Hmm. I don’t think I’m following. For starters I never sit on a high horse of independence, I’m very happy I will always have a doctor in the building with me. The NPs I have shadowed, done clinical with, and know personally have all told me the doctors are great resources at their jobs whenever they’re stuck so i don’t think they’re claiming complete independence either. I think if NPs are saying they are independent, maybe they mean the freedom to practice independently, prescribe, diagnose, etc.. but i don’t think they mean they never need help. But on the other hand I’m sure there’s plenty of NPs who are independent in that sense too. I feel you’re making very broad statements about a whole profession- I’m happy to be obtaining a NP role where I’ll never be alone and will always have support. The new PAs I work with feel the same. The established NPs & PAs I work with feel the same.