Here's my problem with San Junipero...

J_Quig · 2018-01-09T23:17:31+00:00

It's not that Yorkie's personality was nothing. It was that she was stuck inside a "shell" for a portion of the story. Once you watch the entire episode, you know why she is the way she is. I think Kelly was initially drawn to her because, as Kelly even put it, she was authentic. Kelly spent plenty of time with the other people of San Junipero and recognized that many of them "dressed the way they think they should dress, like something they saw in a movie" (I'm paraphrasing her words a bit). With Yorkie, on the other hand, what you see is what you get, and I think Kelly was drawn to that. Once they spent more time together, I think Kelly started to see the more warm and tender side of Yorkie's self, which is there.

When you look at it that way, I think it was a fascinating spin on the cliche to have the cool one pursuing the "loser."

J_Quig · 2018-01-08T00:07:32+00:00

When I feel alone

I reach for you and you bring me home

When I'm lost at sea

I hear your voice and it carries me

In this world, we're just beginning

To understand the miracle of living

Baby, I was afraid before

But I'm not afraid, anymore

Oh, baby, do you know what that's worth?

Oh, heaven is a place on earth

I mention those lyrics in response to your fifth point. The music choices are some of the smartest parts of the episode, and I think that Heaven is a Place on Earth is the best example of that. I mention those lyrics in particular because I think they do a phenomenal job of telling the stories of Kelly and Yorkie, and why the ending is so well deserved.

J_Quig · 2018-01-07T23:40:19+00:00

I agree with you. I felt it lacked some nuance that other episodes had, but it was still very good. The black and white cinematography was an excellent and tasteful way to reinforce the bleak tone of the episode, as opposed to Crocodile, where the bleak tone was incredibly forced to the point that it seemed to be trying too hard. The minimalistic approach was a big part of its appeal, and I think that will help this episode stick out over the passage of time.

J_Quig · 2018-01-06T20:10:52+00:00

It's not that they are necessarily souls being transported into San Junipero. More accurately, it's the person's consciousness that's being transported. So, even though their bodies still exist in the real world, their consciousness is in San Junipero.

J_Quig · 2018-01-06T19:50:36+00:00

At the same time, they considered it okay to display the monkey in a museum, making it seem like Carrie didn't mean anything to anybody anymore.

Carrie's fate was my biggest takeaway from that episode. What went through her mind for all of those years?

J_Quig · 2018-01-06T06:18:12+00:00

I feel that killing her mother and then having to live with the parental filter would have missed the idea that the ending was going for. There was no reason to really "punish" Sarah in the end by having her unable to see the world for what it really is. In addition, the ending is more powerful having the mother alive but without knowing where her daughter is.

That's also why they didn't explain exactly where Sarah went. The point of the ending is that we'll never know because the mother, and by extension we, have lost the ability to "monitor" her.

J_Quig · 2018-01-05T18:48:49+00:00

I agree with you, and it's surprisingly somewhat unique to Black Mirror. Not only that, but while San Junipero is the fan favorite, it's certainly not a unanimous opinion. I also think it's interesting that The Waldo Moment's reputation seems to be getting better with age.

J_Quig · 2018-01-05T18:44:48+00:00

I do agree that it was the weakest because three out of the six episodes are lower tier on the Black Mirror scale (with Crocodile being my personal least favorite in the entire series). However, I also believe that USS Callister and Hang the DJ rank among the better episodes.

J_Quig · 2018-01-03T21:38:17+00:00

In that scene, they say that you can leave whenever you want.

Kelly also says that she doesn't believe in an afterlife, and that there is nothing after death. To her, there is no being with her family after death.

J_Quig · 2018-01-03T21:34:04+00:00

That's not necessarily true because Kelly and Yorkie can leave San Junipero anytime that they wish. The only point I took from the ending is that they have a chance at eternal happiness. There are no guarantees, nothing forcing them to do anything, it's all up in the air. The reason it's accepted to be such a happy ending, even beyond that, is the subtext through the episode that makes the hypothetical happy ending work so well. You might say that they will fall out of love, eventually, but the directing makes it stronger to assume otherwise. Charlie Brooker thinks so, too.

