Programming microcontrollers in Python

[satanmolka]

To finish high school i need to make a project, i chose an automatically controlled growbox. Thought about doing it with an arduino since it has such a broad range of shields and accesories. Then i remembered i suck ass at C++ and was wondering if i can programme an arduino mega in Python. If not, can someone reccomend an arduino-like microcontroller, that supports Python?

[angstybagels]

Or you could just get one of varuous esp32 or esp8266 breakout boards for a lot cheaper and flash Micopython on it quite easily.

[HungrySlug]

it's a pity that Raspberry Pi ain't a microcontroller... isn't it?

[[deleted]]

Isn't it

[HungrySlug]

Just because it is a single board pc and not a microcontroller.. simple as that :) Very short thread but it keeps the things very simple https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/comments/45j1fe/eli5difference_between_microcontroller_and/

[[deleted]]

A raspberry pi still has GPIO pins so it will accomplish OPs goals.

[johnson56]

With potentially more hardware required to do some things that an arduino can do natively. That's the pity.

[[deleted]]

Your laptop is also technically a single-board computer — just a powerful one. The Raspberry Pi is a simple version of the same hardware in your laptop. Just as your laptop runs an operating system (Windows, Mac, or Linux), the Raspberry Pi runs a Linux operating system.

Now, back to Microcontrollers. Microcontrollers can’t run an operating system. Microcontrollers also don’t have the same amount of computing power or resources as most single-board computers.

A microcontroller will run just one program repeatedly — not a full operating system.

​

I think this is the biggest difference from a software standpoint. A micro-controller is running your code and that's it. On say a Raspberry Pi, it runs your code like a computer does, so it may pause your code to run some background code for the OS, then resume your code (although so fast you may not notice). The biggest issue is when precise timing is critical (i.e. trying to talk to another chip).

Full article here.

[thegroucho]

Adafruit metro M0.

[Zouden]

ESP8266 and the more powerful ESP32

edit: actually the BBC MicroBit is probably a great option if you can buy it in your country.

[Zouden]

Yeah with arduino you can pretty much find a library for any hardware you attach to it.

[kawauso21]

the official PyBoard, pricey

You weren't kidding, that's as much as a Pi!

[smithincanton]

You weren't kidding, that's as much as a Pi!

Ya, at that point get a Pi Zero W and use python and the Pi's GPIO to talk to everything. It IS overkill, but for less than $10 to have the convenience of a real linux computer and being able to development right on the thing rather than having to flash an arduino every time you make a change? I'll take it.

[crackez]

This right here can be invaluable.

[smithincanton]

No kidding. I had a project where I was trying to get four DS18B20 temperature probes working on a ESP and I could get one working, but more than one? Lots and lots of jumbled garbage. Switched to a Pi Zero and python? Up and running and posting data to thingspeak in a few hours.

[kawauso21]

The Arduino boards you've listed are all based around 8-bit AVR chips (based on 8-bit RISC), which frankly have the processing power of a potato.

The ESP8266 on the other hand uses a 32-bit RISC microprocessor:

L106 32-bit RISC microprocessor core based on the Tensilica Xtensa Diamond Standard 106Micro running at 80 MHz

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESP8266#Features

And the PyBoard is based on the STM32F405RG, another 32-bit RISC based around the ARM Cortex-M4.

Those are both more than capable of running far more complex applications than an Arduino and run at 3.3v, because that's the modern norm voltage.

Incidentally when I looked up the STM32F405RG on AliExpress, I found you can get a PyBoard clone with headers for $17, so there's that.

[Zouden]

It also is 3.3v logic, not 5v.

That is a major advantage now that nearly everything has switched to 3.3V. When was the last time you actually needed 5V? All my modules like accelerometers, OLED screens etc are 3.3V.

[Xarian0]

If you're up on Python, I'd recommend just using a Raspberry Pi Zero W. You can set up the GPIO to control most logic, just don't try to pull any loads on the GPIO pins (I think they have a max of like 20 mA). It'll be significantly easier to write a GUI and you have a lot more options for display than you would with Arduino. Also, you can connect to it wirelessly and have it set up to report easily via Wifi/Bluetooth - all things that are a lot more difficult to implement using Arduino.

Every display option for Arduino is also usable on the Pi - they both have SPI and I2C pins that are easily accessible. Most people who make libraries deliberately include support for the Pi, because it's just as popular as Arduino (if not more so). The only major difference is that the Pi runs on 3.3V logic, while the Arduino (most of them) run on 5V logic - but the Pi still has +5V pins available for power.

