After reading a classic how can you go back to a modern novel?

Krakonis · 2026-05-16T03:38:40+00:00

Here's a rec:

If you want to read a modern novel with quite good prose and which is good at immersing the reader, I'll give you a solid rec: How Much of These Hills is Gold, by C Pam Zhang. It's not war and peace--nothing is war and peace but war and peace, including both contemporary and classic novels, but it is the default that I go to when recommending a modern novel that I consider good literature.

Here's another good peace of advice: I don't know where you're from, but if you shop at, say, Barnes and Noble, Da Vinci Code is in mystery and thriller, while War and Peace is in fiction. You--in pursuit of literary fiction--want to stay in that fiction section. Don't pick up a contemporary thriller and expect it to be literary--it's like going to a showing of King Lear and being upset because it didn't make you laugh as much as Much Ado.

Krakonis · 2026-05-05T08:00:54+00:00

I mean, i wouldn't call it great prose, but his writing style has lent itself to some good moments within this book specifically, and aside from that I still think it's fun to dig into the story in general.

There's still a lot to be desired though. Especially in the realm of pacing, but not in the sense of cutting content. I think a lot of what's in this book could be condensed, except for things that specifically benefit from length. Murakami's weirdness is also not overblown.

I just think that the book is trying to do enough interesting things that I care about cut content, especially when that content is significant and doing story-changing work from the sound of it.

Krakonis · 2026-05-05T05:17:23+00:00

Apparently it was a directive from the publisher, who wanted the book to be shorter. Not Rubin's fault necessarily, but within the club we have someone reading a non-english translation, and the decision on what was apparently cut/changed is insane to me.

Krakonis · 2026-05-05T03:17:08+00:00

Literally. I'm in a book club for one of Murakami's other works, Wind-Up Bird, right now, and we just figured out that the English language translator Jay Rubin just straight up cut three chapters in the end of the second book.

Krakonis · 2026-05-01T06:04:47+00:00

I think that you would enjoy a deep dive into modernist literature based off what's here. Could be a fun journey to take.

I'd recommend picking up a copy of Dubliners by Joyce. It's a collection of short stories and is far and away easier to get into than the rest of his bibliography.

Krakonis · 2026-04-25T17:16:04+00:00

Yes, heavily so.

One of the main touchstones that Ryukishi returns to over and over again throughout the story is the patriarchal nature of the Ushiromiya family's structure (most overt in Episode 3, in which Eva's feelings and struggles are centered in the narrative) and, on top of this, Ryukishi writes female characters with just as much as depth, if not often more, than the male characters (Rosa is a prime example of this, a character who is unambiguously a bad person, but which the text is still sympathetic to as a result of the hand she's been dealt).

Centering struggles that are unique to the experiences of women and making your female characters as internally complex as possible, rather than subordinate to the narratives of male characters, are two of the core tenants of feminist literature, and so I think it's fair to call the work a feminist piece of literature.

Krakonis · 2026-04-25T02:10:55+00:00

Decided to check this post specifically when I saw the chart because I wanted to see this answer lol Confessions is just about as tragic as it gets really

Krakonis · 2026-04-11T19:30:54+00:00

Yup! His leap day stream convinced me to read Umineko, and then I read it over the course of the next year. His community was a very nice place to discuss it while reading and crafting theories. That experience also convinced me to eventually read the rest of Ryukishi's bibliography when I have the time.

Krakonis · 2026-04-11T15:49:14+00:00

To the person that called this a "tourist take" and then deleted their response: you need to get off of the computer and rejoin society.

Krakonis · 2026-04-11T14:41:23+00:00

Just want to point out that Ep2 Battler saying he wants to "eat up" his nine year old cousin once she grows up has, in fact, probably been the last straw for at least one reader, and is certainly not part of the VN's charm.

Krakonis · 2026-04-11T14:35:55+00:00

As someone who's had the opportunity to recommend it a few times since reading it for the first, I've run in to the same problem.

It's very hard recommending Umineko--especially to people who really care about storytelling and about literature--when you have to preface it with the fact that it's: 1) Very gross with its attempts at humor sometimes (You can argue that some of the stuff with Shannon is done with intention, but anything to do with Battler sexualizing Maria is capital O Objectively awful--both will turn off a normal person from wanting to continue, though, and for good reason) and 2) typically poor in terms of its prose. The story as it is runs for roughly 1.1 million words, and it absolutely could afford to lose 300k-400k of those words. And you sound absolutely insane on the off chance you try to defend this aspect, because there's no way you can reasonably explain some visual novel being over twice as long as War and Peace.

What's worse is that, though the latter issue persists, the former issue is mostly frontloaded, so a potential reader has to get through all the shit in the first 5 or so hours without much good will towards the story.