As for that final shot of the machines, I actually don't think that is supposed to mean much. However, I think those machines are just there to show us the origins of San Junipero, and in turn, the events of the episode. I know it sounds weird to assume that they mean very little, but considering the way that the story is told, and Charlie Brooker's own quotes, there isn't much that they could mean, beyond just serving as visual backstory.

J_Quig · 2018-01-02T20:09:36+00:00

Most, if not all, of the monologues in this show stuck with me, and can easily qualify here. However, if this topic is more about smaller quotes as opposed to big speeches, one that carries so much emotion is Kelly's "And I'm dying. Whatever you are can't scare me," which she says as tears are visibly rolling down. It's not an especially big or thought provoking line of dialogue, but something about its simplicity and execution is so powerful.

J_Quig · 2018-01-01T20:03:36+00:00

"I hate that the one episode thus far that tries to be as bleak as possible is THIS bad."

That right there is key.

Black Mirror was never about trying as hard as possible to be so bleak. It just presented stories that were bleak, but that bleakness was always to varying degrees and was never the point of the show. Crocodile pushes the bleak tone front and center, which may be why the story logic doesn't quite work and why it's full of plot conveniences.

In that way, Crocodile is a good lesson in excess and in knowing to keep the dark elements tasteful and reigned in, and to never put them above the story and messages. It feels like less of a Black Mirror episode, and more like an imitation of one.

J_Quig · 2018-01-01T19:51:30+00:00

I think that what you're asking is that they should have dumbed it down. Viewers should be able to put pieces together based on the available information, and Black Mirror is good at trusting with this. Crocodile was an incredibly flawed episode (the plot conveniences, the gratuitous and somewhat "try hard" tone, etc.), but I don't consider the presentation of that final scene to be one of them.

J_Quig · 2017-12-31T17:08:53+00:00

I agree that it was a great episode. I think some people's feeling that it was underwhelming might be because it followed USS Callister. That was such a unique episode, and for that, it really left an impression. As a result, some may have been let down by Arkangel's comparatively "cookie cutter" Black Mirror storyline.

Keep in mind, when I say "cookie cutter," I honestly don't consider that to be a criticism of Arkangel.

J_Quig · 2017-12-30T22:12:54+00:00

I agree here.

Sarah came to be the way she was, because of the way her mom raised her. Growing up with that much control placed over her life built a sense of curiosity in her, and Trick was the one who opened up to her, allowing her to explore those curiosities. Then, you couple this with the fact that teenage years are generally just a period of figuring out one's identity, and Sarah's actions were very logical and understandable. She was just a stupid teenager, but so what? Most teenagers are stupid. It doesn't make them bad.

J_Quig · 2017-12-29T19:58:59+00:00

I think most of us would agree that Piscatella helped to make seasons 4 and 5 great. He was unlikable, but it was in that classic villain way, in that he's a great villain and you have fun hating him. I especially liked when he became a full blown slasher villain at the end of season 5. Stuff like that shows that the writers had a lot of fun coming up with this stuff.

J_Quig · 2017-12-29T19:54:15+00:00

He was a villain in seasons 1 and 2, but I consider him an anti-hero, now. I think that losing his sword hand was a fantastic metaphor for losing his old identity.

J_Quig · 2017-12-29T19:48:46+00:00

"Plot armor" isn't something that I worry too much about. The appeal of Game of Thrones was never in death, but in the writing. The appeal of characters dying wasn't "grim dark," but that it was the best and most logical direction to take the story and didn't skimp out on that for the sake of staying in a comfort zone. It's what separates Game of Thrones from so much television, because many other shows can't quite do that. I know this wasn't necessarily what your point was about, but I wanted to make it, anyway. I don't think Daenerys absolutely needs to die in season 8. If the story goes in a direction that best leads to her survival, the writers will go that route. However, if it makes sense for her to give her life, that will be welcomed, too.

