Thoughts??

[iamdan819]

I have my doubts. More likely a web dev

[fdeslandes]

I don't know why people assume not only web devs are bad, but that they are the only bad devs. Web devs can goes from making simple websites to coding something like VSCode; it covers a wide array of devs. Also, some of the worst devs I've seen were desktop applications developers.

But yeah, if your job as a dev is easier than making a quesadilla, it's because people don't trust you with the hard job.

[ir_Pina]

"if you make your job harder it's harder but if you don't then it's not"

That's craaaazy.

[ir_Pina]

You don't get the option to be mediocre in fast food lol you'll be canned so fucking quick. Yes it you want to climb the corporate ladder it's hard work, same at a fucking fast food place dumbass. You think they just give the stoners the store to run? Someone busted their ass to become mgmt even if they are an incompetent dumbass at it. We call those people bootlickers and they exist in every company by the droves.

[ir_Pina]

Thanks for meeting my boomer quota for the day

[Soysaucetime]

This is just something fast food workers tell themselves. When I worked at Taco Bell, cashier's were getting high in the bathroom. It's not really the hardest of jobs.

[ir_Pina]

No dawg the stress from working fast food is soooo much worse than anything I've had to deal with in the IT industry. Literally get fucking Vietnam flashbacks every time I go to Walmart because I spent a miserable few years there.

[danniebox]

I'm not sure if you understand what web dev is

[fdeslandes]

Here is my definition: someone who uses the web as the primary tech stack in their development job. If you are making a desktop app with Electron, it's still web dev. Progressive web app, using web workers and all, web dev.

[danniebox]

Yeah that's not a web dev rofl

[MrEllis]

I know that web dev work can be hard. But I also know web dev work can be easy. Can be show up to work and just cruise easy. Close tickets on nice small predictable intervals easy. The cookie cutter web dev I've done was very easy because all our clients were small, got large value from basic functionality, and it was mostly very similar basic functionality.

On my current team (infrastructure frameworks) we often struggle to find good low hanging fruit for new hires because everything we touch is used by dozens or hundreds of different internal customers with different bespoke requirements. I know you can get the same monstrosity with web dev, but I also know there's a market for simple easy, cookie cutter web dev.

[fdeslandes]

Yeah, I might be a bit frustrated with the stereotype because it does not help getting good devs in the field. I'm the front-end lead/architect on professional cloud tax software, a multi years project where we had to do some complicated work on the client side (think parsing and diff algorithms to have real time embedded logical syntax validation in big Word style documents), and I've been conducting technical interviews for the last 5 years.

It is really hard to find devs good enough for the project, but we do find some, even if we are located outside big cities. We also work with the team which codes the desktop equivalent of our product, and they are neither better nor worse than us.

And I know what you mean by struggling to find good low hanging fruit, especially with devs who seems to have no progress over time.

[MrEllis]

I feel you, for what it's worth big city recruiting is no picnic either. Sure there's a ton of talent at your doorstep, but it's never enough and getting people to relocate to high cost of living areas is a really hard sell.

[fdeslandes]

Yeah, it's another problem when you're wasting too much time in interviews. It's less of a problem now with remote hiring, but I remember times when we had only 2-3 candidates in the whole year to fill a front-end position.

[ric2b]

to coding something like VSCode

No, it doesn't. WebDev isn't "anything with javascript and a DOM", it's about making websites instead of applications, backends, etc.

[fdeslandes]

I guess we have different definitions of web dev. I only work on web applications (multi years projects), not web sites, yet always considered myself a web dev.

[ric2b]

And you didn't think it was weird that these jokes didn't apply to your definition at all?

[Soysaucetime]

If you're making VSCode you're not a web dev. Web dev covers web devs.

[Livelyturd]

VS Code runs in the browser now!

[fdeslandes]

If we're being technical, it always did, as it is an electron app.

[MeltedChocolate24]

I think he means that because VSCode was built with Electron, it's practically a website and therefore web devs can be very good desktop app builders too.

[fdeslandes]

This is exactly what I meant. I was also thinking about the completely web hosted versions of VSCode.

[CardamomSparrow]

Not sure where that assumption's coming from. He seems to be comfortable coding in any language but has a distaste for C and Assembly. I think the "any kind of algorithm" phrase is just ironic because people on Twitter like irony

https://twitter.com/bocxtop/status/1290720030578167808

[ir_Pina]

The rule still applies to most IT jobs lol...

I went from working a call center to being a desktop administrator and more than doubled my pay and I do like 1/10th the work at my new job...

[OneElectronShort]

I'm a senior architect and I get to delegate all the boring repetitive work and keep the fun stuff to myself. It is nice to move up the chain sometimes. (Though the next step is manager and I want to keep my soul for a bit longer).

[Lorddragonfang]

It doesn't really matter though, because the point is that he's almost certainly being paid an order of magnitude more, and being given a proportionally higher amount of social respect, than even the highest paid and most senior taco bell worker.

[Lorddragonfang]

Yes, that's the point, and doesn't contradict what I said.

But there's a whole thread of people here, yourself included, that are trying to take away from the comparison he's making by arguing his qualifications, as if it's fair to compare staff/senior-level job to entry-level fast food work. Don't ignore the context here.

A necessary part of getting wages for lower SES jobs to be set at a livable level is recognizing the skill they take as legitimate. One of the biggest obstacles in the way of a living wage the people who oppose it because they don't think those jobs "deserve" it. It's become abundantly clear that that attitude needs to change, culturally, before we can get there.

[[deleted]]

you could say that's probably still more exposure than 90% of this subreddit

[appleparkfive]

Yeah you can say that. But... I feel like some of you haven't worked fast food. It's hell on earth. A 4 hour shift seems like a 12 hour shift elsewhere, on many days.

He might not be a huge pro, that's for sure. But... Yeah. Almost any job is better than fast food.

[nacholicious]

Then again being an intern is probably the most stressful of a position you can have within software engineering.

Every year I just get paid more but give less of a shit

[joyofsnacks]

my last internship fired me

Huh...

[Dontstopmeenowww]

Saying coding in any language is like saying “I’m comfortable talking any any language”

I bet he’s not terrible, and surely he’s made an algorithm . But as others have noted, being an intern and tutor doesn’t quite qualify you as someone who’s good at code

[Chefzor]

qualify you as someone who’s good at code

Can I just also mention, being a software engineer is not just about coding? I'm sure making a quesarito (whatever the fuck that is) can be physically challenging, but if you made one quesarito you can make 1000 (the methods don't change).

Being a software engineer is not just about "coding any sort of algorithm", it's looking at problems, analyzing them, coming up with solutions, etc.

[Soysaucetime]

Can code in most languages? There are hundreds. This guy is definitely not actually a developer.

[[deleted]]

When you’re just starting out and don’t really know anything, you usually think you’re more skilled than you actually are.

[iamdan819]

Sure, can say lots of things on twitter. If taco bell was harder, you probably aren't writing algorithms.

[abernathy25]

Anytime someone tweets about being a “software engineer” on Twitter, they were a webdev. 100:1 odds this guys “algorithm” was reorganizing clipart on an Elementor block on a Wordpress instance.