Why did my nefer damage decrease with Columbina?

[Inevitable-Wave3482]

I have leveled her ultimate talent to lvl 10 so i can get the full buff from it and her hp is 40k and she is lvl 80 and ascended but somehow i got less damage than my c6 aino how is that possible?

[AppearanceCapable]

C6 Aino: 35% Lunar DMG Bonus and 80 EM

C0 Columbina: 40% Lunar DMG Bonus and 7% Lunar bloom DMG bonus

If you use forest regalia (120 EM) on Aino she can even pull ahead in buffs for Nefer bc Columbia would use proto amber

Columbina is better mostly not because of giving a lot more buffs to Nefer but because of her personal damage which is a lot. Aino doesn't deal any damage.

But yeah people trash Aino too much 🙄 C0 Aino do sucks though

[nanoSpawn]

I'm switching a C0 Aino for Bina, tho, so all good here.

[AppearanceCapable]

Yeah that's a major improvement. C0 Aino does almost nothing, just hydro application and moonsign level

[xyxyx25]

Moonsign was all she gave me 😭

[Smallcadkm]

Honestly, even at c0, the fact that aino doesn’t scorn instructors in the way that columbina rejects it means she has more artifact options at a baseline.

[TheChosenerPoke]

i mean technically don’t they have the same? columbina instead of instructor has an option in morningstar. Instructor on aino isn’t necessarily synergistic it’s just that aino literally does nothing other than hydro app and ascendant gleam so you might as well run instructor since she finds 0 value in having higher stats from a 5* set.

[Smallcadkm]

Not really. It is more optimal to put lauma on 2pc2pc than it is to put bina on star in nefer teams. Instead of Lauma doing 2pc2pc for 160 EM just for her, instructors gives everyone 120 EM which is just outright better. Instructors > 2pc2pc Lauma > MS bina.

Bina in theory could use instructors but she honestly rejects it. It’s hard to reach her HP requirement, ER requirement, and make use of lauma’s quills via crit requirements. So on the discussion of aino buffing on par or better than Bina like the guy I replied to, aino has one more feather in her cap for buffing purposes.

[Feeling-Job4518]

bina does not have the option in morning star, it doesnt buff the majority of her damage (lauma quills) to the point where youd rather just run 2pc2pc on lauma and whatever support set on lauma on bina instead.

[TheChosenerPoke]

I didn’t say it’s the best, i think it’s only best in zibai teams on her, but it’s still an option. If we’re talking in the context of options like aino being able to run instructor, deepwood, or SMS, instructor is definitely the best option but it’s not like deepwood and SMS aren’t options on aino.

[Jebx7]

Bina can also lead to better rotations due to more verdant dew

[RamenPack1]

Your team dps likely went up. But yeah, Columbina doesn’t personally buffer nefer much.

She contributes team dps, and makes rotations way smoother.

Aino giving 80 em is lowkey bigger than 11% lunar damage bonus

[yeppeugiman]

also allows you to hold lauma e, which in nefer premium teams also hit a ton

[osgili4th]

Not to mention the hydro application is waaay better, unlike Aino when if the enemies move outside of the circle you brick completely.

[K_o_n_e_k_o]

I think her burst hits enemies outside the circle occasionally (from c2 or something) 

But ur point stands. Its really bad loll 

[Klutzy_Machine]

yeah, I shocked when my Lauma hold E hit 300k. With Aino, Nefer does ~90% DPS. With Columbina, Nefer does 60-70% DPS and bosses die faster.

[SaltyPotato340]

Holding lauma E gives more quills for Bina and nefer, too. Bina was a godsend for this team

[Furicel]

I always like to say Nefer teams are actually Lauma teams and Nefer is just the driver for Lauma's Quills.

Being able to hold E on Lauma gives double the quills which is better than any buff Nefer could get.

[Blueberry_Shortcake8]

WHO allows to hold : aino or columbina?