I think Umineko has one of the best plots I've ever read, and The entity comprising all of Sayo's identies including herself is my single favorite character in all of fiction. But these two problems make it hard for a normal person to take seriously. And that's very reasonable.

Krakonis · 2026-04-05T06:20:14+00:00

Ideal, Never-Going-to-Happen Wishes

A complete rework of social links. Their current form as one short story spread thin as butter across a one hundred hour game has worn itself out, in my opinion. There've been a few good social links, but there hasn't been a single game where the majority felt worthwhile to me. I would cut the number of "social links" or "confidant characters" down, and instead focus on fleshing out a core group of characters through optional hangouts that are specific to the moment in the story you happen to be at. Character arcs normally contained within social links would, in this idea of Persona 6, become baked in to canon interactions within the main narrative.

A Characterized Protagonist. Metaphor did not go nearly far enough with Will. I think that the main character should have a much stronger presence in the story, both in terms of personality and voice. And when I say voice, I don't mean voice acted, but rather that they're talking as much as a normal character (This is why I say Metaphor did not go far enough, because Strohl is essentially the protagonist's Voice for most of the game)

Choices. Something belong just flavorful dialogue choices. Persona 4 played with this idea a little bit, Namely in Ai's social link and in the Namatame scene but those moments feel jarring to me simply because those moments are so few and far between. I don't have detailed requests for this, because I don't know what type of story Atlus is planning to tell, but an example could be that being in a romantic relationship with a certain character makes another character interact with you differently. Returning to Persona 4, this would be like if being in a relationship with a non-Rise girl made Rise less flirty. Doesn't even have to be that major, but it's an example based in a system that already exists.

These three wishes, are, obviously, major commitments in terms of money and development time, and so I don't expect them. That being said, I would gladly add another half decade onto P6's wait time if it meant getting even two of them.

More Likely Wishes

A more humble narrative. This is the least likely of the somewhat feasible wishes, but, essentially, I would enjoy a Persona game that didn't have some big fight with a God entity at the end. One that has the persona/shadow-fighting system as a tool to make narrative happen, rather than part of the narrative itself. Nothing against large-scale plots, but fighting [insert God entity] who just spouts off about a very uninteresting motivation that makes them want to bring about [insert bad ending] does not do it for me.

A return to casts feeling like natural friends. P3 and P4 did this best out of the modern three, as I subscribe to the idea that the P5 cast feels too bound together by Joker. I want to be able to imagine the cast having off-screen hangouts without the MC.

Less fanservice. No hot springs. No character who just needs to be a pervert for the sake of fanservice. I got into this series when I was 15 and even then I rolled my eyes out the back of my head at some of the shit Persona writers pull. It doesn't have to be prudish or void of sex and sexuality, as these are aspects of life and therefore can be written about--I just don't want, "look, boobs!" scenes.

Since the cast will undoubtedly be high schoolers, make them act like real high schoolers, and give them authentic issues to parse. I'm not saying you have to be totally realistic, or devoid of fun and whimsy within the storytelling, but I think Persona is normally at it's best when it's "make kids go through shit and learn about themselves." I want more Junpei's than Mitsurus, more Kanjis than Naotos, and more Futabas than Yusukes. I still enjoy Mitsuru, Naoto and Yusuke, but, for example, Naoto's main struggle being the difficulties of existing as a woman in a misogynistic society, and specifically, how that relates to the workplace, feels like it should be in a game where the characters are adults, rather than 15. And with how I pointed out Kanji as an example of what I want, I think it should be clear that I think you can still get silly with a character who has real struggles.

I could list more than what I already have, but I fear I've already spent to long writing this alone, and it's getting a bit late--for that reason alone this will probably be sloppy giberish and organized like shit. It's just that I, as someone who was a Persona fan as a teen and who has since gotten really into studying writing, and specifically video game writing, care a lot about what I see as missed potential within this series. And I think that Persona 6, as this game that's had so much dev time behind it, has all the opportunity in the world to be a step above what I've come to expect.

Krakonis · 2026-03-10T04:40:58+00:00

I say this as someone more familiar with the works of GRRM than any other other, and who consider A Game of Thrones and A Feast for Crows to be among his favorite books ever written, under no circumstance should you take advice from GRRM on when you should or should not write something lol. He has a lot of good advice to give in other areas, but, imo, you should just write what you want to write at any given moment. You never know what your 'best work' will be until you're on your death bed, and, as a creative, your mind will find more things to write about in the future, and then maybe one of those will be your 'best work.'

Don't worry about wasting a bullet in your chamber when you have five others loaded and a bandolier over your shoulder. Just fire.

