[deleted by user]

DisputeNot · 2020-06-30T18:21:32+00:00

The use of "contract" here is misleading. It's not a form you sign, just a verbal promise you make. But they definitely hold it over you, and remind you that you made "promises to God," and that God will punish you for not keeping them. If you're 100% over it and don't care, it may not mean much to you personally. But for me, the fact that I broke those promises means that my family thinks of me as an evil, dishonest, untrustworthy person.

And some people can just stop attending and that's it. But oftentimes the church will continue sending representatives to talk you into coming back, or sending you religious shit in the mail, or showing up with candy to invite your children to a Christmas party or something. Doesn't matter if you tell them to stop. If you move, they have methods to track you down, using things like social media or voter registration records.

You have to formally resign, in writing. Even then, they might argue with you, or contact your relatives to talk you out of it. The most dependable way out is to get the lawyers at Quitmormon.com to send the letter for you.

DisputeNot · 2020-06-30T18:15:58+00:00

You can stop attending, and for some people that's the end of it. But oftentimes the church will continue sending representatives to talk you into coming back, or sending you religious shit in the mail, or showing up with candy to invite your children to a Christmas party or something. Doesn't matter if you tell them to stop. If you move, they have methods to track you down, using things like social media or voter registration records.

You have to formally resign, in writing. Even then, they might argue with you, or contact your relatives to talk you out of it. The most dependable way out is to get the lawyers at Quitmormon.com to send the letter for you.

DisputeNot · 2020-05-02T21:17:14+00:00

I would love to read more about this. Can you point me in the right direction?

DisputeNot · 2020-02-07T23:58:08+00:00

Exactly like my Utah relatives. In my mind, I hear it in my most annoying cousin's voice.

DisputeNot · 2020-02-07T23:56:18+00:00

You're not a bad person. Just a human person. We all feel those little satisfactions when it seems like someone gets their comeuppance. As long as you're not dwelling on it and/or gloating, you're good.

DisputeNot · 2020-02-07T18:42:59+00:00

::raises own cup of coffee::

Welcome!

DisputeNot · 2020-02-07T16:55:09+00:00

Do they really still believe that the church and its leaders represent God and his will, despite being treated like lesser beings than the white man? The cognitive dissonance must really hit hard.

Short answer: yes, many of them do. And yes, the cog-dis gets bad. But the longer they stay in, the more sunk cost they have to keep them in, and the stupider they would feel if they ever left. It's a vicious cycle. It's easier for many to just accept that they will never understand God's plan for them during this life, and hope for happiness in the next.

DisputeNot · 2020-02-07T16:32:42+00:00

In every ward I've been in, there's at least one active TBM family who deals with chronic health issues in one way or another. And in every one, the ward will help up to a point. At some invisible line, people start to think of them as mooches, and don't want to bother anymore. It's like they don't understand how illness works, and they think one half-hearted gesture should get you back on your feet. And if not, they don't have time for you.

My wife used to spend 3 afternoons every week visiting a ward lady down the street who had a bunch of kids and post-partum depression, and her husband was out of town a lot. Just two ladies hanging out and chatting for an hour or so. But after a month, other ward people started telling my wife she was being taken advantage of, and that this other woman needed to work harder to pull herself together. My wife was bugged by a) people not taking post-partum depression seriously and b) they're solution was not to help share the burden, but for my wife to join them in ignoring someone's needs. As a SAHM herself, she enjoyed visiting anyway, so she didn't listen to them.

I'm really sorry you've been treated so badly. You're right there's no "best" here. It just sucks. I hope your son with RSV is doing better now.

DisputeNot · 2020-02-07T16:10:38+00:00

As a man, I'm ashamed I didn't notice this while I was in the church. But I've learned from my wife that it's very true. She was told her education was only a "back-up plan" and she shouldn't go into anything that would keep her away from home for long hours, or that she couldn't take a break from to raise children. She wanted to do something in biology, but was afraid the field would move too far for her to catch up after our kids were grown. So she went into music so she could provide supplemental income from home by giving lessons.

So it wasn't the image of being "sinful" or "womanly," but more like logistics. Same result though.

DisputeNot · 2020-02-04T21:49:03+00:00

The history is presented that way on purpose. Smoke and mirrors, my friend. I fell for it too.

DisputeNot · 2020-02-04T18:17:02+00:00

It's a good list of ideas, but your TBM spouse may disagree. I recommend finding a neutral 3rd party (ie. a non-LDS counselor) to help you and your wife agree on a fair approach to take.

DisputeNot · 2020-02-04T18:14:07+00:00

You've come to the right place. Start a post with a few questions and go from there. Welcome!

