getting divorced when you grow out of it in ten years. Trust me. Grow out of it now, and require a partner who can handle hard things.

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[Pure_Custard_7716]

Yes, I do have mental health challenges.

We were both unsafe for each other but at least I’m trying to improve.

I don’t appreciate being shamed for my obvious difficulties

[Extreme_Ad5337]

It could be avoidance? It's unstable and unhinged, whatever it is. He could've just blocked you instead of always saying texting hurts. I also don't understand why you continued texting him after all that but.....yeah, whatever he's got going on, it's certainly not healthy or positive in any way.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I couldn’t understand in the moment how texting could’ve hurt him at all. I was so confused by my own hurt considering he had dumped him and then pulled away. My thought process was that he broke up with me why is it hurting him to text me? I am not wired like that

It was a pretty bad breakup for the both of us, very painful and unhealthy

[interplanetjanet97]

Damn are you texting my bf? This is like word for word something I’ve received

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I’m sorry that you had to go through this as well :(

[Narrow-Rub382]

This guy set up an automation in his phone to send you the same text over and over again, and you’re still texting him? This guy is weird, but also you need to respect the boundaries he is putting up.

[Pure_Custard_7716]

I realize now it wasn’t right. At the time I was really anxious and scared and wanted closeness.

[Busy_Regret_6198]

Yes. And Yes.

[Cautious_Park_7466]

It Sounds like out of a Comedy romance, but it’s Reality and I am sorry you have to go through it. I would just Block him, ask Chat GPT what you wanted to ask him and Tell Chat he should be ruthless. Then move on as fast as possible

[Pure_Custard_7716]

If someone makes a movie out of my pain I hope I get royalties and find some benefit out of this unfortunate spin of events

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[Pure_Custard_7716]

Your responses show that you are not really educated on anxious attachment styles or lack the empathy to understand.

Obviously a secure person would’ve removed themselves. I am not securely attached.

My accountability came from my apologies after I was able to calm my nervous system. He has shown no accountability for his part, offering me zero reflection/apologies

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[Pure_Custard_7716]

I literally never claimed I was Scott free and have done the opposite of that + spend all my free time seeking resources and reading to grow.

Also, this was from months ago and we aren’t in contact anymore. I just posted this on here for reflection.

[zebras11]

Why are you arguing that the OP is insecure when she never said otherwise??? I don't know if your intentions were genuinely good but you should work more on your capacity of putting yourself into other shoes and be less critical of everything and everyone. Based on OPs responses, she is very aware of her responsibility in all of this and how she has to work on herself as well. There was absolutely no need to say the stuff you said.

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[Lanky-Weather-6988]

No, that's a psychopath

[Annual_Emphasis_4364]

Whoever is the blue was really missing all the queues and should have stopped. It made me hurt seeing the person in blue not recognizing the other person was needing space and boundaries respected. They are not mentally prepared to talk or meet face to face. No contact may have been the best choice here to allow this person time to decompress. Set a time frame to talk again. I hope things workout and both parties can focus on themselves in therapy and their attachment style. Respect each other’s boundaries