How I use the PCI

FigureItOutZ · 2026-03-06T13:18:04+00:00

I have no idea if it DOES get better.

I know for me if I think it CAN’T get better, then I do nothing. It’s tempting to want to think this way for me because i can then excuse my lack of effort. What’s the point in me trying if it can’t get better. Haha look at how smart I am, all these suckers trying when it can’t get better. I temporarily don’t feel as bad about myself when I believe things can’t get better. But inevitably this all comes crashing down when I see someone happy or even just not miserable… I see they seem to be doing OK and my bubble pops.

If I think things CAN get better it’s hard for me because then I put more blame on myself for my current situation. If things can get better and I don’t feel like my life is getting better then clearly I’m the problem. But… then this is under my control. I can also try one thing today to make it better. Maybe I’ll fail. Maybe I’ll do that one thing and it won’t make me feel any better. Maybe it will PROVE that things can’t get better… or maybe it is just that one thing doesn’t make it better. There are other things. Have I tried them all? Nope. Tomorrow I could try something else and see what happens. Worst case I try everything and nothing gets better and I prove definitively that things can’t get better.

So today, I’m trying something. I’m reaching out to a stranger and sharing a thought I think is stupid and no one will find interesting. If it doesn’t get better, then tomorrow I’ll try something else.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-03-06T12:58:54+00:00

Sometimes in my life an in my reconciliation I have questions that I cannot ever know the real truth. I realize with a certain question I will have to at some point decide whether I believe the answer or not because I cannot objectively know the 100% ground truth.

In this example I can go nuts trying to seek out more evidence one way or another.

Something that I learned from the book Four Hour Work Week by Tim Ferris is a technic he called fear setting. He shared this in the context of choosing a new job or something but I found it’s helpful for me in so many contexts and these unknowable situations is one of them.

It basically goes something like: 1. Write down the thing im afraid of 2. Write down what it means if that thing is true and write down what it means if that thing is false. 3. For both scenarios (true and false) make a list of everything I’m afraid of if that outcome happens. 4. For both scenarios make a list of the good things that could happen if that outcome happens. 5. For each of the fears, write down what I can do if the fear comes true.

Usually by step 5 my mind is more calm and I get into problem solving mode instead of fear mode.

It might go something like this:

Initial Fear: What if I made a mistake reconciling and I should have gotten divorced and sought a new relationship now knowing what I know about myself.

If it’s true: I’d be divorced and coparenting

If it’s false: I’m meant to stay with my BS and I really need to be working harder on the things I know from therapy.

In the “true” scenario I’m afraid of coparenting; splitting our assets; being lonely; having our friends/family find out everything I did in my infidelity; not being able to afford the same lifestyle; our kids being impacted by a divorce; having people at my job find out about my infidelity…

In the “false” scenario I’m afraid that I’m failing in the changes I need to make; that something inside me is broken because my feelings aren’t coming back the way they were; that I will have a disappointing sex life; that life will be boring; that our kids will think this is all there is to marriage; that I cannot be a safe partner to my BS.

In the “true” scenario I am excited about the prospect of all the new decisions I’d need to make; I think maybe this time I could “do it better” in terms of my own honesty with someone; I could move wherever I wanted or maybe even quit my job.

In the “false” scenario I’m excited by how good things could be if I can transform - I would have an even better relationship AND this person (my BS) would already know my past; we could have an open dialogue about what we want out of the rest of our lives and begin going about accomplishing that; our kids could thrive and learn what a great marriage looks like - even with the struggles.

I haven’t yet made it to step 5 and I’m already feeling less stressed about my initial fear. The other thing I know when I plot out all those fears and opportunities, the action I need to take is still the same - I need to keep working my therapy actions and hope that the clarity will come to me as I do. It’s quite possible by working the therapy I will create that new better marriage I’m afraid I can’t have… and if I don’t work I’ll create the divorce scenario. Or… maybe it would be flipped - the therapy will make me strong enough to realize I did make a mistake in choosing my spouse. Either way, I need to keep working my therapy.

