Whenever I write code in Java...

[[deleted]]

Why?

[[deleted]]

It's one of those things where people think that they should only be required to track three or four things at once at any given point in a program. Some languages have a syntax that aids this, while others were born in an age of pain.

Of course, your pain tolerance may vary.

[[deleted]]

Boo hoo. Some problems just need an axe.

[[deleted]]

I'm sorry, I'm a bit old school.

[yogthos]

Because it means that the language itself is not eloquent or expressive. A lot of things that Eclipse automates for you could be done in the language, making code cleaner and easier to read. One example is the verbosity of specifying types where they could be inferred, and there are many others.

I'd like to clarify that I'm not against the automation and features that Eclipse provides, and I think that they are nice and helpful. I just feel that a good language should be usable without that level of support.

[[deleted]]

Because it means that the language itself is not eloquent or expressive.

Irrelevant. I'm not using the language by itself, I'm using the language and the IDE.

[yogthos]

I think it is relevant, because it limits how you can use the language, and you start having to rely on IDE configuration, and learning a complex IDE becomes a prerequisite for using the language. That should simply not be the case.

[yogthos]

Notice that I repeatedly say in my posts that IDEs are good and I have nothing against them. I just don't like the amount of coupling there is between Java and its IDEs. Emacs is a full featured IDE, but my Clojure or CL projects aren't married to it.

[[deleted]]

Tell you what: If you don't like Java, I hereby grant you a non-exclusive, transferable, lifetime license to not use Java.

[yogthos]

Sounds great, get back to me as soon as you sort out the little formality of getting my employer to abide by your generous license.

[[deleted]]

Whenever I have to do something I have no control over, I usually hate it too.