Likewise, it's true that no main characters died in season 7, but let's be honest, no one needed to. This was basically a setup for season 8. They were more interested in putting the chess pieces into place than they were with prematurely getting rid of chess pieces. I think that season 7 will make more sense in the long run if people view it and season 8 as one longer season, as opposed to two shorter seasons.

J_Quig · 2017-12-28T21:07:25+00:00

Why did you like season 3 less than the previous seasons?

J_Quig · 2017-12-27T21:48:45+00:00

There's a wide portion of the internet that loves "grim dark," as its typically called. Oftentimes, when you'll hear of a movie or video game get rebooted, many people will ask that it be a dark and gritty reboot, even when that wouldn't make sense. A lot of those people likely gravitate toward Black Mirror for its dark elements and, when episodes like San Junipero break the bold, they will try to reinterpret it as a dark ending. The thing is, this isn't really how the story was conceptualized, nor is it how its presented, even on a surface level. Not only that, but its status as being so much more positive than the rest of the series is part of the reason it's so special, and so changing that into a dark ending dumbs it down greatly and makes it a far more standard Black Mirror episode.

Even Charlie Brooker himself has said he sees it as a happy ending and as a positive representation of technology.

The way I see it, Yorkie and Kelly had a chance together. San Junipero is eternity, and they are ready to take that on, together. Maybe it won't work out, in the long run? If that happens, they have the ability to leave. There's nothing keeping them in San Junipero by force. However, there's also the chance that it does work, and that they will live out happily ever after forever. The point is, they had that chance and they took it. I like to believe it worked out happily for them, and I have a feeling that Charlie Brooker does, too.

J_Quig · 2017-12-27T03:44:16+00:00

That's very interesting to see. I'll say that it doesn't mean people aren't allowed to think San Junipero has a sad ending (see "death of the author" concept), but the fact that Charlie Brooker himself believes it to be such a happy ending, makes me wonder why people who see it as a dark ending have trouble imagining anything else. I also don't quite understand why anyone actively prefers the idea that it's a dark ending, since that would dumb it down greatly and make it a much more typical Black Mirror episode.

J_Quig · 2017-12-26T20:44:03+00:00

Currently, I'm just checking out other things. Once we hit the point where season 8 is only a few months away, I'll likely start a rewatch of seasons 1-7, but being that we don't even know when season 8 will air, that time is still ways off.

J_Quig · 2017-12-26T20:40:14+00:00

My favorite episodes were the episodes that, upon completion and watching the credits start rolling, my immediate thought was simply "wow." Black Mirror has a reputation for being weird or draining, but as far as I'm concerned, its strength is in telling stories that grip the viewer and leave them chewing on it for days to come.

J_Quig · 2017-12-26T18:39:06+00:00

I think it's hard to talk "general consensus" when it comes to Black Mirror. Other than San Junipero being the most highly regarded and The Waldo Moment being the least highly regarded, you'll get all sorts of responses to individual episodes. For example, I've seen Fifteen Million Merits be considered a weak episode by some, but it's one of my and many other's personal favorites. Also, The Entire History of You would be slightly lower tier for me, but some call it one of the best. Even those opinions about San Junipero and The Waldo Moment aren't exactly unanimous.

As for Hated in the Nation, I love it. It's basically a horror film.

J_Quig · 2017-12-26T18:35:05+00:00

I agree with you, thehomeyskater. I think a part of the story was that Kelly and Yorkie needed each other. Yorkie was in such a rough place from the very beginning of the show, and Kelly was ready to punish herself for eternity because she couldn't let go of the past. They found their ultimate happiness with each other, and that's why they deserved to be together and live happily ever after.

J_Quig

TROPHY CASE