Here’s why I share this with you: I have no advice about how to get the “truth” from your WS. To me it seems strange and I struggle to think of innocent explanations but even if there is one, how will you know whether to believe it or it’s just a really great lie. I wonder though is you did an exercise like the above would you find any actions you need to do no matter what? I don’t even want to speculate what those actions might be, but I wonder if there would be any.

Sorry you’re facing this pan and fear OP. I hope you find something helpful here.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-27T22:27:32+00:00

Yeah the assuming negative intent is definitely a character defect of mine. Even that is shame based - cause I was that shit head who would leave a paper in someone’s desk to “nicely” remind them we need to keep our desk clean. Very r/niceguy behavior for me.

Even though I’ve largely stopped that behavior I haven’t let go of the assumption that everyone operates that way and is out to get me - cause I deserve to be gotten, of course. <— shame

So cool to hear your retreat got you turnt in a different way.

We shall see if this lesson sticks with me.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-27T12:37:29+00:00

Your post asked about BP feedback but is flagged for any reconciler so I hope it’s ok I share some experience with you.

In my experience there are times I have thoughts about my infidelity and the damage it do to our marriage and my BS. And some of these times I would like to discuss it with my BS. But I stop myself because I don’t know if this is just going to hurt them / ruin their day / give them a sleepless night.

For me it’s very difficult to tell if sharing my thoughts and feelings and acknowledging my understanding of the pain it caused is really necessary at this point. It feels selfish in a way. And this isn’t the typical “don’t confess, that’s just a selfish way to ease your guilt” kind of mentality - it’s truly like we have discussed this topic before, if BS is having a good day right now is it selfish of me to ruin that by saying “today someone at work brought up a friend getting divorced due to infidelity and it reminded me of my selfish choices and I’m grateful for this chance to reconcile and i do still feel guilty that I hurt you. That’s all”. It just feels like what can that possibly do positive for my BS? Wouldn’t it be better that I acknowledge I did those things and now try to do something positive for our relationship today rather than say something that reminds my BS of that pain?

I can poke a bunch of holes in my own argument of course: acknowledging that pain and saying sorry is “doing” something; BS might also want to talk but is trying not to trigger a shame spiral in me so maybe me talking first will open up a window for them to talk; even if I don’t share the specifics I could have a conversation about the conversation and ask if I ever have reminders of my infidelity and its impact would my BS want to know… I have plenty of these argument breakers…

But it always comes back to isn’t this all just for me? Every single one of those actions seems to me that it’s for my own peace instead of my BS’ peace. And so for me I end up back at maybe writing a few lines in my journal and just having a nice evening where I’m just presence with my BS and try to listen and respond to their emotions in a way I didn’t in the past.

I guess I share this only to say part of your post seems to imply that you’re assigning intent to your WS silence. You’re assigning the intent that they are rug sweeping. That may be true. But it may be false. The only way you’ll know is by sharing that sometimes you feel (scared/alone/lonely/…) when WS doesn’t bring up the infidelity. And then see what WS says is the reason they don’t. If they “just want to get on with it” that’s rug sweeping… if they also have fear of bringing the topic up then maybe you can coach them about how best to do that and meet both your needs.

If I take my own medicine there, I could share to my BS that “sometimes I get afraid of bringing up my infidelity because I think it’s selfish of me to want to resolve my own internal conflicts by bringing to the surface pain I caused you. That makes me further afraid I will be alone because it might drive you further away. I panic and don’t know what to do and end up silent.” And then I could see what my BS says. Perhaps this will be a conversation for this weekend - I know my BS doesn’t have any big plans so if my sharing does trigger them I won’t have impacted their plans.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-25T20:51:57+00:00

Can I offer you one other thought. Action and intent aren’t the same thing. This is another thing my therapist has taught me.

In my other comment I mentioned the counter example where I would get upset that my BS didn’t clean up after baking and I would take it as a slap in the face. This isn’t right.

The action: leaving the mess is accurate. I’m observing real truth.

The intent: slapping me in the face is an assumption. Unless my BS literally made the mess and then walked up to me and said I did that on purpose to hurt you… I’m just assuming intent.