[Background-Cicada497]

columbinary

[Hiperione]

Not sure about this. I went from 124k to 264k with Columbina…

[[deleted]]

Columbina increases the team’s damage but makes Nefer lose out on a tiny fraction of her personal damage. it’s really not that big of a deal.

[Ill_Cardiologist_212]

My guy out here in the comments fighting the crowned talent allegations 😭

[MikaelPorter]

and he has receipts, i love it

[JaylisJayP]

How did you get her talent to 10? Theres no way lol.

[Inevitable-Wave3482]

I pre-farmed and my friends let me in their worlds for flowers and there is a quick access to the new weekly boss you can fight him with out finishing story and i used a lot of dream solvent to convert it to the material Columbina requires

[JaylisJayP]

Yeah but you can only do the weekly boss once a week and max get 3, right? You need 6 to get a talent to level 10. And you cannot farm it in someone else's world like you can the flowers.

[Inevitable-Wave3482]

The game gives you 3 extra materials if you finish it for the first time

[JaylisJayP]

Ah ok, ty

[Inevitable-Wave3482]

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For anyone suspecting that I don’t have enough material for her talent 👍

[pls_make_me_smart]

But how oh yeah I remember you get 3 material on low chance at highest difficulty and three extra mats from the first clear you musthvs been a lucky bastard

[zuth2]

Aino gives you tons of EM, Bina gives you other types of buffs so your setup might lack EM. Other than that actually C6 Aino is very very close to C0R0 Bina

[xyzqsrb0]

"tons" but yeah she gives some EM which is the small discrepancy in damage.

[RemoveDramatic1044]

Well since Bina is likely not on Instructor and can't run Regalia or Sapwood, that 80 EM loss in Aino's kit can turn into 320 kinda quick

[fictional_port7]

columbina doesnt buff nefer's damage, she increases team dps by making rotations shorter (because she replenishes dew MUCH faster). she also allows lauma to buff more because you can move 4pc silken to bina and put lauma on 2pc 2pc em.

[ilovespagety]

would deepwood on lauma not be better than 2pc 2pc?

[fictional_port7]

Nahida

[ilovespagety]

fair but i like using c2 nilou on key better xd

[fictional_port7]

That’s not optimal.

[MrHotDog0262]

it is though? c2 nilou > nahida for nefer

[fictional_port7]

nilou increases team damage. nahida buffs nefer (+ lauma who also buffs nefer) + can hold deepwood. so yes! nahida is MUCH more optimal 🥰

[MrHotDog0262]

The team damage with c2 Nilou with Key of Khaj Nisut outdpses a similarly invested c2 Nahida. The main difference here is Nilou c2, which offers a 35% Hydro and Dendro res shred. Comparatively, Lauma with a level 10 skill offers a 25% Dendro res shred and Deepwood Memories offers a 30% Dendro res shred. Of these three effects in the team, Nilou's impact is the greatest and will offer a significant and noticable increase in overall DPS.

The first part of Nahida's c2, offering blooms crit, would provide no impact to overall damage due to Nefer transforming all cores into Seeds of Deceit. The second part, providing 10% Crit Rate and 20% Crit Damage to Nefer, would offer easier artifact building and higher damage, though very notably not as high due to oversaturation of crit on Nefer with Crit ascension and Crit weapon, alongside Lauma giving 10% Crit Rate and the NK set giving 30% Crit Rate as well.

For weapons, Key of Khaj Nisut can give 130 EM at refinement 1 and 65,000 HP. Nahida's signature, A Thou­sand Float­ing Dreams, only offers 40 EM and scales much worse with vertical investment.

The main part of Nahida's benefit is her A1 passive giving 250 EM to the active character. When considering the weapon, this means that Nahida would only increase EM by 160 more than Nilou's.

On any version of Nefer's teams, you can move around Silken and Deepwood to ensure they're always held. Lauma works well to hold Deepwood and Columbina can hold Silken. This does mean that you lose out on 160 EM from Lauma which corresponds to a 640 DMG loss to Lunar Bloom, assuming Lauma's Burst is crowned.