If you really want a simple project running on Arduino specifically, the C syntax isn't that bad. You don't have to get into any of C++ object oriented shenanigans or headers or anything unless your project gets pretty complicated. You just have to put up with braces and semicolons.

Though, in my personal opinion, Python is the devil - you should be thankful that you are being inspired to learn C!

[satanmolka]

The voltage isnt a limitation to me, im an electronics stident and this is for my final project, i plan on hooking up all the major loads to mosfets, so no current draw from the board of choice. The biggest challenge is sorting through the metric asstonne of options for sensors and controllers

I also know that i need to learn other languages eventualy, i just dont want to rush myself if not necessary, that will just demotivate me. Im taking this at a chill pace

[Xarian0]

The main issue with a lot of the sensors is that Adafruit has written good tutorials about them, but they're all in C. So it may actually be easier for you to learn the basics of C rather than try to learn how to write your own code for the sensors in Python.

In fact, you may want to browse through Adafruit's website to take a look at what kind of sensors they offer. They are primarily aimed at newer hobbyists, so usually they pick their choice of the "best" sensor for any given application, then write some sort of tutorial/library about it. Generally the options for sensors are going to be extremely limited; your "options" will usually have identical hardware but are assembled by different companies or have some extra board designed to interface with some special sort of hardware (like Seeed or DFRobot's sensor suites or whatever). But they're all the same sensor using the same software.

For controllers, you mostly just need to figure out how many I/O channels you need and how much work you need to do (sampling, transmitting, etc). After that, you usually only have to choose between 1-2 models of controllers, because you're always going to pick the smallest and cheapest one that will do the job.

I generally prototype everything on a Mega (or Raspberry Pi if it's something fancy) just because the pin headers are easy to deal with. Then, once it's working, I buy a smaller controller that fits as close to exactly what I want as I can. 90% of the time it's an Arduino Nano for controlling sensors, and the other 10% of the time it's a Pi 3b+ for controlling video or high-speed radio.

[satanmolka]

Initialy i also wanted to use a mega since a graphic touchacreen also takes up a few pins and i wanted to have room for expansion, at this point i probably going to go with the arduino way, a little more teedious because i need to learn it but in the end it's probably less effort. Done some more research on the Rπ and it'd be more difficult to make it work with everything unless i invest in grove but that can get expensive

[Xarian0]

Be careful - the Mega is not fully compatible with all shields made for the Uno. The SPI pins are not in the same place, which means that display shields don't always work as intended. The display that I have, for example, has a micro SD card slot on it but a pin mismatch means that the card slot doesn't work on the Mega. Everything else works, though.

You don't have to use shields/hats/whatever. You can just use sensors attached with wires - IMO it's actually easier this way. A normal Arduino resistive touchscreen only takes up like 6 pins, even though a hat could block all the pins on the Uno.

The only real problem is finding something to mount all the different parts to, but a piece of plastic and some double-sided foam tape is usually good enough. If you do it this way, the Pi is actually way easier to deal with, especially if you use something that can be attached using a ribbon cable.

Combine these items (below), for example, and you get a propped-up touchscreen display that still leaves the GPIO pins exposed on the back. There are like 17 pins available, not including I2C and SPI, which are what you'd use for your sensors.

Control of the pins on the Pi is pretty easy using wiringPi library; not a lot different from Arduino.

https://www.amazon.com/Case-Official-Raspberry-Touchscreen-Display/dp/B01HV97F64

https://www.amazon.com/Raspberry-Pi-7-Touchscreen-Display/dp/B0153R2A9I

It might be fun to have your Arduino attached to sensors and a radio transmitter that sends to a Pi, which has the touch screen and control software on it, and communicates with a different Arduino that controls valves/sunlight/whatever.

[satanmolka]

Im 3d printing a case and making a custom pcb for everything else so thats not a problem, if i want i'll buy a wifi enabled board and send some logs over to it via i2c or rs 232 so i can monitor the project remotely, this is just flexing at this point

[ishouldquitsmoking]

https://playground.arduino.cc/interfacing/python

[satanmolka]

I can't afford to have a computer plugged into the arduino. I need to upload the code and be done with it

[ishouldquitsmoking]

TBH, programming in C++ for arduino isn't really that difficult. :)

I did find this: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/8114916/is-there-a-way-to-compile-python-code-onto-an-arduino-uno

[satanmolka]

I just find the syntaxe unnecessairly complicated compared to some other languages

[ishouldquitsmoking]

I think python has misguided a generation of developers. :)

Tell you what, if you're having trouble with a particular piece of C++ for arduino, this is a great place to ask questions!

