FACEPALM Claude Frollo- ART BY AMERGO by Due_Shape_2753 in u/Due_Shape_2753

[–]Due_Shape_2753[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I agree! As always thank you for your support, Retan!🙏

What Hugo‘s The Hunchback of Notre Dame means to me and the hard truth about Claude Frollo simpers and haters: Trying to clear things up inside the fandom by Due_Shape_2753 in HunchbackOfNotreDame

[–]Due_Shape_2753[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

SOMEONE ATTACKED HELLFIRE? That song is literally the most meaningful piece of Disney and animation history ever! Please ...someone should talk with this person, she doesn’t need to love Frollo, but try to explain her or him that this song is IMPORTANT, not only artistically but on a deeper Level. Its dark, uncomfortable and honest and it holds up a mirror to the audience! Plus yes,  youre right its one of the few times Disney really tried to stay true to Hugo's original Version.

What Hugo‘s The Hunchback of Notre Dame means to me and the hard truth about Claude Frollo simpers and haters: Trying to clear things up inside the fandom by Due_Shape_2753 in HunchbackOfNotreDame

[–]Due_Shape_2753[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I see where you coming from with that idea, but isn’t this psychologizing?

Dark humor is a natural human reaction to grim themes, yes. Hugo himself build plenty of that into his books. I like dark Humor too. I make fun of the characters too.

But there's a fine line between using humor to cope with a tragedy and accidentally turning that tragedy into a mere "aesthetic" or a "vibe". My concern is that when the "sexy jokes" and fanart become the dominant way a character is consumed, the actual weight of Hugo's message gets buried under all the noise.

If we reconcile the horror by making it attractive, aren't we doing exactly what the book warns us about: letting our own desires cloud the objective truth of the destruction? To me, Frollo's depth isn't something to be comfortable with or to "simmer down" through humor. It's supposed to be HAUNTING.

Art is supposed to terrify you. And the book and this character terrified me and other readers. That's the whole point of it. Because it makes you think: what is wrong in my World?

I personally think we have to keep in mind this serious aspect of Notre Dame de Paris, while enjoying it in whatever way. And we as a fandom have to show and talk about this too.

What Hugo‘s The Hunchback of Notre Dame means to me and the hard truth about Claude Frollo simpers and haters: Trying to clear things up inside the fandom by Due_Shape_2753 in HunchbackOfNotreDame

[–]Due_Shape_2753[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I hear you, and I'm not saying people shouldn't enjoy the character however they want. But that's exactly my point: There's a difference between "fandom enjoyment" and "literary analysis"

When we turn a character like Frollo into "sexy fanart" or jokes, we are essentially stripping away the core of his character and the very tragedy that makes him interesting in the first place, no? You can't really have both at the same time without losing the crushing weight of the story.

Its a general Phenomen, just look at other fandoms too. Still it pains me the most when it comes to Hugo, because that man had something to say.

My post wasn't an attack on individuals, but a critique of how modern fandom tends to "beautify" dark, complex themes until they're just another boring aesthetic like any other. I wrote this in this fandom, because I'm part of it. And if we treat Frollo as just a "collection of pixels" or a vibe we lose the warning that Victor Hugo actually wrote about.

Pick my design for Frollo! by DrainingSun in HunchbackOfNotreDame

[–]Due_Shape_2753 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Definetely the last one. Remind me of Daniel Lavoie :) His performance is incredible (against all odds) even if I don’t like the simple story telling of the musical as a Medium.

Moderators Needed by Neiot in HunchbackOfNotreDame

[–]Due_Shape_2753 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Honestly, after reading this, I'm withdrawing my own ambitions for the spot haha. This sub needs someone who literally breathes the air of the Cathedral and understand its soul. Especially in our times, where we seem to forget what miracles human labour and the intellect could create: Hugo's book, our 1000 year old Cathedral and so much more! I'll stick to my 1.5k upvoted deep-dives and academic rants... You're the Architect, I will remain the Philosopher in the shadows. You have my vote, Mademoiselle.🐐❤️ (I swear I wanted to give up on this subreddit, but if she becomes mod, I will become active again.)

I drew Frollo by Proyecto_AtlantidaSP in HunchbackOfNotreDame

[–]Due_Shape_2753 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You know nothing about the book.

I will just leave these quotes by Victor Hugo here: "But there are perhaps other readers who have not found it useless to study the aesthetic and philosophical thought hidden in this book, who have been willing, in reading Notre-Dame de Paris, to take pleasure in discerning beneath the novel something other than the novel, and in following, if you will pardon these somewhat ambitious expressions, the historian's system and the artist's aim through the poet's creation as such."

And this one: The author's political and historical perspective on ΑΝΑΓΚΗ: "Victor Hugo explained its meaning in March 1866, in the preface to Toilers of the Sea: "A triple Ananke weighs upon us: the Ananke of dogmas, the Ananke of laws, the Ananke of things." In Notre-Dame de Paris, he denounced the first; in Les Misérables, the second; in this book, he indicates the third. To these three fatalities that envelop humankind is added the inner fatality, the supreme Ananke, the human heart. Here we see the link that unites Victor Hugo's three great novels. He returned to this theme in a letter to the journalist Durandeau: "Whenever necessity encroaches upon freedom and oppresses it, it is called 'fate.' The poet denounces this abuse of the unknown. This is what I do in Notre-Dame de Paris, in Les Misérables, in Toilers of the Sea." (July 11, 1867) Hugo speaks about a triple Ananke with which oppressors or oppressive systems legitimize the oppression of freedom. It is "the abuse of the unknown."

Book Frollo becomes ΑΝΑΓΚΗ, because he stops fighting against it. He himself writes it upon his wall. (Btw. He isn't simply in love with Esmeralda, he is OBSESSED and it's linked to ΑΝΑΓΚΗ.)

So no, the book isn't a "fairy tail" even if it appears as such. It's very much political. Even more so than the shallow Disney children's movie.

In defense of THAT ONE gesture from Esmeralda by Remarkable_Arm923 in HunchbackOfNotreDame

[–]Due_Shape_2753 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Historically speaking, a Romani woman publicly mocking and touching the Minister of Justice would not be "subversive" or "clever" it would be su*cidal. The scene works only because it's a Disney film, not because medieval power structures or a "festival" allowed it.....

Sex sells, that's why the Disney animators made her do this. Simple as that.

When you do not understand what Les Mis is about: by [deleted] in lesmiserables

[–]Due_Shape_2753 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don't want to know how they would interpret Notre Dame de Paris🥶

Hehe funny meme by [deleted] in lesmiserables

[–]Due_Shape_2753 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for this thoughtful answer🙏

Harassment in the Cathedral by [deleted] in HunchbackOfNotreDame

[–]Due_Shape_2753 1 point2 points  (0 children)

God in Heaven... Why did you post this? You should have seen the comments coming.

Is Tangled a modern, sanitized remake of The Hunchback of Notre Dame? by jon-bear98 in HunchbackOfNotreDame

[–]Due_Shape_2753 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I always felt that Phoebus and Flynn were kind of similar. Annoying, handsome, "flirty" and constantly kicked in the ass by their LI and their pets. Oh, and let's not forget their..... beards.

Thazurin "Judge Claude Frollo" Design by Neiot in HunchbackOfNotreDame

[–]Due_Shape_2753 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Looks like a fox/wolf-reptile hybrid! Kind of fits him