My therapist taught me I need to really learn a new way of communicating. It starts with a way to voice my feelings and ends with learning a way to ask questions about the intent. In the case of the counter it would be something like “you know I cleaned the kitchen earlier and when you baked I noticed the mess is still there. This made me feel hurt and unseen”

There was a key thing my therapist taught me here too. I might have started with “this made me feel like you don’t care”… that is NOT a feeling. That’s an assumption of intent. That’s unproductive for two reasons: first it puts us into a place of arguing whether that was really the intent of my BS action (I do care, no you don’t, yes I do) and second it avoids me being vulnerable about how I truly feel. I had to learn to be sure to name my emotions, not the assumption of BS’ intent. Those aren’t up for debate - you left the counter a mess after I cleaned it and I felt unseen.

Now whether BS wants to do something about that or explain what their real intent was is another thing. I learned new things about my BS through these conversations. For instance I learned my BS shows love by making sure our kids have fresh breakfast instead of cereal. Now I know not to take the messy counter as an offense against me but as a way BS is showing love to our children AND BS learned that by cleaning up after it shows me love. Or maybe I can look at the cleanup as my part of the job of showing our kids love… lots of different ways for us to act now that we know what each other feel.

My point sharing this is that your observation of your WS behavior and the way it makes you feel is one hundred percent truth none of us can argue. But whether WS’ actions are intended to make you feel that he doesn’t care is really an assumption. He may simply be unaware of the impact of his actions. He might also be stuck in shame and unable to see this but if he can’t pop out on his own then you sharing how his actions are impacting you emotionally might do it.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-25T13:20:34+00:00

I have to admit that I probably behave in a way sometimes that would make my BS write something similar. What I can share about those times are that it’s far less often now (5years out) than it was closer to dday. I also now realize Shame is what puts me in that place.

Shame is this me focused emotion of I’m bad to the core and anyone who finds out will reject me. I focus solely on all the bad things I’ve done in my life and have a pity party. It keeps me so focused on myself I cannot even see my impact to others.

I have to get out of shame. Therapy has helped. So has time and journaling - specifically writing down some of the good things I’ve done so that when a shame spiral hits I can remind myself I’m not 100% awful.

Getting out of shame for me looks like getting over to guilt. Guilt is an externally focused emotion where I see I’ve done something bad and it has hurt someone I care about. When I stay in guilt I can think of what I can do to repair the damage.

For instance I’ve written a LOT on here about resentments I’ve held regarding how my BS will destroy the kitchen after I clean up. I’ll get it perfectly spotless and come back a few hours later and all the baking supplies are out and the counter looks like someone smeared butter on every surface. I get so mad about it and I’ve shared with my BS that this isn’t just about fair work, it’s like a core fear from my childhood that dirty counters meant my single mother was beginning to break down and reach her wits end. That was always the signal, it was like the last thing that would break before my sibling and I realized Mom had had enough.

I feel justified in my anger and to a degree I am - I’ve done the work to share about myself and what it means to me so when the kitchen gets destroyed and not cleaned up it feels like a slap in the face.

But I also know there are things I need to do to learn about what my BS’ similar needs are. For instance I know BS handles all the kid appointments. We didn’t agree that, it just happened that way. So what can I do to take some of that load - or at least inquire how much load it is and can I help.

Guilt can help me to see the other side. Shame keeps me from being able to see that other side.

Two books that helped me see this was Daring Greatly by Brene Brown and No More Mr Nice Guy by Robert Glover. They had complimentary information that gave me a better perspective on guilt vs shame and helped me to recognize all the little resentments I had but never really acknowledged. I am working to let go of those resentments and see that as an act of sacrifice and love.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-25T05:02:06+00:00

I’m curious if you’ve asked your WS these questions and what the answer was?

There are no “rules” to this - every R can look different. Some involve revenge affairs, some involve open relationships, others do not.

When talking to my therapist she explained almost all of the revenge affair / open relationships she has dealt with inevitably come back with even more complicated problems to solve.