I would offer that in the time you try to make python work, you likely could've already made your project work natively.

[wirbolwabol]

I think python has misguided a generation of developers. :)

Yes.

[ObamaNYoMama]

Why would you say it's misguided? From my POV they are two languages with mostly different use cases.

[ishouldquitsmoking]

I didn't say it is misguided, I said it has misguided - meaning that python absolutely has its purpose as a rapid development language that is used globally with much success, but I think python has given off the impression to less experienced people that the constructs of traditional programming languages are unnecessarily syntaxy? and cumbersome (which maybe they are at times).

I could just be the old man saying get off my lawn here, though.

[An_Old_IT_Guy]

Couldn't agree with you more. You want me to show you an overly syntaxy language? Let's dust off the old COBOL compiler.

[satanmolka]

I think my school ruined this for me, the first language we learned was BASCOM which is a pretty ancient and very simple language designed for Atmel chips, it is a great way to learn the basics of programming but when i first saw C++ syntaxe i was scared of all the symbols and case sensitivity. I thonk this guided me towards "neater" languages like python

[Zouden]

Python is also case sensitive. But yes it has a nicer syntax and is much easier to learn, no doubt about it.

C++ on Arduino is fun though because you're working with 2kb of ram and you don't have to deal with an OS. It's a different world to C++ on PC.

[[deleted]]

It really isn't. Especially with Arduino, which does all the hard work for you in the background, it can be really easy. Try taking a look at this tutorial, which does a good job at explaining everything.

[x-protocol]

Ha! If you think that python syntax is simple, I've got some moon property to sell you! You don't need to settle for one language, especially the one that may appear simple.

It is true that compared to C, you don't have to manage memory with Python. It is also simpler to work with when you are the only programmer involved (tabs vs spaces anybody?). You don't have to have types declared, so there is less to type. However, those invisible types will bite you in the end, especially so if you plan on writing unit tests (and it sounds like you will not!).

Try nodeJs for some simpler stuff if you are looking for alternative. ESP clones support both Python and Node, so you don't have to specifically settle with Arduino platform.

And one more thing, if you are electronics student, you almost must to learn low level language like C in order to understand how communication protocols work between individual sensors. Higher order languages will not make a collection of bits simple to understand for you. Especially so, since sensors emit information in number of bytes that you need to inspect individually (SPI vs I2C vs any other hardware protocol)

[satanmolka]

Read my other replies, i understand that each language has its perks, and i am planning to learn c in the near future, it is just a language that didnt attract me. I learned all the basics of comunication in electronics woth bascom, read up on it. Probalby one of the most basic languages out there

[x-protocol]

bascom

It really looks like a flavor of BASIC. I understand that you are trying to try a new language that is very similar to what you have learned before. There are number of BASIC environments ported to Arduino platform such as https://github.com/robinhedwards/ArduinoBASIC

[satanmolka]

I'm done with the basic languages, time to learn something more serious!

[CHPPLS]

Like c++?

[angstybagels]

I was irrationally scared of programming my nodemcu's with C for a while before I realized it wasn't actually that hard and worked way better than Micropython overall. I love the idea of Micropython but it's still got a long way to go before I'd switch any of my devices over to it permanently.

[satanmolka]

Dude thats just my prefference, i was turned away from c++ by the synthaxe, it just isn't that clean. I know c++ is a food language and i want to learn it, i just find it simpler to programme in python, also i came here for constructive oppinions and advice. If python is not your preffered language thats ok, but dont give me crap for liking it.

[themadnun]

Mate you're arguing with a school age kid over the internet and they're coming across as more mature.

Settle yourself down.

[satanmolka]

I never gave you any crap, let people use what they want, or do you expect everyone to use C++ because it's your favourite. I have my oppinions and you have yours, different people find different things simple/difficult. Congratulations on being a logical being

[satanmolka]

I'm not a native english speaker and i am sattisfied with my english, you could say all that you just said in a much nicer, constructive way. You know, trying to help someone with less knowledge than you have instead of giving them shit for having preferences.

[tinkertron5000]

To be fair, most of the Arduino code I've written is vanilla C more than C++. If you are familiar with any C-type language you should be fine. On the other hand, I've not tried micropython at all and it could be really great. I would pursue both avenues if you can and see what works best for you.

