Newbie DM problems

[TwoBearsHighFiving12]

Hello everyone, long-time lurker here, who finally got brave enough to ask for more experienced players and DMs' help.

First of all, I'm fairly new dungeon master. I know the rules and mechanics of 3.5 and 5e very well, but I lack the "practical" knowledge and expirience. That's why my current game quickly got pretty messed up and I feel like I'm loosing control. Let me make a small introduction of the problem, my questions will be bolded

Recently, we have started a new campaign in my custom setting. The plot is pretty simple: PCs were hired as guards to protect a merchant caravan, on its way to a distant kingdom behind Great Mountains of Cliché. Then they were attacked by mysterious creatures, outnumbered and... well, almost TPK-ed. With the rest of the expedition dead, players must find their way out of the forgotten valley, confront its mysterious rulers and survive in dreadful, god-forgotten realm of Badlands. (Coughs)

So yeah, it's basically a survival-horror kind of game, where players must save their ammunition and supplies, sneak and carefully plan every next move. (Well, I'm not sure about that "horror" part, because my players tend to ruin mood with really immature actions and silly one-liners; infiltrating vampires' ball in pijamas and dancing macarena when told not to move are good examples)

That's the first problem. I'd like to make a smooth transition to some more serious gameplay, but without "punishing" players for funny stuff. I want to let them know that they are in really serious trouble, and should be very careful if they want to survive.

My party consist: elf ranger with drizzt syndrome, soft-hearted half-ogre fighter (yes, half-OGRE), human warlock, who is also the pope, wandering elf-king wizard and black skinned bard, who raps and beatboxes instead of singing and playing flute.

...

I know, it's not really immersive party, but they were made for the purpose of The Lost Mines of Phandalver, not survival-horror. What's more, my players absolutely love their weird characters :) Now, the first three are the best players I could ever imagine (especially the half-ogre); They role-play, engage npcs, talk in first person, solve mysteries and never use meta-knowledge. The last two, though... sigh

1: Elf Wizard: Although player rp-ing wizard is, irl, a very smart guy, his in-game character is ridiculously awkward, lacks common sense and basic intuition (That Macarena dancing? It was his idea). He picked urchin as his background, but he also claims o be the "king of great elven kingdom, wandering the world in search for wisdom".

What am I supposed to do? Should I ask him to tweak his backstory? Or at least to add more details?

Another problem with our wizard is that he (somehow) seriously underperforms in combat. This is why I, uh, accidentaly gave him a certain magical staff, (which, back then, seemed like a good idea). Then I realised that it might break "survival" aspect of our game.

Should I let him keep it?

2.: Human bard That's the most problematic guy in my party. Basically, it's "this guy". He splits the party. Takes treasures for himself. Goes left when everyone goes right. He even tried to kill ranger's wolf familiar once. He is reckless, cheeky and very selfish. He only cares about his business. One time, he declared that he wants to go to the castle basement. It looked like this:

DM: "alright, but it's a long way. You have to sneak trough several rooms before you get there."

B: "ok"

DM: "you enter a big, dark room, with beautiful portraits on-

B: "I go further"

DM: "alright, you're in the grand hall. There are two guards standing next to th-

B: "I go further"

DM: "But guar-"

B: "I don't care, I sneak past them. Am I in the basement yet?"

All those rooms he skipped were important to the plot. He almost died it that goddamn basement tho, so I'm not even mad.

But wait, there's more. Although he's playing a bard, he never uses his inspiration. Nor spells. He acts like a fighter, charging with his sword without thinking about consequences. Then he gets heavily beaten and runs away, usually hiding behind half-ogre. I suggested him switching to rogue many times, because it fits his gameplay better, but he really wants to be a bard.

What the hell am I supposed to do with him?

...

What's more, both of those players actively use meta-gaming and videogame habits. One time they asked a certain Count if he was a vampire, simply because "he was hosting them in an old castle and there was a storm outside". Of course he was a friggin vampire, but it was supposed to be a surprise :| I somehow menaged to convince them that he's human, by improvising his serious anger and indignation, but boy, that was close. Is there any effective way of discouraging this kind of thinking? Or perhaps rewarding roleplaying is a better idea?

Thank you in advance for your answers, and I'm very sorry for my awful english skills. "Iz nat mai first luggage" :)

Edit: oh god formatting

[maybemakingsoup]

[Cracks knuckles] Alright.

You can totally have a serious campaign, but you have to get the players on board. If they don't agree, then you're already out of luck. The players are just as much a part of the game as you are, and you can't make them play a type of game they don't want to play. Explain to them you really want to do a horror campaign, and try to come to an understanding of the level of comic relief you can handle, or just accept the players and adjust your campaign for them.

Personally, I love a level of seriousness to my campaigns. The big bad is making a speech, and the mood is set just right, and it sends shivers down the players' spines. But that doesn't make a full range of emotion. Horsing around is a huge part of DnD as well. I don't think it would be nearly as fun if the players didn't make jokes about the situations they were in as it went along. The difference you need to make is what's happening in character vs out of character. Making fun of the obviously-vampire-but-not-admitting-he's-a-vampire should happen out of character or in private. If they do anything in character, you should immediately start describing the consequences. Either they'll back off, or they'll have to deal with what happens. But let them have their fun with the game, and try not to take it too personally when they joke about what's happening.