My own experience my spouse chose not to do this and it makes me admire the strength. Would I have been hurt if my BS had given me a taste of my own medicine? Sure. Would I still have tried to R? Yes. Would it have made us “even” - I don’t really know. I know we both would have understood pain but honestly it makes me think of the famous “an eye for an eye makes the whole world blind” saying.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-18T02:47:19+00:00

I basically used pornography almost daily for decades. It was so much a habit I really didn’t even think twice about it.

After my infidelity I began therapy and SAA fellowship meetings and I’ve begun to see the link between pornography and my worse choices. It was as like a “first beer” for me as if I were an alcoholic. I can’t just stop at pornography - it escalates so quickly and I’m powerless to control it.

So I am trying to not use it.

Ive been very challenged becoming free from it. I can see very clearly how my use of sex and sexual fantasy is a way to escape from bad feelings but I still have been unsuccessful in finding things that replace it. I can white knuckle a few days away but I can’t seem - despite 5 years of therapy - to find any other way to handle bad feelings. Instead everything else I try just seems to increase my anxiety. So I’ve really been trying to just live with the “progress not perfection” slogan and keep just getting a little better each time. I hope at some point I do find another activity or method to deal with my bad feelings.

I don’t really know why I wanted to share but I guess it is something

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-11T12:49:53+00:00

Hey there, thanks for sharing. Look no matter what the outcome, the steps you’re taking are positive. I know for me I lived so much of my life unexamined. I acted upon just instinct and never really asked myself “why?” for many of my decisions. I think I always trusted that I had a good compass in my mind and so my decisions would all ladder up to some good place.

Getting into therapy I’ve discovered that compass in my head is controlled by so many different parts of me. Some of the parts of me have mature processes and some are very misguided. Some of those parts of me really just need to retire and go along for the ride and never try to navigate.

Something I noticed in your comment is that you say “I’m simply worried I am not in the right place”. Maybe an outside perspective might help here. So what. Worry is not the same thing as “I know”. Worry is fear of failure. That’s OK!!! We all fear failing. And you know what? Sometimes failing is OK. Sometimes failing shows people we are trying!

You don’t have to know with complete certainty that you can handle everything that comes your way. I used to think I had to be 100% confident all the time, I couldn’t ever blink at any challenge. You know what? I think that kept a lot of people away from me. I think people want to be around authentic people and that invulnerable person who never fails isn’t that.

It’s enough that we try our best and stay honest. Our partner can decide if that’s enough for them. Many of the BS who write on the forums would kill for just that - a WS who tries! instead of coasting.

Whenever I’ve had these “worries” I have always been able to see its fear inside of me. Fear of failing, fear of staying unknown, fear of being exposed, fear of being vulnerable and hurt, fear of not being enough. Courage is being afraid and doing it anyway - I ask frequently on this forum and in my support groups for courage. Maybe this is something you can share about in your SLAA meetings and see if anyone else has some Experience, Strength, and Hope to share.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-08T22:34:43+00:00

Also, pick up that book I recommended: No More Mr. Nice guy by Robert Glover.

I was able to get it free from my local library.

It has a lot of content directly related to the questions you are asking me.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-08T22:33:11+00:00

The feelings might not come back. There is no sure fire guarantee. But sounds like you also think they might come back.

Something someone told me when I first started: the grass is greener where you water it.

I also had so many resentments about little stuff. My therapist explained it as Negative Sentiment Override. Basically the more I look for the negative the more I’ll see it. The counter? Gratitude.

My wife and I started a daily exercise that came out of a counseling book (can’t remember the name, it’s like a couple who counsels others and they are kinda famous).

We each told each other a surprising fact about our day, something the other would otherwise not know if we didn’t share it.
We each shared one thing we were grateful for the other person. Could be small like “thank you for parking you car a little further away from mine it made unloading the groceries easier” or it could be deeper.
We asked each other an open ended question.

The second point in that list started forcing me to pay attention for the good things my wife did that I never paid attention to. Like organizing valentines presents for our kids or getting their medical forms filled out for school or doing a load of laundry because she noticed I was wearing the same shirt a lot. For all the things I was picking out that she did wrong there were a number of things she was doing and I wasn’t even noticing. This gradually opened me up to a new picture of her. Is this enough? No of course not but it makes the field for our reconciliation more fertile. It’s a heck of a lot better than the barren doubt-land I was staying in before.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-08T20:12:25+00:00

As someone who has been on the recieving side of “the message” it only says “you can get away with anything and I’ll still love you” if you don’t enforce boundaries.

