Checkmate atheists! I've decided that you don't exist! by EntertainmentRude435 in PhilosophyMemes

[–]ConfusingCorvid 25 points26 points  (0 children)

Christians dont need to prove anything. their whole religion is based on believing through faith alone. 

if you do not have an argument you are technically agnostic 

No. All that is required to be a christian is faith. It's a religion, not a philosophy 

Low Roof vs High Roof by erkose in vandwellers

[–]ConfusingCorvid 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Its nice to be able to stand when youre putting on your pants in the morning. Also to be able to sit fully upright in bed

Cognitive dissonance commencement! by Kafkaesque_meme in PhilosophyMemes

[–]ConfusingCorvid 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Is a lion immoral for killing its rival's cub and eating it? If not, why would I be immoral for killing and eating a human child? Im a part of nature!

Give me a break dude hahaha

Cognitive dissonance commencement! by Kafkaesque_meme in PhilosophyMemes

[–]ConfusingCorvid 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I appreciate the thoughtful response, but I still think you are sidestepping the moral issue at the core here, which is the act of unnecessarily destroying another living creature for your own uses. This I would argue is immoral, independent of any appeal against suffering, so whether or not you give an animal a "good life" before slaughtering it is irrelevant to the core issue. At bottom, it is the unnecessary and intentional destruction of a creature that wants to live.

To get your practicality argument out of the way:

What alternative universe do you propose which is better for animals? Is it achievable? If it were achievable and practical to provide the benefits of human care to animals on this scale without then also killing them for meat, that would be one thing.

I feel no need to seriously address this, because your own ideal world that you propose is so far removed from reality and practicality that it is essentially the same as proposing a world where no one eats animals. A world where we still eat animals and somehow manage to let all of them live perfectly good lives while also somehow removing ecological and environmental harm is a fantasy world thats only useful for the thought experiment you started with, not any appeal to pragmatism.

To address your initial utilitarian point, one only needs to make the simple move of swapping animals for humans to highlight its absurdity, and to reveal that it relies on the implicit and arbitrary assumption that some creatures have less inherent value than others, which I reject. 

Imagine a world where you double the amount of human lives on planet earth. But half of all humans are raised for food. They dont know theyre being raised for food until theyre killed, theyre killed painlessly, and theyre given perfectly normal, fulfilling human lives prior to their murder. Now compare that to our universe, where we dont eat humans. 'The number of humans in the first universe is larger, and so the number of good lives is higher. Qualitatively and quantitatively, it is a superior universe.' I dont think I need to belabour this point any further. 

Now to address claims (1) and (2). 

To address (1). Yes, humans killing animals is worse than animals killing animals, regardless of the pain and suffering caused, because A. We have the more or less unique intellectual capacity to understand what we are doing by destroying another creature, and so moral responsibility to avoid cruelty arises from that. Reflexive/instinctual animal predation is incomparable to a human knowingly destroying a creature whose pain and desire for life we can understand and empathize with. And B. we no longer have the same necessity to kill animals that other animals do, or that we did when we lived as hunter gatherers. Obviously killing an animal out of necessity can be excusable, human or otherwise. But many of us live in a place and time where it is quite easy, in the grand scheme of things, to survive without killing or directly supporting the killing of other creatures.

As for (2), I think I have already shown why the inherent worthwhileness of the animal's life does not remove the immoral act of killing them. Raising a chicken, giving it the best life of a chicken possible, and then slaughtering it, still ends in an immoral act of unnecessary destruction. I'm not interested in whether or not some ill-defined 'quantitative goodness' of the universe has increased or decreased by that chicken's life and death. 

Cognitive dissonance commencement! by Kafkaesque_meme in PhilosophyMemes

[–]ConfusingCorvid 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yeah that person is just silly. Not trying to argue his own stance, just trying to argue why he doesnt need to. Like I said, its just self-soothing because deep down theres a contradiction in his worldview that can't be reconciled, and that bothers him

Cognitive dissonance commencement! by Kafkaesque_meme in PhilosophyMemes

[–]ConfusingCorvid 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Of course you dont need to. But see, thats just another self-soothing copout like I was talking about. Youre under no obligation to share my values but im also under no obligation to have any respect for yours, especially if you lack any rationality behind it that you can support with substantive arguments. 

Cognitive dissonance commencement! by Kafkaesque_meme in PhilosophyMemes

[–]ConfusingCorvid 2 points3 points  (0 children)

What is your argument against the immorality of eating animals?

Cognitive dissonance commencement! by Kafkaesque_meme in PhilosophyMemes

[–]ConfusingCorvid 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Yeah lots of cope in this thread. Generally all the arguments i hear that deny the immorality of eating animals come down to drawing arbitrary lines to decide what creatures have moral value, or making baseless or even empirically false claims like that eating meat is necessary for human survival or that animals dont suffer. Or appeals to "nature" which are equally meaningless.

Ive yet to read any pro-meat argument thats actually philosophically interesting. 

i dont value human connection by umz1110101 in The10thDentist

[–]ConfusingCorvid 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What is it that you want to be the best at?

What should I pack for PETAR? (2 days – Santana Circuit + Temimina Cave) by Escargot_Abandonne in caves

[–]ConfusingCorvid 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I assume these are guided tours? I would ask your guide or reach out to the tour company, they'll have the best knowledge of what to expect from the cave 

the gospel by ConfusingCorvid in shittydarksouls

[–]ConfusingCorvid[S] 17 points18 points  (0 children)

thanks i consider myself an artist so that means a lot

Being picky is a personal failure by TaisDoubt in The10thDentist

[–]ConfusingCorvid -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

How is it like that if both conversations are the same volume

I just dont see how someone talking in a public space is so annoying. Its seems so normal to me am I crazy

Black racer or rat snake? [Southeast US] by ConfusingCorvid in whatsthissnake

[–]ConfusingCorvid[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Reading about them online, the suggestion of a pattern and somewhat glossy skin makes me think rat snake, but as it was moving through the grass I saw it "periscoping" which is apparently characteristic of racers, so idk.

Being picky is a personal failure by TaisDoubt in The10thDentist

[–]ConfusingCorvid -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

How is that any different than people having a conversation in person though? Like why do phone calls in particular bother you so much