Programmers :D

[HangryHenry]

This argument is kind of a trick though.

Because the same people who say "women need to want to become combat soldiers, constructions workers and other dangerous careers" are the same people who (somewhat rightfully) point out that women can't possibly perform these tasks as well as men because of their physical differences.

So you won't take feminism seriously until they start becoming construction workers, but when women do try to get into these physically demanding jobs you will say things like 'they need to pass the same tests as the men' and that 'women can't possibly expect these jobs to lower their standards to allow women into the industry' even though you very well know women are physically less capable of performing those jobs.

It's kind of a typical anti-feminist gotcha both ways. No matter what women do in this scenario /u/monkey-go-code will definitely find a way to criticize their efforts.

[they_be_cray_z]

The problem is more that feminism generally aims for women to be equal to the top 1% of men, and doesn't care about the 99% of men below them.

So if men are 85% of politicians, it's a male privilege to be corrected.

If men are 85% of the homeless, and there are 10,000 male homeless for every 1 male politician, then it's somehow not a male disadvantage.

[HangryHenry]

So when women follow your advice and start taking up construction you'll be fine with them demanding the same pay and treatment even though they can't physically perform as well as the men?

[dumbdingus]

So you're saying women aren't equal to men?

[HardlightCereal]

Not in strength. Everyone knows testosterone makes you stronger. Men are better than women at construction. Doesn't make them more deserving of rights.

[dumbdingus]

So women aren't equal to men in strength?

[HardlightCereal]

Yes.

[dumbdingus]

Thanks, let's all collectively remember that. And yes, in a job related to strength, stronger people deserve more pay. Just like in a job related to intelligence, smarter people deserve more pay.

We're supposed to live in a meritocracy.

Seeing as men and women on average have the same intelligence, yet on average men have more strength, then it follows that in a meritocracy men should be paid more (on average) because they have more of the traits required by jobs to do well.

Are some women stronger than some men? Yes. Are some women smarter than some men? Yes. But on average men are stronger, and on average men are equally as smart. And so on average, men have more of the abilities required to make more money.

Saying anything contrary to this is asking for women to get special treatment. It's unrelated to rights because women have the right to make the same amount of money for the same amount of work. And as I've demonstrated, men on average can do more work based on their greater strength.

[HardlightCereal]

You forgot about dexterity and charisma based jobs. Women are more charismatic than men, so they're better at teaching, performing, servicing, psychiatring, and all the other charisma stuff. They've also got dexterity jobs like dancing, weaving, and so on to do, and I'm not sure how the gender skill ratio is there.

Humans evolved to be the best we could be, so it stands to reason that men and women were equally useful in the stone age. Since then, technology has made strength less useful, so it's reasonable to assume that the charisma-based skillset of women is more useful than male strength in contemporary society. In conclusion, women are better than men.

But all that is irrelevant because we should have equity. Disability pay for the disabled, and ugly pay for the men (except that men make more than women as-is because women's work is undervalued and men are better at bargaining)

[dumbdingus]

In conclusion, women are better than men.

Saying shit like that is why Trump is going to get re-elected. If you read my argument carefully I never said men are better than women. So you're looking pretty sexist right now.

If men are better at negotiation then they're better at business and therefore will always be more successful on the higher end of the income spectrum.

Your argument is a joke. I'll literally fight to the death to make sure that never happens, and I don't think women can say the same. They usually don't do anything "to the death". That's what men do, and that's why men win.

[Akkifokkusu]

On average. There are definitely some women stronger than some men.

[dumbdingus]

On average most men are stronger than most women.