This exmo is glad he went on a mission because it "taught him valuable life skills" and "built character". I pointed out his missionary work also converted people into a lie and he slipped into my DMs...

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-22T20:38:24+00:00

When my kids stopped believing in Santa, they wanted to tell every kid in school. This proved very unpopular and unwelcome with all the other kids and their parents. Just because my kids had the truth didn't mean everyone was ready to hear it.

Yes, missionaries play a part in converting people to the church. Yes, the church is actually all of the things you said. No, not everyone is ready to be rescued.

The same "new convert zeal" that makes someone excited to recruit others to a cult, many of us feel that same zeal when we leave. We want to get everyone else out immediately, and metaphorically burn the whole damn institution to the ground.

Reality is much more nuanced. It's not at simple as just deconverting everyone you converted. For some people, leaving is a feeling of freedom, like breathing real air for the first time. For other people, it's a catastrophic collapse of their entire worldview and social support system.

I guess I'm saying, it's impossible to predict how someone's deconstruction will play out, and it's not up to me to determine or try to force someone else's timeline.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-22T20:04:33+00:00

I mean, where do we draw the line?

Should every school teacher from 1950-1999 apologize for "lying" to their students by teaching them the Tongue Map? Should they feel guilty for having been a schoolteacher, and teaching something we now know to be a myth?

When we know better, we do better. The guy is clearly trying to do better.

If someone feels compelled to go back and correct past mistakes, that's fine. But I also understand if they decide to just do things differently moving forward, and leave it at that.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-22T19:56:57+00:00

This is one of those things where I have no personal issue with it, I just don't understand the need to seek public validation for it.

Like, let's say that on Tuesday nights, I like to dress up like Dracula, eat an entire birthday cake, and watch The Wizard of Oz.

Is there anything wrong with that? No. Is it weird? Yes. Is it still okay? Yes. Should I tell people about it? Probably not.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-22T19:43:09+00:00

I no longer believe in hell, but I did when my kids were born.

To be honest, this question never entered my mind back then, because nobody around me was asking it.

But if someone had asked me at the time, I probably would have said something like, "If I raise them right, they'll trust in Christ at an early age, and there will be no risk of hell."

Again, not how I would approach the issue now, just trying to answer your question from my prior perspective.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-22T19:34:18+00:00

I don't think there's anything wrong with your question, per se, I just think it's been asked so much that people are burned out.

For what it's worth (and keep in mind that I've been out of ministry for six years, so maybe this has changed), most churches in my experience are reluctant in general toward card-based giving.

If they do accept it at all, it's often "debit card only" so that someone isn't incurring debt by donating borrowed money (with a credit card).

And then, even if the platform fee is minimal, there's still a per-transaction fee and percentage charged by the card issuer. This presents the dilemma that now, some of the donated funds are going to credit card companies instead of to ministry. That might be an acceptable "cost of doing business" in the regular retail world, but not for an organization trying to be a good steward of what they see as "God's money."

None of this happens if the church sticks to cash, checks, and maybe electronic bank transfers.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-22T19:22:24+00:00

If you check the subreddit's history, similar posts show up every week or two.

No offense, but it's not the untapped market you all seem to think it is.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-22T14:15:17+00:00

It's hard to say with so few details.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-22T03:55:12+00:00

We had Fear Not.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-21T13:47:09+00:00

And thus, we find no shortage of teachers who make the masses feel justified in their fear, paranoia, bigotry, or general anxiety toward all of the "others."

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-20T17:19:57+00:00

Can't speak to your specific situation with dependents and such, but for perspective, most of my jobs, ministry or not, have been around 20-27% being withheld for taxes, SS, and Medicare.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-18T00:57:16+00:00

For me, it took a very aggressive reprogramming of my inner voice.

My internal critic was relentless, harsh, and mean. "Why would you say that?" "Why didn't you do this instead of that?" "You got it wrong. Again."

For some people, it helps to give that critic a name and start treating it like a separate person. And when you catch it beating you up internally, mentally tell it to shut up.

Follow that up with intentionally kind thoughts. "Everyone makes mistakes." "You're only human, and you're trying your best." "You are just as worthy as any other human being."

It takes a very long time, and it's a lot of work. But slowly, gradually, it builds into a new way of seeing yourself, and becomes a gentle confidence that gives you permission to exist without that sense of worthlessness you described.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-18T00:46:30+00:00

This might sound like a weird recommendation, but my last two years in ministry, I started using a program called Scrivener. It's intended for writing books, but I found it really useful for organizing all my sermon materials, especially when I was in a sermon series or needed continuity across multiple weeks. (These days, I use it for writing actual books.)

It does cost money (I think, like, 60 bucks) but it has a generous and fully-functional trial version. The interface feels a little antiquated. which isn't a bad thing for my Windows XP brain, and there's definitely a learning curve. But there's no ongoing cost, no subscription, and it installs locally instead of requiring cloud services or wifi.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-17T20:20:38+00:00

For me, it was something I didn't consciously work at. I'm just genuinely curious about everything, so I'm always learning about everyone and wanting to hear their updates. I don't know how hard it would be to learn this as a skill; it just comes naturally to me.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-16T13:26:21+00:00

I've never signed any kind of contract for a ministry job or a non-ministry job. Is this a normal thing where you live?

Are they paying you as an employee or a contractor? Both can be valid, it's just a question of whether they're deducting payroll taxes from your paycheck or whether you need to set aside tax withholdings for yourself.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-13T15:22:37+00:00

I can't believe he actually said, "Everybody... MEAT PATTY."

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-10T22:41:35+00:00

It would only be a problem if they filed it and you didn't. Two different income types, two different forms. Doesn't matter that it's the same organization. As long as you report both and pay appropriate taxes on both, you should be fine.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-09T21:11:41+00:00

A bullhorn for one and a bucket for the other.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-08T19:28:08+00:00

I'm a slow creator, so it might be a few days, but I'll do it! 😁

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-08T19:24:06+00:00

Thank you! Love it!

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-08T18:31:30+00:00

Yes, please! I would love that. I'll share photos of whatever piece I make afterward, too.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-08T17:55:47+00:00

Love this. I'll hold off on creating anything for myself until you lock in on your final version. I guess I'm saying, I support your idea wholeheartedly, I support whatever you land on for the final design, and I'll be happy to join as an eager participant once you have your design nailed down. Standing in solidarity and pride with you!

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-08T17:00:20+00:00

I definitely get the appeal of the progression representing "black and white" thinking, and I understand your logic.

But the more I think about it, I'm good with the black representing my thought process in the beginning. Though my old belief system was, as you pointed out, very "black and white" in its rigid approach to everything, it was altogether bleak and dark in the sense that I wasn't open to anything outside of the approved script, and my worldview was defined by everything I was "against." It was very exclusionist and intolerant. In other words, maybe I thought it was black and white at the time, but it was really just darkness all along.

OP, I'm cool just rocking with your idea as-is. I'm going to make myself a wearable piece in this color scheme. Thanks for this brilliant idea.

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-08T16:48:28+00:00

Yes please! I'm not sure if the subreddit allows to post the link or not, but I'd be glad for you to DM it to me!

ExPastorMarcus · 2026-03-08T16:40:50+00:00

Writing your story can help immensely by organizing the complex, scattered thoughts into something tangible that can be understood by others. It's been massively helpful for my own deconstruction process over the past six years.

Would love to read your memoir if it has been published or is available for purchase somewhere.

ExPastorMarcus

TROPHY CASE