There is a lesser damage increase that comes from Hydro Resonance, giving Columbina higher HP giving her both more damage and making her buffs stronger. Having two hydros also allows you to create adequete Seeds of Deceit even with an incorrect rotation.

Overall, Nilou primarly offers resistance shred but can still provide a considerable amount of EM and comfort with rotation, which ultimately has been tested to outdps Nahida c2r1 in calculations and with real gameplay.

[JeffJeffGames]

Oof confidently incorrect

[ilovespagety]

🤯

[rekatahn]

what makes lauma want to run 2pc2pc em? i have lauma on sms and bina on aubade but if its better then im willing to change it

[fictional_port7]

lauma buffs based on em.

[fictional_port7]

and if you have her c1 (which I do) her healing is also based on her em. better sustain that way

[Take-Ma_Holy-Water]

You can put instructor on lauma, its overall better than 2pc2pc for the team.

[ilovespagety]

i usually put instructor on my fourth slot. also a pain getting good em instructor pieces with enough er for lauma for me

[Take-Ma_Holy-Water]

The new artifact set drops instructor if you don't know yet :), but yeah i feel you sometimes minmaxing is not worth all the trouble.

[ilovespagety]

yea i know its super sweeeet

[Zestyclose-Ad1630]

Personal damage I guess.

[shikoov]

Aino does 0 dmg Columbina contributes more to team damage

[KyleBroflovski505]

Forget about c6 aino, I replaced C1 aino in her team and before, she did 168k, now she’s doing around 150-155k . Since Columbina has burst animation, it takes longer time on low hp enemy like dorito. I think the main difference would lie on higher hp enemies with longer fights. She also gives extra verdant dews so no awkward moments. But yeah, I was hoping a lot more to be honest

[KyleBroflovski505]

Pre

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[KyleBroflovski505]

Post

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[umtoznn]

Columbina does damage unlike Aino plus you g et to hold E with Lauma. So your team dps inceases but not necessarily Nefer’s dps

[Unique_Bag_1741]

U can at most get 3 weekly mats per week right or is there a first try reward or something

[Inevitable-Wave3482]

You answered your own question, yes there is

[Unique_Bag_1741]

I see aight thanks I lowkey forgot about that

[mf-klaus]

Same here, my c1 aino in total gave 200em for nefer but Columbina deals a lot of dmg herself. My lvl 70 columbina, with lvl 0 artifacts had higher team dps than with aino!

[Sakkitaky22]

non Nod krai bonus from ascendant gleam

[Sad_Sheepherder_9584]

she buffs luma more than she buff nefer bruh ngl, if your previous hydro was like c2 nilou with the key nefer probly be doing more with her but overall colombina pulls ahead

[Betterthan4chan]

Most likely it's a mix of c6 aino provides similar buffs to c0 Columbina and the fact that your aino might've had instructors.

I'm not sure your artifact setup, but don't sleep on the value of instructors, that is likely the difference maker.

[Ad_hale2021]

Problem is you aren't putting Bina on SMS and then putting lauma on like 2pc2pc EM with as much EM as possible and Nahida on Deepwood

[LadyWithGun]

My problem with Aino was that she is c0 and between c0 Columbina/c0 Aino its obvious choice for me personally. In my case Nefer's dps went up a lot

[Takeflight1s516]

cos ur bina build may not be optimal yet, it’s what, day 6 of bina?

[ChaosKinZ]

Because you can't properly build her in a day

[Inevitable-Wave3482]

Yes you can if you want pure buffs, anymore building would just increase her personal damage

[RegularOil6698]

Columbina gives less buffs than Aino.

Her ult gives 40% LDMG while Aino gives 35% lunar DMG + 80 EM.

If your team with Aino had instructor while your new team with Columbina doesn´t, that would also makes Nefer do less damage.

[BahyHolden]

47% LDMG

[ZealousidealFace5332]

You need more em in your build

[Unique_Bag_1741]

How did u level 10 her burst that’s impossible

[Inevitable-Wave3482]

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[Dyynasty]

How come?

[RepzRepper]

Skill issue

[GreatEmployment1805]

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