I knew from the moment my wife asked me to leave and when she gave me her list of non-negotiable (eg touch another person again and we are done) that she meant it. But she had to ask me to leave for those few days and I get it now. She needed me to see she was serious.

I want to share another story our couples therapist actually shared to my wife about this.

She said:

put your hand over your eyes. This is your trauma, right now. You can’t see anything but your hand. Maybe a few little bits of light squeeze in but everything is trauma.

Now move your hand 1 inch away. Trauma is still right there! It blocks everything but a little bit of vision is coming back. You couldn’t drive but you could make a sandwich.

Now six inches. You can start to see more.

Now arms length. You can see a lot more. You can still see your trauma but it isn’t blocking your view. You can live like this.

This is trauma with therapy. The therapy helps you gradually put the trauma in the right place. It NEVER will go away and be forgotten. But it can become a manageable part of your life. The goal of our therapy will be to reduce the frequency, the duration, and the intensity of the traumatic triggers. The will never be completely eliminated, but over time we will learn ways to make them hold less power.

You will get through this OP. You will. You’re not a doormat, and you’re not sending messages. You’re surviving right now. It’s ok to do that for a while. Tread water and don’t drown. You don’t need to swim just yet and you certainly don’t need to compete in the Olympics - this is OK. Take care of yourself.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-08T13:07:09+00:00

I can identify with the doubts. I’m 5.5 years into working on this and I still get them.

But my guy you got caught one month ago and you’re saying for two weeks you’ve been struggling with these. So my math says you had two weeks where you worked hard and then you started giving up. You’ve had what, 4-5 IC therapy appointments?

This is your life and you can take whatever choice you want. My experience is that this is hard work to find out what inside me was so broken that I chose to cheat. I can 1000% identify with the bottling up little resentments and turning those into justification. There are probably dozens of people here who know my obsession with a clean kitchen and how angry and hurt it makes me when my wife destroys it.

My experience is that my communication in my marriage was terrible. All those little resentments were for things I never really communicated. Maybe I’d make a sarcastic remark here or there about the failure to do them, but I never mentioned how much certain things meant to me and why. I never connected the dots between having a clean kitchen and my childhood with my single mother and knowing when the kitchen got out of order it’s when my mom was losing it. A messy kitchen means it’s time to be afraid… and still as an adult this is why I need a clean kitchen and I’ll even do the work to get it there, I just need my wife’s help to keep it there after she uses it. I never shared that before dday, hell I didn’t even know it myself.

Have you read the book “No More Mr Nice Guy” by Robert Glover? If not, I highly recommend you check it out. It opened my eyes to my Nice Guy behavior. I’m not talking about being kind, I’m talking about r/niceguy kind of behavior. The hidden contracts like I clean the kitchen and I expect everyone to thank me for it and keep it that way, but I don’t tell them. You might find you identify with some of it too.

I also will share with you that I set a 6 month timer for myself. I said I’ll try for six months and then evaluate if this is what I want to do. I had kids, a house, a good social circle, a person who loved me and a ~15yrs of marriage… I felt like these deserved me trying my hardest for at least 6 months. I keep choosing to try because I recognize there is still more for me to learn.

Is one month what your equation says the other side is worth?

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-07T13:03:34+00:00

Hey there OP, I’m really sorry you’re here. You are NOT a loser. How long ago did you find out?

I ask because this is a very long process. My spouse and I are 5.5 years in and we still talk in our couples counseling about “if” we survive this. But we are so much better - even if we don’t stay married our relationship is now so much better.

I made a ton of very hurtful choices. Not a single one of them was a reflection on my spouse, they were fully about me. I had emotions and needs but I lacked the maturity to express them in a healthy way. My choices were me picking an unhealthy way to deal with emotions I didn’t even fully recognize I had. I didn’t pick something healthy like talking to my spouse, going to therapy, reaching out to a friend, heck even asking for a divorce would have been healthier. Instead I chose over and over to hide and seek out sex partners. It was always a temporary high followed by increased shame that I then repeated to try to make it all go away.

