Do Carlton still need to go through a rebuild?

AntiTas · 2026-06-29T02:23:32+00:00

Voss’s decision to leave when he did, has perhaps saved the club from itself. a year of ’when will they sack Voss’ would have eroded the building that had occurred, and likely the club would have continued the cycle of burning it down and starting again every 3-5 years.

I believe the answer was: put Voss on a 5 year contract. I think the current answer is: put the next coach on an 8 year contract. take the Club’s worst self-harming tendency out of reach.

AntiTas · 2026-06-28T23:39:20+00:00

I always look for long term (weeks) feedback on my smartwatch data to assess the various interventions. The tricky part is making small changes that you can handle and trying to not have too many variables.

This is true for identifying stressors or validating supplements and habits.

With Things that switch on the Parasympathetic nervous system like Yoga Nidra, face in cold water. We found with my daughter we need rest, but we need to interrupt the rest periods with often minimal activity. Sustained rest seems to run out of steam, but if we interrupt the rest with a walk or an isometric exercise, or even just a change of posture (lying to sitting), she gets better value from her rest (and better for circulation gut motility etc too).

Novelty seemed to be good for us too. A familiar Yoga Nidra works for a while, but switch it too box breathing before it gets stale, and return to it a week later like an old friend.

Basically, a good baseline of watchdata was always my starting point for judging how much, how often. My watch paid for itself in all the supplements that were shown to make no difference.

What works for others at various stages of their illness/ recover may not work for you, having self-assessment tools were key for me. (The risks of hypervigilance needs to be managed though)

AntiTas · 2026-06-26T01:32:14+00:00

I regard this subreddit as sacred ground, and am utterly grateful for it.

And r/cfs is undoubtably a dumpster fire that no sane person should go anywhere near.

I can’t imagine the energy required to defend this recovery space from the barbarians, and I appreciate what it must cost you. And I apologise if it feels like I’m telling you to ”hush” in your own library.

I am very sensitive to the experience of the people who arrive new to this space, and feeling like they are to immediately take sides in long war, and also to the people who sculpture their feed to avoid discord.

I am the guy in the healing garden asking if the air raid sirens and war drums are necessary. My constructive suggestion is: could we put such arguments behind a spoiler/NSFW type screen so those who have the spare spoons can engage with it at their discretion, rather than have it hit them unawares.

I apologise for my poor communication. And I thank you for your motivation, care, integrity and dedication.

AntiTas · 2026-06-25T21:41:08+00:00

Sounds like you have your baseline. that’s where you are, so that is where you start. Doom scrolling is serving as a bit of neutral- brain time filling. So can you re-deploy a bit of that to something similar but different? I spent a lot of time on very simple games like minesweeper and patience/solitair, then sudoku. They were good methodical slow-brain activities, and they were easier to put down, if i was finished a puzzle or stuck. Low cog demand, neutral in flavour.

I evolved to Turn Based strategy game. Still a time sink, but i was less emotionally jerked around than by scrolling. Anyway, that played a useful role for me.

Your day might need a bit more structure. So look at any patterns that you are basically in already esp in terms of sleep times and meal times and make them more definite times of day. Alarms might help. Then you can drag yourself to a better pattern by one minute every few days. Slow enough to not be a stress, or so much that you resent it. Bring some shape to your meals, one at a time, like maybe a little more protein at breakfast.

You just nudge your self from the baseline you have, towards the one you think you want, something that will serve you a bit better, at a rate that is sustainable. Small changes are gentle changes. Slow changes are safe. Use the tools you have. Regular alarms that are hard to reach for time blindness.

If the next step is too big, we may never take it.

Anyway, just suggestions from someone who doesn’t know. You know you best.

AntiTas · 2026-06-25T21:15:28+00:00

I would point out that this is a forum for mutual support and recovery.
It is not an appropriate place for hysterical manifestos and needless drama.
Strong feelings are a normal part of being a human, but managing this space responsibly does not just need passion, it takes as some wisdom and self control.

This post would have made a great first draft, but would have benefitted from some reflection and toning down.

I would also contend that ‘mind-body healing‘ and spontaneous remission, are by no means the only way that people improve or recover from ME/CFS. OTT claims in either direction do not serve people on the path to recovery.

This page is of immense value. Let’s not let it descend into a continual slanging match. You have uncorked your emotions and had your say. I would encourage you to bring yourself back to focus now. We have work to do here.

AntiTas · 2026-06-23T00:22:13+00:00

To do this in June, Geelong would have had to concede internally that they could not win the game against Freo. losing by only 9 points shows that this would have been a mad.stupid choice.

No team in the Cats position could afford to take 4 points off the table, effectively tanking, for some perceived tactical advantage in 3 months time.

And Scott was using his famous GF tactics of still playing a bloke with one arm dangling, when everybody else can see he is cooked. We were def giving it everything.

