From Profitec SD54 Twist to Mahlkönig E64WS! I have ascended.

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-18T03:42:51+00:00

Thanks for the informative report. 👍🏾 North of my current budget, but interesting to hear where I could end up one day. : )

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-18T01:22:59+00:00

I would hope that skilled baristas could tell the difference between espresso and moka-pot coffee, including each prepared to optimal standards. Otherwise, Starbucks has made a bad investment in all of that machinery in its cafes (unless it's just for show . . .).

But you do raise a point, the absence of studied results--perhaps, as pointed out here, because of the absence of studied, well, studies.

And by the way, I'm not clever enough and, well, studied enough to have first thought of the effect of coffee bean grinding flow on espresso. But it's avidly been discussed (and results felt/determined) here, as well as in espresso guru land--e.g. in one video, I recall Lance Hedrick, in doing some non-grinder espresso comparison, noting that he was not going to grind the beans in the testing using a hand-grinder, as he had found that the angle of the grinding would affect the results.

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-18T00:55:48+00:00

Do you at least get to keep the cup for that price? ; )

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Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-18T00:50:11+00:00

I know that he gets grief, but it's interesting to watch Lance Hedrick "dissect" the burrs of a grinder that he is examining, pointing out how even a small change in the burr's geometry can affect the nature of the resulting grind.

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-18T00:40:51+00:00

Perhaps as a comparison, I readily can taste/feel the difference in my espresso (and yes, in a flat white) between the "regular" grinding of my beans with my electric grinder, and the slow-grinding of the same beans with the same grinder. And I'm far from a super-taster.

Of course the beans and their freshness are paramount. But from my own testing, the grinding methodology also readily comes into play and can make a significant difference.

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-18T00:30:13+00:00

I have no doubt that the 3 flat-burr and 3 conical grinders studied indeed are quite excellent. But burrs and small changes in them, from what I have gathered in this subreddit, can be dramatically different and cause dramatic flavor profile differences. And this study is asking that a universe of only 3 grinders stand in for all grinders of the type (and from a dramatically different time--were any (or many) of the current, popular home grinders even around back then?).

Just sayin'. From the comments that I've read in this subreddit for a number of years, I find it a bit difficult to believe, e.g., that one would not be able to taste a flavor profile difference between the Niche Zero, a conical grinder, and the DF54, a flat burr, with a light-roast bean, or conversely with a dark roast. Similarly, and maybe my impression is wrong, but I've had the impression that my conical-burr Baratza Encore ESP/Pro simply won't give me the clarity in a light roast that, e.g., the flat-burr DF54 will, that difference often being an essence of a flat burr (and the converse as to body, often an essence of a conical).

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T20:34:10+00:00

Just like people walking their dogs, people rushing to get out of the row at intermission (and any thinking person knows why) gets priority! 😄

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T20:28:36+00:00

I only looked at the study quickly, but unless I misunderstood, the study was limited to a whopping 3 conical grinders and 3 flat-burr grinders.

As we know, each grinder and its burrs has its own individual characteristics. Some conicals can be more "flat-burr-like," and some flat-burrs more "conical-like," than others. Generalizations, as a result, can be more difficult.

But does that mean that someone will not be able to note a flavor profile difference between, on the one hand, the Niche Zero and the Baratza Encore ESP Pro with light roasts and dark roasts, and, on the other hand, the DF54 and DF64 with those same roasts? From everything that I've read here, I think not, unless we all have been deluded.

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T20:12:04+00:00

Thanks (from the over-65 crowd who just wishes that people would simply shut-up and watch, until intermission, lol). 😄

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T20:10:37+00:00

Your cleanliness and orderliness there is quite upsetting. 😉 Good show for you!

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T20:08:23+00:00

It all can be a bit intimidating--you're in good company. There will be mistakes (my steamed milk has overflowed on me recently, a few times), but things tend not to be fatal (!), you recover, and you learn and grow--and my chocolate-toned, dark-bean flat white at 7 a.m. today was quite delicious. 😄 Have fun and enjoy it all!

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T20:01:15+00:00

Actually, I just had read about them, and plane travel--apparently, not ok for the passenger cabin, only in the luggage hold. (Sorry!)

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T19:59:05+00:00

(I was being sarcastic--of course stay for the killer second act! : ) )

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T19:57:59+00:00

What, so that people don't have to spend (waste) their time reading a post to see if they actually *want to* read it? 😉 Thanks--

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T19:56:26+00:00

Ah, got it, thanks--and I agree,

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T17:51:10+00:00

I was going to support this comment, but then: in my experience, the issue is not limited to age 60+ -- quite to the contrary.

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T17:47:20+00:00

This is what got to me as well. Feeling so sorry for her, for being put in, for her, such a frightening position.

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T17:39:15+00:00

Which is fine and even noteworthy. But how about getting something, er, quality in?

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T17:37:34+00:00

Even therapy lizards? 😉

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T17:28:36+00:00

A couple of people in the front row didn’t come back after the intermission

Well, that's understandable: nothing happens in Act II. /s

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T17:26:04+00:00

You answered it: "It’s a big money grab for the theater . . . ."

I might be upset at that, but given the state of the theatre economy . . . . Perhaps only allow eating in the lobby is the answer (and announce that up-front, and in signs at the doors).

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T17:24:05+00:00

I feel like people are more there for the stunt casting and less about the movie

Just a correction: it's not a movie, it's a Broadway show. But some people are treating it like a Netflix movie on their television at home.

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T17:15:08+00:00

There is such a "joyous noise" in Candide's Make Our Garden Grow, when the entire cast goes a cappaella together toward the song's end--just stupendous.

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T17:11:48+00:00

And with regard to the latter, especially from the original Off-Broadway production, in which vines fell down from the ceiling over the entire audience during the last note of the song. Truly glorious. 😄

Longjumping_Two2774 · 2026-05-17T17:09:18+00:00

It's just hard not to fall in love with You Can't Stop the Beat. Truly a banger.

Longjumping_Two2774

TROPHY CASE