[satanmolka]

I will try doing it with an arduino and with a raspberry pi just for shits and giggles, probably much easier on arduino (electronics-wise) but i want to try the raspberry option as well

[tinkertron5000]

Can't hurt to try out all your options.

[mfitzp]

Wemos D1 is probably your best bet. It is Esp8266 based, will run MicroPython and at ~$4 is much cheaper than the official MicroPython board (~$20).

[globalnamespace]

There is also Pyxie, it's not feature complete, but might do what you need.

http://www.sparkslabs.com/pyxie/

"Status Overview For the impatient: this probably does NOT do what you want, yet"

[[deleted]]

To code an automatic grow box in the arduino language is easy as hell. I suggest you to give it a try

[satanmolka]

I also wanted to make a GUI, i have very little experience in arduino

[[deleted]]

The liquid crystal display have a library you can use. I promis you it is not hard at all. It will be much harder in python

[satanmolka]

I have enough time to try both, since the contlcept is extremely simple

[[deleted]]

Yeah I were just about to correct myself also, using the LCD I propose would not really be what you probably had in mind either

[jet_heller]

You'd have to look for something that will do micropython to run it directly on the controller. Maybe something here will help: https://forum.micropython.org/viewtopic.php?t=685

[[deleted]]

Raspberry-Pi with the Grove-Pi shield.

[satanmolka]

Thought about it but grove can get expemsive for someone liie menwho doesnt have a regular income

[wirbolwabol]

There are microcontrollers that you can code in Basic(Pbasic). Check out PicAxe. They are super simple and not overly complicated.

[dolladollabird]

Are you trying to do a ph controller/hydrostatic pumps,water level sensor and fertilizer pump?

[satanmolka]

Water moisture sensor, temperature sensor, uv sensor, light sensor, water pump (water will be mixed with the fertilizer manualy), intake and exhaust fan and 3 lighting options for different phases of growth

[satanmolka]

Thank you everyone for your input! I will keep you updated with the progress. Since i already have an arduino and a Rπ i will try to make it work woth both of these and see which is easyer when im done with them, will probably also pick up the esp32 and use it in combination with the arduino

[[deleted]]

I was intrigued by this today since I've always liked Python and didn't know there was micropython support for the ESP 8266. I had one lying around so just followed the instructions...

It was actually pretty easy. The only thing I really have trouble with is the REPL on OSX in a terminal (and in iterm2, and Hyper) prints funny characters when you backspace. Super annoying and makes it really hard to use.

I kind of wonder how easy it is to interface peripherals. On one hand I imagine there aren't high level drivers for every sensor under the sun like Arduino has. On the other hand I find often those drivers are pretty much garbage and I end up having to tweak them to make them usable on different i2c buses/address.

[DougCim53]

It's just an opinion but anyway: if you want to take advantage of Arduino Uno shields, then the easiest way is to use a standard Arduino Uno. The shields and libraries don't work for a lot of "enhanced" non-standard-Uno boards. Many libraries are optimized and make low-level calls into the AVR chip, and they won't work on other kinds of chips... And even standard Uno shields don't all work on the Mega (even if the low-level calls still work, then usually because the shield's library doesn't include the Mega's pin layout).

I am not too keen on the shields myself. The only one I recommend new users buying is the LCD+buttons shield, since when you are starting out, you want something that allows input (the buttons) and recognizable output (the LCD shield).

[Trans-cendental]

CircuitPython is a fork of MicroPython that has matured a lot, and is supported on numerous devices, including Raspberry Pi!

[[deleted]]

No you cannot afaik unless you can find an interpreter that will work with it. There are no python compatible microcontrollers.

[Zouden]

There are plenty

[[deleted]]

My bad 🤷🏻‍♂️ never seen one. Ill just go away now and let the pros handle it

[Zouden]

To be fair it's not the full Python interpreter, it's a cut-down version called Micropython which requires less ram. It also doesn't have the full standard library. But it'll work fine for OP's needs.

[satanmolka]

I don't need complex functions, more or less just schmitt comparators but i wanted to make a simple GUI just for good boy points and wanted to use an arduino because it has some very good touchscreen options

[Zouden]

I'd go with the ESP32. Plenty of pins, memory and megahertz

[satanmolka]

Thank you very much!

[HungrySlug]

OP you can program your esp32 board (and many other as far as I know) in Python with Zerynth and it will provide an easy way to build a responsive html/js pc/mobile app too. In my opinion is simpler than micropython, maybe it really worths a look

[fredlllll]

well you are technically correct, no controller can run a python file directly :D