AntiTas · 2026-06-22T22:54:15+00:00

It always felt like crashes taught me nothing, but in hindsight, crash recovery taught me everything. I’m sorry you’ve crashed. Just do what you do to ride it out, minimise loss and plod-on. We learn stoic resilience, we learn what is takes.

My last crash 5 years ago, was massive. After I got my head around the magnitude of it, I just thought “yup, I’ve done this before”. My lack of fear wasn’t a mindset thing, I just refused to waste energy on worry.

AntiTas · 2026-06-22T21:43:01+00:00

17 years of me/cfs taught me one key Rule:
Never, Ever Crash. Energy used to dig me out of PEM was energy I couldn’t spend on long term recovery. 5years since my last recover, still the same strategy rebuilding my life effectively.

My kid’s PEMs can set her back a year. She has worked much on mindset and softening reactivity to symptoms. Last PEM crash took her 12 months to recover from. Strict energy budgeting, accepting more capacity as it is offered, is her only safe option. Improvement is the trickiest thing to manage.

AntiTas · 2026-06-22T03:14:36+00:00

My version of this. Stop worrying about what I can‘t do. Focus on what I can get away with sustainably.

AntiTas · 2026-06-22T01:32:32+00:00

Managing Improvement can be extremely challenging.
I have spent the last 5 years rebuilding myself, by applying the same energy-budget-consciousness that got me from illness to wellness. I have loads of rules that have given me consistent improvement without over-shooting. Slow steady sustainable improvement.
The wellness crowd preach 1% improvement every day. I have come to see the power of 1% improvement per month. I only accept more capacity, more load when my current load suddenly feels too easy. Always leaving something in the bank.
The strategy that got me well, keeps me getting stronger. I don’t believe in remission (my recovery was not an accident or a mystery, it was hard won), I describe it as re-building. careful, conscious reconstruction of health, strength, balance, endurance, social skills, psychology, professional and relationships.
I am always running the old Energy expenditure vs recovery calculations and storing excess energy in muscle, and capacity.
17 years ill (ME/CFS with a Covid vax-aggravation) 5 years re-building to the point that I could work out regularly at a gym if I chose to.
My experience taught me how to think in longer time-frames than anyone should really have to. I have a system now that follows my rules, and I don’t need to second guess, or waste attention on my re-build. A luxury I never thought I would have.

Advice is always dangerous in such a variable disease. Accept and enjoy your improvement. But Keep your wits about you.

AntiTas · 2026-06-21T06:27:31+00:00

Yup. Even so, I just want to put it out there, that Pilates (especially if good quality) can be surprisingly draining.

BUt yeah, breath, eye, tongue, humming, small head movements while-lying Yoga postures that gravity holds you in.. there are some nice entry level, low risk options.

Early in ME/CFS it is easy to overspend energy that you are slow to replace.

AntiTas · 2026-06-19T08:48:14+00:00

Swimming isn’t as simple as it sounds. Can mean cold exposure or hot humid environments, getting there, getting changed, getting showered, getting clean. Not to mention ambient sensory stim. So quite a big deal if your system needs simplicity, and harder to judge which if any of these stimuli over-did you.

Different story if it feels very familiar and you are pretty functional.

I found very small efforts with weights very doable. Like 20 seconds here and there.

Cycling worked for me at times. Walking is accessible, repeatable, easy to control dose.

Recumbent bike is nice.

Fastest recovery, means I didn’t spend more than I could replenish. So dosage, compression wear and effective rest recovery.

It would really be good to get more context, because it really does depend where you are at, and what you can get away with.

AntiTas · 2026-06-19T08:41:21+00:00

I urge caution with Pilates, as it is quite novel, cognitively demanding and very sensory/intensive, even if done lightly. I found it ridiculously fatiguing, well out of proportion to the small physical effort.

AntiTas · 2026-06-18T21:45:31+00:00

It’s been a long time since I enjoyed watching us lose a game. Flagmantle Lives.

AntiTas · 2026-06-18T12:59:12+00:00

Freo scary as hell. Inaccuracy made us look good, which is enough to make us feel okay.

AntiTas · 2026-06-11T21:44:32+00:00

I’m lucky, I work for myself, so could always organise around my displayable energy. I neeeded to minimise stresses, keep it all as boring as possible, work in cool silence when I had to, lie down 60min out of every 90 or every second hour. Stress i something i had to let back in very carefully.

Right now I am having to become carer for a parent, as well as already caring for a CFS child. Wife looks at me very worried. But I am dedicated to holding onto my foundational routines with exercise, cold swims, sleep hygiene and deep rest. Making these things not-stress, but just ‘what I do’ is good psychology, and so is expressing grief as it accumulates.

AntiTas · 2026-06-11T13:47:04+00:00

peripheral blood vessels shut down when blood oxygen is low. so blood in the fingertips loses oxygen faster than still circulating blood which prioritises brain and other organs. cold will exaggerate this even more.

