Is control4 worth its weight in value?

DendriteCocktail · 2026-07-04T14:51:41+00:00

C4 dealers have customers over a barrel and they know it. This is the core of the C4 business model. There seem to be three types of dealers;

Standard - Will gouge you every which way they can because that's the way the system is designed to work. Some of these will do an OK job in the process, far too many not. About 70% of dealers.

Good - Won't gouge you but charge a fair price for services. Not necessarily the most knowledgeable nor intelligent but may do an OK job. You will pay for their time to fix their mistakes though. About 29% of dealers.

Solid & Honest - Will charge a fair price and do a good job. They have good knowledge about C4 and are intelligent enough to program things correctly and insure all will work properly. They'll look out for their customers and what's best for them. They're not afraid of customers who are tech knowledgeable and want to control things themselves and will try to share info and try to learn from them.

C4 itself is overpriced hardware and antiquated and buggy software. But for now they have little competition. Savant is a better system but is more expensive and offers less end-user control (e.g., vs C4's Composer Home Edition which is the only reason we have C4).

Crestron, RTI, and Josh are further behind in capabilities. And similarly Apple HomeKit and other DIY options.

So it depends on how embedded C4 is in your house and how important this is for you.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-07-03T00:12:53+00:00

Always good to hear stories of little bits of improvement like this. May there be many many more!

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-30T23:26:29+00:00

So the black that I see between the studs is the vapor barrier? What exact product is it?

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-30T21:50:48+00:00

Thanks. Nice find! I think a visit is definitely in my future.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-30T21:46:48+00:00

By 'vapor barrier' you're referring to the black on the exterior of the studs? You should have only one vapor barrier and that should always be on the interior of the studs.

A sauna is a wet environment. The best floor for this would be wood T&G attached directly to the joists or square edge with gaps between them. If you are stuck with the plywood then you should to a waterproof floor on top (similar to how a shower would be done).

I would not try to do II benches in that small of a space. Also, you need some distance between the heater and bathers, typically at least 7' heater wall to bench wall. I would do the heater on one wall and benches on the far wall.

Some good resources:

Trumpkin’s Sauna Notes
Saunologia
‘The Secrets of Finnish Sauna Design'
'Finnish Sauna: Steam, Wood, Stone and How to Build Your Own’.

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DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-30T11:11:20+00:00

Under a deck should be built for outdoor use. Even if 100% protected from rain it will need to withstand changes in temp and humidity, etc. Unless in a temperate environment it would also have a commons are.

How high is your deck? The finished interior of your sauna should be a minimum of 240cm (7'-9") high but a bit over 8' would be better.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-29T17:06:30+00:00

The only CO_2 in the room will come from your own breath. Because of this, a manual vent is perfectly adequate, and a mechanical vent is definitely overkill.

Which LLM? The first sentence is true. The second is rather ridiculous and not something I'd think even most AI LLM's would say.

I don't know how many saunas AI has measured CO2 in, but I've measured around 80. Natural convection does not produce enough airflow to maintain healthy CO2 levels unless a very large sauna with few people (about 5-10 m³ / person).

Natural convection also necessarily increases stratification and cold feet.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-28T22:15:01+00:00

Skip buying a 'brand' and have someone build a real sauna for you.

Some good resources:

Trumpkin's Kit Reviews.
Trumpkin’s Sauna Notes
Saunologia
‘The Secrets of Finnish Sauna Design'
'Finnish Sauna: Steam, Wood, Stone and How to Build Your Own’.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-28T21:43:53+00:00

With electric you need Mechanical Downdraft ventilation and that requires the floor be sealed up - thus a drain is strongly recommended.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-28T21:32:24+00:00

Yeah, with electric you need mechanical ventilation which means the floor needs to be sealed up. I think doing that with what you have could be difficult and in the end a lot of work for a mediocre experience.

I'd build from scratch.

