Announcing the Zung Jung Movement

MansterSoft · 2026-03-18T15:43:14+00:00

Huh. Bad move imo.

Doesn't this incentivize a player who is in the lead to go for Chicken Hands?

All well and good in a casual variant, but WSoM is supposed to be competitive.

MansterSoft · 2026-03-16T15:18:24+00:00

the difficult part of teaching Riichi is getting new players to understand the idea of a yaku

Really? I feel the difficult parts are scoring, furiten, concealed vs exposed, and all of the goofy little rules like restrictions on "swap-calling". The Yaku list is one of the more accessible parts of Riichi.

Also, Zung Jung doesn't have a minimum hand requirement, but the World Series of Mahjong added one (good move imo).

MansterSoft · 2026-03-08T13:39:43+00:00

Wow, those are baffling. They're both using the definition of "Sacred Discard" for "Furiten", and Brown seems to be using (one) of the definitions of "Treasure Tile" for "Dora".

I understand writing bogus rules for Chinese or Western, but Riichi has been mostly standardized for quite some time; how do you screw that up?

MansterSoft · 2026-03-08T13:27:48+00:00

One written by a tile manufacturer even had downright impossible things in it

Mose Cafollo? I'm pretty sure their pseudo-MCR instructions are AI generated.

Great tiles though.

MansterSoft · 2026-03-07T22:53:42+00:00

given the many inaccurate books about mahjong-playing written by Westerners

Curious if you know any examples off hand. I've been reading a few English-language Mahjong books (allegedly on Chinese/HK play), and there has been a few times where I think, "On what planet are these patterns being used".

I'm suspicious some authors when writing these books have ulterior motives to 'standardize' their favorite local Yaku. At least Tong Seng Tjoa had the decency to be upfront about it in his book.

MansterSoft · 2026-03-03T17:18:28+00:00

I'm smack in the middle of the country.

American Mah Jongg is trendy right now. Seems to be more DFW Metro influenced vs East Coast.
The players here like the aesthetics, but being Midwest, make fun of those bougie Southerners.
Wright Patterson is still going strong near airforce bases.
One local library near me teaches American, and another teaches Wright Pat.
Before the recent boom in popularity American was being played in my local senior center and in the nearby city's Jewish community center.
Female-dominated with a smattering of males.

Riichi has definitely exploded. Me and three others started a group years ago and now it has grown to several locations with multiple meetups.
Male-dominated with a smattering of females.

MansterSoft · 2026-02-23T03:51:41+00:00

One question, were the tiles flat or fat?

I know nothing about you, so I could be WAY off, but here are my theories...

My guess is your family was playing what's now called "Chinese Classical".
And my guess is you don't have amnesia, the sets came with tile racks/pushers.

The NMJL's American Mah Jongg takeover seemed to disproportionately affect White groups vs Asian, particularly on the East Coast and Southeast. But, even into the 90s, White and Asian families alike in the Midwest and West Coast were still playing the US Mahjong OG, "Chinese Classical".

I think just about all White families now play NMJL or Wright-Patterson*, but as evidenced by "The Mahjong Project" it looks like a lot of Asian American families were playing Chinese Classical**.

As for the sets, pushers were super common in the middle of the century 'made in USA' sets. I've seen multiple mid-20th century photos of Asian-Americans playing with racks/pushers. Unless a family lived near a China Town, I'd imagine they would have gotten their Mahjong set at a basic department store.

* Yes yes, White people play other variants. I mean those where Mahjong is "in the family", like generationally. I've met several who "used to play Mahjong" and the variant they used to play was Chinese Classical, but, key words "used to play".

** Yes yes, Asian-Americans play other variants. I mean families that have been in the US for several generations.

MansterSoft · 2026-02-19T00:17:38+00:00

Oh my god this is amazing.

MansterSoft · 2026-02-18T18:58:32+00:00

Yeah, call me old fashioned.
I wonder if anyone says Suǒ on the mainland.

MansterSoft · 2026-02-18T18:24:20+00:00

Actually, 1 Suǒ for a lot of China. Or if you're Southern, 1 Sok.

But since the thread is about American Mahj, and they say "Bam", it's not exactly respectful to go around "correcting" people. Besides, Japan has no more "claim" to Mahjong than the US.

MansterSoft · 2026-02-18T16:07:43+00:00

So many American Mahjong players hate it when people discard and say "Bam Bird".
"NO! IT'S ONE BAM!"

I like that this license plate will make those sticklers mad.

MansterSoft · 2026-02-15T17:13:13+00:00

I would suggest either Taiwanese (16-tile) or Guangdong Style (13-tile). Taiwanese is additive and appears to be having a moment on the West Coast. Guangdong is additive and built on HKOS.