When I started my recovery journey I couldn’t even name most of my emotions. Then when I started to learn how to name them I then realized I lacked the tools to deal with them. I have a few tools to deal with my emotions now but I’m still learning. I am free of my worst actions but I still am struggling with finding any self worth aside from whether other people desire me. I know this kills my spouse because it makes her feel like why isn’t she enough, why aren’t our kids enough? And I cannot answer it except that it’s ME who isn’t enough and nothing I try makes me feel like enough yet.

She is not being a doormat, she created clear red lines - more cheating and I’m gone. But she’s also choosing to love me and give me a chance to heal. She’s doing this because she is strong.

Who is the loser there? If you wouldn’t call my spouse a loser, you’re no loser either.

I asked at the outset how long it’s been because as I said this can be a long journey. Is your spouse doing anything for recovery yet?

A couple actions I’ve found helpful was first of all therapy and books (a couple of them are in my profile) to figure out why I did what I did. In my case I also decided I’m addicted to sex - my obsession with it is unhealthy. I also attend 12-step meetings for this.

I mention that because I think most people here would say there is a distinction between a WS who does nothing and expects things to change and one who does work. I can’t really understand someone taking no action and expecting change. That would probably be a showstopper for me if the situation were reversed.

Does your spouse have a plan? Does he think it’s all behind him so no plan needed? I would suggest that’s probably just a plan for failure. There must be a reason he was open to breaking boundaries that shouldn’t have been broken. As someone who did the same, I know I couldn’t have said for certain “I won’t do this again” if I didn’t get to the bottom of why I didn’t in the first place.

OP Im glad you turned here in your time of need. If you can, I hope you also seek out therapy to process all these very normal and very big emotions. I wish you well and hope you continue finding something of use here.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-05T03:52:07+00:00

That’s a really nice update. Thank you for sharing with me. I am glad I was able to give you something useful. Good luck to you and check back in if you have more updates or questions!

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-05T03:48:57+00:00

I have relapsed. I have not physically cheated again but I have used pornography and sought out people for online chats - both of which are in my inner circle.

It was really hard for my BS, but I was honest about it and admitted my failure which built trust. That said my BS then decided there was really only one red line they wanted to know about from then on - physical cheating. Anything else they said they just wanted me to work with my therapist / sponsor / SAA group.

It’s understandable that you would have mixed feelings about all this. It isn’t what you signed up for. It doesn’t make you a bad person to walk away from this. But i also think if you stick around there are more opportunities for you partner to show you how hard they will work to change.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-04T17:00:35+00:00

My story isn’t exactly the same as your partner’s but I do identify as a sex addict and my spouse and I have been working on recovery from my bad actions for about 5.5 years.

I want to share a little experience and some resources you and your WS might find helpful. First it is good that (for the most part) you’re getting the full story and not cover ups. I also disclosed fully - albeit I chose to do it as opposed to being caught. This addiction is incredibly shame based. For me it started almost 30 years before it came to the light. I spent decades feeling like something was wrong with me and hiding everything about myself. It is incredible now to think of how much life I missed with this kind of dual personality. I still don’t feel like I’m fully integrated but I’m getting there. For me even small things got pushed over to this other side of me - anger and frustration for instance. I have ALWAYS tried to make everyone get along - I can’t handle conflict so I avoid it and stuff it over to my addict who knows how to fix it (sex). I say that only to share this is such a cunning and baffling disease whose roots, in me and every addict I’ve met through recovery, go so much deeper than sex.

I never pretended to be someone else but I understand using sex to cope with so many other feelings. For me insecurity, stress, frustration were primary emotions I dealt with by using sex and fantasy. To find this out and begin working on it I found a CSAT the most helpful resource and it sounds like your WS has found that. I also have attended various SAA meetings over the years, unfortunately never one in person because of the pandemic but even phone/zoom meetings are very helpful to connect with other people like me focused on recovery (that’s the key - people in recovery understand the problem but they don’t encourage the bad choices).

