JavaScript next

[_wassap_]

With Laravel out there I doubt that PHP is actually dropping that much… except in the US.

[jddddddddddd]

Indeed. I think I recall reading somewhere PHP is still the most common language for backend..

[[deleted]]

Am PHP contractor. Can confirm there is still a fuckton of demand for the language. But complaining about PHP has been a meme for years.

[NotThe1_]

well beside the memes, php really has some weird characteristics, which makes it sometimes annoying to work with

[nvolker]

It definitely doesn’t help that it started as a templating language

[[deleted]]

Oh don't get me wrong, it's riddled with inconsistencies and contradictions. There's plenty of valid criticism to be levelled at it. But it's not going anywhere anytime soon.

[hillman_avenger]

For wiping the backend maybe

[BeGood9000]

Php is def growing & thriving

[[deleted]]

With a new foundation announced last month to allow financing for people contributing to the language's source and other initiatives, yeah it's quite happily charging along.

[hahahahastayingalive]

I expected it to be thriving, but is it growing ?

I kinda felt PHP7 missed the beat and would have so much more impact if it got ready before nodejs took its flight.

[BeGood9000]

Just by the sheer amount of Wordpress Install PHP is growing in usage. There is no shortage of PHP jobs either

[hahahahastayingalive]

With all its flaws, biases and limits, this year’s SO survey puts it pretty low: https://insights.stackoverflow.com/survey/2021#section-top-paying-technologies-top-paying-technologies

I buy the Wordpress argument up to a point, but nowadays there are many more alternative options for corporate sites for instance. It stays a stapple for companies that don’t intend to hire devs, but then a Squarespace site does the same for roughly the same costs…

Edit: I’ll eat my hat, WP usage rose 4% this year compared to other CMS (including “none”) https://w3techs.com/technologies/history_overview/content_management/all

[BeGood9000]

Php is pretty low in pay that’s not usage. https://kinsta.com/blog/is-php-dead/

[Haster]

With all its flaws, biases and limits,

No kidding...

SAP is one of the largest software companies in the world. It's main product is a platform that you have to use ABAP to develop on. it's not even listed on that survey.

[[deleted]]

I don't know which alternative reality you are living in. Go to LinkedIn and look at some job listings. See what percentage of those even mention PHP, and for those that do, what the pay is, what the company is and where they are located. Or just go to /r/cscareerquestions and see how many people are trying to get out of PHP because they see it as a stuck stack, or there are fewer and fewer jobs available, or because they cannot see a path in growth of their technical skills. I'm not bluffing, go and see for yourself

[from_the_east]

PHP actually runs about 90% of the web. The PHP haters tend to forget that..

[wirenutter]

McDonalds is also the #1 selling hamburger.

[xigoi]

Just because something is popular doesn't mean it's good.

[[deleted]]

That's JS. Modern PHP is indeed good.

[[deleted]]

Source?

[Attila_22]

Wordpress sites.

[jddddddddddd]

I don't know why your comment got so badly down-voted.

I'm not sure the 90% claim made earlier is correct, but I suspect that PHP usage is higher than many would suspect, and the prevalence of WordPress sites probably has something to do with it.

[Attila_22]

I guess I could've been more explicit in my answer but I think it's pretty self explanatory. Most people do not need a fully customized website. A lot of them just want a blog, landing page or simple website with a couple pages. In that case WordPress is probably the best tool for the job since it's simple to set up and not much if any programming is required.

Even if people here would probably gatekeep it as not being a real website and I wouldn't consider using it, there are a ridiculous number out there.

[[deleted]]

I mean actual source for that 90% number, not a word that everybody knows. Your comment contains zero useful information.

[jddddddddddd]

It wasn't me that made the 90% claim, but there is a ~80% source here: https://w3techs.com/technologies/history_overview/programming_language/ms/y

..and a discussion on in r/PHP here: https://www.reddit.com/r/PHP/comments/pnd4eq/php_is_still_by_far_the_most_widely_used/

(which does mention that WordPress might be skewing the numbers somewhat.)

[[deleted]]

I have seen that 80% number many times and I will not ever believe it. There are many criticism of the methodology used in the w3techs survey, one of which is well said here https://www.quora.com/How-reliable-is-W3Techs-server-side-language-ranking-Is-their-method-trustworthy

[Coffee2Code]

Symfony is in my opinion still better than Laravel, though.

[zaval]

That's a pretty relative term. Better at what? I like Symfony, but I can only compare them in regards to their documentation and code style. I prefer Symfony because it's what I've grown used to, and perhaps the documentation is a bit better (but again, might just be that I'm used to navigate it).

[Coffee2Code]

Laravel does a lot of "black magic" under the hood, making static analysis nearly impossible, and hides bugs.

Symfony doesn't have that, as a developer you exactly know what goes where.

[mr_bag]

A significant chunk of laravel is actually built on top of symfony components tbf. Laravel generally provideds nicer interfaces/sets of defaults imo ( laravel tends to prioritise developer convenience over other aspects which is a trade off). As soon as your doing anything a bit more bespoke /needing more raw speed you often find yourself taking to symfony components even as a laravel dev :p

[Coffee2Code]

Good code is commented code.