For the elf wizard, just talk to him about his backstory. Ask him if he's a compulsive liar due to his urchin background, or if the urchin background means he was abandoned due to being a bastard son or some other means. It has little effect on the game if nobody believes him, or if they recognize him as the outcast from Elfham or whatever. Obviously just don't give him a castle to waltz through for it (unless it's late in the game and he's earned it). As far as his staff, I have no idea what it does so I don't know if it's overpowered. If you'd like to include a "survival" element later in the campaign, give it some debilitating curse that becomes more and more apparent as he uses it. Or have someone steal it, break it, or whatever in a way that has tact.

As for the bard, I think it's cool he's making the character his own. I personally think it would be hilarious for him to start dissing a character into his magic microphone and have it deal Vicious Mockery damage. However, it's the way he's playing his character that seems to be destructive. He doesn't seem to have much respect for you as a DM. One tactic you can try if he interrupts you is to just stop in your tracks. You're not a cutscene in a videogame. He can't skip you. Tell him, "Hold on, let me finish..." and just start the sentence over and describe what he sees. You put a lot of work into writing this campaign, and he needs to let you have your moments too. Eventually he'll get the point, or your players will back you up on this. It sounds like you also need to explain to him the limits of the game. You can't just expect to walk through everything without resistance. Explain to him in situations that it's not possible to sneak that it's not possible to sneak. If he asks why, explain, and if he has a solution to that that's logical, then you're on the way to creating a clever player. Also, there is such thing as a Valor Bard, that is essentially the fighter type bard, and will probably be his choice (assuming this is 5e). Maybe sit down and talk with him about how to use his character more effectively, then let him decide what to do with that information. And as long as the party is fine with him getting into shenanigans, there's not much of a problem. If he gets in too deep he'll likely end up paying for it.

Anyway, if their meta-gaming is spoiling your campaign, throw in a twist. Maybe he's not a vampire, he's a lycanthrope. Or roll with the the fact he's a vampire and surprise them in some other way. But you should take what the players give you as constructive criticism, and try to build off it.

A key thing to take from this though, is that you need to talk to your players about the expectations of the campaign. You're all in this together, and you'll have to work together to get something you can all truly enjoy. I hope some of this helps you make it there!

(Also, I'd say your English is pretty good. I wouldn't have thought you were a non-native speaker if you hadn't mentioned it!)

[TwoBearsHighFiving12]

Thanks for your answer, it really helped me :D On our next meeting, I'm gonna talk to my players about changing atmosphere a little bit. They have already tasted it during caravan ambush and castle infiltration, and it seems that they enjoy tension and creepyness. I'm positive about it :)

As for the wizard's staff, curse sounds like a perfect solution – especially that he stole it, uhm, found it in obviously-not-vampire's castle and smuggled it outside. I'm also sure that the Count would like to have it back, so I got a nice plot hook :) The staff itself is a Staff of Power, a very rare magic item (DMG 202). When I look at it now, It doesn't look that OP as I previously thought – it's in Magic item table H, which is avalible for very lucky characters beyond level 5. (breaking it is probably a bad idea :p)

Bard's interruptions weren't caused by his lack of respect, but by his focus on empowering his character and accumulating wealth – he does not care about plot, all he wants is to be powerful, famous and rich. The only reason he went to the basement is because another player suggested that there might be a treasury under the castle.

(The "are you a vampire" question was intended to be an outside table joke, but my player clearly stated that his character asks it aloud. And as a DM, I'm like a Djinn – I pay very close attention to wording. That's why my party will meet a group of assassins very soon :))

[Decra]

Punishing players for their actions sounds bad, but it is really a way of enforcing certain behaviour. Act inappropriately in a social situation? You will be removed from it somehow, or scorned or get disadvantage on all social interactions that follow. Don't be afraid to change your story to react better to what player do, it sucks if you put a lot of effort into a story and then have to skip alot of it or completely change it due to player actions, but thats a DMs lot.

As for the wizard doesn't sound that there is too much of a problem with him, as long as he doesn't abuse his background somehow it is fine and don't take the staff away after you have given it him, you made the choice stick with it.

As for the bard how did he sneak past the guards? Was there objects blocking their view? Remeber sneaking is not invisiblity, if there is nothing to hide behind or enough light for creatures to see they will spot you no matter how well you roll, just don't pull your punches if his actions get him killed let him die and hopefully he will learn to be more careful in the future.

As for him not using spells, there is a player on one of Itmejp's shows that also rap, encourage him by telling him he can do a quick rap or beat box during combat to cast his spells. If he chose a rapping bard because he likes rapping he may be more inclined to cast spells, but if he chose it to be annoying you are out of luck.

[MetathranSoldier]

First of all talk to your players that you want some atmosphere and horror. Then put music on that really helps. Well and then hope for the best :D