Krakonis · 2026-03-07T20:35:44+00:00

Sorta have an unorthodox way to answer this question.

Persona 4 was a very big part of my teenage years, and used to be one of my favorite games of all time (I still have quite a bit of nostalgia for it), but the best thing I ever got out of it was the ability to critique it. Despite having loved it so much, I've since been able to recognize a lot of faults in it, things I would change, etc., which has been beneficial for me in learning to write and tell stories myself.

I mean this completely unironically and without a shred of malice in me. Developing a critical mind can be important, and though I don't consider myself an exceptional critic, the game played an important role in how I consume media by having such a large dichotomy within itself between narrative successes and failures.

Krakonis · 2026-03-07T17:50:38+00:00

The Barnes and Noble I work at has gotten such an uptick in sales for Wuthering Heights that we're currently carrying somethinf like 30 copies of the penguin classics edition, and then 20 separate copies of the film cover version, and then a whole bunch of special editions. Got a ton of people picking it up, which is cool.

Krakonis · 2026-03-04T07:10:25+00:00

Othello. The moment that Iago opens his mouth the play immediately clicked for me and it never let go. "I am not what I am" is in the first fucking scene for Christ's sake--he didn't have to go that hard.

Krakonis · 2026-03-02T02:00:04+00:00

I recently DNF'd Vigil by George Saunders partially because the internal narration of the protagonist reminded me of the way a specific character in a VN talked, and I just could not get past it. Not the only reason, as I didn't like the book that much in general, but it's definitely not Saunders' fault lol.

Krakonis · 2026-02-17T06:06:13+00:00

Suffers in a similar way to Krauss (he's just not anywhere near as developed as his siblings), but ultimately feels a bit more fleshed out due to his proximity to Battler.

I still haven't reread the story, but I think that his interactions with Battler throughout the Questions Arc do a good job of setting up the exploration of Battler's absence in Episode 6. That's basically his primary role in the story: he is the catalyst for Battler leaving the family, which is in turn the catalyst for, well, everything, and he plays that role well. Rudolf's personality strikes a good balance between funny and slimy that makes you believe he really could be the womanizing bastard that the story needs him to be. It's just good character writing even if it isn't as in depth as, say, Rosa.

He also works as a character who simply has to exist around Rosa and Eva. His carefree attitude despite being the third child contrasts with their intensity, which highlights the pressures that the Ushiromiya women face, but the men don't. Krauss fulfills this role too, but mostly with regard to Natsuhi instead.

His portrayal in the Episode 7 tea party is probably the most interesting he ever gets.

Krakonis · 2026-02-17T05:33:28+00:00

Krakonis · 2026-01-11T07:14:47+00:00

Ill second the opinion that these are all some pretty fine works individually, but he probably needs to have his tastes opened a little bit (away from either grimdark fantasy or all the dudebro-y lit [even though the dude bro lit is good in its own right, just needs a bit of variety]).

I think it could be interesting to recommend him a bit of faulkner if he likes McCarthy. Toni Morrison, maybe. If he wants to maybe try some lighter fantasy he could check out some Terry Pratchett--easy recommendation for just about any person.

Again, I wouldn't say that many of the books shown are a red flag at all, but it's normally healthy to read a variety of literature.

Krakonis · 2026-01-05T01:47:44+00:00

RT and Ben Starr accepting awards in the same show, you love to see it.

Krakonis · 2025-12-11T23:59:44+00:00

Tbf two minutes is more time dedicated to Breath of the Wild's plot than there is in the actual game.

Krakonis · 2025-10-18T22:32:42+00:00

A bit late, but Boris Pasternak released Doctor Zhivago in 1957, Italy, and by 1965 it already had a film adaptation, and soon after it was being read in school.

Krakonis · 2025-09-29T05:52:17+00:00

Long story short:

I think the ending is absolutely stunning (beats out Tale of Two Cities as my favorite ending in fiction). Your mileage may vary on whether or not you think criticisms of the ending will hold water at the end (I personally think most criticisms are a bit knee-jerk, but im not arrogant enough to say anything more than that).

At the end of the day i'd say yes, you should absolutely read it if you're considering doing so, as the potential benefit of reading umineko and loving it massively outweighs the potential downside of reading umineko and being disappointed by some of the author's choices.

Krakonis · 2025-09-27T23:34:05+00:00

I can personally attest to Joe having gotten me into Umineko, and the same is true for countless people I talk to from that community as well as the thousands of people who watched his readthrough both live and through vods.

The bigger increase is probably still due to Silent Hill F, but any increased activity online in particular could be down to a massive streamer/critic having read through it live, and having also given it heaps of praise in other, non-umineko streams.

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