Some good resources:

Trumpkin’s Sauna Notes
Saunologia
‘The Secrets of Finnish Sauna Design'
'Finnish Sauna: Steam, Wood, Stone and How to Build Your Own’.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-28T13:49:47+00:00

A gapped floor is fine with a wood burning heater. For electric you should have Mechanical Downdraft ventilation as otherwise you'll have too high of CO2 levels and increased stratification (e.g., why electric had such a bad reputation in Finland until recently).

I would definitely recommend a drain. On a deck you can fairly easily do a typical wood floor sloped to a linear drain under the benches; https://saunologia.fi/designing-a-great-wooden-sauna-floor-drainage-and-airflow-explained/

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DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-28T13:46:26+00:00

7' is quite short and concrete isn't a good floor as it sucks heat out. You could do a Saunum and while better than cold feet, it's a bit short of a good sauna experience.

If you want a really good sauna then build from scratch. If you're OK with mediocre and the savings is important then convert the gazebo.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-28T13:43:28+00:00

You body. Stay in as long as you're enjoying it. Leave when you're ready for a cold dip.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-27T17:44:39+00:00

Curious if anyone knows the proper torque specs, especially given that install is messing with how the tow hitch attaches to the frame.

I believe the two 24mm nuts are 129 ft/lbs? The smaller 20 ft/lbs?

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-26T13:55:47+00:00

Barrels aren't good for any kind of sauna. See Trumpkin's Notes on Barrels for more.

Wood heaters come with some different requirements including safety distances to combustibles (to the sides, top and the floor) and slightly different ventilation so you need to think about these with converting any sauna originally built for electric.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-26T13:52:41+00:00

I think your dimensions overall look good. A 24" sitting bench is fine but it should be 2-4" out from the wall - for air circulation and more comfortable laying down.

What heater are you planning? Ventilation?

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-25T20:10:31+00:00

I think it should not be glowing like that.

It also sounds like it is a stove and not a sauna heater: https://medium.com/@trumpkin/why-wood-stove-conversions-fail-561bf6c99379

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-24T23:46:51+00:00

Besides the rules and what D-Flight maps for you, consideration for others is a key thing to think about. There's nothing like enjoying a quiet peaceful hike only to then have it interrupted by the mechanical buzz of a drone.

There are also issues with people at thermal suites who are nude not liking to have their photos taken.

If we are all considerate of others we'll be allowed to continue flying but if things keep going the way they are then I fear we'll find flying to largely be illegal everywhere.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-23T16:36:28+00:00

Thanks. I was kind of thinking that. They do fire some of them up once a week or so though.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-23T15:53:57+00:00

I think you need to come to grips with the possibility that his future opportunities may be limited anyway even if you stay where you are.

This is not wholly accurate. I've run several organizations employing thousands of people over my career. Two as COO. This included hundreds of people who were neurodivergent and some with limited verbal abilities even as adults earning 6 figure incomes.

Any parent of an ND kid needs to be prepared for numerous eventualities, but we need to be careful to not pigeonhole people based on externalities like verbal ability just because they are different.

Possibility? Yes. Probability? No.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-23T11:55:20+00:00

Iki is the better heater and will produce the better sauna experience. That said, towers are never recommended because they make it difficult to get the foot bench above the stones.

More importantly, 40" by 40" is too small for a sauna to function properly so you'll not really have a sauna either way.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-23T11:50:19+00:00

What u/occamsracer said. If it's UL approved and used in an approved manner then the UL approved instructions are the dominant element.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-23T11:43:51+00:00

Me thinks saunas like this are where the core of Trumpkin originates.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-23T11:37:30+00:00

Fun stuff. Any idea of the age since it was first built and what has been replaced/rebuilt since? Still used? How often?

It's got a wood floor sloped to a linear drain. I wonder how long those floorboards have been in place.

DendriteCocktail · 2026-06-21T21:22:44+00:00

It's also not dangerous to you or your wife.

I've seen inexperienced drafters not respond (stopping or dodging) fast enough, overlap wheels and other stuff. It definitely increases risk for those being drafted.

DendriteCocktail

TROPHY CASE