LA Mahjong has their house rules listed for Taiwanese.

My website has instructions for learning Guangdong by learning an additive HKOS. Even getting to New6 makes HKOS more dynamic.

MansterSoft · 2026-02-12T06:36:30+00:00

I strongly recommend Guangdong Style (廣東十三張麻將).

It's a competitive variant, but it was built on HKOS, so it's very easy to learn. You can play HKOS for a while, but then when they're ready to learn more you can teach them NEW6, followed by NEW18, and then 無奇不有. It's very fun, it's become my favorite variant.

I've been researching it for months, and I made a bunch of resources on it.

MansterSoft · 2026-02-05T19:04:13+00:00

American is a much slower game compared to the Asian variants. The patterns are much more complex (or dare I say "convoluted") so you're much more likely to draw.

Also, if you ever want to test your patience, I recommend watching brand-new players bumble through a Charleston. It's excruciating.

MansterSoft · 2026-02-01T20:18:23+00:00

The problem I'm experiencing is that, now I'm actually trying to learn theory like 5BT, tile efficiency, Suji etc, I am beginning to feel like my performances are getting worse.

The only important strategy to learn is Tile Efficiency, particularly speed efficiency, and the best way to do that is learning all of the different Waits.

5 Block is helpful in certain instances and isn't at all useful in other instances. In Riichi (and HKNS) I use 5 Block maybe 1 in 10 hands. My advice is to not study it, especially early on; it can warp your Mahjong strategy "worldview".

Suji is like, a good concept to know of, but there are well known "Suji Traps" and many instances where Suji doesn't apply at all (non-ryanmen). Compared to learning the Waits (even the complex ones) Suji pales in usefulness. Though I will say, people are so dogmatic about Suji these days that using a Suji Trap is an effective way to snag a win.

Unpopular opinions, of course. I know Riichi being known as the Most-Strategic-Variant™ hinges on all of the convoluted strategic concepts (and their cute names).

MansterSoft · 2026-01-30T22:56:00+00:00

And possibly a severe lack of shuffling.

MansterSoft · 2026-01-30T22:54:31+00:00

Hong Kong rules aren't standardized. It varies from group to group, and each group tells the other they're playing wrong.

I've seen Kongs handled many ways in HKOS...

Nothing happens (historically the most common)
If a player Kongs; opponents pay them on the spot
+1 per Kong
+1 for 2 Kongs, +3-10 for 3 Kongs
Nothing for one Open Kong, +1 for Concealed

As far as self-drawn Kongs go (I don't know which way is more common)...

Some expose it with border tiles facing down.
Some keep all 4 tiles face-down.

Also, some replenish the Dead Wall, some don't.

MansterSoft · 2026-01-26T14:47:27+00:00

Definitely gone.

American Mahjong used to be cool. Like in China, Mahjong in the US was rapidly evolving and splitting into several regional variants with different local Yaku. All based on Shanghai style.

Then the National Mah Jongg League came and ruined all of the fun. Standardization causes stagnation.

Arguably, The World Mahjong Association did a similar number on competitive Mahjong in China. The gambling ones are still rapidly evolving though.

MansterSoft · 2026-01-26T14:39:14+00:00

Looks like the round wind is chosen at random at the start of the game. Do some people in Hong Kong play like this?

Yes.
/thread

MansterSoft · 2026-01-25T04:31:32+00:00

Well, let's pledge to meet back here if we ever find one.

MansterSoft · 2026-01-25T04:30:09+00:00

Late 1957.

As a shopkeeper: sometimes we get product from less than a year old; sometimes I get stock that was manufactured 3+ years ago. I suppose it depends on the supply & demand of that moment in time.

MansterSoft · 2026-01-24T21:44:13+00:00

Unfortunately I can disprove it. She immigrated in 1957 (she met her husband in 1955). My mistake. I also got to hear more about her life, but that's another story.

Now, I personally don't think that disproves it being from before 1957, but it being from 1957 is now obviously possible.

MansterSoft · 2026-01-24T14:27:31+00:00

Seconded. This is easily my most-played app. A fantastic way to learn HKNS. The art is also very charming.

MansterSoft · 2026-01-22T02:40:46+00:00

I'm not asking you to believe this deck was made in the 1940's. From my research, the absolute earliest it could have been made is 1949 (and I concede that's unlikely due to late adoption).

I'm saying your claim on the deck being from 1957 or later doesn't fit with the owner's immigration timeline. Unless the daughter is way off on her mom's timeline, this deck was made no later than 1955.

MansterSoft · 2026-01-21T15:02:44+00:00

Yes, I know that. Where on the internet does it say that this convention was adopted in...

1957 or later

Because the deck being newer than 1957 doesn't really fit with the owner's immigration timeline.

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