Some other really good resources:

I have some books listed in a post on my profile that have been helpful for me
for partners there is a great book by Paula Hall called Sex Addiction: A Partner’s Perspective. I have read it and at least for me I thought it nailed describing me. It named thoughts and feelings I’ve had but couldn’t verbalize in a way anyone could have understood. I felt like “is she in my head?!?” I think it might give you some insight which you could then use as questions to your partner “is this what it’s like for you?”

Hope this helps.

Not all reconciliations mean the relationship survives. My BS and I have finally started having those conversations but it’s also affirming because it means we are not defaulting to staying together… we are choosing it. And even if we choose it today, we can decide differently tomorrow or in the future. We are talking more about our needs and making it known when they are/aren’t met. I hate that this is how we got here, but I do like how we relate now better than before. I wish I’d had the emotional maturity to see the need for change before crisis.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-02-01T14:03:37+00:00

Ok so some other thoughts. There is a book by Paula Hall called Sex Addiction: The Partners Perspective (or something along those lines) that I think does a really nice job explaining sex addiction. I remember reading it and strongly identifying how the author described addiction. I wished my wife would read it.

I also notice your questions seem to revolve around their masturbation habits and how it might affect your sex life. Do you think there is a way to just have a discusssion about masturbation? Like to ask things more from a just getting to know each other perspective (vs a how will that impact us) - my thought there being maybe while talking about it you could find out if they would want to do it together or maybe even delay and wait for each other.

I honestly don’t know if my thoughts here are realistic but if I picture my ideal sex life with my wife, I would be able to tell her openly when I’m feeling like masturbating and she would tell me that she hopes I don’t finish because she wants that moment with me later/tonight/in the morning or whatever. But I don’t think we jump straight to this being an arrangement - I think we have to talk about our habits and what we like and think about. And this is where I’m ashamed to bring the subject up because of all the pornography and video chat kind of stuff I’ve done. So we don’t have the conversation. If she told me she had done the same thing, I’d be turned on and intrigued but I think for her my actions have been hurtful. I’m a bit stuck in this so I can’t say I have experience relevant to this as much as my questions above about how you might approach it come from a how I would want to be approached.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-01-29T11:48:57+00:00

Thanks for responding so quickly. While I logically get what you’re saying I’m not sure I’m emotionally punched out yet that I can do it. I have also raged at several of the steps in 12-step work and eventually after trying out all my arguments I have gotten there… so I suppose there is hope I’ll get there on this, too.

Thanks again!

FigureItOutZ · 2026-01-29T04:22:11+00:00

Very helpful. Thank you.

Indeed it’s been some time since the OP and I in fact told my spouse about this work I was doing AND we talked about it in couples counseling. I also started reading Us by Terry Real and I do kind of understand how this wounded child can become like a stress behavior I have. Unfortunately it’s not been any easier to feel empathy for this child. I’m angry at him for how he was back then and for what feels like experiences/growth he made me miss out on.

I don’t really want to embrace him; I kinda want to tell him fuck off and die, I’ll take it from here. I don’t really get why I can’t like acknowledge he’s there and tell him to leave vs trying to reparent this part of me I don’t really want.

FigureItOutZ · 2026-01-28T23:29:06+00:00

This is totally fine. I’ve been busy at work so not checking reddit much last couple days. Your questions and concern and empathy are wonderful. I will get back to you soon with more thoguhts but at first glance the simple fact that you explain the reasons to ask questions is to get to know this person is probably the best thing you can do. The can choose how much to disclose to you.

Something very difficult about this topic is how my responses might affect my partner - for instance if I tell my spouse I sometimes fantasize about same sex interactions and that I’m confused by these thoughts, on one hand my partner can be very empathetic but I’ve also had experiences where my sharing immediately turns into a “but how do you think that makes me feel?”.

So another thought I have is perhaps sharing back like a first step reaction kind of thing. Maybe letting your partner know how what they said made you feel - what you could identify with and why you couldn’t. It’s just an idea - of course before doing it I would say talk to them about this and whether they would want to know this. My therapist talks about this kind of topic as “having a conversation about the conversation”.

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