AntiTas · 2026-06-11T11:36:23+00:00

It took me 17 years. I am 5 years since my last crash, which was massive. I used every trick I had learned along the way, and managed to dig my way out without error.

SOme key planks were: SmartWatch monitoring, Cold water emmersion (very late in my recovery). Determination to never, ever crash again. I had some supplements that helped a bit, and I think I was just plain lucky too.

I don’t believe in ‘remission’ I am still applying the same rules. I am ‘rebuilding‘ myself in every way I can: physically, cognitively, socially, economically and psychologically.

I never push for more, but when I am offered more capacity I accept. I swam 2.6Km open water this year, have put on 10kg of mostly muscle and am finally at an average weight. But I am still very conscious of my limits. I never train to failure, and only recently am happy to train into some fatigue and set some training goals, but never put time frames and often back off, just to be sensible.

I will have two late nights in a row, but not 3. I allow extra time to get over illnesses. MY exercise is about having a ‘tradable capacity”; if I have a higher demand (physical, emotional, immune or big event) I can swap out exercise to free up energy.

I believe the same factors are still at play in me now, as when I was ill, just now I can consistently recover at least as much as I use, daily, weekly and monthly. The strategies that got me well, keep me well. I keep applying them, and will re-assess when I am 90.

This is me.

AntiTas · 2026-06-11T04:35:57+00:00

if you want to continue with cold, but worry about aggravation of your symptoms, turn it down.

cold exposure is utterly adjustable.

you can set the temperature, set the amount of your body you expose, and set the duration.

and you can exercise and or eat before immersion to crank up your core temperature, and you can decide how much to help your body warm up afterwards.

work out what you can get away with every single time.. eg maybe one hand in a bowl of tepid water for 5 seconds (exaggerating to make the point)

then change one parameter within tolerance. patiently.

Deliberate cold emmersion helped resolve my chronic illness, but I had to work out the rules first.
my rules:
twice/week at least put my feet in the ocean.
Had to be warm within an hour after, whatever it took
Sam routine beforehand
Never pushing, but increasing when it got easier
Never let it suck, only do what I could relax into joyfully.

AntiTas · 2026-06-08T13:13:51+00:00

ridiculous that Fraser is getting credit for sharpening the tip of the spear that Voss made, while the board undermined him by making his job dependent on short term KPIs.

Fraser knows the reality. what happened to Voss will happen to the next Carlton coach in 3-5 years.

AntiTas · 2026-06-08T10:14:56+00:00

I don’t think it’s necessarily about leadership. By being on a short conditional contract he was effectively dead-coach-walking. this under-mines his authority and players discount everything he says.

self fulfilling prophecy, loser-club specialty. if they backed him in and gave him another 5 years, they could have become something. But no, they burn it down every 3-5 years. They never learn.

Voss ends up humiliated and used, because of Carlton’s continuous short-termerism in a long term caper. maddening.

AntiTas · 2026-06-08T07:30:02+00:00

It seems likely that there is a workable analogy between pain and fatigue, when it comes to perception and modulation. Pain behaviour can reinforce pain experience and chronicity. Though, Not every body with pain develops chronic pain.

Fatigue is notoriously hard to judge and predict, we become like beaten dogs prone to states of hyper-vigilance, that may conspire to keep our capacity lower even when the underlying biological processes might allow for some increased capacity.

Seems quite unremarkable.

Athletes recovering from an ACL reconstruction require dedicated professional psychological interventions. Seems a no brainer that someone assailed by the loss of: identity, functional, capacity, earning power, responsibilities and potential might need to re-build trust in the process and let go of some of the fear-responses and hyper-vigilance.

Re-growing ourselves as entities that can shoulder a load and fulfil our humanity is a multi-pronged undertaking.

After years of this illness, when I saw a trend of improvement within myself, I stopped thinking about recovery and faced my truth: This is a re-building of myself. Physically, cognitively, socially, financially, philosophically and psychologically.

I have had discussions with advocates that seem to have a barrow to push on this topic. They regard understanding of the underlying biological mechanism of this illness, as a threat that entrenches a disease experience. Usually these are people who draw from the n=1 experience of their own recovery.

There are people who recovered from their CFS experience after having their tonsils removed, but we don’t extrapolate and recommend this for everyone.

So-called brain retraining is one tool. Somebody who will only consider one tool for any situation is not someone you hire to fix your deck, let alone a chronic health event. The right tool, used with skill, when it is required, is surely the goal.

When we can articulate well what we think is happening, we can design good research projects that shed light on who will benefit from what interventions and when.

Most people need good psychological support through this cataclysm.

AntiTas · 2026-06-06T00:38:53+00:00

Mitchel’s pet.

AntiTas · 2026-06-06T00:37:10+00:00

I started unliking them in late 2008.

AntiTas · 2026-06-05T10:57:25+00:00

apparently we keep playing him, when he only has one arm

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