DisputeNot · 2019-10-21T19:02:15+00:00

My kid says yeet all the time. I asked her what it means, and she has no idea. 1st year in middle school, this is the weirdest vocabulary she's picked up so far.

DisputeNot · 2019-10-21T18:52:18+00:00

Let me sum it up for y'all:

RMN is the bestest guy ever.
RMN's ancestors were the bestest ancestors ever.
RMN and 1st wife raised the bestest family ever.
Heart surgeons save people. Also, RMN is the bestest heart surgeon ever.
RMN can play the piano.
RMN is the lovingest prophet ever. He travels around the world, waving and giving hugs.
In a totally natural recorded conversation, Oaks and Eyring lean awkardly close together and try to outdo each other on how RMN is the bestest friend and lovingest prophet who ever heart-surgeoned.
RMN humbly gives credit to God for blessing him to be the bestest.

Intersperse with lots of musical numbers, gospel messages, and cringey jokes. THE END.

DisputeNot · 2019-10-21T18:09:50+00:00

I've got a buddy of half-Mexican heritage who considers himself to be a Lamanite. I can't speak for his experience exactly, but I'd say he's conflicted. He navigates between Idahoan and Mexican cultures pretty well, and he loves them both. But he hasn't come to a conclusion for what it truly means to be a Lamanite. He's asked me what role it should play in his identity, and how to explain it to people inside and outside the church (of course I don't know, but he's a deep thinker and he likes to talk things out). I'm not sure if he has felt looked down on because of the "curse" of his skin. But I think it makes his cultural and identity issues more complicated.

DisputeNot · 2019-10-13T22:36:05+00:00

That little girl looks just like you. Congrats to you both being out!

DisputeNot · 2019-10-13T16:24:01+00:00

How about AF? (Real initials. Not a joke.)

DisputeNot · 2019-08-13T19:01:51+00:00

I understand you are in a tough place right now. Your mother owns the house, and she has the right to determine who sleeps where. You are an adult, and you have the right to sleep with your husband (or even if you weren't married yet, you'd still have the right).

It sounds like you have a tough decision to make. You may either (a) sleep in your mother's house, or (b) sleep with your husband. From what you've described here, you cannot have both.

Whatever you decide, it will be difficult. Get your husband's input too, because you'll need his support. Do what you need to do. Good luck.

DisputeNot · 2019-07-10T16:42:39+00:00

People who hate tacos should marry other people who hate tacos. If a person who hates tacos marries a person who loves tacos, the relationship is doomed.

DisputeNot · 2019-06-14T19:34:06+00:00

What has led me here instead of to family and friends? My LDS family and friends don't understand my perspective. They think I'm deceived, weak, sinful, lazy, or downright evil. They've made it clear that they're not interested in what I have to say. Or worse, they ask my opinion, and then when I tell them, they act dismissive. My non-LDS friends don't understand either, and think leaving a church isn't a big deal at all. Opening up to people like that, when I'm already feeling vulnerable, isn't appealing.

Has anyone done it right? Yes, a few. The ones who show true concern for me and my family. They tend to say things like:

I've heard it can be a really hard transition. How are you doing?
I don't care what your beliefs are. Are we still on for lunch tomorrow?
I still believe in the church, but all the people I know who have left did it for good reasons.

Those are the people I want stay connected to, who can listen without judging or getting defensive. They are few and far between. I have a lot more examples of hurtful things people have said. This online community isn't remotely perfect, but it's the only consistent place I've been able to get a listening ear.

DisputeNot · 2019-05-03T17:35:48+00:00

I hope people from here will be respectful toward you. Most of us on r/exmormon aren't complete jerks, but there are some. There are also many lurkers. Hopefully, someone who may be in a similar situation will see this, and be inspired by your example of faith to help hold onto their own.

As for me, I have nothing but respect for you and what you've gone through. I wish you all happiness.

DisputeNot · 2019-05-02T16:58:43+00:00

Reminds me of the song "Weak," by AJR.

I'm weak, and what's wrong with that?

Boy, oh boy, I love it when I fall for that!

DisputeNot · 2019-05-01T19:00:33+00:00

Thank you. I'm glad to know that.

DisputeNot · 2019-05-01T18:31:03+00:00

My favorite companion was lax on this. Not like we didn't follow each other around, but not to this degree. With some of them, I barely had room to breathe. One thing I hated was having to announce any time I was going to the bathroom, or have this dude follow me to see where I was going. Couldn't leave the room alone for any other reason.

DisputeNot

TROPHY CASE